Need advice on Catholic ceremony

mjmchugh86

Hello everyone,

Seeking some advice. My Fiance was raised in the Catholic Church and wants a full Catholic mass. I was also raised Catholic, but am no longer practicing. If it were up to me, we would not be having a Catholic ceremony, however, it is very important to my fiance so I agreed to one. I am really having trouble coming to terms with my decision. There are many aspects of the Catholic church that I am uneasy with, and I do not want to start my marrige in a way that makes me uncomfortable. Has anyone else had any experience with this? Any advice? Thanks for any help.

professorscience

Welcome!

I would first talk over your concerns with your FI (as I'm sure you have), so that hopefully the two of you can work this out.  In order for your marriage to be considered valid you have to follow proper form.  Getting married outside of the church would cause you and your FI to be barred from the sacraments.  Hopefully your FI can tell you not just why it is important to him to have a Catholic wedding but also why it is important to have a Catholic marriage.  And you should be able to bring your concerns to him completely openly.

Next I would talk to your priest or a pastoral associate or someone else in your church who could counsel you on the aspects of the church with which you do not agree.  If you're both baptized I'm pretty sure they would insist you have a mass, but you could ask about having the ceremony without mass.  The worst they can do is say no.

And then I would pray.  For God to give you guidance and patience, strength, knowledge, peace -- whatever it is that you need to reconcile your relationship with Him and His church.

I'm really sorry that you are in this position, it is definitely not an easy one.  Lots of the regular posters on this board (myself included) have either come to the church after being outside of it or have been raised in the church but struggled with her teachings like you and have found their way back.  Personally I laid all my concerns out for my husband (back when he was my boyfriend) and he met each one with love and patience and was able either to explain whatever it was or point me in the right direction to find the answers I wanted.  It took me a really, really long time to come around, but I'm so happy I did.

Eliz77

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:e821d83f-a35c-4c2a-9460-320e1850d493">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE] If you're both baptized I'm pretty sure they would insist you have a mass, but you could ask about having the ceremony without mass.  The worst they can do is say no. 
Posted by professorscience[/QUOTE]
I agree with all professorscience said but wanted to share: both FI and I are baptized Catholics, but only I was raised Catholic and still practice. We were given the choice if we wanted Mass or Ceremony. Because FI was honoring my wishes to be married in the Church, I honored his wish to not have a full mass. Compromising here was well worthwhile for us, now we both are fully comfortable with our decision, and have worked together on all the details. My family is Catholic. His Dad's side is, but his Mom's side left the Church a long time ago, hence why FI was not brought up Catholic (parents are divorced and his mom/maternal Grandparents were the biggest influences in his life). Since our  guests will be split Catholic Vs non-Catholics, and I KNOW some on his side are not comfortable with certain aspects of Catholic Mass, it was never a question in my mind a Ceremony was more appropriate for us.<div>
</div><div>But as PP said, sit down and share your concerns with FI. It also would be helpful to speak with a Priest to help sort through some concers. We spoke with both the Monsignor and also the Deacon who is marrying us, and I can't tell you how great they both were-very open, welcoming and friendly and pretty much put FI at ease. I wouldn't be surprised if because of them, if FI becomes more involved when we have our own family. But at the same time, I will not push him into it, he is allowed to form his own opinions/beliefs, as are you. Good luck!</div>

professorscience

You know, Eliz, I didn't even remember it until you said something, but H and I were actually advised by one priest NOT to have a mass since no one in my family is Catholic.  Whoops!

So there you go.  You guys can have a ceremony without mass if that's what you decide!

Calypso1977

first and foremost i think you should talk to your FI, if you have not done so already, abotu the role of catholicism in your marrriage.

your wedding day is merely the start.  if you are uncomfortable about marrying in the church, how will you feel abotu raising your children in the church?  there are some hard questions you need to ask and answer honestly.  religion isnt just about the wedding day or making a compromise for someone for one day. 

agapecarrie

I'd also look into why these things make you feel uncomfortable. Learn what the church actually teaches (not just what you heard), and why. Most people have not learned much about things before they reject the church. Learn what you're rejecting before you do so. You might be completely surprised that there is a lot makes sense. 

We can recommend books depending on the nature of your questions--- if you feel like sharing. 

bibliophile2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:5807600e-843f-4881-9f49-667ae8e4b956">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]first and foremost i think you should talk to your FI, if you have not done so already, abotu the role of catholicism in your marrriage. your wedding day is merely the start.  if you are uncomfortable about marrying in the church, how will you feel abotu raising your children in the church?  there are some hard questions you need to ask and answer honestly.  religion isnt just about the wedding day or making a compromise for someone for one day. 
Posted by Calypso1977[/QUOTE]

This. What role is religion going to play in your life? Your marriage? Your children's upbringings? Talk openly with your fiance about each of these things if you haven't already. That should bring some clarity to the issues.

Then, I would do as others have suggested and consider the WHYs behind those things you might have issues with. Have an open mind and heart. You might find that God leads you to surprising places.

Riss91

Welcome!

I agree with everything that has been posted. I truly do not think you want to force your future husband to be married outside the Church if his faith is important to him. Doing so would mean that neither of you are in good standing and therefore could not receive sacraments. This might not matter much to you - but think about your husband not being able to go up for communion ever again. I don't think that is something you want to force upon him. It might also be difficult to have any future children baptised in the faith bc a priest may not feel that the child would be raised according to the faith.

If there are certain things you are uneasy about - please research them. Not too long ago, I completely disagreed with many church teachings (birth control, etc). I would attack the faith to my devout Catholic boyfriend. He was patient and had a wealth of knowledge. I wound up learning that everything I thought I disagreed with - I actually didn't even know what the REAL teaching was. I only knew what society/the media had led me to believe. I wound up changing my mind a great deal. It was a huge life changing experience for me.

If you ever want to chat about anything regarding the faith, please feel free to PM me or anyone else here to discuss in a stress-free way. Good luck with everything and please stick around!

mjmchugh86

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for all of your replies. I think the real issue is that my fiance either can't or won't express to me why getting married in the church is important to him in a way that I understand. (He tells me that it is the right way and it is important to him, but does not tell me why). I try to have a conversation with him, but I always feel that is goes in circles.

We honestly have talked a lot about religion, and what role religion will play in our future. I fully support is beliefs, I just do not partake in them. I have no issue with our future children being raised Catholic, as my "falling out" with the chuch occured the more I learned about Catholic teaching (through confirmation and theology courses at my Catholic university, paired with the stance that the church takes on certain topics). My future children are free to believe what they want to believe as long as they are educated about the topic.

Why was it important for you to get married within the Church? Would the church refuse to marry us if I was honest about my beliefs/feelings?

professorscience

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:28f4401a-577c-4914-8ae3-5d61ff985b19">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE] Why was it important for you to get married within the Church? Would the church refuse to marry us if I was honest about my beliefs/feelings?
Posted by mjmchugh86[/QUOTE]

I don't think they would refuse, but keep in mind that you have to fully believe and mean what you say in your vows.  Just "going through the motions" could also be grounds for invalidation (although I doubt that comes up often).  I think a good adviser would try to get to the root of your issues and point you toward some research aids.

I have to admit, I'm really curious what issues came up for you as you studied.  I think usually the opposite of your case is true -- people question the church, so they study works of theology, and their faith is strengthened.  I think it was already mentioned that there are tons of books and blogs that seek to answer those really tough questions.  Sometimes you do the research and you still don't like the answer, though, and I totally respect that.

I don't know how far off your wedding is, but your FI is going to HAVE to address this eventually.  PPs are right -- it's going to come up again.  If you're fallen away and he's not strong in his faith, then your kids are not likely to get strong spiritual guidance and maybe 30 years down the road will find themselves in exactly your position.  And I mean, it's great that you want your kids to believe whatever they want, but our faith is shaped (positively and negatively) by the influences of our parents.  If you say to your kids, "Well, we baptized you, but I don't believe this because x, y, z," and your husband says, "Well, we did it because that's what you do," it sends really confusing messages to them.

Calypso1977

 I think the real issue is that my fiance either can't or won't express to me why getting married in the church is important to him in a way that I understand. (He tells me that it is the right way and it is important to him, but does not tell me why).

he is catholic.  if he wishes to continue to practice his catholic faith (i.e., take communion) he must be married in teh church.  if he marries outside of the church, the church considers that a sin, and he would nto be allowed to receive communion.  its a pretty big deal. 

Riss91

I think if his faith is important, and his faith requires him to be married in the Church, that should really be enough. he might not be blessed with the right "answers". Many people can't explain why they feel strongly about their faith - they just feel it. The fact is, NOT being married in the Church is a really big deal to someone who subscribes to the Catholic faith. If you are okay with your children being raised in the faith, having the Catholic ceremony just makes sense.

I would also say that almost all of us doubt (or have doubted in the past) parts of the faith. I'm sure many Catholics have had doubts while up on the altar. I wouldn't say you are an oddball in any way. When you have doubts, discomfort, uncertainty, I would still think it's better to receive the blessings/sacraments than not to. Now, if you feel 100% that the faith is garbage and you cannot stand it for a second, I wouldn't necessarily say you should go ahead with it.  But that doesn't seem to be the case here.

I admire you for wanting to do the right thing and not be dishonest. I still think you can have the Catholic ceremony even with your feelings on certain issues. Again, if you want to chat about some of them, just to be sure you have your ducks in a row, please contact one of us. We are more than willing to ensure the proper information was passed along to you and are fine with "agreeing to disagree" in the end!

Tami87

I agree with previous posters that if it is really important for your FI to remain in good standing with the Catholic church that I would respect his wishes and go through with the Catholic ceremony. Although I would suggest that you try to compromise with him and have a ceremony outside of mass if that will make you more comfortable. I admire you for wanting to be honest, and I would think that if you have a good priest and are open to talking to him about your concerns he should still be willing to work with you. (I would watch your tone and how you say this though. Saying "I am struggling with understanding why the church teaches x, y, z and don't know if believe that" is going to go over much better than "I think the church is wrong about x, y, and z"). From my experience with my own marriage prep the coordinators are well aware that many couples are not following certain teachings (especially about co-habitating, birth control, and waiting for marriage) but they are willing to meet them where they are with their faith and just ask that the couples consider what the church teaches with an open heart.

I also wanted to chime in that I was raised Catholic by my mother although she was never very strict about making me go to mass as a kid and my dad only attended church with us on holidays (I believe he considers himself to be agnostic). While I still identified as Catholic, I wasn't sure that I agreed with some of the church's teachings (i.e. only men as priests, birth control, gay marriage, in vitro fertilization etc). I tend to be pretty skeptical and questioning in general (I am working on PhD in Cell Biology so kind of part of my training), but after really doing some research and reading what the church teachings and why it just all kind of made so much more sense. My views have radically changed on many of these issues from what they were a few years ago. I would echo other posters comments that if you want someone to talk about specific concerns with the church I am happy to talk to you about them.

Welcome and Good luck!

mjmchugh86

Thank you everyone for your replies,

I think I will be in a much better place once I have the oppertunity to speak with a priest. We currently do not have a church to get married in (we are not getting married in Boston - too expensive, so we need to find a church closer to our reception site. Has any one else gone through this? Is it hard to get get permission to marry in a church other than your home parish?) Our wedding is over a year away.

Professor - I remember the exact moment when I begain to question my faith - It was during confirmation when I learned that unbaptized babies do not go to heaven. It was something that I could not reconcile with what I felt God to be. There is much more than that - but that was where my doubt began.

I like the idea of just having a ceremony instead of a mass. I will have to talk to FI about that. Thanks for the idea - I did not know this was an option

Eliz77

I had the same conversation with my FI and my answer was I feel my upbringing was sort of centered around being Catholic. It gave us a real reason for having faith and was a foundation for our morals/values. Now, I KNOW people can have morals/values/faith without being Catholic or even religious, but it was how I grew up and what I know, so it just made sense for me in looking towards our future family. Maybe your FI feels the same way? When FI and I had this discussion, he said while there are things he agrees/disagrees with regarding the Catholic Church, he would support me and be my partner is raising our kids in the Catholic Church as long as it's OK if they want to learn about and are exposed to other religions. I am 100% fine with that. My father is not Catholic and it was NEVER an issue when growing up. He, along with his father, shared other teachings and ideas through stories and I never once was confused or felt pressured to believe one thing or another. I think my FI will take on the same role. It is very important to me that our children develop acceptance and tolerance towards all people, but I also think having a specific foundation will just make them stronger in becoming good people. 

It does seem to me that you may be more comfortable not having Mass. Having a ceremony might be a good compromise for you. At the very least, it keeps that door open in case you do want to have your children baptized, or if you do want to resturn to the Chruch. 

Jasmine&Rajah

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:7bf2d8ab-a535-4296-97e1-f2fb15d16c6a">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]. Professor - I remember the exact moment when I begain to question my faith - It was during confirmation when I learned that unbaptized babies do not go to heaven.
Posted by mjmchugh86[/QUOTE]

That is not what the Catholic Church teaches.  I am so sorry to hear that this misunderstanding led to a weakening of your faith.

From the Cathechism:

<span class="text"><strong>1261</strong> As regards <em>children who have died without Baptism</em>, the Church can only entrust them to the mercy of God, as she does in her funeral rites for them. Indeed, the great mercy of God who desires that all men should be saved, and Jesus' tenderness toward children which caused him to say: "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them,"⁶⁴ allow us to hope that there is a way of salvation for children who have died without Baptism. All the more urgent is the Church's call not to prevent little children coming to Christ through the gift of holy Baptism.


Praying that God blesses you on this journey.  :-)



</span>

mjmchugh86

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:7ce9f2e8-ce10-45cc-9c54-29240f4b6af8">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony : That is not what the Catholic Church teaches.  I am so sorry to hear that this misunderstanding led to a weakening of your faith. From the Cathechism: 1261 As regards children who have died without Baptism , the Church can only entrust them to the mercy of God, as she does in her funeral rites for them. Indeed, the great mercy of God who desires that all men should be saved, and Jesus' tenderness toward children which caused him to say: "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them," 64 allow us to hope that there is a way of salvation for children who have died without Baptism. All the more urgent is the Church's call not to prevent little children coming to Christ through the gift of holy Baptism. Praying that God blesses you on this journey.  :-)
Posted by Jasmine&Rajah[/QUOTE]

Thank you for your reply,

In 2002, when I made my confirmation, the offical church doctrine stated that children who died without baptism would go to limbo, a place without suffering, but also without knowledge of God's love and seperate from heaven. While limbo is not mentioned in the Cathechism, it is part of chuch doctrine, dating back to the 13th century. This is a vast improvement, in my opinion, of the teachings of St. Augustine, who stated that unbaptized children went to hell.

In 2007 (well into my questioning of my faith), Pope Benedict announced a change in the interpretation of doctrine, saying that though God's love and mercy, unbaptized children may enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he was not prepared to say that unbaptized children <u>would</u> be admitted into the kingdom of heaven. 

Here is a link to that story.

<a href="http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0702216.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0702216.htm</a>

This is only one aspect of the chuch I do not agree with
 

Riss91

No one here can ever say that we KNOW for certain who gets into heaven, or who is eligble for heaven. The idea of limbo is no longer current doctrine.

Hopefully we've at least relieved one of your concerns!

professorscience

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:c0e6a4c4-33e5-4311-ac7f-a5bc7c49fdd0">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]No one here can ever say that we KNOW for certain who gets into heaven, or who is eligble for heaven. The idea of limbo is no longer current doctrine. Hopefully we've at least relieved one of your concerns!
Posted by Riss91[/QUOTE]

This is what I was going to say.  There is no way to fully know who does or does not go to Heaven.

I hope we've helped at least a little!

mjmchugh86

Thanks Riss and Professor! I certainly did not come here to argue Church teachings, and you have all been very helpful.

In responce to my previous question, has anyone else had a ceremony outside of their own church? What was your experience with that? Also, If we do get married in a church far away, how would pre-cana work? Would we travel there, or would we be able to go to the church in the city we live in?

professorscience

I know that question has come up a lot, so you are definitely not alone.  I think you should contact the church where you want to get married first, and see what their policy is?  You'll have to explain why you're not getting married in your "home" church.  I know military couples sometimes complete their marriage prep via Skype, and others do their marriage prep at one parish, but get married at another.  I think it's a pretty easy situation to handle!

caitriona87

Just to clarify further re: infants who die without baptism...limbo was never official doctrine of the Church. It was proposed (yes, by saints...but they do not teach infallibly!) but was never magisterial teaching (i.e., taught by all bishops in union with the Pope.)

The thing is that God has not revealed exactly what happens in this situation, so the Church can't say.  I don't mean to keep hammering this in but I would just hate to see bad feelings take place over something that is a misunderstanding instead of the truth. Also for full disclosure, I definitely have a horse in the race as my own son died prior to baptism. We baptized him anyway as we do not know for sure when the soul leaves the body. As Catholics we also believe there are two other kinds of baptism aside from by water--baptism by fire (as in martyrdom for the Faith) and baptism by desire (if someone wanted or would have wanted baptism but did not have the opportunity for whatever reason.)


Anyway, sorry to derail going off topic.

I've had friends get married in a church they did not live near, and they were able to do pre-cana at a local church; it just involved getting the go-ahead from the priest/church where they would be married.

lalaith50

mjm- I hope you don't interpret this as arguing, but I was so upset when I first read that you had originally started to question the Church because of misinformation, that I just feel like I have to clarify this-

I'm not sure of the exact nuance from the CNS link you posted, and how whatever they "decided" in 2007 is different from previous beliefs, because even that link mentions how as early as 1970 there was a funeral rite for unbaptized infants (so obviously the Church didnt teach that they went to hell,) and the Catechism quote that Jasmine mentioned which speaks of a "hope for salvation," was published in 1995! 

So that is just horrible that someone (especially in a position of teaching authority!) told you unbaptized babies do not go to heaven! Like PPs have said, we just don't know! (As we don't know for a fact that anyone goes to heaven! [except canonized Saints])

ETA: sorry it looks like we are pounding this topic! I was typing the same time as PP!

mjmchugh86

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_need-advice-on-catholic-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:e1e3f213-ad88-4f9d-891f-9816947eed23Post:57b026cb-d526-43dd-be9c-5bc369dfaf75">Re: Need advice on Catholic ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]Just to clarify further re: infants who die without baptism...limbo was never official doctrine of the Church. It was proposed (yes, by saints...but they do not teach infallibly!) but was never magisterial teaching (i.e., taught by all bishops in union with the Pope.) The thing is that God has not revealed exactly what happens in this situation, so the Church can't say.  I don't mean to keep hammering this in but I would just hate to see bad feelings take place over something that is a misunderstanding instead of the truth. Also for full disclosure, I definitely have a horse in the race as my own son died prior to baptism. We baptized him anyway as we do not know for sure when the soul leaves the body. As Catholics we also believe there are two other kinds of baptism aside from by water--baptism by fire (as in martyrdom for the Faith) and baptism by desire (if someone wanted or would have wanted baptism but did not have the opportunity for whatever reason.) Anyway, sorry to derail going off topic. I've had friends get married in a church they did not live near, and they were able to do pre-cana at a local church; it just involved getting the go-ahead from the priest/church where they would be married.
Posted by caitriona87[/QUOTE]

Caitriona - I am so sorry for your loss. Thank you for advice.

agapecarrie

Just to reiterate, the "limbo" thing was never ever official doctrine of the church.

mjmchugh86

Perhaps I should clarify.

I was NEVER taught that unbaptized babies go to hell. I don't want to mislead people into thinking that is what I was taught.

I was, however, taught that because babies were unbaptized, they were never free from original sin, and were not permitted access into the kingdom of heaven. They were sent to limbo, a place which was peaceful and free from suffering, but could not go to heaven. Again, I understand that we do not know who goes to heaven, however it was my understanding that these babies were denyed the chance. I understand this is not what is officially taught by the chuch, but was widely theologized, and what I have heard from several different sources.

I understand that recently the church has changed their position on this, and this is not longer what the church teaches. However, Professor asked me what it was that lead me to doubt the church, and this is what it was.

I hope I have not offended anyone, as that certainly was not my intent. And if anyone can point me to a source that says that this is not what the church taught and that I am wrong - please point me in that direction!

agapecarrie

The church never taught limbo officially. Unfortunately, many teachers did. I don't think you can prove a negative, can you? If it wasn't in the baltimore catechsim, official church documents, or current catechism...then it wasn't a teaching.

Church Teaching (As in doctrine about faith and morals) can never change. If they changed, one wouldn't be true, and that's impossible.

lalaith50

[QUOTE]And if anyone can point me to a source that says that this is not what the church taught and that I am wrong - please point me in that direction!
Posted by mjmchugh86[/QUOTE]
Doesn't this direct quote from the Catechism (already mentioned above) answer your question?<div>"<span style="font-family:Arial;font-size:12px;background-color:#ffffff;">Jesus' tenderness toward children which caused him to say: "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them,"</span><span style="font-family:Arial;font-size:12px;background-color:#ffffff;"> <strong>allow us to hope that there is a way of salvation</strong> for children who have died without Baptism. "</span></div><div><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:12px;">
</span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span style="font-size:12px;">That is far different from saying they do *not* go to heaven-- in fact, it completely leaves open the possibility-- and it certainly does not say they go to "Limbo." Is that the exact issue you were wondering about? Or was there a slightly different angle that you wanted a document to address?</span></font></div>

mjmchugh86

Ok, so you have convinced me what I (and i assume many other people) was taught was incorrect.

But I do have some question then regaurding baptism. If God can grant an infant salvation to an infant without baptism, can he grant it to anyone? What then would be the point of baptism?
 Does the person have to have not sinned to be considered for salvation in this way? I know someone upthread mentioned baptism through desire/martyrdom. Assuming that infants cannot become martyrs, could they become one through desire? Would an infant be considered capable of this kind of thought?

 - Not an argument, I just really wound like the anwsers!

Riss91

Really great, thoughtful question.

God can grant salvation to whomever He chooses, yes. (I mean, He is God - He can do whatever He wants!!). This is why it would be possible for non-Christians, or even athiests to get into Heaven. But, we do not know what the parameters are, so it is better to be "safe than sorry", right?

Baptism washes away original sin, so you can think of that as being one step closer, or a bit "cleaner" where your soul is concerned. Baptism also brings you into the faith, and leaves an indellible mark on your soul. There are many blessings and much grace that attained though sacraments.

Riss91

Also - I just want you to know - I have been told completely false information from priests and other laypeople that have the repertoire/training that would lead you to believe they knew what they were talking about! Unfortunately, it is pretty common to be given inaccurate information. We see a lot of brides get misinformation all the time!

I think that's why many of us are so eager to ensure that others at least have the correct info when they are makeing a determination of the Church and her doctrine.