In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:1e3468a0-1a1c-4749-bda7-28649b23ae11">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Andplusalso if he's not willing to go to couples counseling what makes you think he'd do individual counseling? Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>He won't do couples because he doesn't want me there. He thinks I'd gang up on him with the therapist because I'm a health psychologist- though that's not clinical councelling. Hopefully he'll feel more at ease if he goes alone.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
*hugs*
It's not, I hope your FI gets his act together but if he doesn't you derserve so much better. This will not be your last chance at happiness, you will find that person who treats you like you derserve, who says, "I'm going to stand beside her because she's my wife."
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. <strong>Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. </strong>Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
I just caught up on reading this, but you are so so wrong; you have so much to offer to the right person -- someone worthy. I PROMISE you that.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Oh honey I want to hug you right now. This is <em>not</em> your "last chance." You are <em>not</em> damaged goods. You are a sweet person who deserves to be with someone who is going to put you <em>first</em> in his life, and that guy is out there for you, I promise.
Here's another way to think about this: If your best friend just said to you what you wrote here, what would you tell her? You need to treat yourself with the same love and respect you'd treat your best friend, instead of thinking so negatively about yourself. I know it can be kind of a weird thought experiment, but seriously - treat yourself the way you'd treat a friend. You deserve at least that much.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:03ac31ba-66ab-4206-a83b-d280cdfea5ef">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]It is never your last chance. My mom has a good friend from college who was married for the first time when he was nearing 60. Don't settle for what you haev now because it is better than not having anything. Never settle. Know that you deserve the best. You are worth it. You can demand that you have someone who sides with you. Sometimes that person takes a while to show up. Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
You think you're damaged good because you've been made to feel this way. Whether by a previous relationship or this one. Regardless, whatever comes of any discussion this evening you need to get in to counselling. ASAP.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Most people have baggage, been through a bad relationship, etc. My mom one time asked if I knew how to date guys that weren't divorced. FI is divorced (with a cray-cray ex) but his "baggage" made him who he is now. I don't look at him or myself as damaged. We aren't damaged, as that to me implies we aren't whole. We are whole, and at times, we may be a whole lot of nuts to others, but that works for us. We just have stuff to get through from our past. We just recognize it, deal with it head on, and move forward.
This isn't your last shot at marriage, and this isn't saying that you guys won't get married. It's just a recognition of someone who deserves better. When you put yourself at the bottom of a priority list, others do too. When you start standing up and putting yourself on the top, others see that. You deserve better. You just happened upon a group of internet strangers who want what's best too.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:41f196a6-76f2-438d-8973-060765b3f7c7">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : The walking away part is absolutely scary, but you just have to really ask yourself if they way things are currently is something you can deal with forever. And it absolutely CAN get better if your FI is willing to work on it. H and I had to have a few talks about being a united front to his mother and he has improved so much. Think about the possibiliities - if 20 years from now your FILs are getting older and can't do as much for themselves anymore where do you think they're going to want to go? You could end up with this woman who thinks wives are temporary living under your roof, in EVERY aspect of your life. Posted by Kate61487[/QUOTE]<div> </div><div>Uhoh... her living under my roof under these circumstances is definitely another scary thought. I really don't think I'd be able to handle that with the way things are at the moment. </div><div> </div><div>I can see that things need to change, or my relationship with fh needs to change. It's not healty to go on like this.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:31e4070c-4520-44cf-86a8-96dab6c159bb">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : What the emmer effing eff? That's....uh....yeah. No words. Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>That was my family's reaction, too. You can imagine how awkward the rest of the day was.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:7f87d987-82a1-4659-a552-497d9f081abe">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Your FMIL said this??? Posted by edielaura[/QUOTE]
<div>yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment.</div><div> </div><div>When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". </div><div> </div><div>She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:4f52573e-8450-4701-91dd-61349555d6fd">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]She said WHAT?!?!??! Oh Good Lord, WTF IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE????? Edit: Andrea, I just keep feeling worse and worse for you. Please know you deserve SO much better than this. Follow some of the awesome advice given on here, keep your chin up, and stand firm in whatever decision you make. <3 Posted by josephwedding[/QUOTE]
<div>Thanks, I'll try my hardest to keep my chin up, and I'm going to put the advice to work tonight.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:8a0c481c-8a39-4092-84c0-ae34138bda0b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment. When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Gah I think I dislike this woman even more now than I did earlier.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:8a0c481c-8a39-4092-84c0-ae34138bda0b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment. When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Wow.
Your FMIL has major insecurity and respect issues. MAJOR issues.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:741a81fa-ae98-4b16-ab21-bd3f1a055fea">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Ummmm, WHATTHEFUCK!?!? Who the hell says that? I am so sorry your bubble is popped. I know from my experience that there was a bunch in my head that I just refused to acknowledge. When someone else said it, it became more impossible to ignore. Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
<div>And with the amount of people that have said things, it's become pretty obvious, too</div>
How old is your FMIL? Did she grow up in the 1800's? Seriously? It baffles me that people still think like her.
And if your FI can't handle you being not passive, then he needs to move on and find someone new. Again, if you change yourself for these people, you lose yourself.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b61578c4-5236-4167-97fe-2e8ec6af180b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Look, I get feeling like you're damaged goods. Trust me, I came with a lot of baggage from as far back as I can remember. But it doesn't matter how much baggage you have, or how many serious relationships you've had - you're not hopeless. The fact that you're talking about this and willing to do what you have to do proves you're not hopeless. You just haven't found the one who makes it all worthwhile. Or maybe you have, and he's got his head too far up his family's asses to see what he's missing out on.
I'm not going to say to leave him, but I will say that all this needs to be handled before you do any more wedding planning. If it works out, then fantastic. If it doesn't, then you move on. Don't let the fear of the unknown hold you back from being truly happy. And don't let his refusal to do to counseling stop you from going yourself, or from trying to improve your relationship. I fully, 100% believe in happily ever after, and that there is no "last chance" when it comes to love.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:dc5108c8-2102-4292-9bbc-6f6301fdb38a">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]How old is your FMIL? Did she grow up in the 1800's? Seriously? It baffles me that people still think like her. And if your FI can't handle you being not passive, then he needs to move on and find someone new. Again, if you change yourself for these people, you lose yourself. Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
Andra, I've read through this whole thing and I am REALLY concerned for you. This is going to be harsh, but I'm hoping to shock some reality into you.
What I see: You got out of a horribly abusive relationship, and straight into the arms of your FI, who "helped you get over" the other guy. That made you see your FI as such a wonderful, loving person. He's not. Know what he saw? He saw a target. A mark. He's emotionally abusive to you and he lets his family abuse you as well. He brought you in to be their punching bag.
If he loved you, he'd stand up for you and he wouldn't shut you out himself. If he loved you, this would just be a priority & communication issue and he'd want to work with you to fix it. He'd be going to counseling with you, with no argument. This is not love. What you saw in the beginning was not love. It was a sham, an act to draw you in. This is what abusers do. They don't ask you out on a first date, then haul off and hit you. That'd never work. Who'd stick around for that?
No, they start off great. They draw you in. And then it starts small, insidiously, with manipulation. (sound familiar?) And it keeps getting worse and worse, bigger and bigger. (sound familiar?) If he and his family push gradually, each time doesn't seem quite that much worse compared to the last time, which was almost as bad anyway. (sound familiar?) You start to feel like this is the best you deserve. (sound familiar?) You lose who you are. (sound familiar?) You become afraid to leave because no one else will ever want you. (sound familiar?)
I hate to say this, but this relationship will not get better. It's really unhealthy. And couples counseling doesn't work in abusive relationships; in fact, it can make things worse.
Get individual counseling. Make yourself strong. And go do better for yourself with a different guy.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough. ~Mae West
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:a0e05aa9-0239-466a-baa1-d46474f32b02">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : That's the thing, though, sweetie. By asking you to marry him, that should clearly indicate his choice. He wants to create his own family, with you. But he's certainly not showing that with his actions, and it's very important that he does show that. <strong>Both you and his family can be big parts of his life - that's fine, and totally normal. The relationship he currently has with his family is not normal. At all. And it's not fine.</strong> Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>Fully agree, and this has been my point for ages. I don't want to start a competition or make him feel like he's in the middle, but I need something more from him if this relationship is going to work. I want to feel secure. I always stand up for him, even when it's minor things.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:68a9ee5d-b090-4604-8fbd-abc4a0e8e589">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : So he automatically assumes that you will use couples counseling to mistreat him? Does he trust you at all? Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>Yep, he thinks I have tricks up my sleeve to manipulate him. Funny how he's so cautious with me but not his family, whose entertaiment is manipulation.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:0ce46052-05e5-4337-af85-57d1b6e7b020">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : This happened to me. I kept making excuses for my ex, over and over. He was emotionally abusive, but in a slightly different way, although he would often "punish" me for bringing up things I didn't like by shutting me out, the same way your FI is doing to you. He did go to couples counseling with me once. He refused to talk the entire time we were there. And when we left said that the counselor was on my side because he had agreed with something I'd said. I refused to recognize how bad the situation was until he tried to hit me in the middle of an argument. We all reach our point of realizing "I can't live in this situation anymore." That was when I finally broke off the engagement. And looking back, I can't believe how much I ignored about the way he treated me. This probably doesn't sound like a success story to you right now since we didn't end up together, but I def consider it a success story for me. I am 80 million times happier than I ever would have been putting up with that for the rest of my life. Esp because, unless addressed, things don't get better, they just get worse. Posted by LoveMuffins[/QUOTE]
<div>I think I've reached the end of my rope when it comes to trying to get him on my side as well, and trying to take on his family. Hopefully he will go for some form of couselling and it'll help us in the end.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:17f1f5c5-5e0c-4fb3-9223-8b216964fdc8">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? :<strong> OMGWTFBBQ????</strong> WTH says this??? What is wrong with this woman. If she thinks like this, he was raised in a family that thinks like this. This is terible. Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]<div> the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P</div><div> </div><div>He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter, not because she meant it in a bad way"</div>
Also, I sadly have to agree with LD (sadly because the situation sucks). Don't let yourself be manipulated into a lifetime of misery. Believe that life and be better.
It sounds like you know what you need to do, or at least what you can do to get on the path to happiness, which is awesome. I wish you the best.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:6ec474a1-036f-49e4-aa02-1920874643de">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Yep, he thinks I have tricks up my sleeve to manipulate him. Funny how he's so cautious with me but not his family, whose entertaiment is manipulation. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
After reading this I change all of my advice. Leave. Now. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. He's a manipulator who will only manipulate you in to thinking he's going to work things out. He's not.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:8b2e4ec0-75ed-447e-80b5-6efb179260ca">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter,<strong> not because she meant it in a bad way" </strong>Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
So there's a <em>good</em> way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags? Come on Andra. You <em>know</em> this is WRONG.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:80f67b07-a24e-4579-ad32-8468769e7de9">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]I hope SO much that this improves for you. MIL one time said to H; after he'd agreed with me on something ridiculously small and stupid "oh so you're always going to side with your wife now" and, God love that man, he said "uhh, yeah. She's my wife". I hope you'll have that - with him or with a better man a few years down the road. Posted by Kate61487[/QUOTE] I hope so, too! And I really hope it's with him, because as I said, we haven't had any issues about anything else- just this family issue.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:49366ab6-b40c-4080-8b34-a3b5acc0b2b1">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I hope so, too! And I really hope it's with him, because as I said, <strong>we haven't had any issues about anything else</strong>- just this family issue. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
I don't think this is, strictly speaking, true based on what you've told us. I mean, he won't go to counseling with you because he doesn't trust you not to conspire against him with the counselor - that goes far beyond the family issue, don't you think?
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:79b7d690-14fe-4c80-a86b-23290944110b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : <strong>So there's a good way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags?</strong> Come on Andra. You know this is WRONG. Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
OMG DED. I get that this isn't something to laugh at, but holy hell that's funny.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:360c1103-cf8a-4013-8929-2db76d3dd80a">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I *almost* heaved when I read that. If I didn't have the stomach bug going around, now I do. That's disgusting, classless, and holy eff this woman has issues. Just remember two things that have become priceless to me: 1) Children are what they live. Take a good look at his parents. If you're afraid he'll turn into them, think long and hard about your life with him. Real life example: my mom, as much as I love her, has emotional ups and downs that most roller coasters don't have. FI was concerned after being around her for awhile, and he flat out said, "I can't handle her like this, I couldn't handle you like this, please make sure you don't go down this road". I'm in counseling, though for other reasons than just my mom. My mom refuses, thinking she's just fine and that therapy makes a person weak, and everyone else has issues. FI's in counseling, and we both go together as well. It's helped tremendously, but we were ready for the therapy. 2) When you marry, you marry three people. The person they are, the person you want them to be, and the person they'll become as a result of marrying you. Don't just look at him this way. If you're already turning into someone you don't like because of how you feel you have to be around his family, think about your life like that for the next 50+ years. If it's ugly, think twice. Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]<div> </div><div>Thanks for taking the time to write all that out, it's good advice :) and I appreciate it.</div><div> </div><div>I'm definitely seeing a side of me that I never saw before, and I don't like it. I'm getting super sensitive, easily annoyed, and I'm starting to feel like "if he did X to me, i'm not gona bother being nice to him". I don't want to go down that road now, let alone for the next 50 years.
Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?
[QUOTE]Andplusalso if he's not willing to go to couples counseling what makes you think he'd do individual counseling?
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>He won't do couples because he doesn't want me there. He thinks I'd gang up on him with the therapist because I'm a health psychologist- though that's not clinical councelling. Hopefully he'll feel more at ease if he goes alone.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
*hugs*
It's not, I hope your FI gets his act together but if he doesn't you derserve so much better. This will not be your last chance at happiness, you will find that person who treats you like you derserve, who says, "I'm going to stand beside her because she's my wife."
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. <strong>Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
</strong>Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
I just caught up on reading this, but you are so so wrong; you have so much to offer to the right person -- someone worthy. I PROMISE you that.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Oh honey I want to hug you right now. This is <em>not</em> your "last chance." You are <em>not</em> damaged goods. You are a sweet person who deserves to be with someone who is going to put you <em>first</em> in his life, and that guy is out there for you, I promise.
Here's another way to think about this: If your best friend just said to you what you wrote here, what would you tell her? You need to treat yourself with the same love and respect you'd treat your best friend, instead of thinking so negatively about yourself. I know it can be kind of a weird thought experiment, but seriously - treat yourself the way you'd treat a friend. You deserve at least that much.
[QUOTE]It is never your last chance. My mom has a good friend from college who was married for the first time when he was nearing 60. Don't settle for what you haev now because it is better than not having anything. Never settle. Know that you deserve the best. You are worth it. You can demand that you have someone who sides with you. Sometimes that person takes a while to show up.
Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
Also this.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
You think you're damaged good because you've been made to feel this way. Whether by a previous relationship or this one. Regardless, whatever comes of any discussion this evening you need to get in to counselling. ASAP.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Most people have baggage, been through a bad relationship, etc. My mom one time asked if I knew how to date guys that weren't divorced. FI is divorced (with a cray-cray ex) but his "baggage" made him who he is now. I don't look at him or myself as damaged. We aren't damaged, as that to me implies we aren't whole. We are whole, and at times, we may be a whole lot of nuts to others, but that works for us. We just have stuff to get through from our past. We just recognize it, deal with it head on, and move forward.
This isn't your last shot at marriage, and this isn't saying that you guys won't get married. It's just a recognition of someone who deserves better. When you put yourself at the bottom of a priority list, others do too. When you start standing up and putting yourself on the top, others see that. You deserve better. You just happened upon a group of internet strangers who want what's best too.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : The walking away part is absolutely scary, but you just have to really ask yourself if they way things are currently is something you can deal with forever. And it absolutely CAN get better if your FI is willing to work on it. H and I had to have a few talks about being a united front to his mother and he has improved so much. Think about the possibiliities - if 20 years from now your FILs are getting older and can't do as much for themselves anymore where do you think they're going to want to go? You could end up with this woman who thinks wives are temporary living under your roof, in EVERY aspect of your life.
Posted by Kate61487[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>Uhoh... her living under my roof under these circumstances is definitely another scary thought. I really don't think I'd be able to handle that with the way things are at the moment. </div><div>
</div><div>I can see that things need to change, or my relationship with fh needs to change. It's not healty to go on like this.
</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : What the emmer effing eff? That's....uh....yeah. No words.
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>That was my family's reaction, too. You can imagine how awkward the rest of the day was.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Your FMIL said this???
Posted by edielaura[/QUOTE]
<div>yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment.</div><div>
</div><div>When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". </div><div>
</div><div>She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while.</div>
[QUOTE]She said WHAT?!?!??! Oh Good Lord, WTF IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE????? Edit: Andrea, I just keep feeling worse and worse for you. Please know you deserve SO much better than this. Follow some of the awesome advice given on here, keep your chin up, and stand firm in whatever decision you make. <3
Posted by josephwedding[/QUOTE]
<div>Thanks, I'll try my hardest to keep my chin up, and I'm going to put the advice to work tonight.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment. When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Gah I think I dislike this woman even more now than I did earlier.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : yes, in front of his family and my parents. I was not present at the moment. When my mom called her out on it later on, she told my mom that "since I'm younger than fh I should be more passive and let him make the decisions, or else he'll see that there are other fish in the sea and leave me". She talks a lot of crap behind my back, and to my own parents even. My parents have backed off of them majorly, because it was all fights and drama for a while.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Wow.
Your FMIL has major insecurity and respect issues. MAJOR issues.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Ummmm, WHATTHEFUCK!?!? Who the hell says that? I am so sorry your bubble is popped. I know from my experience that there was a bunch in my head that I just refused to acknowledge. When someone else said it, it became more impossible to ignore.
Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
<div>And with the amount of people that have said things, it's become pretty obvious, too</div>
And if your FI can't handle you being not passive, then he needs to move on and find someone new. Again, if you change yourself for these people, you lose yourself.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I keep thinking about that sentance, as quite a few people have told me to ask myself that question before. I think part of me sees myself as damaged goods, and I had a couple serious relationships and if this one doesn't work out, I feel like I'm hopeless. Maybe I feel like this is my last chance, I think.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
Look, I get feeling like you're damaged goods. Trust me, I came with a lot of baggage from as far back as I can remember. But it doesn't matter how much baggage you have, or how many serious relationships you've had - you're not hopeless. The fact that you're talking about this and willing to do what you have to do proves you're not hopeless. You just haven't found the one who makes it all worthwhile. Or maybe you have, and he's got his head too far up his family's asses to see what he's missing out on.
I'm not going to say to leave him, but I will say that all this needs to be handled before you do any more wedding planning. If it works out, then fantastic. If it doesn't, then you move on. Don't let the fear of the unknown hold you back from being truly happy. And don't let his refusal to do to counseling stop you from going yourself, or from trying to improve your relationship. I fully, 100% believe in happily ever after, and that there is no "last chance" when it comes to love.
[QUOTE]How old is your FMIL? Did she grow up in the 1800's? Seriously? It baffles me that people still think like her. And if your FI can't handle you being not passive, then he needs to move on and find someone new. Again, if you change yourself for these people, you lose yourself.
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
This.
I think that whole family needs counseling.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : That's the thing, though, sweetie. By asking you to marry him, that should clearly indicate his choice. He wants to create his own family, with you. But he's certainly not showing that with his actions, and it's very important that he does show that. <strong>Both you and his family can be big parts of his life - that's fine, and totally normal. The relationship he currently has with his family is not normal. At all. And it's not fine.</strong>
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>Fully agree, and this has been my point for ages. I don't want to start a competition or make him feel like he's in the middle, but I need something more from him if this relationship is going to work. I want to feel secure. I always stand up for him, even when it's minor things.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : So he automatically assumes that you will use couples counseling to mistreat him? Does he trust you at all?
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>Yep, he thinks I have tricks up my sleeve to manipulate him. Funny how he's so cautious with me but not his family, whose entertaiment is manipulation.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : This happened to me. I kept making excuses for my ex, over and over. He was emotionally abusive, but in a slightly different way, although he would often "punish" me for bringing up things I didn't like by shutting me out, the same way your FI is doing to you. He did go to couples counseling with me once. He refused to talk the entire time we were there. And when we left said that the counselor was on my side because he had agreed with something I'd said. I refused to recognize how bad the situation was until he tried to hit me in the middle of an argument. We all reach our point of realizing "I can't live in this situation anymore." That was when I finally broke off the engagement. And looking back, I can't believe how much I ignored about the way he treated me. This probably doesn't sound like a success story to you right now since we didn't end up together, but I def consider it a success story for me. I am 80 million times happier than I ever would have been putting up with that for the rest of my life. Esp because, unless addressed, things don't get better, they just get worse.
Posted by LoveMuffins[/QUOTE]
<div>I think I've reached the end of my rope when it comes to trying to get him on my side as well, and trying to take on his family. Hopefully he will go for some form of couselling and it'll help us in the end.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? :<strong> OMGWTFBBQ????</strong> WTH says this??? What is wrong with this woman. If she thinks like this, he was raised in a family that thinks like this. This is terible.
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]<div>
the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P</div><div>
</div><div>He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter, not because she meant it in a bad way"</div>
It sounds like you know what you need to do, or at least what you can do to get on the path to happiness, which is awesome. I wish you the best.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Yep, he thinks I have tricks up my sleeve to manipulate him. Funny how he's so cautious with me but not his family, whose entertaiment is manipulation.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
After reading this I change all of my advice. Leave. Now. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. He's a manipulator who will only manipulate you in to thinking he's going to work things out. He's not.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter,<strong> not because she meant it in a bad way"
</strong>Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
So there's a <em>good</em> way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags? Come on Andra. You <em>know</em> this is WRONG.
[QUOTE]I hope SO much that this improves for you. MIL one time said to H; after he'd agreed with me on something ridiculously small and stupid "oh so you're always going to side with your wife now" and, God love that man, he said "uhh, yeah. She's my wife". I hope you'll have that - with him or with a better man a few years down the road.
Posted by Kate61487[/QUOTE]
I hope so, too! And I really hope it's with him, because as I said, we haven't had any issues about anything else- just this family issue.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I hope so, too! And I really hope it's with him, because as I said, <strong>we haven't had any issues about anything else</strong>- just this family issue.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
I don't think this is, strictly speaking, true based on what you've told us. I mean, he won't go to counseling with you because he doesn't trust you not to conspire against him with the counselor - that goes far beyond the family issue, don't you think?
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : <strong>So there's a good way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags?</strong> Come on Andra. You know this is WRONG.
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
OMG DED. I get that this isn't something to laugh at, but holy hell that's funny.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I *almost* heaved when I read that. If I didn't have the stomach bug going around, now I do. That's disgusting, classless, and holy eff this woman has issues. Just remember two things that have become priceless to me: 1) Children are what they live. Take a good look at his parents. If you're afraid he'll turn into them, think long and hard about your life with him. Real life example: my mom, as much as I love her, has emotional ups and downs that most roller coasters don't have. FI was concerned after being around her for awhile, and he flat out said, "I can't handle her like this, I couldn't handle you like this, please make sure you don't go down this road". I'm in counseling, though for other reasons than just my mom. My mom refuses, thinking she's just fine and that therapy makes a person weak, and everyone else has issues. FI's in counseling, and we both go together as well. It's helped tremendously, but we were ready for the therapy. 2) When you marry, you marry three people. The person they are, the person you want them to be, and the person they'll become as a result of marrying you. Don't just look at him this way. If you're already turning into someone you don't like because of how you feel you have to be around his family, think about your life like that for the next 50+ years. If it's ugly, think twice.
Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>Thanks for taking the time to write all that out, it's good advice :) and I appreciate it.</div><div>
</div><div>I'm definitely seeing a side of me that I never saw before, and I don't like it. I'm getting super sensitive, easily annoyed, and I'm starting to feel like "if he did X to me, i'm not gona bother being nice to him". I don't want to go down that road now, let alone for the next 50 years.
</div>