this is the code for the render ad
Texas-Dallas and Ft. Worth

SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???

Ok I'm sorry if this is long and complicated, but I'm just ready to rip my hair out I'm so frustrated!!

Originally, I wanted a friend of my family to be the photographer at my wedding. She takes beautiful pictures and all of the money she makes right now is going toward a 2-year mission trip to India that she is trying to go on. But she told me that she would probably be in India already at the time of my wedding, so I kept shopping around for photographers.

I eventually started talking with Evan Godwin Photography because he comes so highly recommended by everyone on here. It seemed good, he was within my budget and one of his associate photographers was available on my date. So he gave me my personalized login info on his site and told me to pay the deposit and once that had been done and my contract had been signed, then the associate would talk to me about specific details. So I paid the deposit about three weeks ago, but on my site under "billing and legal" (Where the website said I would view my contract) it said that an electronic version of my contract was not available. So I figured that I would have to sign it in person and the associate or Evan would contact me about it.

Well the holidays came and went and suddenly my friend got in contact with me and told me that she would, in fact, be in town for my wedding if I still wanted her to shoot it. I really wanted to be able to support her trip, so I told her I was willing to forfeit my deposit with Evan and switch to her. I emailed Evan to let him know and he informs me that on top of losing my deposit (which I assumed I would be doing) I also owe him 25% of the remaining balance. I was horrified!! I looked back through all the emails I exchanged with him looking for some hint of this and couldn't find one anywhere. I went back to my personalized site and finally, under an obscure tab named "files", I found a copy of a contract I had never seen or been told about where it states that it is his policy that if a booking is cancelled any time before three months out from the event, 25% is due (any closer to the event and you owe half).

I am just SO frustrated because I definitely never signed that contract!! I never even saw it!! So, my question is....can he do that? I know everyone swears by him but this just seems so underhanded and shady. I am on such a tight budget for this wedding and am trying desperately to scrape by with what little we have. What do yall think??
«1

Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???

  • angelsong21angelsong21 member
    1000 Comments Second Anniversary Combo Breaker
    edited January 2012
    Well, I can tell you I don't swear by him at all because I had my own very negative experience with him last year.  I would never recommend him to anyone but I do try to keep my opinion to myself when others recommend him on this board because they have had a good experience.  I am sorry that you fell into the same "negative experience" category that I did.

    Annnnnyway, I would tell you that if you have NOT signed a contract, I personally would not pay that money.  If you never signed a contract, how can you be contractually obligated to pay any additional money?  I would challenge that.  I will also warn you that he easily throws "lawyer" into the mix when you do challenge him on something. 
    Anniversary Image and video hosting by TinyPic
  • I don't think he can bind you to something that you have never signed. Also, If the contract was not there to begin with, do you think that he uploaded it when you told him you where cancelling? Or did you not look in the file folder? 

    I don't have any experience with this person but 25% seems pretty high for 5 months out.
    image
  • Owing money is normal... if you signed the contract.  You didn't sign it so I don't see how he could possibly try and stick that to you.
  • It's a sticky situation, because if you did any kind of "e-sign" on his website, then that could be counted as your contract.  If you never signed anything, then PP are correct -- you don't owe him anything.

    Maybe we should edit our recommendation of Evan: He is a talented photographer, but make sure he's absolutely what you want, because cancelling seems like a hassle.
    Anniversary

    image

    image

  • I don't know if it was there in the file folder the whole time or not, i never thought to look there.  But I know that it has always said that my contract was not available online.  I think I'm going to ask around with some lawyers I know and see if I can be held responsible for that money. 
  • I looked back through all my correspondence with him, and he never said anything about "if you respond affirmitavely then I'll consider the contract signed".  I don't know how I would have signed that without knowing, unless somehow paying the deposit meant I was signing
  • Oh no, e-signing is pretty obvious.  It's not actually legal to just consider your affirmative response as an acceptance of the contract.  Granted, sending in the deposit implies that you agree, but that's neither here nor there at this point.
    Anniversary

    image

    image

  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local Wedding BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:12d325f7-9ce9-4a4a-bcd0-dd5831c973c4">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]It's a sticky situation, because if you did any kind of "e-sign" on his website, then that could be counted as your contract.  If you never signed anything, then PP are correct -- you don't owe him anything. <strong>Maybe we should edit our recommendation of Evan: He is a talented photographer, but make sure he's absolutely what you want, because cancelling seems like a hassle.
    </strong>Posted by professorscience[/QUOTE]

    I agree here.  I haven't been too keen on him since the last disaster when someone defending him came onto this board insulting everyone after the last cancellation.
  • I would like to hear insight on cancellation from, say, Chelsea or Lynn.
    Anniversary

    image

    image

  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local Wedding BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:2f2056a1-08b5-4a6b-b181-b1a3ddd9f905">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]I would like to hear insight on cancellation from, say, Chelsea or Lynn.
    Posted by professorscience[/QUOTE]

    They aren't really allowed to post on this topic... :) 
  • Ask on TN and C&P ;)
    ~DFWs Resident Snark~
    I'm not so good with the advice... Can I interest you in a sarcastic comment?
    image
  • edited January 2012
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:7e47e53e-808f-446c-8d2b-541f6ab9a3ef">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this??? : They aren't really allowed to post on this topic... :) 
    Posted by bsn1752[/QUOTE]

    <div>I know, but they're easily accessible.  And really, I'd be interested to hear the typical cancellation policy for any photographer who wouldn't be described as "budget."  I feel like Evan's cancellation policies are so severe because his prices are so low and his experience is limited.  When you have a $700 photography package, I can imagine you'd want to recoup at least some of those losses if someone cancelled to go with a competitor.</div><div>
    </div><div>The deposit for someone like McGowan is (I imagine) larger than what Evan's would be, plus they are hugely popular, so they wouldn't have as much trouble booking that lost day.</div><div>
    </div><div>Edit: I'm not saying Evan is right.  From the last incident, he seems kind of brash and could benefit from some customer service improvements.  I'm just wondering if this is fairly normal and we never hear about it because most people don't skimp on photography.</div>
    Anniversary

    image

    image

  • fallbride1109fallbride1109 member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 5 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited January 2012
    Oh no I feel terrible because I recommend him whenever someone is on a budget because he seems one of the best in the lower price point but if so many here have had problems than obviously something is very wrong (angelsong I didn't remember that happening to you I am so sorry). As far as what can legally be done I am not sure.
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local Wedding BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:526521f6-90b7-49bd-a4be-973354f173ac">SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE] So I paid the deposit about three weeks ago, but on my site under "billing and legal" (Where the website said I would view my contract) it said that an electronic version of my contract was not available. Posted by monkey0808[/QUOTE]

    Plain and simple: ask <strong><em>him</em></strong> to produce a copy of a SIGNED contract.
    ~DFWs Resident Snark~
    I'm not so good with the advice... Can I interest you in a sarcastic comment?
    image
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:8e9e4280-2881-4ef2-86ec-89dd9588e789">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to SO frustrated...can my photographer do this??? : Plain and simple: ask him to produce a copy of a SIGNED contract.
    Posted by FebDallasBride[/QUOTE]

    Co-signed,
    Me
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:e22302d8-dc15-4986-8129-504a44e1449d">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this??? : Co-signed, Me
    Posted by juliebug1997[/QUOTE]
    Third this. As someone who works in contracts as a living, nothing is contractually binding for EITHER party (including payments and/or providing services) unless if there is a signed document. E-signature has specific steps that have to occur before an e-signature can be contractually binding (i.e. you probably had to have checked a box and filled in a date designating your understanding of executing a contract). Don't let him bully you around- wait until you have a signed copy of his contract and read through the entire thing. 
  • Shay102007Shay102007 member
    10 Comments
    edited January 2012
    I'm so sorry this is happening. Did you by chance print out the contract he sent you? I think it's so important to read what you are signing and this is something we can all learn from. You can firmly let him know he can keep the deposit but you will not be sending any additional payments.
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:3b34c7f3-1be4-429e-8610-7361fea71055">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]I'm so sorry this is happening. Did you by chance print out the contract he sent you? I think it's so important to read what you are signing and this is something we can all learn from. You can firmly let him know he can keep the deposit but you will not be sending any additional payments.
    Posted by Shay102007[/QUOTE]

    She didn't get a contract.
  • He never sent me the contract, and under "billing and legal" on the website (where it says the contracts are to be viewed) it said a copy of mine wasn't available.  I just found it last night in another section of the website called "files".  But yes, I did save a copy of it.  It doesn't say anything about paying the deposit being equal to signing the contract
  • edited January 2012
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local Wedding BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:3b34c7f3-1be4-429e-8610-7361fea71055">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]I'm so sorry this is happening. Did you by chance print out the contract he sent you? I think it's so important to read what you are signing and this is something we can all learn from. You can firmly let him know he can keep the deposit but you will not be sending any additional payments.
    Posted by Shay102007[/QUOTE]

    She didn't sign anything.
    ~DFWs Resident Snark~
    I'm not so good with the advice... Can I interest you in a sarcastic comment?
    image
  • angelsong21angelsong21 member
    1000 Comments Second Anniversary Combo Breaker
    edited January 2012
    Just for clarification on what happened in my experience:

    1)  I did not cancel anything with Evan.  I inquired with him about what his cancellation policy was for a date that was about a year out because we had some financial changes and we were reviewing the commitments we had made for our wedding to ensure we could keep everything as it was booked.  In turn, Evan terminated our contract because, even though I had paid a deposit and signed the contact to hold my date and time, my questioning about his cancellation policy was proof to him essentially that I wouldn't be following through with the contract and he wanted to book someone else.

    2)  Evan stated that per his lawyer, my verbal inquiry as to his cancellation policy was enough to indicate I had an intent to cancel and therefore that was binding.  .... right.

    3)  Evan did not do e-sign, at least when I worked with him last you.  You had to sign the paper contact and attach to e-mail I believe.

    ETA:  And I know in the end he posted his side of the story last year when this all came about.  I have e-mails saved if anyone should care to question what had actually happened.
    Anniversary Image and video hosting by TinyPic
  • Ah yes, I do remember that now Angelsong--although I didn't ever hear his side, not that it matters.  I will be sure not to recommend him anymore.  OP, I don't want to comment since I can't see his website, don't know if there is something hidden there, etc. but I hope you are able to reach a resolution. 
  • Angelsong's story and debacle with him was enough to make me never recommend him!
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local Wedding BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:d7aac0a5-80f5-43df-aea3-6d0da55682a1">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]Angelsong's story and debacle with him was enough to make me never recommend him!
    Posted by bsn1752[/QUOTE]

    Well why didn't you guys ever remind me?  Remember--I'm OLD!  :)
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:d7aac0a5-80f5-43df-aea3-6d0da55682a1">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]Angelsong's story and debacle with him was enough to make me never recommend him!
    Posted by bsn1752[/QUOTE]

    Thumbs up. 
  • I'm an Evan bride and my contract is under the files tab.  You might check there. 
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • Oh I just read closer.  You fond the files tab.  Forehead slap.
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • thank you so much for everyone that gave me input on my problem! I just wanted to let you all know that I heard from Evan and he is not going to charge me the extra fee and has apologized for all this confusion. Again, thanks for the advice ladies!!
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/local-wedding-boards_texas-dallas-ft-worth_frustratedcan-photographer-this?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Local%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:102Discussion:01942bb2-5381-4485-a7d9-b203ac3c446ePost:ac292b74-6873-4648-ba8d-c149d9df7c68">Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this???</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: SO frustrated...can my photographer do this??? : Well why didn't you guys ever remind me?  Remember--I'm OLD!  :)
    Posted by stephiehall[/QUOTE]

    LOL stephiehall, you are NOT old!!!  And no need to apologize to me at all (in an earlier post on this thread) -- don't even worry about it!  Like I said, I tried not to say much about it because I know other people have had a good experience with him.  I thought maybe, perchance, my experience was just a fluke.  And others who were on this board for the whole debacle continued to recommend him, so I thought it was a shared sentiment.   So no worries! :)
    Anniversary Image and video hosting by TinyPic
  • Ok but I promise to remember from now on! At least he did right by the OP.
This discussion has been closed.
Choose Another Board
Search Boards