Cursing and etiquette

TerriHugg

Hi everyone,

I'll be the first to admit that I am by no means etiquette savvy and I don't pretend to be. And I promise I'm not trying to be a troll and start trouble. 

However, I was just curious about how others feel about cursing and etiquette advice. Now, I have to admit I may be bit old-fashioned but I don't like cursing at all though I do tolerate it. You will be very hard pressed to ever hear my curse. That being said, I don't take too well to people giving etiquette advice while cursing in their response. As soon as I see someone with a curse in their reply, I promptly disregard it. Now I understand, most people probably don't care as much as I do. And also I understand the origin of "bad words" and how silly the idea of conforming to it is to some people. However, I sometimes feel like cursing should have no place when giving etiquette advice. 

But I'm wondering, am I the only one doesn't like etiquette advice or (any advice for that manner) delivered to me or others with foul language? Once again, I really am genuinely curious about this and not trying to start any trouble. 

Jen4948

I have to agree with you, and plead guilty to doing this sometimes.  You're right, it is hypocritical of people to give advice on etiquette while being rude themselves.

I myself do try to avoid cursing and being nasty when I initially give advice...it's when the poster in question, or some other poster, acts obtuse or attacks me in turn that I want to curse.  So I'm not always setting the example I want to set. 

But a lot of people, some of whom don't post here anymore, do that and assume of new posters who are advocating breaches of etiquette or just bad advice that their bad suggestions are made in bad faith-that they just don't care, when a lot of times they're just ignorant but with a little gentle redirection they would get the hint.  It's really a shame.

MrsMack10612

And it's folks like you that have started turning TK into puppies and rainbows.  If you think it's harsh around here now, you should have been here years ago.  I'm sorry that bluntness makes you uncomfortable, how do you function in real life?  Perhaps you should read the Special Snowflake thread. I used to enjoy TK, got myself bashed a few times but generally enjoyed reading and popping in with advice on occasion.  Now it's a ghost town thanks to posters like you.

What either of you fail to notice is that no one ever starts off cursing, only when some poor newb got there feelers hurt and starts throwing around their own hateful language does anyone ever start swearing.

Jen I'm sure you were one of the big players in why Stage & Linger got banned.

If you're so special and sensitive maybe the interwebz isn't for you.

ETA:  And it's not against TOS, so get over youselves.

TerriHugg

MrsMack10612 said:

And it's folks like you that have started turning TK into puppies and rainbows.  If you think it's harsh around here now, you should have been here years ago.  I'm sorry that bluntness makes you uncomfortable, how do you function in real life?  Perhaps you should read the Special Snowflake thread. I used to enjoy TK, got myself bashed a few times but generally enjoyed reading and popping in with advice on occasion.  Now it's a ghost town thanks to posters like you.

What either of you fail to notice is that no one ever starts off cursing, only when some poor newb got there feelers hurt and starts throwing around their own hateful language does anyone ever start swearing.

Jen I'm sure you were one of the big players in why Stage & Linger got banned.

If you're so special and sensitive maybe the interwebz isn't for you.

Hi there,

I think you may have misunderstood what I wrote. NO where did I say, I find it harsh or too blunt. And I am also well aware that not everyone starts of cursing. Though, I don't always post I've been around here for years so I know what it used to be.

I also never said I was too sensitive for cursing. I just don't like it. I function in the real world just fine. If you read above I stated that I do tolerate it. I just feel like etiquette really never has a place for cursing whether it is warranted or not.  I really only started this thread to start a dialogue and read other opinions. That's all. 

It's fine if you don't agree, but don't interject things into my post that I didn't say or wasn't even thinking for that matter.

But your point is noted and you have every right to disagree with me. 

Pepper6

It's cool if you don't like to curse, but many people do in real life situations, so I'm a little confused as to how you function if you automatically dismiss good advice simply based on the language used to convey it.  To each his own though, if you're easily offended, then TK might not be the place for you. 

cruffino

i curse alot in real life. i almost never curse AT people. but i pepper my language with curses to illustrate a point, or to express how i feel. i think there's a big difference between cursing AT someone, or calling them foul names and using curse words as part of expression. 

i know that others are not as comfortable with curse words as i am. in real life, i'm respectful of people who i know don't care for curse words. on the internet, i can only be myself, curses and all. i have no idea what virtual strangers are sensitive to.  

its generally unwise to be sensitive on the internet. if curses make you reach for the smelling salts, then perhaps the internet isn't the place for you.

climbingsingle

I prefer my etiquette advice (given and received) with cursing. I feel like it really gets the point across.

;-) 

TerriHugg

Pepper6 said:

It's cool if you don't like to curse, but many people do in real life situations, so I'm a little confused as to how you function if you automatically dismiss good advice simply based on the language used to convey it.  To each his own though, if you're easily offended, then TK might not be the place for you. 

Once again, I've been on the knot for years. And I function just fine. I just feel like cursing is in poor etiquette. (I realize it may be a wrong opinion, but it's my opinion.) So when people curse when giving etiquette advice, I find it kind of odd. That's all. I never said I need to leave The knot or anything. Some people just don't like cursing and I'm one of them. It doesn't mean, I get totally offended and want to duck and hide for cover when I hear it. I just don't like it. That's all. 

Also, while I don't like cursing I can appreciate it when it adds something to the text. For example, in some songs cursing adds to it's artistic flair. In other songs, curse words seem to just be there for the sake of cursing. 

And I understand cursing for the point of illustrating a point, I just feel like when giving etiquette advice there are other was to illustrate a point. 

Jen4948

MrsMack10612 said:

And it's folks like you that have started turning TK into puppies and rainbows.  If you think it's harsh around here now, you should have been here years ago.  I'm sorry that bluntness makes you uncomfortable, how do you function in real life?  Perhaps you should read the Special Snowflake thread. I used to enjoy TK, got myself bashed a few times but generally enjoyed reading and popping in with advice on occasion.  Now it's a ghost town thanks to posters like you.

What either of you fail to notice is that no one ever starts off cursing, only when some poor newb got there feelers hurt and starts throwing around their own hateful language does anyone ever start swearing.

Jen I'm sure you were one of the big players in why Stage & Linger got banned.

If you're so special and sensitive maybe the interwebz isn't for you.

ETA:  And it's not against TOS, so get over youselves.

I had nothing to do with the decision to ban Stage and Linger, but I'm not sorry they're gone.

And no, the bolded is not your decision to make, and no, I won't get over myself.  You are in no position to tell me to do so unless you get over yourself.

As to whether it's acceptable to curse on the Internet, it's people like you that turn it into the sewer that it is.

FutureMrsN3312

TerriHugg

ClimbingBrideNY said:

I prefer my etiquette advice (given and received) with cursing. I feel like it really gets the point across.

;-) 

I like the honesty. It just proves different strokes for different folks. 

KeptInStitches

Cursing at people is against etiquette (it's rude). Cursing in general is not.

MrsMack10612

Jen4948 said:

MrsMack10612 said:

And it's folks like you that have started turning TK into puppies and rainbows.  If you think it's harsh around here now, you should have been here years ago.  I'm sorry that bluntness makes you uncomfortable, how do you function in real life?  Perhaps you should read the Special Snowflake thread. I used to enjoy TK, got myself bashed a few times but generally enjoyed reading and popping in with advice on occasion.  Now it's a ghost town thanks to posters like you.

What either of you fail to notice is that no one ever starts off cursing, only when some poor newb got there feelers hurt and starts throwing around their own hateful language does anyone ever start swearing.

Jen I'm sure you were one of the big players in why Stage & Linger got banned.

If you're so special and sensitive maybe the interwebz isn't for you.

ETA:  And it's not against TOS, so get over youselves.

I had nothing to do with the decision to ban Stage and Linger, but I'm not sorry they're gone.

And no, the bolded is not your decision to make, and no, I won't get over myself.  You are in no position to tell me to do so unless you get over yourself.

As to whether it's acceptable to curse on the Internet, it's people like you that turn it into the sewer that it is.

I didn't see a single curse in my post, how is that I've turned the entire internet into a sewer?

I wasn't making a decision, it was a suggestion.  Reading comprehension fail. 

 

Pepper6

TerriHugg said:

Pepper6 said:

It's cool if you don't like to curse, but many people do in real life situations, so I'm a little confused as to how you function if you automatically dismiss good advice simply based on the language used to convey it.  To each his own though, if you're easily offended, then TK might not be the place for you. 

Once again, I've been on the knot for years. And I function just fine. I just feel like cursing is in poor etiquette. (I realize it may be a wrong opinion, but it's my opinion.) So when people curse when giving etiquette advice, I find it kind of odd. That's all. I never said I need to leave The knot or anything. Some people just don't like cursing and I'm one of them. It doesn't mean, I get totally offended and want to duck and hide for cover when I hear it. I just don't like it. That's all. 

On the etiquette line, I feel it's rude to curse AT someone, so yes, I can see how that would be dichotomous when giving etiquette advice.  But like PP, I feel using course language in general just elevates the sense of feeling being conveyed.  For example, I use 'fuck' when I feel very strongly about something, so in the tattoo thread, I used it to convey how very, very pissed off I would be if someone asked that of me.  

But to say that you would 'promptly disregard' my contribution to that post simply because I used language that you don't 'like' makes me think that you are missing the point.  If I feel that strongly about something, then it's probably a good indicator that others might as well, and if you ignore it simply because of the language, then you are doing a disservice to yourself and the others that would be affected by your choices if you don't consider what was said.

Jen4948

MrsMack10612 said:

Jen4948 said:

MrsMack10612 said:

And it's folks like you that have started turning TK into puppies and rainbows.  If you think it's harsh around here now, you should have been here years ago.  I'm sorry that bluntness makes you uncomfortable, how do you function in real life?  Perhaps you should read the Special Snowflake thread. I used to enjoy TK, got myself bashed a few times but generally enjoyed reading and popping in with advice on occasion.  Now it's a ghost town thanks to posters like you.

What either of you fail to notice is that no one ever starts off cursing, only when some poor newb got there feelers hurt and starts throwing around their own hateful language does anyone ever start swearing.

Jen I'm sure you were one of the big players in why Stage & Linger got banned.

If you're so special and sensitive maybe the interwebz isn't for you.

ETA:  And it's not against TOS, so get over youselves.

I had nothing to do with the decision to ban Stage and Linger, but I'm not sorry they're gone.

And no, the bolded is not your decision to make, and no, I won't get over myself.  You are in no position to tell me to do so unless you get over yourself.

As to whether it's acceptable to curse on the Internet, it's people like you that turn it into the sewer that it is.

I didn't see a single curse in my post, how is that I've turned the entire internet into a sewer?

I wasn't making a decision, it was a suggestion.  Reading comprehension fail. 

 

Right-your fail. I didn't suggest that you personally turned the entire Internet into a sewer.  I said "people like you," not you personally.

Sorry, but I'm done wasting my time arguing with you.

MrsMack10612

Wow...so 2 replies and 2 responses equals an argument?  Ok then.

I'm still curious why I fall into the "people like you" category who have turned the internet into a sewer?  Please point out where I have contributed to the sewer-like conditions of the interent.

 

Maggie0829

i curse alot in real life. i almost never curse AT people. but i pepper my language with curses to illustrate a point, or to express how i feel. i think there's a big difference between cursing AT someone, or calling them foul names and using curse words as part of expression. 

i know that others are not as comfortable with curse words as i am. in real life, i'm respectful of people who i know don't care for curse words. on the internet, i can only be myself, curses and all. i have no idea what virtual strangers are sensitive to.  

its generally unwise to be sensitive on the internet. if curses make you reach for the smelling salts, then perhaps the internet isn't the place for you.

I agree with all of this. I "speak" on here basically how I speak in real life. If you don't like it then don't read it. But just because I use curse words does not mean my opinion or advice is any more or less helpful.  The internet is not a place to be sensitive.

Maggie0829

@Jen4948 - saying "people like you" is basically including @MrsMack10612 in the group that you feel has turned this place into a sewer.  Since you think people that act like her are responsible for it I really don't see how you can say that you didn't include her into that group if you think that she acts just like the rest of the people you are referring to.

Jen4948

Whatever.  I don't think that cursing adds anything good or positive to this forum.  As I noted above, I've done it myself, and I'm not proud of it.

But I do think people have the ability to rise above the level of the Internet or what they consider the "real world" and behave like civilized beings with each other, and sorry, but I don't think cursing is consistent with "civilized."  Whether or not @MrsMack10612 does that herself, in this thread or elsewhere, is sophistry that I'm not interested in discussing.

TerriHugg

Pepper6 said:

TerriHugg said:

Pepper6 said:

It's cool if you don't like to curse, but many people do in real life situations, so I'm a little confused as to how you function if you automatically dismiss good advice simply based on the language used to convey it.  To each his own though, if you're easily offended, then TK might not be the place for you. 

Once again, I've been on the knot for years. And I function just fine. I just feel like cursing is in poor etiquette. (I realize it may be a wrong opinion, but it's my opinion.) So when people curse when giving etiquette advice, I find it kind of odd. That's all. I never said I need to leave The knot or anything. Some people just don't like cursing and I'm one of them. It doesn't mean, I get totally offended and want to duck and hide for cover when I hear it. I just don't like it. That's all. 

On the etiquette line, I feel it's rude to curse AT someone, so yes, I can see how that would be dichotomous when giving etiquette advice.  But like PP, I feel using course language in general just elevates the sense of feeling being conveyed.  For example, I use 'fuck' when I feel very strongly about something, so in the tattoo thread, I used it to convey how very, very pissed off I would be if someone asked that of me.  

But to say that you would 'promptly disregard' my contribution to that post simply because I used language that you don't 'like' makes me think that you are missing the point.  If I feel that strongly about something, then it's probably a good indicator that others might as well, and if you ignore it simply because of the language, then you are doing a disservice to yourself and the others that would be affected by your choices if you don't consider what was said.

I can appreciate the bolded. And I'm not saying my method is perfect. And I promise I'm not trying to attack you when I say this, but I feel like there are much better ways to show how strongly you feel about something other than curse words. I recognize this may be wrong and I apologize to anyone I may offend, but I feel like only using curse words to express how strongly you feel about something makes people seem a less intelligent. (Note I said  it makes people seem less intelligent and not that they actually are less intelligent. And I'm by no means saying you are one of those people I'm just speaking generally.) 

I just feel like there are so many other words in the dictionary to convey a point so I find it kind of sad when the only word people can think to say is F U to convey how important something is to them.

But that being said, I can appreciate it when it does add color to somethings like art or even sometimes in conversation when it truly is peppered in to prove a point. But other times, I feel like it's pointless and takes away from what you are trying to say. 

MrsMack10612

@maggie0829 - I'm still waiting for examples of how I am one of those people.  Clearly I'm a guttersnipe and didn't even know it.

 

MrsMack10612

Jen4948 said:

Whatever.  I don't think that cursing adds anything good or positive to this forum.  As I noted above, I've done it myself, and I'm not proud of it.

But I do think people have the ability to rise above the level of the Internet or what they consider the "real world" and behave like civilized beings with each other, and sorry, but I don't think cursing is consistent with "civilized."  Whether or not @MrsMack10612 does that herself, in this thread or elsewhere, is sophistry that I'm not interested in discussing.

So you're going to make a generalized statement, include me in it, yet have nothing to back up that statement?  And then run away using the proverbial "50 cent word" because you can't back up the statement.

That might be how they do things in your "civilized" world, but it's certainly not mature.

 

Maggie0829

@MrsMack10612 - I have a feeling I am part of that group that has turned this place into a sewer.  I throw around the fuck word like it is my job (but I also do that in real life as well).

Sooooo...I guess I should apologize for being myself?

phira

Cursing might be rude, etiquette-wise, but the point of this board it do discuss wedding etiquette. We encourage people to practice proper wedding etiquette ... but we're not actually necessarily etiquette-ing on the board.

Basically, we'd suggest that people NOT have curse words in their wedding invitations. Or we'd suggest that people not violently swear at their wedding party.

Anyway. You're being kind of an asshole by saying that you ignore people's advice if there are swears in it. I hate the whole, "Well, if you just ask nicely, THEN people will listen to you." Good advice is good advice.

MrsMack10612

Maggie0829 said:

@MrsMack10612 - I have a feeling I am part of that group that has turned this place into a sewer.  I throw around the fuck word like it is my job (but I also do that in real life as well).

Sooooo...I guess I should apologize for being myself?

@maggie0829 - You should be ashamed of yourself.  Treating the internet like real life.  Clearly you are far too uncivilized for TK.

TerriHugg

Maggie0829 said:

i curse alot in real life. i almost never curse AT people. but i pepper my language with curses to illustrate a point, or to express how i feel. i think there's a big difference between cursing AT someone, or calling them foul names and using curse words as part of expression. 

i know that others are not as comfortable with curse words as i am. in real life, i'm respectful of people who i know don't care for curse words. on the internet, i can only be myself, curses and all. i have no idea what virtual strangers are sensitive to.  

its generally unwise to be sensitive on the internet. if curses make you reach for the smelling salts, then perhaps the internet isn't the place for you.

I agree with all of this. I "speak" on here basically how I speak in real life. If you don't like it then don't read it. But just because I use curse words does not mean my opinion or advice is any more or less helpful.  The internet is not a place to be sensitive.

You are completely right that if I don't like it, I don't have to read it. And I don't read it, nor do I respond to it. You are absolutely right that using curse words doesn't mean your advice is less helpful. I just dont' respond well to it, mostly because I find it odd when  I've admitted her in many posts that my method may not be right. I just feel like cursing is in poor etiquette so it's a bit ironic when people choose to use curse words when giving etiquette advice. That being said, I have noticed that you do give good advice. 

But what I don't understand is why my admission that I don't like cursing means I'm too sensitive. I never said I was too sensitive to handle it. I even said that I tolerate cursing. I just don't like cursing. While people like me are hard to come by, I'm sure I'm not the only one in the world who doesn't like cursing.

TerriHugg

phira said:

Cursing might be rude, etiquette-wise, but the point of this board it do discuss wedding etiquette. We encourage people to practice proper wedding etiquette ... but we're not actually necessarily etiquette-ing on the board.

Basically, we'd suggest that people NOT have curse words in their wedding invitations. Or we'd suggest that people not violently swear at their wedding party.

Anyway. You're being kind of an asshole by saying that you ignore people's advice if there are swears in it. I hate the whole, "Well, if you just ask nicely, THEN people will listen to you." Good advice is good advice.

Well, I don't agree with calling me an asshole. But you are right that it could be good advice even if people are swearing when giving it. I can admit when I'm wrong. And I apologize to anyone I offended because that was not my intention. 

But I never said the whole "Well, if you just ask nicely, THEN people will listen to you." I don't know where that came from, but it wasn't me. 

Pepper6

@TerriHug, I take no offense to how you view cursing, I know people like that IRL and try to curb my language around them out of respect, but online, I post as how I would talk to my friends, which, for better or worse, includes cursing.  This is probably how most people are on here, so you should probably just take it with a grain of salt.  You might not like how it's said, but that doesn't change the validity of the advice actually being said.  Likewise, you can feel however you want about the language, but it will probably never influence anyone who uses it.

Maggie0829

@TerriHugg - the sensitive portion was not directed solely at you.  Being sensitive on the internet or these boards was brought up further down in the discussion.  I was basically using it in the general sense.

I get what you are saying but it is hard to sensor yourself when you are just trying to be yourself. How I give advice on here is how I would give advice to my best friend.  I have no problem saying to my friend "Are you fucking crazy?!" so I feel like I should be the same way on here.  I don't know, it is hard to explain but I feel like I can give advice better by being myself then when I try to sensor myself.  When I try to sensor myself it never comes out they way I want it to or makes as much sense as it would if I just talk like I normally talk.

I guess you could equate it to trying to talk like a freaking genius with a crazy high IQ when you aren't one...you tend to sound silly and confusing.  KWIM?

MrsMack10612

@TerriHugg - You may not be sensitive in general, but that you are willing to disregard something based on the use of curse words is rather short sighted.

It was @Jen4948 who suggested "gentle redirection" as the best way to get a point across. 

If you have been around for years as you say, you know that gentle redirection and asking nicely does not work.  You have seen the evidence that nice, yet blunt,  well thought responses can turn a poster into a banshee with little effort.  None of the posters that are being referenced having turned the internet into a sewer ever got nasty, mean or started cursing until this happens.  Then is when the gloves would come off.

TerriHugg

Pepper6 said:

@TerriHug, I take no offense to how you view cursing, I know people like that IRL and try to curb my language around them out of respect, but online, I post as how I would talk to my friends, which, for better or worse, includes cursing.  This is probably how most people are on here, so you should probably just take it with a grain of salt.  You might not like how it's said, but that doesn't change the validity of the advice actually being said.  Likewise, you can feel however you want about the language, but it will probably never influence anyone who uses it.

Thank you so much for the thought out response. And I really do take cursing with a grain of salt, which is why I still lurk on the board. If I really was so sensitive and offended by it like some people think I am, I would never be on here. I'm also well aware that it won't influence people to stop cursing. I guess you are right that it might not change the validity of how it's said. I guess it's just that, I feel using curse words when giving etiquette advice is a bit hypocritical considering swearing isn't actually conforming to proper etiquette. 

But I did sort of misspeak when I said I promptly disregard it. While I admittedly, disregard etiquette advice delivered with curse words I don't always do that in real life if it is good advice. 

Thanks again for the honest and thoughtful feedback. It is truly appreciated.