family invitations

motheroftheboy · March 2010

I'm the mother of the groom. My only son is getting married to a girl who we all like and appreciate. Her mother is a lovely woman and a friend. My dilemma?

It isn't my wedding, so I have taken care not to pry or ask questions that could make it seem that I am trying to run the event. but tonight, at a family dinner at my home where the bride to be, and her mother were present, I received some news that was actually shocking to me. Apparently, we are not assigned any number of invitations. We are of course invited, and his sisters are invited. But all the other guests have been "selected" by the bride and groom because it is "their wedding", and they have "already had to leave out a lot of their good friends to keep the guestlist at 200. "

I was so surprised that I could only indicate that it was my sense of wedding tradition that was guiding me. I stated that for 25 years there have been some close friends of the family who have witnessed our raising of our children. We have been to or were invited to their children's weddings. In mentally paring my own list, we are talking about 3 couples (whom I have offered to pay for. ) But the wedding couple seem utterly unaware that this is a reasonable request on our part. My son is supporting his fiance, which I agree he must do. However.....I find myself feeling lost and extraneous and suprisingly very hurt. I know I need to explain this to him privately, and will do so. He has no common sense when it comes to weddings, but apparently neither do the bride and her mother. They both think it reasonable that "the kids" (who are also paying for their own wedding) should invite only their closest friends. I will be hosting the rehearsal dinner and am inviting the usual wedding party and their spouses. I want to get over this because I have no intention of attending the wedding or events leading up to it in any less than full gracious support.

How to understand this modern viewpoint?

shellydiane820 · March 2010

Honestly, it is their day to celebrate, they should get to choose who they want to celebrate with.

Just because you're close to someone, doesn't mean they are.

I actually had this problem with my parents. They were wanting to invite people I didn't even know. I asked them if it was okay to not invite them, just because of the fact, I didn't know them, and to me it seems gift grabby.

It gets hard where to draw the line on who to invite and who not to invite, but the line has to be drawn. Especially if there is a budget to stick with.

Brie2010 · March 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_family-invitations?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:862f1219-4b29-4337-ae77-8cca2a8abffcPost:764aef3d-ada2-414e-88cc-e2a2dd2c1cde">family invitations</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm the mother of the groom. My only son is getting married to a girl who we all like and appreciate. Her mother is a lovely woman and a friend. My dilemma? It isn't my wedding, so I have taken care not to pry or ask questions that could make it seem that I am trying to run the event. but tonight, at a family dinner at my home where the bride to be, and her mother were present, I received some news that was actually shocking to me. Apparently, we are not assigned any number of invitations. We are of course invited, and his sisters are invited. But all the other guests have been "selected" by the bride and groom because it is "their wedding", and they have "already had to leave out a lot of their good friends to keep the guestlist at 200. " I was so surprised that I could only indicate that it was my sense of wedding tradition that was guiding me. I stated that for 25 years there have been some close friends of the family who have witnessed our raising of our children. We have been to or were invited to their children's weddings. In mentally paring my own list, we are talking about 3 couples (whom I have offered to pay for. ) But the wedding couple seem utterly unaware that this is a reasonable request on our part. My son is supporting his fiance, which I agree he must do. However.....I find myself feeling lost and extraneous and suprisingly very hurt. I know I need to explain this to him privately, and will do so. He has no common sense when it comes to weddings, but apparently neither do the bride and her mother. They both think it reasonable that "the kids" (who are also paying for their own wedding) should invite only their closest friends. I will be hosting the rehearsal dinner and am inviting the usual wedding party and their spouses. I want to get over this because I have no intention of attending the wedding or events leading up to it in any less than full gracious support. How to understand this modern viewpoint?
Posted by motheroftheboy[/QUOTE]

Please don't type in italics. It's incredibly hard to read.

Who is paying for the wedding? Generally, he who pays, says, so if your son and his fiancee are paying, the guest list is theirs to choose.

ohwhynot · March 2010

MUD? Seems unlikely that your son and his fi have so many friends that they had to cut good friends to keep their list down to 200. Are there NO relatives invited from your side, except for you and the groom's sisters? NO relatives of the bride's? I find it hard to believe that the bride's family would accept this.

If that is, indeed, the case, you may want to restate your willingness to pay for the extra 6 guests.

Brie2010 · March 2010

Also, I don't believe that offering to pay for the guests is really a great solution. FFIL started making demands to add people to our guest list after we'd sent out invitations--we invited one couple because they were left off in error, basically, but the other couple we flat-out said no to. Even IF he had offered to pay for them, we do not know these people (FI hasn't seen the guy since he was 8 or 9), and we'd be inviting them to a wedding halfway across the country. That just comes across as gift-grabby and ridiculous. No way.

[Deleted User] · March 2010

What was their reason for saying no to the additional couples even after you agreed to pay for them? If it's a capacity issue, I'm not sure that there's much else that you can do.

While I agree with Shelly that it's their wedding and if they are paying, they should have the ultimate say in the guest list, I do find it odd that they didn't at least ask you if you had any guests that you'd really like to be included. My FILs are not contributing to the wedding / reception (they are paying for the RD), but we felt strongly that they should be considered when determining the guest list.

AmoroAgain · March 2010

I doubt this is MUD, OWN.

Mother, I can see your point, and if I were you, before you get anymore upset about this, perhaps you should take a peek at the guest list? Just express some interest in the wedding and see if there are people on there that are invited that you weren't aware of, or ask for some clarification. There are polite ways to find out about the guest list without being rude and I would go that route.

aMrsin09 · March 2010

Sorry, I don't believe for one hot minute that the MOB doesn't have any of her friends on that list of 200. It sounds as if she was just a touch too zen about the situation to have not had her very BFF going to the wedding.

OP, I would do as Amoro suggested and try to sneak a peak at the guest list.

ohwhynot · March 2010

I'm still on the fence - 200 friends (and that's leaving out many good friends) and absolutely NO invitations for anyone on either side of the family? No relatives, no lifelong family friends? That just seems so unreasonable on the part of the bride & groom that I find it a bit hard to believe.

I guess I also find it hard to believe that the bride & groom , being this insensitive to other people's feelings, would have over 200 closest friends to invite.

Brie2010 · March 2010

I just noticed that they are paying.

While it's not something I would do, really, think of it in non-wedding terms. If your son and his FI hosted a party in their home, would you insist on bringing 6 of your friends, even if you brought enough hot dogs and beer to cover them? Probably not.

And from a bride's perspective--imagine having demands on the guest list YOU'RE paying for coming from all directions. It's probably not just you suggesting an extra few people--her parents probably are too, as well as friends who want to bring guests and their children that aren't invited, co-workers insinuating they'd like to come, et cetera, et cetera...it's stressful. I wouldn't broach the subject again.

crfische · March 2010

Oh for pete's sake, this isn't mud. It's a concerned mother who is in a shitty position, which I think is the way a lot of parents feel.

WhatawagSBNy · March 2010

     I am thoroughly modern, but think they have gone too far. In a wedding this size, there is no reason they cannot have 3 couples of family friends, known to your son for years,   and the same on the bride's side.

     With couples paying most of their own wedding expenses,   gone are the days when some parents would invite 20 to 40 or more of parents only friends, bosses, country club friends, and very distant relatives that the B or G hardly knows, and would not put on their own relative's list.

    The parents are no longer hosting, the couple are.   You are talking each side having a few couples, that for both would add up to about 6 percent of the guest list.

     That seems reasonable.   The other thing to look at, is how many family are being invited.

     If only immediate family, plus all aunts and uncles and their children and SO or family (1st cousins to groom) plus the older generation, grandparents and their brothers and sisters ( couple's great aunts and such.), no one can be cut.

     But once it gets to second cousins, and 2nd cousins once removed, and more distant relations, choices can be made.
   If bride and groom only want some of these less close family that they know well, but not   those they do not know,    and parents are insistent that distant relatives the couple hardly know are to be invited, this pretty much uses up the parent's discretionary invitations.

     Parents of Groom and Bride cannot expect to insist on people the B and G see only at other relatives homes, who never write, call, visit, or invite the bride and groom to their homes. (reciprocal - and whom the bride and groom would never extend a dinner invitation to outside of wedding time.)

      Parent's first or second cousins and kids , who may have lived 20 miles or 200 from B or G for 5 years of their adult lives, with neither asking the other to come visit, are really not necessary to invite for the first time to their wedding, just because their parents stay more friendly.

     So when you talk about the parents having some invitations, even though not hosting, you may have to choose between these distant (to B and G) relatives, and old family friends you want.

     It is unreasonable to expect to invite both.
Your are talking inviting 6 family friends, which sounds doable.
.   But if that is on top of 20 relatives (or children) that B and G do not want, that you have asked they invite, that is a very high proportion of people the B and G have little relationship with, and I can understand their not wanting more.

WhatawagSBNy · March 2010

     I know your post referred only to you and the sisters as family. But maybe the bride has 4) family on the list.

     The kids do not need 170 friends at a wedding. But this policy may have come about because of overall numbers with the bride's side, that you do not know.
     That is why I mentioned, distant family.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · March 2010

Honestly, my fiancé and I are paying for the entire wedding. My mother has no family, I'm inviting my dad's sister, my cousin, and a few other family members. I asked both my parents if they wanted me to invite anyone else, which they did not (it is also an out-of-state wedding for my entire family). I didn't divide the list to give either family a certain number of "spots" - we each just made a list of people we wanted to invite, including family and friends. I believe FI's parents requested invitations got o some of his great aunts, and we'll oblige them. However, we have nowhere near 200 people on the list. If we did, we would certainly not be adding more. If your son isn't particularly close to these people or doesn't like them, that's his decision. Obviously there are about 200 people the couple is closer to than these couples.

katiewhompus · March 2010

As much as I do feel for you, I also see the bride's point. If I had paid for the wedding myself the guest list would have been very very different. As it stood I only had about 10 of my friends there, 2 of dh's friends and 5 mutual friends. The rest of the 80 person guest list (and 70 who rsvp'd yes) were friends of my parents or his family. I had invited many of my parents close friends and relatives who I really wasn't thrilled about inviting, including all 8 of my mom's brothers (who never even responded to our rsvp or phone calls, but thats another story). I didn't know about 10 of the people that mil had on her portion of the invitation list and some didn't even know I existed prior to the invitation going out.
If the list already consists for 40 relatives on either side that the bride/groom aren't close to, I can see where they would say 'no we're not inviting our parent's friends'.

but again, this is all my viewpoint having not seen the guest list, known the bride or groom, or if there is anything else to the story.

azrefugee · March 2010

Mother of the boy, I see your point however you should look at it from the kids perspective. When we set our guest list we decided to only invite people who we have contact with in our adult lives. People who were influential to us as children but have lost contact with us would extended the list to coaches, teachers, and long lost neighbors. It would get out of hand. So for out wedding (130 guests) we cut out a LOT of family and didn't give either side of the family a set number of people to invide. His mom was pretty upset when she found out and we did feel bad however it is our day and we wanted people we knew we would keep in contact with.
You also need to realize people who are special to you might not be special to him. My future mother in law was really upset when we refused invite two of his cousins. The truth of the matter is the last time we were in contact with them my fiance hid in the basement and I took ab out 20 tylenol to keep the headache at bay. But to spare her feelings we said we simply could not afford to have them there.
I'm sorry and I do feel bad for you. I wish you luck, maybe you can suggest to have the couples added to the "B" list. That way they can come if someone decides not to show.

goheels05 · March 2010

I agree with CEW.

Also, I don't think that the OP is saying that no family members were invited. I think what she is saying is that the B&G wrote the guest list (including family members from both sides and quite possibly even family friends), but did not ask for any additional input from the OP regarding additional guests. For example, when Mr. Heels and I wrote the guest list, we had family from both sides, friends, and family friends on the list, and when we sent the lists to our parents to ask for addresses, we also said "please let us know if there is anyone you think we may have forgotten."

banana468 · March 2010

PPs have given great suggestions.

Be prepared as well that if you "discuss with him privately" he will tell his FI. You can't expect him not to.

polichik · March 2010

I know about the "whoever pays, says" rule, but that's just ridiculous. If the parents of the bride or groom were footing the bill and didn't permit the bride and groom to invite three couples with whom they are close, I'd be shocked (although I'm sure it's happened).

Even if FI and I were covering the whole thing, we'd still want our parents to be able to invite some close family friends, provided that we knew them. If they were random friends of my parents' who I'd never met, I'd be uncomfortable having them there.

If the B&G really are inviting only their friends, that kind of sucks. I'm pretty darn modern, but modernity is no excuse for poor manners.

squirrly · March 2010

Have you considered that your son may not like these people? That he might not be neutral to them, but might actively NOT want them to attend? It's certainly not the only answer, but it's AN answer.

My FI and I are paying for our wedding ourselves. We wrote the guest list, sent it to our parents, and they each asked to add one couple, which we did. However, I don't think we'd have been agreeable to adding too many more - those are people WE are not close with. They're not people WE have chosen to share our lives with, even if our parents made that choice for us.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't have any influence over the guest list. But there may be things in play beyond what you're aware of.

You never mentioned if any of the rest of your family is invited.

ohwhynot · March 2010

Mother, I'm glad you came back, and I apologize for accusing you of being MUD. But could you clarify a bit - are relatives (aunts & uncles, cousins, for example) included in that list of 200 people? Or is it really just 200 of their friends and no relatives beyond parents and siblings?

I think a lot of folks may have a different response, depending on the answer.

squirrly · March 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_family-invitations?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:862f1219-4b29-4337-ae77-8cca2a8abffcPost:732e705a-f019-493c-9cfb-dcecbd515272">Re: family invitations</a>:
[QUOTE]Mother, I'm glad you came back, and I apologize for accusing you of being MUD. But could you clarify a bit - are relatives (aunts & uncles, cousins, for example) included in that list of 200 people? Or is it really just 200 of their friends and no relatives beyond parents and siblings? I think a lot of folks may have a different response, depending on the answer.
Posted by ohwhynot[/QUOTE]

ohwhynot, actually, my answer doesn't change. There are a few relatives i'm not inviting that I know my grandparents would prefer I include. I actively dislike those people and would not want them to attend if I had room or could afford it. As much as it's a nice theory for a wedding to be about family - if the bride and groom are paying and would prefer to have their friends present to family or friends of their parents with whom they have no relationship, I don't see why they should feel obligated to do so.

We tell brides on here all the time whose parents are paying that they need to suck it up and deal if their parents invite their own friends over those of the bride and groom. Why is it different if the B&G pay? Why doesn't what they want take precedence when their checkbook is footing the bill?

ohwhynot · March 2010

Well, yes, we tell brides here that if they want to invite their friends they can pay to do so. This mom offered to pay for these guests and hasn't indicated whether it's a space issue or a money issue. She also hasn't given any indication that her son can't stand these people.

I guess the reason my answer depends is because if there are a lot of family invites that are squeezing out the b&g's friends, then I'd tell the OP that she's out of luck. If, after all the "obligation" invites, the b& g are making tough choices about their own friends, then it's unreasonable for the OP to ask them to include her friends over theirs.

But if the b&g are claiming that they just have to invite 200 friends and there is no room for anyone else, I think that's selfish of them. I find it hard to believe that one couple has so many friends that even with inviting 200 friends and virtually no one else, they are being forced to trim "good friends" from their list. I guess it is their prerogative to be selfish, but I'd have a lot more sympathy for the OP.

This doesn't sound like your situation at all.

MyNameIsNot · March 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_family-invitations?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:862f1219-4b29-4337-ae77-8cca2a8abffcPost:2f4e21a6-ebef-44cb-97ca-64bb4a4e611b">Re: family invitations</a>:
[QUOTE]But if the b&g are claiming that they just have to invite 200 friends and there is no room for anyone else, I think that's selfish of them. I find it hard to believe that one couple has so many friends that even with inviting 200 friends and virtually no one else, they are being forced to trim "good friends" from their list. I guess it is their prerogative to be selfish, but I'd have a lot more sympathy for the OP. This doesn't sound like your situation at all.
Posted by ohwhynot[/QUOTE]

<div>But if it's their money and their wedding, they have the right to be selfish with the guest list. </div><div>
</div><div>I agree that it's unlikely that the couple has 200 friends and are using those friends to exclude close relatives, but if they want to and they are paying for it, they don't need to justify it. </div><div>
</div><div>ETA: when a bride comes on here complaining that her parents are paying and running the guest list, we say "that's too bad, but if you don't like it, turn down the money and do it your way." Why should a couple have less rights to their own guest list when they are the ones paying?</div>

ohwhynot · March 2010

I'm not saying the bride & groom can't do it, obviously they CAN, but I would have a lot of sympathy for a mother whose kids did that.

I would not have as much sympathy for a mother whose kids are already inviting a lot of family and are having to make choices as to their own close friends. Nor would I have as much sympathy for a mother whose kids were hosting a small wedding and simply didn't want to extend their list beyond those closest to them.

I don't think the bride & groom are required to be gracious, but virtually every bride here did extend some basic graciousness and generosity toward their parents, regardless of who was paying for the wedding. I think it would be a shiitty thing for the couple to do, regardless of whether it's their "right" to do so.

Tisha. · March 2010

My fiance and I have been together 10 years (11 years on the day we get married) so our lives and relationships are pretty much totally intermingled at this point. We sat down and made our list together, and then called both sets of parents. They all came up with a few names we had forgotten.

There are some people on the list, who will likely not get invited. There's just no need. They are family, but I haven't seen or heard from them in any form, for 20+ years. Our list of 150 people, which is the max for our location, will likely get cut to about 125. Then we'll hope that only 60% or so of those can come. :-) We are on a tight budget and are paying for this on our own. The fewer people we have to feed, the more chocolate we can afford for that chocolate fountain.

That might sound harsh, but it IS our day to celebrate. And we KNOW the people we truly want to be there, will be.

motheroftheboy · March 2010

Mother of the boy again:
     The "200" guests included from groom's side:his mom & dad (us), his 2 sisters and maternal grandmother. (paternal grandmother is deceased) Mind you, I am older myself (the boy was my last baby at age 40), so grandmother is most likely too old to travel the distance involved. I do think generation is a factor here. Others in my age range were most likely to react similarly to my first response. Perhaps we have in common a sense of tradition and formality, which in my case led directly to some deeply held expectations that burst through before benefiting from my conscious awareness. My mediating daughter is 31years old and more readily espoused the view of many in this thread of wanting to be surrounded with those you will continue with in life. But she did promise me that when she marries I can go to town with all the help I want to offer!
      I was young and a free spirit once as well. But here is what I have learned to value: On the day you marry, you take a step outside of that special oneness you have with your fiance, and stand forth in the world saying "This I promise". Those surrounding you receive that promise and treasure it with you. Your community witnesses the gift you bring to all around you and adds that to the solid foundation of community life. Your union nourishes and renews it. There will be many times of individual strife when it takes a village to bring the help and healing required. (Look at what you have offered me!) We treasure that experience in different ways at different ages. Ideally, regardless of one's age, those who surround you on that day will carry your hopes, dreams, and potential in their hearts and wish you well. I agree you should not have to suffer having someone present who cannot do this, as in someone the b or g do not like.
      So, I thank you for the gift of your insight from different points along the path. It has brought me peace and acceptance. And I wish you all a happy and productive future.
Aloha,
the Mother of the Groom

motheroftheboy · March 2010

Oops- one more question: I thought the brides who answered me were filled with good considerations and suggestions~ I appreciated their perspectives and trusted their sense of propriety. Sooo... MOB wants to send out a printed Wedding Announcement to all those people who don't get invited. Am I just reacting to the first surprise adjustment, or does this appear gift grabby? I know she doesn't mean it to be that, but I would have felt more inclined to communicate this news in conversation when we see friends, or in a Christmas letter. I know that some (maybe most) of the couples we considered inviting would wonder why they hadn't been invited to the wedding. This could be another point of decorum I'm out of touch about. Any thoughts?
Mother of the Groom

motheroftheboy · March 2010

not sure what MOB had in mind~ she hasn't said, and the bride is planning on her own without commenting or soliciting comments from us. I hope to ask how things are going when we see them at another dinner soon.

WhatawagSBNy · March 2010

    Announcements may be sent out, quite properly, even if 1,000 were at the wedding.

   No gift is ever required or even suggested for an announcement. It is like the announcement in the local paper, spread to a greater distance. A "status update" on the family.

   It usually includes the names they are using after marriage, and at least the town they will reside in, so that people who wish to offer social invitations in the future, or make personal visits, are aware of where (in general) they are.

cukimerrydoll · March 2010

I think it's a decent alternative to an invitation, especially to family friends, co-workers (for parents...) and extended family.

Since we have a huge extended family (my mom has 64 cousins, and dad is up there too), we were thinking of sending wedding announcements to everyone on our Christmas card list, MOB's card list, and MOG's card list as long as they didn't get an invite.

The people who did get invited will get Thank You cards.

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