Online Ordainment? Or Self-Uniting License?

EGHovermale

I've read so many articles & posts that go back and forth on whether or not someone who becomes ordained online can or cannot legally perform a wedding ceremony in Pennsylvania.  Here's our deal:

We're getting married later this year and would like my fiance's brother to perform the ceremony.  He became ordained online through The American Fellowship Church.  He's called both Allegheny & Westmoreland county clerk's offices and has not been able to get a definite answer on whether or not he'd be legal.  He asked about licensing and no one could answer his questions.  I know this isn't the first time this has come up, so this is frustrating.

We're debating on whether we should just go ahead w/ the ceremony as planned and have one of our vendors, who used to be a mayor, say a few words w/ the two of us privately, and two witnesses after the ceremony to make everything legit and he'll sign the license.  OR......should we just go ahead w/ a self-uniting license?  I've only learned of this type of license recently.  Has anyone on here in PA done one of these before who can give me some advice on it?

Thanks for any help you guys can provide!  It's greatly appreciated!

Flowerstar1023

Hahaha! Good luck and let us know how it goes! I guess if worse comes to worse you could go in front of the JOP before the wedding (although I know that might not be a wanted option). As an aside, I have heard through this board that Westmoreland County is easier and cheaper than Allegheny.

cgyvhu

Y I Oughta got a self-uniting license last summer for her wedding.  You could try paging her (start a new post with just her n ame in it) and maybe she can give you more information.  But I think anyone can get one, you just have to ask for it when you are at the courthouse, and then you need witness signatures the day of.

HeathenSwan

I've done a lot of research on this, as I'm officiating or friends this year. I am ULC odained. For online ordination, there were two court cases that were signifigant. 

The first, in 2007, was a couple that was married by their friend, who was ULC ordained. They decided a year to so later that they were going to divorce. In order to take the easy way out, they devised a plan to just have the marriage deemed invalid. They successfully fought in York county court that, because their friend was ordained online, the marriage was never legal.

The second case, in Bucks county, and in response to the York county ruling, found that the ULC IS a recognized church and those with in ordination from the ULC may perform weddings in PA. The opinion from that case is that the judge in York county misinterpreted PA state law, and applied it too narrowly in his decision. The article can be found here: http://www.totaldivorce.com/news/articles/society/internet-ordained-ministers-legal.aspx

The ULC has a virtual congregation, if you will. It is also a recognised legal church, per the federal government, and the state government. I believe that, currently, York county is the only one who will reject a ULC minister, but that ruling did not effect state law. (The court cases dealt with ULC specifically, but it should be the same for any online ministry)

EGHovermale

We went today and got our Self Uniting License in Allegheny county and it was nothing but a breeze!  We were shocked!  We maybe spent 10 mins. there.  The lady was super nice & funny.  Only downside is we have to go pick it up ourselves, or just one of us, in a week.  They won't mail it to us.  Oh well.  She explained it all and it's legit.  Just still shocked that Allegheny county was so easy w/ this.  You just have to mention right off the bat that that's what you want.  $75 and 10 min. later, we swore the information we gave was correct as it could be and we were out of there!

Flowerstar1023

That's awesome. Thanks for the update. What did you have to bring with you and where did you go? I assume you both have to be present?

ChristineNB

Me and my fiance are doing a self-uniting marriage.  We have been researching it on-line as well as have spoken with Allegheny county and it seems like the perfect option for us (we don't want anything religious).  My only concern is since we are both legal residents of Virginia how will our home state handle it, but my understanding is that other states must honor self-unifying as a legitmate marriage.  As long as you have a marriage lisence, there shouldn't be any problem.

EGHovermale

We went to the City-County Building at 414 Grant Street in Pittsburgh.  Once you walk through the metal detectors you go into the 2nd door on the left titled "Marriage Licenses"  (security asked us where we intended to go & pointed us in the right direction....yet again, they were all so nice!)  Go in and to the left of the front desk, and all the way back to the sign in at the long desk on the sign in sheet for marriage licenses and then sit & wait your turn. 

We showed up at about 2pm and were the only ones there.  About 2 mins, later, the entire room practically filled up w/ people.  I'd say go between 1-2pm and there's no wait time.  **Just make sure you start out by asking them for the Self-Uniting Marriage License.  I asked 3 times just to be clear they were getting it right b/c it all seemed to be going too easy lol.**

1.  Yes, you both have to be present w/ current I.D.  You need an official divorce decree or death certificate if either of you has previously been married. 
2.  You DO NOT need your birth certificate if you're 18 or older, just know the city & state you were both born in and it's helpful if you know aroundabouts where each set of parents were born. 
3.  BRING CASH, it's the only form of payment they accept. $75 for the license and an additional $5 for each divorce decree you bring in.

Glad to help!