In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:8b2e4ec0-75ed-447e-80b5-6efb179260ca">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P <strong>He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter, not because she meant it in a bad way"</strong> Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
HOW ELSE are you supposed to mean something like that? Seriously. Give me a break. I lose my filter sometimes, but I'm never disgustingly rude.
Look at it like this: your FI is always going to forgive his mother, no matter what he does. When she makes him mad, does he give her the silent treatment?
But when you upset him, he gives it to you.
Whose side is he really on? If he gives his mom the silent treatment, then he shuts down with stress. But I would bet an entire city that he doesn't EVER give her the silent treatment. He's afraid of her. He doesn't care about you or your reaction.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:5412895c-a54e-4637-83ec-cfecb173dd4e">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]I would also like to point out that your FILs are concerned about the wedding looking "cheap" to their friends and family, yet FMIL uses words like c*nt. Klassy, I wonder what her friends and family would think if they learned that about her. Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>She says stuff like this around others, too... so I think a few people at least have an idea of what she's like.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:d113e1f3-ad14-4dc0-96df-bb44ce03a795">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Same goes here. FMIL announced one time at dinner (in a public restaurant no less) That I poisoned her food and that because I was laughing I did it. I was laughing because she's a crazy pants. But that's beside the point. FI refused to talk to his mother until she apologized (which was half-assed) but she's never made a scene like that again. PLEASE don't hang on because you don't want to have "nothing" because you never know what may happen and in all reality it sounds like you can't even look forward to these big events in your life because your ILs have pretty much taken the reign on your parents dime. That's not ok. Also, you might want to tell your vendors (if you continue on) that the only upgrades that will be made will be made by you personally. Not FI, FMIL or FFIL. You. I think you owe that at least to your parents. Posted by crash2729[/QUOTE]<div> </div><div>O wow, you have a "fun" fmil too. I don't know what it is about parents loosing it when their kids are starting a new chapter.</div><div> </div><div>My parents have already talked to his about upgrading things, and I have already told my vendor (we only have one so far- the venue/catering) that only I get to make changes since I signed the contract (fh isn't even on the contract, he'd probably be pressured into upgrading behind my back).</div><div> </div><div>Wowzers, I have a lot of thinking to do and fh is home in 2 hours.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:35e4d575-d5f2-4ad3-a5e8-bc1ced22dfbe">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : If I were Andra, I'd start a Twitter feed posting all the super-klassy things her FMIL says. And I'd make sure FMIL's full legal name was associated with it. (Of course, I can be kind of an @$$, so maybe this isn't the most productive solution, but it'd certainly make me laugh.) Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>hahah that would be something! I could title it "$hit that my fmil says" :P She'd probably add to the list if she were to ever even see this post.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:35e4d575-d5f2-4ad3-a5e8-bc1ced22dfbe">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : If I were Andra, I'd start a Twitter feed posting all the super-klassy things her FMIL says. And I'd make sure FMIL's full legal name was associated with it. (Of course, I can be kind of an @$$, so maybe this isn't the most productive solution, but it'd certainly make me laugh.) Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>hahah that would be something! I could title it "$hit that my fmil says" :P She'd probably add to the list if she were to ever even see this post.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:4069f61d-e65b-4f95-b033-8fbf9ab16e15">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Oh Andra, please keep us updated. We're all rooting for you! Posted by rachers1017[/QUOTE]
<div>THanks Rachers, will do!</div><div> </div><div>If I come on here in 5 hours telling you girls that I'm wandering the streets... I didn;t have any luck. But I'mhoping I'll have positive news!</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:0a07005f-6d08-4af6-901f-2011aa4f7265">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Oh Gosh....::hugs:: Just know that even though we're internet strangers to you we do want what's best for you. Get a sig pic or avatar and keep us posted. I want to be able to remember you. Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>How do I get either of those? I'm terrible with these programs</div>
Andra, I have a feeling you're ignoring what I wrote because you really don't want to hear it. No one would. But please, for your own sanity and safety, consider it. I've been working in the domestic violence field since 1989. I know what I see.
You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough. ~Mae West
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:5ac34927-469a-4e06-8757-c7223f2a61a8">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Andra, please keep us posted!! The fact that you know you need to change things makes me think you've known things were not right for awhile. If you're this accepting of the fact that your FI's behavior is flat out wrong and you feel your personality changing around your FILs, then you know something's up. You're already halfway there if you're ready to make a change, and you've got the strength to do it. Thinking good thoughts for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]
<div>Thank you, Chumlee! I guess we'll see if I have the strength soon, and wow I hope I do!</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:77d98179-1f0d-4f8b-b956-c13533c56009">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]I'm very interested to see what happens with this too, Andra, so I repeat what other posters have said. Please keep us updated. You DO deserve better than this. You really do. Please seek counseling for yourself, even if your FI won't go with you. The counseling will likely help you become strong enough to fight this out with your FI, or without him, whichever the case may be. But you need the counseling regardless of the current relationship. You can't live your life as it is now, especially if you are losing yourself in it. Later in life, do you want to look back to who you used to be, and miss that person, all while looking at who you've become, and hating yourself? Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>Very true, and I definitely don't want to end up hating myself!!! I used to go to counseling after my last relationship, but I stopped after a year. I should pick it back up, it helped.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:03ac31ba-66ab-4206-a83b-d280cdfea5ef">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]It is never your last chance. My mom has a good friend from college who was married for the first time when he was nearing 60. Don't settle for what you haev now because it is better than not having anything. Never settle. Know that you deserve the best. You are worth it. You can demand that you have someone who sides with you. Sometimes that person takes a while to show up. Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
<div>Thanks, CRFB87. Hopefully in his case it's better late than never... and he shows up now while we still have a chance.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:b2d80a6b-c16e-4a11-8fcc-c13066ead795">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : How do I get either of those? I'm terrible with these programs Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
If you go to My Bio and "Edit My Avatar & Sig" you can upload a picture for your Avatar. There are directions in the sticy on CC that tells you how to put a sig pic in.
LD I don't know that's she's ignoring you per se. There's a lot going on and she's responding kind of out of order, but she's responded to almost everything so far.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:5ae45b4b-9e3f-4f40-9a92-01647880e5f2">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I just caught up on reading this, but you are so so wrong; you have so much to offer to the right person -- someone worthy. I PROMISE you that. Posted by aragx6[/QUOTE]
<div>This turned it to a super long post, no?</div><div> </div><div>I hope you're right, thanks for sayint that :)</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:78b9d179-e70f-4bc5-90e0-660bed6374c4">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Oh honey I want to hug you right now. This is not your "last chance." You are not damaged goods. You are a sweet person who deserves to be with someone who is going to put you first in his life, and that guy is out there for you, I promise. Here's another way to think about this: If your best friend just said to you what you wrote here, what would you tell her? You need to treat yourself with the same love and respect you'd treat your best friend, instead of thinking so negatively about yourself. I know it can be kind of a weird thought experiment, but seriously - treat yourself the way you'd treat a friend. You deserve at least that much. Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>I would tell my best friend the exact things you ladies told me. I think that's why what has been said has gotten through so well- it's exactly the advice that I would give.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:03227e44-3442-46af-ad7d-6f2993c5adaf">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Andra, out of curiosity, how old are you? The reason I ask is that I'm 32. I'm getting married for the first time in April. I've been in many, many relationships, and had the same feelings you do - if we break up, how will I ever find someone else? You will. I promise. It'll work out in ways you could not have even imagined. I know mine did. Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>I'm 23. I've always been the type to work my ass off and try to fast track everything- I even graduated high school 3 semesters early. So I've taken that mentality to my relationships, trying to work my ass off for every single one. </div><div> </div><div>I've always been happy when I was single, but it was always hard to get to that point and have the balls to really break it out.</div><div> </div><div>What you said was definitely true with my last relationship, and, if it comes to it, I hope it will be the same with this.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:37dc25c4-5d44-4650-acd9-cde2e1fba091">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Most people have baggage, been through a bad relationship, etc. My mom one time asked if I knew how to date guys that weren't divorced. FI is divorced (with a cray-cray ex) but his "baggage" made him who he is now. I don't look at him or myself as damaged. We aren't damaged, as that to me implies we aren't whole. We are whole, and at times, we may be a whole lot of nuts to others, but that works for us. We just have stuff to get through from our past. We just recognize it, deal with it head on, and move forward. This isn't your last shot at marriage, and this isn't saying that you guys won't get married. It's just a recognition of someone who deserves better. When you put yourself at the bottom of a priority list, others do too. When you start standing up and putting yourself on the top, others see that. You deserve better. You just happened upon a group of internet strangers who want what's best too. Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]
<div>I agree, and I have been putting myself on the bottom of that priority list. It's what made me feel so resentful- I felt robbed of what was important to me because I kept having to give it up for their sake.</div>
Oh 23? You have soooooo much ahead of you. If you can't fix this with FI DON'T trap yourself in to something that will only bring your heartache in the end.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:2386bece-15be-477d-8bec-3c054f686cf5">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Wow, in front of your parents, no less? Holy hell dude. What did your parents say about all this to you? Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>They said that they were really shocked, kept quiet, and got out before a scene started.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:2386bece-15be-477d-8bec-3c054f686cf5">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Wow, in front of your parents, no less? Holy hell dude. What did your parents say about all this to you? Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>They said that they were really shocked, kept quiet, and got out before a scene started.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:0b12bb7e-ddb1-41f7-b90a-c588dd4882ae">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I'm 23. I've always been the type to work my ass off and try to fast track everything- I even graduated high school 3 semesters early. So I've taken that mentality to my relationships, trying to work my ass off for every single one. I've always been happy when I was single, but it was always hard to get to that point and have the balls to really break it out. What you said was definitely true with my last relationship, and, if it comes to it, I hope it will be the same with this. Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
You DEFINITELY have more chances ahead of you, if that's what you choose. You're 23. Don't ever feel hopeless.
And you said you work your ass off in every relationship - don't you deserve someone who works just as hard for you?
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:e3f98b33-a144-4700-9667-5d4da9917820">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Andra, I've read through this whole thing and I am REALLY concerned for you. This is going to be harsh, but I'm hoping to shock some reality into you. What I see: You got out of a horribly abusive relationship, and straight into the arms of your FI, who "helped you get over" the other guy. That made you see your FI as such a wonderful, loving person. He's not. Know what he saw? He saw a target. A mark. He's emotionally abusive to you and he lets his family abuse you as well. He brought you in to be their punching bag. If he loved you, he'd stand up for you and he wouldn't shut you out himself. If he loved you, this would just be a priority & communication issue and he'd want to work with you to fix it. He'd be going to counseling with you, with no argument. This is not love. What you saw in the beginning was not love. It was a sham, an act to draw you in. This is what abusers do. They don't ask you out on a first date, then haul off and hit you. That'd never work. Who'd stick around for that? No, they start off great. They draw you in. And then it starts small, insidiously, with manipulation. (sound familiar?) And it keeps getting worse and worse, bigger and bigger. (sound familiar?) If he and his family push gradually, each time doesn't seem quite that much worse compared to the last time, which was almost as bad anyway. (sound familiar?) You start to feel like this is the best you deserve. (sound familiar?) You lose who you are. (sound familiar?) You become afraid to leave because no one else will ever want you. (sound familiar?) I hate to say this, but this relationship will not get better. It's really unhealthy. And couples counseling doesn't work in abusive relationships; in fact, it can make things worse. Get individual counseling. Make yourself strong. And go do better for yourself with a different guy. Posted by LD1970[/QUOTE]<div> </div><div>Hi LD, I wasn't ignoring you, just trying to keep up with all these posts, but I've finally made it to yours!</div><div> </div><div>I think, if you don't mind, I'll say some of the things you posted on here to FH. I wonder what he'll say when I tell him that his treatment, and that of his family, has been abusive. I've never used that word around him before.</div><div> </div><div>Thanks for all the advice, and for taking the time to write all of that up!
Andra, I am really thinking of you. I want good things for you, and I have read all of the way through this post to here, wasting a solid hour of company time I might add!
I have no better advice than what has already been said. I am posting mostly so I can come back and read more later.
The fact that you can make these changes is inspiring to me!
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:ff2749e0-413b-46da-8005-cb1c8cd0887c">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]Also, I sadly have to agree with LD (sadly because the situation sucks). Don't let yourself be manipulated into a lifetime of misery. Believe that life and be better. It sounds like you know what you need to do, or at least what you can do to get on the path to happiness, which is awesome. I wish you the best. Posted by Seshat411[/QUOTE] Thank you, seshat411 :)
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:da91839d-3d62-4ac1-a076-1f23d03be0c2">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : After reading this I change all of my advice. Leave. Now. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. He's a manipulator who will only manipulate you in to thinking he's going to work things out. He's not. Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>I don't know if I'm strong enough to do that without trying to push therapy one more time. But if he says no to therapy, then I do think I have no way of being ok in this relationship</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:79b7d690-14fe-4c80-a86b-23290944110b">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : So there's a good way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags? Come on Andra. You know this is WRONG. Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>Oh, I'm not saying that I see it that way- that was just his defence of her. Didn't fly with me at all, and even so "having no filter" is no excuse.</div>
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:c9d9faec-4188-42c4-869d-188108f4c7be">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Not "having a filter" (which is a bogus excuse, btw) does not mean that she should still get away with behaving towards you that way, NOR does it excuse your FI from not putting his foot down and standing up for you. If you said something so atrocious to her (which I don't think you would), would your FI tell his Mom "She didn't mean it rude, she just doesn't have a filter!". I don't think he would. Posted by rachers1017[/QUOTE]
<div>EXACTLY what I told him following that incident!!!</div>
Andra before you talk to FI this evening make sure you've got a place to go if you need to leave. Even if it's just for the night to cool off or give each other time to think.
I'm leaving work now, but I'll be thinking about you a lot. I hope everything goes OK tonight and know that, no matter what, you have to do what's right for you. Please give us an update when you can so we'll know how you are.
In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_intimate-engagement-party-not-inviting-fbils-gf-that-we-dont-really-know?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:e9ec9368-7f78-4bb1-9ab0-17525d9a2605Post:faeba71e-1b7e-4dd3-8772-db397554d1f2">Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?</a>: [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I don't think this is, strictly speaking, true based on what you've told us. I mean, he won't go to counseling with you because he doesn't trust you not to conspire against him with the counselor - that goes far beyond the family issue, don't you think? Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>I think the whole reason he doesn't fully trust me is because his family doesnt, and I've stopped bending over backwards for them. I wanted to try therapy because of this family issue, and he told them about it. They thought it was a load of crap and "offensive"</div>
Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know?
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : the omgwtfbbq made me laugh a bit :P <strong>He was actually pretty shocked that his mom said that, but he keeps claiming that it was just because "she doesn't have a filter, not because she meant it in a bad way"</strong>
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
HOW ELSE are you supposed to mean something like that? Seriously. Give me a break. I lose my filter sometimes, but I'm never disgustingly rude.
Look at it like this: your FI is always going to forgive his mother, no matter what he does. When she makes him mad, does he give her the silent treatment?
But when you upset him, he gives it to you.
Whose side is he really on? If he gives his mom the silent treatment, then he shuts down with stress. But I would bet an entire city that he doesn't EVER give her the silent treatment. He's afraid of her. He doesn't care about you or your reaction.
[QUOTE]I would also like to point out that your FILs are concerned about the wedding looking "cheap" to their friends and family, yet FMIL uses words like c*nt. Klassy, I wonder what her friends and family would think if they learned that about her.
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>She says stuff like this around others, too... so I think a few people at least have an idea of what she's like.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Same goes here. FMIL announced one time at dinner (in a public restaurant no less) That I poisoned her food and that because I was laughing I did it. I was laughing because she's a crazy pants. But that's beside the point. FI refused to talk to his mother until she apologized (which was half-assed) but she's never made a scene like that again. PLEASE don't hang on because you don't want to have "nothing" because you never know what may happen and in all reality it sounds like you can't even look forward to these big events in your life because your ILs have pretty much taken the reign on your parents dime. That's not ok. Also, you might want to tell your vendors (if you continue on) that the only upgrades that will be made will be made by you personally. Not FI, FMIL or FFIL. You. I think you owe that at least to your parents.
Posted by crash2729[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>O wow, you have a "fun" fmil too. I don't know what it is about parents loosing it when their kids are starting a new chapter.</div><div>
</div><div>My parents have already talked to his about upgrading things, and I have already told my vendor (we only have one so far- the venue/catering) that only I get to make changes since I signed the contract (fh isn't even on the contract, he'd probably be pressured into upgrading behind my back).</div><div>
</div><div>Wowzers, I have a lot of thinking to do and fh is home in 2 hours.
</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : If I were Andra, I'd start a Twitter feed posting all the super-klassy things her FMIL says. And I'd make sure FMIL's full legal name was associated with it. (Of course, I can be kind of an @$$, so maybe this isn't the most productive solution, but it'd certainly make me laugh.)
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>hahah that would be something! I could title it "$hit that my fmil says" :P She'd probably add to the list if she were to ever even see this post.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : If I were Andra, I'd start a Twitter feed posting all the super-klassy things her FMIL says. And I'd make sure FMIL's full legal name was associated with it. (Of course, I can be kind of an @$$, so maybe this isn't the most productive solution, but it'd certainly make me laugh.)
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>hahah that would be something! I could title it "$hit that my fmil says" :P She'd probably add to the list if she were to ever even see this post.</div>
[QUOTE]Oh Andra, please keep us updated. We're all rooting for you!
Posted by rachers1017[/QUOTE]
<div>THanks Rachers, will do!</div><div>
</div><div>If I come on here in 5 hours telling you girls that I'm wandering the streets... I didn;t have any luck. But I'mhoping I'll have positive news!</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Oh Gosh....::hugs:: Just know that even though we're internet strangers to you we do want what's best for you. Get a sig pic or avatar and keep us posted. I want to be able to remember you.
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>How do I get either of those? I'm terrible with these programs</div>
[QUOTE]Andra, please keep us posted!! The fact that you know you need to change things makes me think you've known things were not right for awhile. If you're this accepting of the fact that your FI's behavior is flat out wrong and you feel your personality changing around your FILs, then you know something's up. You're already halfway there if you're ready to make a change, and you've got the strength to do it. Thinking good thoughts for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]
<div>Thank you, Chumlee! I guess we'll see if I have the strength soon, and wow I hope I do!</div>
[QUOTE]I'm very interested to see what happens with this too, Andra, so I repeat what other posters have said. Please keep us updated. You DO deserve better than this. You really do. Please seek counseling for yourself, even if your FI won't go with you. The counseling will likely help you become strong enough to fight this out with your FI, or without him, whichever the case may be. But you need the counseling regardless of the current relationship. You can't live your life as it is now, especially if you are losing yourself in it. Later in life, do you want to look back to who you used to be, and miss that person, all while looking at who you've become, and hating yourself?
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>Very true, and I definitely don't want to end up hating myself!!! I used to go to counseling after my last relationship, but I stopped after a year. I should pick it back up, it helped.</div>
[QUOTE]It is never your last chance. My mom has a good friend from college who was married for the first time when he was nearing 60. Don't settle for what you haev now because it is better than not having anything. Never settle. Know that you deserve the best. You are worth it. You can demand that you have someone who sides with you. Sometimes that person takes a while to show up.
Posted by crfb87[/QUOTE]
<div>Thanks, CRFB87. Hopefully in his case it's better late than never... and he shows up now while we still have a chance.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : How do I get either of those? I'm terrible with these programs
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
If you go to My Bio and "Edit My Avatar & Sig" you can upload a picture for your Avatar. There are directions in the sticy on CC that tells you how to put a sig pic in.
LD I don't know that's she's ignoring you per se. There's a lot going on and she's responding kind of out of order, but she's responded to almost everything so far.
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I just caught up on reading this, but you are so so wrong; you have so much to offer to the right person -- someone worthy. I PROMISE you that.
Posted by aragx6[/QUOTE]
<div>This turned it to a super long post, no?</div><div>
</div><div>I hope you're right, thanks for sayint that :)</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Oh honey I want to hug you right now. This is not your "last chance." You are not damaged goods. You are a sweet person who deserves to be with someone who is going to put you first in his life, and that guy is out there for you, I promise. Here's another way to think about this: If your best friend just said to you what you wrote here, what would you tell her? You need to treat yourself with the same love and respect you'd treat your best friend, instead of thinking so negatively about yourself. I know it can be kind of a weird thought experiment, but seriously - treat yourself the way you'd treat a friend. You deserve at least that much.
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>I would tell my best friend the exact things you ladies told me. I think that's why what has been said has gotten through so well- it's exactly the advice that I would give.</div>
[QUOTE]Andra, out of curiosity, how old are you? The reason I ask is that I'm 32. I'm getting married for the first time in April. I've been in many, many relationships, and had the same feelings you do - if we break up, how will I ever find someone else? You will. I promise. It'll work out in ways you could not have even imagined. I know mine did.
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>I'm 23. I've always been the type to work my ass off and try to fast track everything- I even graduated high school 3 semesters early. So I've taken that mentality to my relationships, trying to work my ass off for every single one. </div><div>
</div><div>I've always been happy when I was single, but it was always hard to get to that point and have the balls to really break it out.</div><div>
</div><div>What you said was definitely true with my last relationship, and, if it comes to it, I hope it will be the same with this.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Most people have baggage, been through a bad relationship, etc. My mom one time asked if I knew how to date guys that weren't divorced. FI is divorced (with a cray-cray ex) but his "baggage" made him who he is now. I don't look at him or myself as damaged. We aren't damaged, as that to me implies we aren't whole. We are whole, and at times, we may be a whole lot of nuts to others, but that works for us. We just have stuff to get through from our past. We just recognize it, deal with it head on, and move forward. This isn't your last shot at marriage, and this isn't saying that you guys won't get married. It's just a recognition of someone who deserves better. When you put yourself at the bottom of a priority list, others do too. When you start standing up and putting yourself on the top, others see that. You deserve better. You just happened upon a group of internet strangers who want what's best too.
Posted by chumlee7478[/QUOTE]
<div>I agree, and I have been putting myself on the bottom of that priority list. It's what made me feel so resentful- I felt robbed of what was important to me because I kept having to give it up for their sake.</div>
[QUOTE]Wow, in front of your parents, no less? Holy hell dude. What did your parents say about all this to you?
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>They said that they were really shocked, kept quiet, and got out before a scene started.</div>
[QUOTE]Wow, in front of your parents, no less? Holy hell dude. What did your parents say about all this to you?
Posted by Holly4212011[/QUOTE]
<div>They said that they were really shocked, kept quiet, and got out before a scene started.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I'm 23. I've always been the type to work my ass off and try to fast track everything- I even graduated high school 3 semesters early. So I've taken that mentality to my relationships, trying to work my ass off for every single one. I've always been happy when I was single, but it was always hard to get to that point and have the balls to really break it out. What you said was definitely true with my last relationship, and, if it comes to it, I hope it will be the same with this.
Posted by andra loves andre[/QUOTE]
You DEFINITELY have more chances ahead of you, if that's what you choose. You're 23. Don't ever feel hopeless.
And you said you work your ass off in every relationship - don't you deserve someone who works just as hard for you?
[QUOTE]Andra, I've read through this whole thing and I am REALLY concerned for you. This is going to be harsh, but I'm hoping to shock some reality into you. What I see: You got out of a horribly abusive relationship, and straight into the arms of your FI, who "helped you get over" the other guy. That made you see your FI as such a wonderful, loving person. He's not. Know what he saw? He saw a target. A mark. He's emotionally abusive to you and he lets his family abuse you as well. He brought you in to be their punching bag. If he loved you, he'd stand up for you and he wouldn't shut you out himself. If he loved you, this would just be a priority & communication issue and he'd want to work with you to fix it. He'd be going to counseling with you, with no argument. This is not love. What you saw in the beginning was not love. It was a sham, an act to draw you in. This is what abusers do. They don't ask you out on a first date, then haul off and hit you. That'd never work. Who'd stick around for that? No, they start off great. They draw you in. And then it starts small, insidiously, with manipulation. (sound familiar?) And it keeps getting worse and worse, bigger and bigger. (sound familiar?) If he and his family push gradually, each time doesn't seem quite that much worse compared to the last time, which was almost as bad anyway. (sound familiar?) You start to feel like this is the best you deserve. (sound familiar?) You lose who you are. (sound familiar?) You become afraid to leave because no one else will ever want you. (sound familiar?) I hate to say this, but this relationship will not get better. It's really unhealthy. And couples counseling doesn't work in abusive relationships; in fact, it can make things worse. Get individual counseling. Make yourself strong. And go do better for yourself with a different guy.
Posted by LD1970[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>Hi LD, I wasn't ignoring you, just trying to keep up with all these posts, but I've finally made it to yours!</div><div>
</div><div>I think, if you don't mind, I'll say some of the things you posted on here to FH. I wonder what he'll say when I tell him that his treatment, and that of his family, has been abusive. I've never used that word around him before.</div><div>
</div><div>Thanks for all the advice, and for taking the time to write all of that up!
</div>
Andra, I am really thinking of you. I want good things for you, and I have read all of the way through this post to here, wasting a solid hour of company time I might add!
I have no better advice than what has already been said. I am posting mostly so I can come back and read more later.
The fact that you can make these changes is inspiring to me!
-big giant bear hugs-
[QUOTE]Also, I sadly have to agree with LD (sadly because the situation sucks). Don't let yourself be manipulated into a lifetime of misery. Believe that life and be better. It sounds like you know what you need to do, or at least what you can do to get on the path to happiness, which is awesome. I wish you the best.
Posted by Seshat411[/QUOTE]
Thank you, seshat411 :)
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : After reading this I change all of my advice. Leave. Now. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. He's a manipulator who will only manipulate you in to thinking he's going to work things out. He's not.
Posted by mkrupar[/QUOTE]
<div>I don't know if I'm strong enough to do that without trying to push therapy one more time. But if he says no to therapy, then I do think I have no way of being ok in this relationship</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : So there's a good way to compare your son's girlfriend's ladyparts with your own funbags? Come on Andra. You know this is WRONG.
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>Oh, I'm not saying that I see it that way- that was just his defence of her. Didn't fly with me at all, and even so "having no filter" is no excuse.</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : Not "having a filter" (which is a bogus excuse, btw) does not mean that she should still get away with behaving towards you that way, NOR does it excuse your FI from not putting his foot down and standing up for you. If you said something so atrocious to her (which I don't think you would), would your FI tell his Mom "She didn't mean it rude, she just doesn't have a filter!". I don't think he would.
Posted by rachers1017[/QUOTE]
<div>EXACTLY what I told him following that incident!!!</div>
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intimate engagement party- not inviting fbil's gf that we don't really know? : I don't think this is, strictly speaking, true based on what you've told us. I mean, he won't go to counseling with you because he doesn't trust you not to conspire against him with the counselor - that goes far beyond the family issue, don't you think?
Posted by StephBeanWed61502[/QUOTE]
<div>I think the whole reason he doesn't fully trust me is because his family doesnt, and I've stopped bending over backwards for them. I wanted to try therapy because of this family issue, and he told them about it. They thought it was a load of crap and "offensive"</div>