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Catholic Weddings

Thoughts on Annulment

My fiance and I are both Catholic, and wanting to be married in the Catholic church. I was married once before, my fiance has not. Because my first marriage was in the church, even though my ex was not Catholic, I am going through the annulment process. I wasn't initally sure I wanted to go through all the painful paperwork, drudging up years of bad memories with my ex, and my own turbulent years leading up to that marriage. So, I went to confession several times and finally decided to go through and do it. At that time, my fiance and I were not engaged. Now, I've gotten my painful questionaire filled out and sent back. But obviously, now we are engaged. I know the church is pretty insistant on waiting to plan any wedding until the process is completed and approved. His parish priest even called me and said he thought we should wait (called to update our dating status so the forms were correct). Both my fiance and I, at great length, discussed waiting and believe that there is just too much "what if" to wait. There is no guarantee the annulment request will be approved -- though priest says it looks like I have at least 5 solid reasons for it being approved. And neither of us feel that we should put the start of our life together on hold for church red tape. Part of me is angry that I even have to go through this process when my ex remarried literally 1 month after the civil divorce was final. Don't get me wrong, I love the church. But I take issue sometimes with its policies. So, we're planning our wedding for next October and praying that the annulment goes through expediently so we can be married in the church. If, however, it does not, then we'll be married by my uncle (a non-demonitational Christian minister) and try for a convalidation ceremony at a later date. We know that the convalidation is not a big to-do and would be for ourselves alone. We're fine with that. Our very Catholic families are fine with that. But the parish priest does not seem fine with that, and that makes me nervous. I'm already feeling shut-out from the church by not getting to take communion (a major sticking point with me as my daughter just had her first this past spring), and by going through this annulment process. So uncertain about this right now. I would really love to hear other people's opinions and thoughts on the matter.
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Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart

Re: Thoughts on Annulment

  • Riss91Riss91 member
    Eighth Anniversary 1000 Comments 25 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited December 2011
    First of all - welcome to the board! I'm sorry that you are struggling - and I appreciate your honesty.

    Though I haven't been in your shoes, I know there are many ladies here who have gone through the annulment process and found it to be extremely rewarding and freeing .

    To explain the Church's point of view: Your first marriage still exists whether you have divorced or not. A civil divorce cannot undo the bonds of marriage under God. This is why annulments are necessary. So, until the annulment goes through, you are still considered married. I know that it sounds impossible to wait so long for the annulment, but I would personally feel uncomfortable going through with wedding planning until it was settled. It does take a long time, but there is a reason for that - both you and the Church need to carefully examine that marriage in that process. It's not something to be rushed.

    Try to understand the position you put your priest in when you say you'll just get married again without the annulment and then seek a convalidation. You are flat out telling him that you are choosing your desires over the doctrine of the Church. You're saying "Hey, I only want to follow your rules, and use your sacraments when it suits me". It isn't the Church's fault that you are ready for another marriage, but haven't sought an annulment. And you're asking a lot of a priest if you're telling him you simply don't care about certain rules of the Church, but you want him to grant you a convalidation.

    I know this is really difficult, but I think you will feel so much better if you wait to be married until the annulment is settled. I truly believe it will be worth the wait. Best wishes to you!
  • chelseamb11chelseamb11 member
    2500 Comments Third Anniversary 25 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited December 2011
    Riss makes a lot of valid points.  This is a crappy position to be in, and I'm sorry.  How long does it take to find out if you got the anullment and for it to actually happen?  If it's only a few months, you would still be able to feasably plan for October of next year.  My FSIL planned her wedding in 4 months and all the details were great.  By starting the planning process now, you do have thast slight danger of it not going through and then, like you were planning, getting married outside the church.  I'm not 100% on this, but I feel like if you get married outside the church because you were more or less too impatient to get married in it, there is no way they will convalidate your marriage later (I hope I'm wrong, but I feel like logically they really won't go for what you are doing).  I know it's a tough road, so whatever you decide, I think you should really talk to your priest.  He sounds like a  nice guy based on how you described him.  He can let you know what can happen depending on which road you choose.  I'd just hate to see you risk the validity of your marriage in the church's eyes simply because you couldn't wait an extra 6 months to a year.
  • Calypso1977Calypso1977 member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 25 Love Its First Answer
    edited December 2011
    well, really, you have to ask yourself whether or not marrying in the church is important to you. it sounds like it is, so waiting is what makes sense.

    you have to consider the consequences of marrying civilly and "hoping" the annulment goes through.  if it does not, you are legally married to someone to whom you can NEVER be married to in the eyes of the church.  you would essentially be living in sin for hte rest of your life, unable to participate in the sacraments.  that's huge, to me.

    are they refusing you communion now becuase you are living together?  the priest does have the right to do that, if he suspects that you are not in a state of grace.

    your ex could remarry right away becuase he was not catholic.  you are, and sounds like you want to remain so.  so of course its easier for him, so you cant let that get you down!  what you will have in the end is worth it.

    annulments often take 2 years, from what ive heard.  you were catholic and married in the church the first time.  it wont be quick and simple, but it sounds like from what they are telling you, it may very well go through.  i know its hard to be patient and wait, but it will be worth it.

    good luck!
  • edited December 2011
    Thirteen years after my divorce, I finally sought an annulment.  I was ready to move on with my life and begin dating.  I had sufficient grounds and the annulment took about 8 months.  It is important that you and your witnesses complete and return the questionnaires as soon as possible to move the process along.  It helps as well if your ex cooperates, simply by not contesting.  I found the process very rewarding and freeing.  I settled in my mind many of the issues that were still affecting me.  I started dating during the process, but did not meet my FI until after my marriage was nullified.  I was resentful of my ex who was Catholic, but remarried a non-Catholic a couple years after the wedding.  The Church was not important to him.  That is what you have to decide - how important is your religion to you?  Will you regret it years from now if you do not get married in the Church?  I am so happy that I am now able to marry my Lutheran FI in my Church.

    As far as Communion, I received Communion while I was divorced and continued to be a EM, since I had not remarried.  Perhaps it is as Calypso stated, that it is because you are living together?

    I wish you well.
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  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    The church honors marriages by believing people when they vow to love until death. 

    and then people get mad at the church because she holds them to that.

    It is out of charity that the church has the annulment process to investigate if those vows were somehow faulty (whether by impediments, consent, etc).  
  • mica178mica178 member
    5000 Comments Fourth Anniversary
    edited December 2011
    I feel that if your parish priest is not comfortable with your current plan, that's an indication that a petition for convalidation is less likely to be successful.

    Could you delay wedding planning for now and see how the annulment proceedings go?  By putting the wedding plans on hold, you are showing your parish/priest that you are serious about wanting to get the annulment and then married in the church, and act of faith, if you will.  Going ahead with wedding planning without the annulment being granted indicates that you don't care as much about having a valid Catholic wedding.
  • edited December 2011
    I know a blunt person would tell me that I need to find another religion because I can't seem to follow Catholicism to a tee. But this is my church. This is what I believe, even though there are things that I don't agree with completely. I view it sort of like marriage: you have to work hard to make the relationship work at all. Disagreements are inevitable. That said, I don't know how  to practice in a faith that is seemingly shutting me out for a divorce I didn't initiate, and punishing me for wanting to remarry. I can't partake of communion (we're living together because I'm out of work and its economically and financially practical, so I understand the church's stance on that--even if it wrankles a bit). I have to put myself through paperwork and psychological hell to try and have the past annulled. I have to try to gently explain to my child why the church doesn't acknowledge my life, why I can't celebrate communion at mass with her. It is gut-wrenching.

    I'm terrified that the annulment won't go through, even though our priest tells us he's pretty sure it will (in the same breath, he also says that then again, he's not a tribunal lawyer so he can't be positive). The diocese tries to resolve all petitions within a year--which is why I thought we'd be ok since I started the process back in June, and completed my paperwork in August. Then my fiance proposed and we both knew we wanted to be married in the church. We thought we'd be ok setting the date for end of October next year. By having started the process before I knew I was going to be remarried, I don't see how anyone could say I'm not taking the Catholic faith seriously. I don't see how our priest could think that I'm not being considerate of church policy. But if the annulment doesn't go through, doesn't get approval, then we'll have waited for nothing. We'll have put our lives on hold for nothing, and the church would still not acknowledge our marriage.

    I know I should really talk to our priest about this conflict. It doesn't help that I'm painfully shy, private, and our priest has really only met me twice and has known my fiance and his family forever. I'm just saddened to feel like I'm being pushed out, that my child in Catholic school will eventually be taught that only she and not her family is a part of the church. I don't know how I can continue to go to mass every week and feel like I'm a bystander instead of a participant.

    I wish I knew others that have been, or are, in this predicament.
    image
    Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart
  • edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]The church honors marriages by believing people when they vow to love until death.  and then people get mad at the church because she holds them to that. It is out of charity that the church has the annulment process to investigate if those vows were somehow faulty (whether by impediments, consent, etc).  
    Posted by agapecarrie[/QUOTE]

    I really am not mad in the slightest that the church holds me to that. I would still be in that marriage had my ex had the same fortitude. Of course I care, and wish to keep being part of the church. I wouldn't be on this board if I didn't. Your comment, while perhaps not meant to be, was incredibly snarky towards a first-time poster on this board who just opened her heart out. I certainly hope you're not like that toward everyone.

    I really do understand the process, the need for it, and its purpose. I am, nonetheless, pained by it. A little sympathy and compassion would be appreciated.

    I'm going to make an appointment to meet with our priest. I should get to know him better anyways, and perhaps he can put my anxiety to rest and restore that bit of faith that is really hurting right now.
    image
    Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    It was not snarky at all. It was simple facts that you laid out. 

    You said this:

    And neither of us feel that we should put the start of our life together on hold for church red tape. Part of me is angry that I even have to go through this process when my ex remarried literally 1 month after the civil divorce was final. Don't get me wrong, I love the church. But I take issue sometimes with its policies

    I laid out what you call a "policy". The church believes people when they vow for life. It's not a policy, its following Jesus' teaching that marriage lasts until death. You are still married. 

    The fact that you all told us that you are going to circumvent the church and choose a civil marriage outside of the church over being in communion with the church, if thats what it comes down to, is offensive to Catholics. 

    Instead of viewing it as a policy, laying it out as it really is...marriage lasts until death, and that out of charity there is the annulment process, hopefully you can see this is a good thing, and not against you. 

    By the way, if you are not engaging in premarital sexual activity, discuss this with the priest.... you can receive communion because you can be in the state of grace, even if living with someone. 
  • Riss91Riss91 member
    Eighth Anniversary 1000 Comments 25 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE] That said, I don't know how  to practice in a faith that is seemingly shutting me out for a divorce I didn't initiate , and punishing me for wanting to remarry.
    Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

    I completely understand why it would feel this way, but I think you need to look at it from the Church's perspective. They are not doing this to punish you. They are not shutting you out. In fact, they are trying to bring you back into the Church, to allow you to marry again. When you think about all the time and effort of the people within the Church that will be reviewing your case, it is really a kind thing they are doing FOR you. I know it is not an easy process and in fact can be painful to recall all the details, but the idea is to clear it up for you. Not to tear you down. I think once you are more involved in the process, this will be more apparent.

    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE] But if the annulment doesn't go through, doesn't get approval, then we'll have waited for nothing. We'll have put our lives on hold for nothing, and the church would still not acknowledge our marriage.
    Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

    Another area where I think it's wise to try and step back from your gut-reaction. It's not for NOTHING. Going through the process is the right thing to do. It will be beneficial to you as part of confronting the past. If the Church would not allow your annulment to go through, there is a valid reason for it. And that reason is something you do need to be aware of before you do anything else. At the end of the day, you will stand before God and be responsible for your actions. The Church is trying to help you do what is right for your own sake. So at that moment, God will be happy with the choices you've made. They also have to be certain they aren't just haphazardly giving out sacraments. That would demeen the very sacrements themselves.

    Of course it would be heart wrenching to have gone through the process, waited and be declined, but I think you shouldn't be focused on that outcome. Try to pray for the best, ask for guidance and trust in Him.


    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE] I don't know how I can continue to go to mass every week and feel like I'm a bystander instead of a participant. I wish I knew others that have been, or are, in this predicament.
    Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

    Many many people do not receive communion every week at mass. Not everyone has made it to confession in time. Try not to focus on that.

    I know there are many ladies that have come on this board that have gone through this process - and many echoed that it was very difficult and very rewarding. I'm hoping more of them peek their heads in.
  • edited December 2011
    To Agape:

    Wow. Even that came off as rude. I would choose your wording carefully in the future.

    Look, I'm not at all seeking for someone to tell me that our proposed plan is ok to Catholics, the Church, or anyone other than my fiance and I. What I am looking for is some guidance. If I wanted to know the specifics of Canon Law, I'd ask. As it is, I'm very familiar and knew that this is never a question of right or wrong. So, let me be more specific.

    I'd like to know:

    1) If anyone has gone through the annulment procedure while trying to plan a wedding--how did it go?

    2) If anyone has had a convalidation ceremony because they were not married in the Church initially--how did that go?

    3) If anyone was denied an annulment, and chose to remarry, how do you practice your faith? Do you feel like an outsider?
    image
    Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart
  • edited December 2011
    To Riss:

    Thank you. It is hard to step back from what is such an emotional process and think of it in terms of the Church guiding me toward what is ultimately for the best. It feels so unknown right now. And unfortunately at my church, very VERY few people sit out communion, so it always feels a bit more pointed.

    I knew this was never going to be easy.
    image
    Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart
  • chelseamb11chelseamb11 member
    2500 Comments Third Anniversary 25 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]To Agape: Wow. Even that came off as rude. I would choose your wording carefully in the future. Look, I'm not at all seeking for someone to tell me that our proposed plan is ok to Catholics, the Church, or anyone other than my fiance and I. What I am looking for is some guidance. If I wanted to know the specifics of Canon Law, I'd ask. As it is, I'm very familiar and knew that this is never a question of right or wrong. So, let me be more specific. I'd like to know: 1) If anyone has gone through the annulment procedure while trying to plan a wedding--how did it go? 2) If anyone has had a convalidation ceremony because they were not married in the Church initially--how did that go? 3) If anyone was denied an annulment, and chose to remarry, how do you practice your faith? Do you feel like an outsider?
    Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

    This comes off a lot ruder than what she said. She was just laying out the facts for you.
    I know this is a crappy situation, but you can't expect us to just fawn all over you and say "awww poor baby, the church is being super stupid, you should plan your wedding anyways. that'll show them".  Because that is not how we feel.

    Think of it this way.  How old is your daughter?  Let's just say she wants to get her bellybutton pierced, but you told her you needed to wait a week to think it through.  In the meantime, she gets it pierced, HOPING that you will be okay with it.  How would you feel?  The Catholic Church is like your parent in this situation.  Guidng you with principles and honesty in order to bring you closer to God.  You need to trust in them that they know what is right for you and for your soul in this situation.  If they just gave out anullments to everyone, the sanctity of "till death do us part" will be completely lost.  I agree, in some situations, it's just not right because one spouse (or both) has completely changed and is unable to set things right.  Just trust in the system that they will give you justice :)
  • edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment : This comes off a lot ruder than what she said.

    Then my apologies. I'm certainly not wanting or trying to be rude. Just frustrated.

    but you can't expect us to just fawn all over you and say "awww poor baby, the church is being super stupid, you should plan your wedding anyways. that'll show them".  Because that is not how we feel.
    Posted by chelseamb11[/QUOTE]

    As I said previously, "I'm not at all seeking for someone to tell me that our proposed plan is ok to Catholics, the Church, or anyone other than my fiance and I. What I am looking for is some guidance."

    That doesn't mean I want an "aww, poor baby approach", but as it is such an emotional and stressful situation, a little effort at sympathy would be appropriate towards anyone with such an issue. If someone is obviously stressed, then hitting them over the head with a point blank and blunt view isn't the best method of commanding a positive reactionary response.

    All said, I understand very clearly what everyone, Agape included, is saying. I appreciate the opinions given, even when not addressing my real question.

    Chelsea, thank you for putting it in a metaphor as such. From that stand point, I completely understand the view. Granted, I understood it before. But you illustrated it perfectly.

    Agape, thank you for your susinct translation of the church's laws. Though thoroughly familiar with Canon Law, I know you meant well in reminding me. And I apologize for snapping back at you. Please understand that my emotions are a bit strained at present.

    Riss, your words were kind and I genuinely appreciate that. I really appreciate the reminder to have faith that things will work out for the best, not to think about the worst case scenario, and to trust that the Church is acting on my behalf. Its not always easy to step back from a stressful sitatiion, but I am trying and praying.

    Regarding the actual questions I pose for anyone with actual experience on the matters, I still would VERY much love to hear how things have worked out for you. I know that no situation is exactly the same, but I believe that shared experiences can have elements of commonality and are thus valuable in application to one's own life.

    Thank you all.
    image
    Ovarian cyst lapro: '01, '04, '09 Conal biopsy: '01- results negative Dilation: '03 for cervical scarring Pcos test: '05, FSH and LH normal Mirena removed July '12 My Ovulation Chart
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    You didn't list all of the options: I can give you a real life experience. Not mine, but a friend.

    His wife cheated on him. He did not file for the divorce, she did. She was immediately engaged to someone else, broke it off, had other relationships, and now is married outside the church.

    He, on the other hand, is living faithful to her. He is living a chaste single life. (In my opinion, after knowing the whole story, his annulment would be very simple, there are many issues that would make her incapable of consenting) but he will not apply for annulment. If he did and weren't granted one, he would live the same way. Faithful to his vows he made...not marrying another. He chooses the church over another person. This is the only option in order to remain in the state of grace and be able to receive Christ in the Eucharist.

    People do indeed choose this. It's difficult, but they do.

    Adding: what I mean by "only option" is if an annulment isn't granted. I don't mean to hail my friend as "holier" for not applying for annulment--that's his choice that I don't necesarily agree with, but thats another story.
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    Also,

    I wasn't translating church's laws. These are not church's laws. These are Christ's Truth. There is a big difference. A church law is a discipline that may or may not be changed.

    You say you are looking for guidence. None of us are going to "guide" you to live in a state of mortal sin outside the church. We are trying to encourage you change your view of the whole situation. We want you to be in communion with the church, receiving the infinite graces from the Eucharist. Please do not choose a person (or anything else) over this.
  • Riss91Riss91 member
    Eighth Anniversary 1000 Comments 25 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited December 2011
    lv - you're more than welcome. Also - try to read agape's post for content only. She really does offer a wealth of information, however coldly it is communicated. Her intent is to clear up misconception and allow you to think everything through.
  • chrissyinatlchrissyinatl member
    100 Comments
    edited December 2011
    I am kind of a similar situation as you, OP.

    My Fiance was previously married, and his wife of 11 years wrote him a "Dear John" letter one day. He thought they were happy, and it turns out she wasn't, and wanted to "see other people".  The divorce was 100% her idea, and after a year of counseling, he still wasn't able to make her see that they made vows. 

    Anyways, they were not married in the Catholic church, so his process is less extensive then an anullment, but similar.  We also had to WAIT.  We got engaged in October and did not hear back from the tribunal until MARCH!  It was torturous, especially since it should have been an easy case.  I have not been married before, and his should have been very easy to grant a "lack of form".

    Am I glad we waited to get the All-Clear from the church?  YES!  I have dreamed my whole life of a Catholic wedding, Catholic marriage, Catholic babies that are baptized in the Catholic church. 

    The waiting was HARD but it's worth it.  I HATED the questions daily from people about "When are you going to set a date?" and always cracked a few times and settled for a civil ceremony.

    So anyways that's my personal experience with it.  Hope that helps! 
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • caitriona87caitriona87 member
    Fifth Anniversary 100 Comments
    edited December 2011
    lv, I haven't been through this process myself but I did just want to say two things as far as receiving Communion goes. First, that just being under the same roof does not by itself keep you out of the state of grace. If you live chastely, as brother and sister, you could receive. If you have not up until this point, but are willing to do so, you can confess, begin living chastely, and receive the Eucharist. The graces of the sacraments would probably be so beneficial to you through this trying time.

    Secondly I just want to reiterate that not receiving is perfectly ok and in fact necessary when we are not in the state of grace. It is really an issue that needs to be addressed more, IMO because when you look at the line for confession vs. the line for communion in most parishes....something doesn't add up. It is totally fine to attend Mass and not receive, and we can see this in the precepts of the Church. We are required to attend Mass every Sunday, but only required to receive once per year. Obviously more frequently is awesome, but those are the requirements, so don't feel "lesser" in any way if you are not receiving. There are all kinds of reasons people don't--not being in the state of grace, not having fasted for the required length of time, even not being in a proper disposition of heart. I have attended Mass without receiving for all those reasons at one time or another.

    Finally I just wanted to encourage you in your wait...although I haven't been in this exact situation, I'm going through my own hardship right now and sometimes have a hard time trusting that God really has something good planned in the future for me. But we've got to do it. There is no resurrection without the cross. "For I know well the plans I have in mind for you, says the LORD, plans for your welfare, not for woe! plans to give you a future full of hope." I'm sure you already know this verse but I just thought I'd try to give you a little encouragement...God is faithful, our part is just to keep His commandments and trust in Him. Good luck with everything.
    Our little saint, 12/18/2010-12/28/2010

    [IMG]http://i40.tinypic.com/2hnyji0.jpg[/IMG]
  • ootmother2ootmother2 member
    Tenth Anniversary 5000 Comments 25 Love Its First Answer
    edited December 2011
    Welcome, lv,

    I did go through the annulment procedure after my divorce.  I wasn't planning on remarrying at the time so there was not set rush on it.  Start to finish, it took a bit over 6 months.   I do believe that's faster than the norm but my exH was cooperative from day one.

    I think that the tribunals in larger cities may work faster just due to the sheer numbers.  That's just a guess though.  Calypso said she thought the norm was two year but I know a couple in her area who had his first marriage annuled in less a year.

    Don't throw in the towel now. If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right.

    Good luck!
  • doctabroccolidoctabroccoli member
    1000 Comments
    edited December 2011
    Hi lv -
    Just wanted to say welcome!  Trust me, I know how it feels to not be in agreement with 100% of what the Church says.  And with some prayer, you'll know what is best for you and your fiance. 

    Good luck!
    BabyFruit Ticker
    Waiting to meet the baby broccoli on 5/5/2013!
  • blush64blush64 member
    Sixth Anniversary 500 Comments
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]Hi lv - Just wanted to say welcome!  Trust me, I know how it feels to not be in agreement with 100% of what the Church says.  And with some prayer, you'll know what is best for you and your fiance.  Good luck!
    Posted by doctabroccoli[/QUOTE]

    I agree with this.

    I do not agree 100% with what the church says. I do follow the teaching of Jesus as best I can though.

    The poster I have quoted said it best. Pray about it and talk with your fiance.
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    The teaching of Jesus and the church are not separate nor conflicting.
  • edited December 2011
    Just a short comment from a lurker on this board-

    My annulement from my first marraige took only a few weeks, I cannot recall exactlly how long, but it seemed to be over fairly quickly. I was lucky enough to have my Priest on the marraige tribunal at the time and he took care of all the paper work and everything for me.

    He has all the original paper work and has openlly offered it to the our Rector if he wanted copies but he never asked for them and only asked for statements from the both of us about what happend in our previous marraiges.

    I know it's frustrating, but hang in there. It will be over before you know it.
  • ootmother2ootmother2 member
    Tenth Anniversary 5000 Comments 25 Love Its First Answer
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]Hi lv - Just wanted to say welcome!  Trust me, I know how it feels to not be in agreement with 100% of what the Church says.  And with some prayer, you'll know what is best for you and your fiance.  Good luck!
    Posted by doctabroccoli[/QUOTE]


    ditto

    Docta is right, all we can humanly do is try to follow the best we can, even if we're not in total agreement with what the Church says.  God knows that we are human and I'm pretty sure he keeps that in mind ;)
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]Just a short comment from a lurker on this board- My annulement from my first marraige took only a few weeks, I cannot recall exactlly how long, but it seemed to be over fairly quickly. I was lucky enough to have my Priest on the marraige tribunal at the time and he took care of all the paper work and everything for me. He has all the original paper work and has openlly offered it to the our Rector if he wanted copies but he never asked for them and only asked for statements from the both of us about what happend in our previous marraiges. I know it's frustrating, but hang in there. It will be over before you know it.
    Posted by LadyRusa[/QUOTE]

    This was most likely a lack of form decree rather than a full out annulment. Even if the tribunal had no other cases to investigate it takes longer than a few weeks to compile a case.
  • blush64blush64 member
    Sixth Anniversary 500 Comments
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]The teaching of Jesus and the church are not separate nor conflicting.
    Posted by agapecarrie[/QUOTE]

    Throughout history there have been times when the teachings of the church and the teaching of Jesus were not in line. I don't judge the present day church by that but there are still rules, traditions, rituals, of the church that were not taught by Jesus. Also, depending on where you are in the world the Catholic church is different.
  • agapecarrieagapecarrie member
    Knottie Warrior 1000 Comments 100 Love Its Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thoughts on Annulment : Throughout history there have been times when the teachings of the church and the teaching of Jesus were not in line. I don't judge the present day church by that but there are still rules, traditions, rituals, of the church that were not taught by Jesus. Also, depending on where you are in the world the Catholic church is different.
    Posted by blush64[/QUOTE]

    You are confusing tradition with "Tradition". Discipline vs doctrine. Doctrine ..the teachings of the church, have never ever changed nor conflicted with Jesus's teachings. Ever. In fact, Jesus said to Peter " the gates of hell will not prevail against the church and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven". This is not the same as discipine and practice. Paul said "The pillar and foundation of truth is the church". 
    The Whole universal catholic church is not different in different parts of the world when it comes to belief in faith and morals. They have different rites and ways of practicing, some into different sacramental theology, but not in doctrine of faith and morals. 
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