Speaking of church...

SarieP

There is a board on the Bump (cringe) that I visit frequently and a certain post really got me going and I'm curious to know the response that would be on here.  I will share my response a little later.Husband and Wife are pregnant.  Wife's family tradition is to have baby baptized in the same gown and then sew initials on the gown to show all the babies who have been baptized.  Husband is not religious in any way.  Wife is agnostic.  Husband does not want baby baptized.  Wife does for tradition's sake.  Wife's mom wants to "borrow" baby to get baptized without telling Husband.  Wife doesn't know what to do.How would you reply?

vallyhoo

She needs her head examined. Are you PG, Sarie?

opalsky007

This is why I believe in letting children make their own decisions, when they're old enough.

danieliza1127

I would suggest husband and wife come to an agreement and stick to their own decision.  If it were me, I would go ahead and have the baby baptized.  What is the harm?  My brother and his wife had their baby baptized for her family's sake even though neither of them are religious.

SarieP

Vally, you shut your mouth when you're talking to me! hehe, no way, I'm not pg

Simply Fated

Borrow a baby? Babies are not hedge clippers... you can't just borrow one and hope for the best...Baptism is a religious ceremony that many people take seriously. Doing it just for traditions sake is making a mockery of it, in my opinion.

vallyhoo

I love that line! Ok just had to ask

danieliza1127

If it were me, I would go ahead and have the baby baptized.Not without my husband knowing though.  Felt I should clarify that.  I do not think they should "borrow" the baby with husband knowing.

salt78

Hell no you shouldn't baptize a child without telling the father. Personally, we have had lots of discussion about this. I am agnostic, FI is non-practicing Christian. I don't want to have our child baptized. FI wants to do it to make family happy.

vallyhoo

And also I think this is something they should have discussed BEFORE conceiving, but meh.My co-worker and her husband got into a HUGE debate over this. He wanted to baptize their future child for tradition's sake, she calls it "Fire Insurance." Personally, I don't see the point of doing it a) that young or b) when it has no significant meaning to either parent.

SarieP

Here is my c&p reply on the bump: I think it is absolutely absurd that you even have to ask this question.   Your husband is not religious at all and you are agnostic.  Why would you even consider baptism?  Baptism is not a tradition.  Baptism is the Christian sacrament signifying spiritual cleansing and rebirth.  If you are not a Christian and do not plan to raise your child as a Christian, it is an insult to Christianity that you would make such a mockery of such an important event just for the sake of sewing some initials on a gown.

tidetravel

I think there's a difference between "not religious" or "agnostic" and not agreeing with a religion or a ceremony being against one's personal views. What is the husband's reason for not wanting the baby baptized?  If he isn't religious, (and I read that as not caring one way or another), then I think he should agree to have the ceremony performed, simply because it seems that wife DOES want it, if only for tradition.  I don't see the harm there.Of course, "stealing" the baby for the baptism and performing it behind his back is wrong, as it's not respecting his opinion, either. 

ZRex

I am agnostic (but was raised Muslim) and my FI is Catholic. We're going to let our kids decide, so I wholeheartedly agree with whomever said that kids should be able to choose when they are old enough. That being said, I am terrified that one day I will go to pick up my kid ad school and FMIL will have kidnapped and baptized it.

ZRex

Stage, thanks for the clarification. I am so clueless about a lot of religious things. I'll put this on my list of "things to Wiki when I'm bored in class" list.

AlexiaANDRobert

Sarie, I liked your response. The whole situation is completely ridiculous.  I don't think it would EVER occur to anyone in my family or H's family to steal a kid to have him/her baptized. That is just NUTS!!!!

baystateapple

Sarie, I agree 100% with your response.That being said, if my husband and I were both agnostic (only he is BTW, I'm Christian), but my mother felt so serious about it that she wanted the baby baptized (my mom and FI's mom are both Catholic, so the cleansing of original sin is a Very Big Deal), I would talk to FI about having a private baptism -- in the Catholic Church, anyone who has holy water can baptize an infant in good faith.  I would never lie to him to have the baby baptized.  I would make an attempt to make a compromise between the two of us.But I wouldn't do it just for the "tradition."

baystateapple

Stage -- yup.  Catholic church calls it "baptism".

mwhitson14

While I agree that they should come to an agreement, I plan on christening on my child even though FI isn't hugely religious. In my church (nondenom), we see christening as the baby being accepted into a "second family," if you will. In this case, it means the baby will be loved and cared for by the church as if it was their own child. And in our church, we hold true to that. Hospital visits if the baby falls ill, treats on their birthday, spiritual guidance when they're ready. Christening and baptism are two totally different things, so I honestly think it's silly to say, "well, that's why something like this shouldn't be done until they're old enough to make the decision themselves." When they're old enough to make their own decisions, christening is no longer an option.

SarieP

Whit, while I understand what you are saying, if you and your FI both were not religious, there would be no point in christening your child and it would mock the church if you were doing it just for tradition's sake.

mwhitson14

Also, my church does both christenings and baptisms, but not baptisms for babies. Like I said though, we're nondenom and we blend a lot of church practices.

opalsky007

My church does not do christening, just infant baptism. I understand the arguments for infant baptism being a promise by the parents to raise their children in the church, and a promise by the church community to provide a "second family" for the child. I think that's great, I just don't think it equates with a person making their own decision to be baptized. I wish we'd just call it christening and be done with it. They're different ceremonies and should be treated as such.In any case, if the point is for the parents promising to raise the child in the church and the acceptance of the child by the church, why would a non-religious couple do it? I like your answer from the Nest, Sarie.

mwhitson14

Sarie, I see that side completely. But honestly, since christening means something a little different in my church, I might still have it done. I think it's nice to have a large, extended family being there for the baby. We even have some families in the church fostering children that were christened in our church, one after a tragic accident that killed both parents, and another who's mom willingly gave her up to a foster home. So I don't know. It's hard to compare my situation/church to that one.

sarabellam

Wife's mom needs to back the eff off! Husband and wife need to come to an agreement (and yeah, this probably should have been discussed prior to concoption).Stage, not only Catholic churches perform infant Baptism. Episcopal churches, as well as the other churches in the Anglican Communion, perform the Sacrament of Holy Baptism on infants (and older people, too.)

wadingmoose

This decision should be left up to the parents of the child to be baptized. 

vallyhoo

I would like to amend my first comment- I didn't realize the wife's MOM wanted to borrow the baby. The rest of my comments stand.And I agree that it shouldn't be treated as "Fire Insurance" (christening or baptisms) in case that wasn't clear. I blame it on the a-a-a-a-alcohol.

sarabellam

Stage, it is considered a Sacrament, though the infant doesn't speak for himself. I'd ask my local expert (my dad, the Episcopal priest), but he's somewhere on a cruise ship in the Carribean right now.