Super Complicated father issue (XP)

kxp004 · July 2010

Okay.. so I have a seriously messed up family.. My parents got divorced when i was little and then of my parents remarried - which brings in my step-parents... Neither couple gets along with the other! My mom and dad can hardly be in the same room together! When I was little, my father taught me to believe that my step dad was a jerk and only wanted to take his place, and being little I believed him, but now I'm old enough to make my own decisions... and have found that it was quite the opposite. My bio father wants to walk me down the aisle, sit at an honorary table, and do the father daughter dance, but doesn't want to pay for anything-claiming that he paid enough child support which he says "should have covered ALL of my college and my wedding if my mom distributed it right".... my stepdad and FIL are paying for our wedding. My bio dad doesn't even support me getting married! He is emotionally abusive and when we have issues, he makes sure the entire world knows that it a) wasn't his fault and b) I'm the most unappreciative daughter in the world and don't love anyone.

I really don't want to invite my father or stepmother to the wedding, but if I don't, my younger brother and sister won't be able to come, and it's already bad enough that they can't be IN the wedding. I really want them to be there, but there is no one else who can bring them....I don't want to completely ruin my relationship with my siblings, but I really don't want my father at the wedding because he will expect to do all the things that fathers do, and that's not goning to happen, which will tick him off...HELP PLEASE!!!!!!! Do I invite him so the kids can come, or do I not invite him and try to explain it once my siblings are old enough to understand...?

I'm not bending on the fact that he will not be an honorary guest... that is something that is given out of respect and respect is earned, not given because you have a title...

tidetravel · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_super-complicated-father-issue-xp?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:d45a50dd-9d88-4c3e-8e5d-b2e06c2706e1Post:dc105de2-459f-4bee-988a-40cd79e28220">Super Complicated father issue (XP)</a>:
[QUOTE]Okay.. so I have a seriously messed up family.. My parents got divorced when i was little and then of my parents remarried - which brings in my step-parents... Neither couple gets along with the other! My mom and dad can hardly be in the same room together! When I was little, my father taught me to believe that my step dad was a jerk and only wanted to take his place, and being little I believed him, but now I'm old enough to make my own decisions... and have found that it was quite the opposite. My bio father wants to walk me down the aisle, sit at an honorary table, and do the father daughter dance, but doesn't want to pay for anything-claiming that he paid enough child support which he says "should have covered ALL of my college and my wedding if my mom distributed it right".... my stepdad and FIL are paying for our wedding. My bio dad doesn't even support me getting married! He is emotionally abusive and when we have issues, he makes sure the entire world knows that it a) wasn't his fault and b) I'm the most unappreciative daughter in the world and don't love anyone. I really don't want to invite my father or stepmother to the wedding, but if I don't, my younger brother and sister won't be able to come, and it's already bad enough that they can't be IN the wedding. I really want them to be there, but there is no one else who can bring them....I don't want to completely ruin my relationship with my siblings, but I really don't want my father at the wedding because he will expect to do all the things that fathers do, and that's not goning to happen, which will tick him off... HELP PLEASE!!!!!!! Do I invite him so the kids can come, or do I not invite him and try to explain it once my siblings are old enough to understand...? I'm not bending on the fact that he will not be an honorary guest... that is something that is given out of respect and respect is earned, not given because you have a title...
Posted by kxp004[/QUOTE]
How old are your siblings? This will probably affect my advice.

AmoroAgain · July 2010

While I say that his paying or not paying has nothing to do with what your father "gets" at your wedding, the personal relationship or lack thereof, should be your only basis for deciding whether he's there or not, or whether he participates or not.

I didn't invite my father because I hadn't spoken to him in over a year by the time we got married. It caused a huge rift with my sisters, and we're probably never going to be the same again. So remember that when you decide whether to include family or not.

kxp004 · July 2010

@tide travel

My half sis (sky) is 9 and my half bro (Jake) is 6.... My sis is already mad because my other sister (my mom's) is the flower girl...

They both were going to be in it originally and then my father got mad and we didn't talk from last Oct until this past April...which messed up my relationship with Sky because he told her that I didn't love her and didn't want to see or talk to her....

@love the beach

Jeez... Sorry that we're in the same boat.... it sucks....

The wedding is this October. I'm not sure when I'm going to tell him cause I don't even know if I want to invite him yet....

apnk2005 · July 2010

I agree with the PP. Invite him, but tell him that he won't be doing any of the father/daughter stuff ASAP. If you want to avoid issues, you could tell him you've decided that you don't want him to walk you down the aisle because you'd rather walk down the aisle yourself/with your FI for whatever reason (you don't believe that fathers should "give" their daughters away, you and FI want to start your marriage walking in together, whatever), and that you and your FI decided not to do parent dances, because you don't want to take up time and bore your guests. You could also decide not to have an honorary table, just to avoid that issue as well. My father and I have a lot of issues, too, and I decided it wasn't worth the fight, so I told him basically what I suggested above. He was upset at first, but I kept telling him that it was nothing to do with him personally (which it was, I freely admit I lied about that), and that we had just decided to do things the way we did because it was what WE wanted, and how we wanted to start our marriage.

kxp004 · July 2010

@apnk2005

These are all really awesome suggestions, but I just don't think he will care... I tried explaining to him why my fiance didn't ask him if we could get married.... I told him I'm very forward thinking and I believe that I can make that decision myself and that I don't give myself away, and nobody else will either, because I'm a person, not a piece of property....(it sounded much better when I said it) he didn't care and immediately withdrew all of his support and proceed to tell my fiance that I would never love my fiance like a person, I only love his money (what $? we're broke college students going into policing)

We will have security at the reception (it's really for the bar, but they are police officers) but I still want to have the parent dances and it's DEFINATELY not fair to not have honor tables (my mom and my MIL would flip) so... that cuts those out...

Everyone's advice is great, but just not quite fool proof.... and I just really need to know that whatever I do I make the right decision....

tidetravel · July 2010

Wow, I'm sorry your dad's an ass.

I think if you're worried about him keeping you away from your siblings, then I would suggest follow PPs advice. Although, that may simply serve to piss him off more.

I hate it when people use/manipulate children like that. The kids don't deserve it. If your father and you are currently on talking terms, maybe you could have a day with the kids - take them to the zoo or the park - and have a talk with them (as much as you can with young kids.) Let them know that no matter what happens, or what anyone says, that you love them very much. If your father is going to hold them over your head, this may be something that they have to grow up and understand later.

kxp004 · July 2010

welllllll.... i wouldn't exactly call it talking terms.... but maybe I can figure something out.... I'm just worried that when I call to tell him that we won't be doing any of the father/daughter things that he will say, well I'm not bringing the kids unless you let me do that.... which is something he would do... but then I also don't want him to bring the kids and then have them watch him be police escorted out of the wedding for causing a scene.... y'know?

tidetravel · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_super-complicated-father-issue-xp?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:d45a50dd-9d88-4c3e-8e5d-b2e06c2706e1Post:39a85d68-c441-40d1-9842-a8801ed6898b">Re: Super Complicated father issue (XP)</a>:
[QUOTE]welllllll.... i wouldn't exactly call it talking terms.... but maybe I can figure something out.... I'm just worried that when I call to tell him that we won't be doing any of the father/daughter things that he will say, well I'm not bringing the kids unless you let me do that.... which is something he would do... but then I also don't want him to bring the kids and then have them watch him be police escorted out of the wedding for causing a scene.... y'know?
Posted by kxp004[/QUOTE]
If he were to do that, I would be inclined to remind him, in not such a nice way, that shiit like that is the reason that he's not walking you down that aisle in the first place.

hd7694 · July 2010

I don't have any good advice since I am sort of a witch and would tell my dad exactly what I thought of him. I just wanted to say that I am so sorry that you are going through this. I cannot believe that a grown man would tell his small children that someone does not love them. That is absolutely pathetic. What does your step-mom say about how your dad talks to the kids? Does she allow this? Would she bring your brother and sister to the wedding even if your dad doesn't come? Again, I am sooooo sorry that you are going through this.

lauralaur · July 2010

Could you maybe concede the father-daughter dance? I know it's not what you want and I definitely understand why, but here are my thoughts: You could have the DJ cut the song short, 2 minutes tops, and then just not use any of the photos. Request a special song from the DJ for you and your step-dad to dance to (with everyone else, not solo) (if you want to have a special dance with your step-father, I can't tell whether you'd rather do the dance with him or not) and tell your photographer to keep an ear out for that song and to take lots of pictures of the two of you dancing. But maybe that would give him just enough to not blow his lid? Normally I'd say to tell him to just go away, but unfortunately, until they get older and figure things out for themselves as you did, he's your connection to your siblings. Right now, you need to do all you can to prove to them that your dad is wrong about you, so that when they grow up and reflect back on their times with you, they can realize that you aren't the horrible person your father makes you out to be. You need to invite him, because your siblings need to be there. However, you need to talk to him about not walking you down the aisle and the sooner the better.

It sounds like no matter what you say as your reasoning the man will flip his lid. I don't really know that there is a way to do this delicately, you know your dad best and what will set him off. But, be firm on the aisle-walking. Other than what I wrote above, I really don't have any suggestions for how to handle this, but again, you need to invite him for the sake of your relationship with your siblings. Good luck and I'm so sorry you're having to deal with all of this.

kxp004 · July 2010

@ hd

Nope she doens't care and is even more mad at me because I won't forgive my father for knocking me around....whatever... but no she wouldn't bring the kids... there's defiantly no love lost between us.... and i have told my father, but he thinks i'm just being unappreciative....but thanks so much for the support

It's really nice for all of y'allto help with this issue...OMG you're getting married on 10/23/10? we are too! what a coincidence...

@ lauralaur

that's a really good idea to like... sneak it in...

That's what I will do if i invite him and he shows up.... thanks for the advice... cute puppy btw.... is it a German shepherd? we have one of those....

so adorable

lauralaur · July 2010

Thanks!

She's 3/4 Belgian Malinois, the other 1/4 is unknown, although her vet paperwork says Malinois/Shepherd mix. The original owner who had the puppies didn't know what the heck she was doing, so we're not sure. She goes for her first vet visit with us on Wednesday and I'm going to talk to the vet about figuring out exactly what breed/s she is.

KimandWil · July 2010

I am sorry to hear about this. I thought I had a compicated Father issue. As if planning a wedding isn't stressful enough.

This day is for you and your husband to be, I personally think that inviting your father is more trouble than it's worth. I come from a big family, I have 10 siblings. I know what it is like to want to have that bond with your sibs, is there an aunt or uncle that can intervene, or offer to watch the kids so they can come to the ceremony?

If not, you may have to explain when they are older exactly what happened and why they were unable to come. Maybe after all the wedding stuff is over, plan a special day with just the two of them... you don't have to explain what happened, but you can just hang with them and let them know that you do love them.

We have a saying that goes like this " Any fool can be a dad, but it takes a real man to be a father." You have a real father in your step dad. enjoy your that relationship with him.

Good Luck and enjoy your day.

Catwoman708 · July 2010

Simplify.

"I only ask that for this one day, you put aside bitterness and past problems and just attend as an honored guest, and enjoy seeing me happily married, without any conflict or stress. Can you do that for me, give me ONE happy day, and happy family memory?".

If not tell him you understand it's too difficult for him, and that you will miss him and your siblings.

Don't apologize, don't back down. If he misses out, if your sibs miss out, it's on him, not you.

kxp004 · July 2010

just fyi this is a crosspost with the customs and traditions board... sorry for any confusion....

kxp004 · July 2010

Question I posed on the other board:

What do y'all think about invinting the kids in my grandmother's invitation? Would that make things worse or better? Just trying to make sure that they know they are invited... I don't know if my grandma will bring them, but at least they are invited right? maybe? i dunno....

oh and yes i had originally asked for them to be in the wedding, but as I posted earlier, he has convinced them that "I don't love them" and that "I love my adopted bro and sis more"....(my mom's children are adopted) this is a recurring argument... he says that his kids should be more important because they are my "blood" siblings.... and the other ones are adopted.... which is absolutely ridiculous, but that's what he believes.... so to throw one more problem into the issue, the children will not be allowed to play together at the wedding so that the negative ideas he has put into them don't get said to my other siblings because that would be really hurtful.... y'know? (This is my mother's decision and I respect her wishes, so I can't change the no contact between the children...)

J.T. · July 2010

If you've had such issues with your dad then odds are his other kids will at some point as well. It sounds like anything you do that your dad doesn't agree with, whether related to the wedding or not, will cause him to cut your siblings off from your. My advice would be to take them out of the equation. Make your decision solely based on your relationship with him. I agree with PP and would tell him that he will not be walking you down the aisle, dancing with you, etc. and see if he shows up. Do you really think a 2 minute dance will make him happy enough to not complain the entire day about everything else he's not getting (in his eyes)?

While it really, really sucks, I think you probably won't get to have much of a relationship with those siblings until they're old enough to see you on their own. Then you can contact them, explain the situation, and try to go from there. I'm not saying you should give up on them right now by any means, but I just think that not having a great relationship right now is a possibility that should be considered rather then allowing your father to use them as a pawn to continue to make you miserable. That's not healthy for anyone.

squirrly · July 2010

I think if your grandmother could reasonably bring the kids, that would be the best solution. If your father is as abusive as you say, why invite him at all? And, if he's going to tell your siblings that you don't love them anyway, regardless of whether they attend the wedding, allowing him to come and but his "special twist" on your wedding day doesn't really seem worthwhile as a means to get your siblings there.

Maintain the best relationship you can with them outside your father. But, don't let him blackmail you. If he's that evil, the kids will recognize that as they grow up. Until then, they'll believe what he says, hook line & sinker.

Beachy730 · July 2010

I would be straightforward with him and say "I would like you and the kids to come to my wedding as a guest, but I want you to know that stepdad will be walking me down the aisle and dancing with me in the father/daughter dance. If this is something you can handle then I would like you there, but if you can't then i would prefer you not come." If you really think he would cause a scene, then you can even mention that there will be security there if any problems arise. If these traditions are things that you want for your wedding, then I wouldn't sacrifice them to avoid hurting the feelings of a man who clearly doesn't care at all about your feelings.

As for your stepsiblings, honestly, i think if the only reason you are inviting him or for them to come, then just forget it. They are young enough (at least the boy) that they probably don't even know if they are invited or not, and even if you did invite them theres a good chance that your dad will lie to them anyways. And i think it would be miserable for them to sit and watch as all the other kids played together and they couldn't. You said that your dad told you all these lies when you were growing up about your stepdad and things, and now that you are older you know what kind of man he is and the lies he told. There's a good chance that these kids will figure out the same thing. And as long as he's going to keep feeding the negative thoughts in their head, its going to negate anything you do for them.

kxp004 · July 2010

I do appreciate everyone's advice and help throughout this experience, whether or not I agreed with the comment or not... I asked for advice and got more than I ever expected. I want to thank EVERYONE for taking time to help me, someone y'all don't know, work through an issue.

I have also made my ultimate decision... Based on the conversations here, my parent's feelings, my FM&FIL's feelings, my FI's feelings and most importantly my own... I have decided to not invite my father and stepmother to the wedding...instead I will invite my little sis and bro with my grandmother and hope that if they can't come, they will eventually understand why I had to do what I had to do...

THANKS EVERYONE!!! and WISH ME GOOD LUCK!

~Kristen

kateashley9 · July 2010

Good luck to you and I totally agree with your decision! I have a very similar issue and am NOT inviting my dad. Thankfully my youngest sibling through him just turned 16 so is ok to drive himself. Its hurtful to not have been blessed with an amazing father, but thankfully the rest of my family/ friends make up for it!

Super Complicated father issue (XP)

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