Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony

kellyheartache

We're getting married at a small outdoor chapel next Fall, and intended to have only parents, grandparents, and the wedding party attend the ceremony (thus inviting the rest of the family and friends to the reception). However, we're using my fiance's uncle as our wedding photographer, so he would obviously need to attend the ceremony as well. I'm trying to figure out if we need to invite his wife to the ceremony also, or would it be okay to only invite her to the reception? She's not the type to get offended easily, so it's not a huge issue, I just don't want to be accidentally rude to anyone or make her feel left out. 

jeanna85

I would be more worried about offending all of the people who are invited to your reception but aren't important enough to actually witness your ceremony. Any reason why you're leaving so many people out?

waltzingmatilda13

I would say include her if she wants to come on the understanding that her husband is going to be very busy taking pictures and won't be able to chat or anything.

jeanna: small ceremonies like this are acceptable because it is immediate family and WP only. If OP were picking and choosing and having about 50 people, that would be rude, but I think parents, grandparents and WP is okay.

ETA: I may be in the minority on this opinion. However, OP, you might want to consider that the reception is the most expensive part of the wedding.  Perhaps you could host everyone at both the ceremony and the reception.

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:e4173dc9-af42-4c3a-88d7-e1ff5339546e">Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]We're getting married at a small outdoor chapel next Fall, and intended to have only parents, grandparents, and the wedding party attend the ceremony (thus inviting the rest of the family and friends to the reception). However, we're using my fiance's uncle as our wedding photographer, so he would obviously need to attend the ceremony as well. I'm trying to figure out if we need to invite his wife to the ceremony also, or would it be okay to only invite her to the reception? She's not the type to get offended easily, so it's not a huge issue, <strong><u>I just don't want to be accidentally rude to anyone or make her feel left out. 
</u></strong>Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

What about everyone that just is invited to the reception. That is pretty rude.

kellyheartache

The chapel is a tiiiiiny outdoor chapel and can only fit 20 people comfortably. With his siblings, parents, step-parents, grandparents, my mom, both sets of my grandparents, and the wedding party (my best friend and her husband, the officiant, and his best man), we fill it up. The reception will be small as well, with only a few close friends and the rest of our families. We are on a budget of $5000 that we're coming up with ourselves, and no one has objected to this arrangement so far.

I'm mainly worried about his other aunts getting offended at the one aunt getting to see the ceremony. I'd hire a professional photographer if we had the money to do so, then we wouldn't have this mess. 

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:75534d00-0d2f-474a-9142-db21d7a5346a">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]We've already reserved the venue, and it's the only one around that works in our budget. As I said, no one that I have talked to about this arrangement has said anything negative (aside from thinking it's going to be way too cold in November in Texas haha), so I really just wanted input on the aunt thing, not the rest of our plans. I know that our budget is doable, especially with only 60ish people total.  Personally, I don't think I would be offended at all if I were invited to attend someone's wedding reception only with the understanding that the ceremony was limited to parents, grandparents, and the wedding party, so I don't see why that aspect is such a big issue here. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

We are just telling you that whatever you do on the Aunt issue, people will be offended.

You didn't answer my question, let me rephrase. Why did you pick a venue that was not large enough for your guests?

kellyheartache

Good gravy I was not expecting such a backlash here! I am not asking for your opinion on my wedding plans, only on whether or not to invite a single one of my fiance's aunts to the ceremony. If no one can answer this question for me without making me feel the need to defend myself, then I guess I'll just ask someone elsewhere. For people who are supposed to be offering help on not being rude, y'all sure are acting the opposite. Sheesh. 

waltzingmatilda13

Um, I answered your question. You apparently didn't care to read it.

I would say include her if she wants to come on the understanding that her husband is going to be very busy taking pictures and won't be able to chat or anything.

squirrly

I really, really, really hate it when people invite more people to the reception than the ceremony.  A friend did this earlier this year - just had her and her H's immediate & step families, which totalled 40 people, at the ceremony, and then another 120 at the reception. 

In that 120 was a group of 8 college friends, plus our SOs.  All of us were annoyed with the arrangement.  I hate being good enough to give a gift, and not good enough to see the ceremony. 

If that chapel is where your family has been getting married for generations, I'd be more understanding.  If it's where you go to church every Sunday, I'd be more understanding.

But, I'm guessing you picked it because it's pretty, like my friend did her ceremony spot.  And if that's the case and I were a guest, I'd be annoyed that pretty trumped me seeing the REASON you wanted me to give a gift and celebrate with you.

As for the aunt. . . well, I think the other aunts and uncles will be pissed anyway, regardless of whether she attends, but if she does, that's just more fuel for their fire.

kellyheartache

Honestly, redhead, we could fit all 60+ ceremony/reception guests at the chapel if we needed to. It has room on the outside of the facility for additional chairs or standing room. My fiance has severe social anxiety and really wanted just a small wedding, so this is our compromise. It's not going to change anytime soon since it took us about a year to figure it out. We reserved a venue that fit our budget, location constraints, style, and personal beliefs, and NO ONE EXCEPT FOR THE LADIES ON THIS BOARD have objected to the plans. 

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:3962a27e-4b1b-4ad3-8a99-c033b9fdde24">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]Good gravy I was not expecting such a backlash here! I am not asking for your opinion on my wedding plans, only on whether or not to invite a single one of my fiance's aunts to the ceremony. If no one can answer this question for me without making me feel the need to defend myself, then I guess I'll just ask someone elsewhere. For people who are supposed to be offering help on not being rude, y'all sure are acting the opposite. Sheesh. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

From this reaction, I conclude that you picked the tiny chapel only because it was pretty. ::facepalm::

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:86635752-f8f1-4d15-91af-264447326a7a">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly, redhead, we could fit all 60+ ceremony/reception guests at the chapel if we needed to. It has room on the outside of the facility for additional chairs or standing room. My fiance has severe social anxiety and really wanted just a small wedding, so this is our compromise. It's not going to change anytime soon since it took us about a year to figure it out. We reserved a venue that fit our budget, location constraints, style, and personal beliefs, and NO ONE EXCEPT FOR THE LADIES ON THIS BOARD have objected to the plans. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

Well thanks for answering my question, finally.

squirrly

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:86635752-f8f1-4d15-91af-264447326a7a">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly, redhead, we could fit all 60+ ceremony/reception guests at the chapel if we needed to. It has room on the outside of the facility for additional chairs or standing room. My fiance has severe social anxiety and really wanted just a small wedding, so this is our compromise. It's not going to change anytime soon since it took us about a year to figure it out. We reserved a venue that fit our budget, location constraints, style, and personal beliefs, and NO ONE EXCEPT FOR THE LADIES ON THIS BOARD have objected to the plans. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

So, he's ok with 60 people watching him eat dinner, dance with you, dance with his mom, and party it up, but not with them watching him say "I Do"? 

If you want small, have small.  But stick to just those 20.  This just doesn't add up to me.

jeanna85

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:86635752-f8f1-4d15-91af-264447326a7a">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly, redhead, we could fit all 60+ ceremony/reception guests at the chapel if we needed to. It has room on the outside of the facility for additional chairs or standing room. My fiance has severe social anxiety and really wanted just a small wedding, so this is our compromise. It's not going to change anytime soon since it took us about a year to figure it out. We reserved a venue that fit our budget, location constraints, style, and personal beliefs, and NO ONE EXCEPT FOR THE LADIES ON THIS BOARD have objected to the plans. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]
 

So now after us asking you why you're doing this, suddenly the answer changes to social anxiety. So the social anxiety is limited to places of worship I'd assume, because you're then having a large reception where apparently he won't be anxious even though he'll be the center of attention there as well? That makes zero sense.

We're just trying to be honest. People WILL be complaining about this and offended, although maybe they'll be polite enough to say their comments behind your back instead of to your face.

kellyheartache

matilda, I'm sorry, that frustration was not directed at you as you actually have been pretty helpful. I'm just offended at the rudeness I'm seeing displayed by others here when I came here to ask for help. 

The chapel has no religious affiliation or sentimental/traditional value for my family. Neither my fiance or I are religious, and this place just fit. No, it's not just pretty. It was built with great values and beliefs behind it that we wholeheartedly agree with and would feel honored to uphold by using the facility. It is the only "free" chapel in the world, with a refundable or donatable $100 reservation fee that we just paid this morning. After searching for a venue for over 2 years, we settled on the Chapel in question because it felt the most "us". If it were up to my fiance, we would elope at the courthouse and be done with it, but as he is being kind enough to compromise with me and have a small ceremony with a slightly larger reception, that is what we're doing. If you don't agree with it, that's fine. I'm sure there's something about your wedding I wouldn't agree with. But please, do not belittle me and act like I am being selfish when you do not even remotely know me, my fiance, our families, or our personal values. 

waltzingmatilda13

OP, I really have to agree with what everyone else is saying though. It's great that you want all these people to celebrate with you, but by not having them at the ceremony you are slighting them. They may not say it to your face, but I'm sure a lot of them are hurt that they are not invited to "the main event". The reception is meant as a thank you for your guests for coming to witness the exchange of vows. Thus it only makes sense that they actually get to see those vows. And people that have been in that situation before are telling you what they said and how they actually felt. You might want to take that into consideration. You may be hearing one thing, but people may be feeling another.

You should really consider fitting in those other people at the ceremony, especially since it won't cost you much more money to rent chairs. I do find it odd that your FI is fine with all these people at the reception but not the ceremony. I guarantee that neither of you will notice all those people anyway. You'll only be looking at each other and the officiant.

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:1b6cdea9-6c49-4eab-a6a7-9a1c25b9361b">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]matilda, I'm sorry, that frustration was not directed at you as you actually have been pretty helpful. I'm just offended at the rudeness I'm seeing displayed by others here when I came here to ask for help.  The chapel has no religious affiliation or sentimental/traditional value for my family. <u><strong>Neither my fiance or I are religious, and this place just fit.</strong></u> No, it's not just pretty<u><strong>. It was built with great values and beliefs behind it that we wholeheartedly agree with and would feel honored to uphold by using the facility.</strong></u> It is the only "free" chapel in the world, with a refundable or donatable $100 reservation fee that we just paid this morning. After searching for a venue for over 2 years, we settled on the Chapel in question because it felt the most "us". If it were up to my fiance, we would elope at the courthouse and be done with it, but as he is being kind enough to compromise with me and have a small ceremony with a slightly larger reception, that is what we're doing. If you don't agree with it, that's fine. I'm sure there's something about your wedding I wouldn't agree with. But please, do not belittle me and act like I am being selfish when you do not even remotely know me, my fiance, our families, or our personal values. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

The bolded part, I don't understand. *(nevermind)*

People may be offended, so I told you. I still think people will be offend by your plans. Personally, I want people to tell me their opinions. This is an internet forum and all.  But sorry if I offended. I promise I wasn't trying to get you this upset.  You need to relax, this is the internet.  

ETA: Sorry, my work computer is slow.

kellyheartache

squirrly - Would it be as offensive for us to elope and then have a reception party after? I've known several people who have gone that route and have heard no complaints. Before we ever made our ideas of having a small ceremony and larger reception into more concrete plans, I had asked several people in both my family and his what they thought of the idea and not a single one objected. I'm not sure if it's a southern cultural thing or what, but everyone has been extremely helpful and supportive in our decision making process. 

I'm sorry to have gotten so upset, but I felt as if my fiancé and I were personally under attack for a minute there. 

kellyheartache

redhead, perhaps this excerpt from the chapel's website can explain it better than I can: 

Wizard Academy is a nontraditional business school that considers all the languages of the mind. Perhaps the most misunderstood and poorly leveraged language in our society is the language of symbolic thought.

Similes and metaphors express symbolic thoughts in a spoken or written language. In matters of faith, symbolism is woven into sacrament and ritual. Artists use shapes and colors symbolically. Likewise, musicians use pitch, key, rhythm, musical interval, contour and tempo to symbolically express ideas, feelings and moods.

Chapel Dulcinea was constructed on the new campus of Wizard Academy as www.mondaymorningmemo.com/?ShowMe=ThisMemo&MemoID=1643">an expression of our belief in the value of long-term commitment. A wedding chapel is the perfect symbol of how equal-but-opposite perspectives don't have to merge into the somber, dead gray of compromise, but can be drawn together to create the wonderful electricity that flows when polarities are brought into close proximity.

These important ideas and others are woven into the physical location, the architecture, and the name of Chapel Dulcinea. It is our gift to the world because it's a symbolic expression of who we are, and the creative values for which we stand.

P.S. Yes, I know it's the Internet. This is the only forum I've participated in in years (and rarely post here, at that), so transitioning from talking online with people I know IRL and talking with complete strangers is kind of difficult haha. 

redheadfsu

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_parents-grandparents-only-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:95e4f231-372b-4782-9a3c-9394421d5f5cPost:4cf4de46-43e9-4f1f-9b8a-2bada9e187d1">Re: Parents- and Grandparents-Only Ceremony</a>:
[QUOTE]squirrly - Would it be as offensive for us to elope and then have a reception party after? I've known several people who have gone that route and have heard no complaints. <strong>Before we ever made our ideas of having a small ceremony and larger reception into more concrete plans, I had asked several people in both my family and his what they thought of the idea and not a single one objected. I'm not sure if it's a southern cultural thing or what, but everyone has been extremely helpful and supportive in our decision making process.</strong>  I'm sorry to have gotten so upset, but I felt as if my fiancé and I were personally under attack for a minute there. 
Posted by kellyheartache[/QUOTE]

Then people may not be offended. You have to remember we don't know all the background when we give our 2 cents.

I would recommend asking your family how to handle the uncle/aunt situation.

squirrly

It depends.  If you have a DW and invite everyone, but very few come, then I think it's fine to have an AHR later and invite all those people again.  But, if you do NOT invite me to the ceremony, and do invite me to the reception, regardless of location/date, I'm going to find it offensive. 

I've attended receptions in cases where I wasn't invited to the ceremony for a few friends.  And I'm still bothered, years later.  I went because we're friends and they wanted me to be there.  But I won't lie - I felt like a second tier friend, and it has affected the way I view our friendship.  And I know it's not just me - other people in the same situation commented on the very same thing. 

And, we're all from the south, FYI. 

squirrly

Also, traditional etiquette says it's suitable to do, because you're feeding people at the reception, not the ceremony.

I just want you to understand that these situations DO cause hurt feelings, but NONE of us talked to the brides in question about it.  That would have been rude, as well.  So, don't assume that just because no one told you they'd be hurt, that they wouldn't actually BE hurt.  They might be too nice to tell the truth on that one.

kellyheartache

Would it help if I explained that the only non-family-members in attendance would be my matron of honor and her husband? I'm an only child, so no siblings to do the honors for me. His brother will officiate the ceremony as well. I think that the split between parents/siblings/grandparents and extended family is a natural one, so that's the way we chose to do it. Grandparents were added to that list only because he's got both parents, both step-parents, and three siblings (along with their two SO's) on his side and I'd only have my mother (my father and I are estranged), my MOH, and her hub on mine. GP's just kind of balanced it out a little better since I've got two sets and he's just got the one. 

squirrly

Nope.  Doesn't change anything for me.  My friend this year who did this?  There were ZERO friends at the ceremony.  Just family/step-family.  And we still all found it offensive/strange.

We came in for the receiving line right after the ceremony, and she was crying and all.  I still, 7 months later, don't know why she was crying.  But I got to hug her through that. 

It was awkward, and lame, and a huge let down.  The wedding is about the ceremony.  The reception is to celebrate the ceremony.  Why do you want people to celebrate something you won't let them see? 

kellyheartache

No, I mean, no other friends invited to the reception either, just aunts, uncles, and cousins. I guess it makes a difference to me. 

Originally, we had wanted to rent a vacation home for a weekend and have everyone come to the ceremony and reception on the property. After months of not finding one that would let us hold a wedding on the property without paying an arm and a leg, and months of my fiance hinting from time to time that he'd rather just have a courthouse wedding with parents attending, this is the compromise we came up with. 

I look at the reception as not only a celebration of the marriage, but a celebration of our love for each other in general. I could see being offended if we were inviting parents, grandparents, both our best friends and a few other friends to the ceremony and then the rest of the family and several more friends to the reception, but since it's such a family-centric event with only two non-family-members in attendance I guess I just don't understand where the offense would stem from. Maybe I'll ask around a bit more (with hypothetical situations of course) to see if I get a different response. 

And honestly, we're not really expecting gifts at all since we've already been living together for 3 years. 

squirrly

It's up to you, obviously.  But, I really wanted you to be aware of how this is sometimes seen.  Now you have, so you're informed.  That's step one, right?   

And, whether it was friend or family, I'd feel the same, so I don't think that changes a lot from that perspective either. 

Oh.  People will still get you gifts, regardless. 

Best of luck.

kellyheartache

Thanks squirrly. Sorry for being such a brat. 

polichik

OP, I think that the issue here is that the discrepancy in number of guests between the ceremony and the reception is fairly small. Given that it wouldn't cost anything more to have the other 40 guests attend the ceremony, and given that there is room for them, I'm confused as to why you won't just invite them as well. Believe me, I understand social anxiety, but I would imagine that the reception would trigger those feelings of anxiety much more than during the ceremony.

The ceremony is the whole point of a wedding. The reception, though necessary to thank your guests for attending, is fluff. I would be deeply saddened to not be invited to the ceremony. But, as a good friend, I of course wouldn't complain to the bride or groom. But I would definitely be hurt.

Think of it this way... Given that your FI is still going to have to deal with the large number of guests at the reception, is there any way that you would regret having the rest of your guests present for the ceremony? Or, on the other hand, is there any way that you would regret declining to invite those guests to the ceremony, given the very real possibility that they would be hurt, even if they didn't voice that hurt to you?

starrynight1658

For your original question, I think you should invite your aunt. I know you said she wouldn't care either way, but that would just be my personal preference.

As for the small ceremony/larger reception, I'm in the minority here because I actually did this. We chose a small ceremony (immediate family only) because my father recently passed away, and it was an incredibly emotional experience for me that I didn't want on display for lots of people. I'm sure there were those that thought it strange or were a bit upset that they were invited to the reception only. We chose to have a larger reception to celebrate with our extended family and friends, because, frankly, I wanted to be able to let my hair down and have fun after a wedding planning process/ceremony that was emotionally draining because of my dad's absence. Again, I recognize that most people don't agree with how we did things, but it was a compromise of what my family and I needed emotionally and what I'd always pictured my wedding day being.

With that being said, I think the fact that there is such a small difference between the number of guests invited to the ceremony vs. reception might seem rude to people. However, I'm not judging, I promise! Good luck with your planning and whatever you decide to do.

tpender13

OP, I just wanted to add my two cents and say that I totally get why you're having a smaller ceremony. Yeah, your FI will have to "deal" w/more guests at the reception, but there you'll basically just be hanging out and having a good time. At the ceremony, he'll be standing up in front of everyone that's there, and exchanging vows w/you promising whatever it is that will be included in your vows. If I had social anxiety like that, the ceremony would be the scariest part, and the less people there, the better.

I think it's great that you two were able to work out a good compromise.

EDIT: I just checked out the link for the chapel; that place is gorgeous!!!