Priest Vent

kmt_cas · January 2010

I need to get this out before we have another meeting and I end up spewing all sorts of things that I'm going to regret.

I had really high expectations for our priest. During mass he is incredibly fun, gracious and kind. He has been an inspiration to my family all of whom had become disenchanted with the catholic church, but he brought them back to the community. So here we are planning our wedding and I'm psyched that we get to talk to this person.

Our experience, although not completely negative, has been predominately negative. I won't bore you all to tears but here are a few direct quotes:
"I'm going to question you separately so I know you aren't lying to me."
"I like watching couples fight, it's much more entertaining than watching you two talk rationally."
"You aren't allowed to take the quiz together because you will cheat."

Are you kidding me? Here we are trusting in you and confiding in you and you can't trust us to be in the same room. And as far as thinking that maybe he is being sarcastic, FI is incredibly sarcastic and he was offended by those comments, they came without a smile without a joke, completely straight faced. So if he meant them to be sarcastic the delivery was awful. I know I'm overreacting a bit, but I am so frustrated and I'm really losing faith in this process.

Not only that, after being given Together for Life, I found myself unhappy with some of the reading options. I brought in a couple other passages to run by him in hopes that he would find one of them acceptable. He found issues with each one. So I asked what other couples used outside of the book and he said something along the lines of "just look through the bible and bring in what you like and we can talk about it." I already did that! You just shot me down! I'm so over it. We haven't even talked about the seating situation (if you missed that post he wants the bride and groom to be seated separately for the whole mass until the vows are read). That will not happen. Ugh! Thanks for listening. I'm really at a loss of what to do. But I feel better just getting it off my chest.

awestie · January 2010

I think the sarcasm on his end is a little too much...

While the priest that's marrying us did say "I'm going to move you two into the same room so you don't cheat..." he's also very close with my FI and I. (We then called each other from the other room and I asked him what he got for number one and we were able to hear Msgr Paul laugh from the other room.)

I would talk to him about what's bothering you. Sometimes the joking gets to be too much. Let him know that some of the comments were hurtful. And give him examples of what he said that hurt you. I would be hurt too. Jokes can go too far and sometimes people don't realize it.

As for the sitting separately during the ceremony...I know that in my church, we sit across from each other during the most of the mass until we're pronounced husband and wife, and then we both sit on the same side. I have only been to like 4 wedding ceremonies in my life, and 2 were not in a Catholic church...so I am not sure about how it's supposed to work.

I hope this helps and good luck. Let me know how you fair.

berrytr · January 2010

Sounds like this guy has a twisted sense of humor. You may need to pull him asideand have a chat with him.

Theresa626 · January 2010

Can you find another priest or another church or are you super far in? Those comments would really upset me too.

kmt_cas · January 2010

Thanks ladies. I actually did say something after the 'fighting is more fun to watch comment' since I'm getting my Masters in Dispute Resolution and I had a serious problem with what he said, especially after working with a divorce lawyer doing mediations. And then his reply was something along the lines of, 'well, I'm just being honest here'. I probably should try talking with him again that I really take offense to his comments and hopefully he will be a little more accommodating.

I wish we could change churches/priests but at this point it's really too late. Everything books up here so quickly, plus there is really only one other church in the area and their priest is on a leave of absence due to "inappropriate behavior" and there are some investigations going on...FI went to Catholic school and had a priest who was a mentor for him - we contacted him a few days ago but he is unfortunately booked for a wedding the same day. My childhood priest (who was really my priest from first communion till I was 23) was absolutely wonderful but died several years ago. So I really think we're stuck....

On a lighter note, my 94 year old grandmother was so upset with him that she only gave $1 last week instead of her typical $2....lol she's too funny

Morfudd · January 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_priest-vent?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:07ff1e5a-47e8-4633-a53a-ea19748eeb14Post:53412727-a78e-408e-ac94-20d26131aaa5">Re: Priest Vent</a>:
[QUOTE]On a lighter note, my 94 year old grandmother was so upset with him that she only gave $1 last week instead of her typical $2....lol she's too funny
Posted by kmt_cas[/QUOTE]

I know a woman who put a penny in the collection basket for YEARS as a protest against the church remodeling project.

Anyway, yes, tell him you're upset. Or, write a letter. I mean, you don't want to be a crazy church lady, but...

The talking to you individually thing is standard, and has a long history in the Church's strong feelings against coerced marriage. Basically, he wants either of you to be able to say to him, "actually, I don't want to do this, but my father/mother/etc. is making me." But the way he said it was really offensive. Then again, I've felt talked down to throughout this entire process. "You may have your ideas about weddings from your favorite soap opera..." It's probably a sin to say what I wanted to say at priests, unfortunately.

Also, gross historical inaccuracies about the Middle Ages. We're both Grad Students in Medieval Religious History. You can tell us that you disapprove of whatever wedding practice you like, just don't tell us it originated in the "Dark Ages." (Or we'll point out to you that church weddings were a 12th century innovation.)

Have I confronted the priest about this? Not yet. I'm sick in bed tonight; maybe I'll write an angry letter, but it would probably just really embarass the junior priest (chaplain of the young adults group) who is actually witnessing our ceremony on behalf of the church.

Sorry to hijack your priest vent with my own. I'm sorry! I hope your citing of your professional experience gets it through to him that he's not funny. (And he's WRONG. I've said things to my fiance when mad that I didn't actually mean or think in a million years.)

GulfCoaster · January 2010

The sarcasm (or whatever it is) is a bit much, and I can see why you would be frustrated.

A couple of the things he's doing are pretty standard... First, it is pretty common (and might be required, but I'm no canon law expert) for priests to question an engaged couple separately. This is, as PP said, to make sure that each of you are entering into marriage of your own free will and are not being coerced into it. But the way he said it, yeah, I'd be a little rattled by that.

As far as the seating goes... Every Catholic wedding I've been to has done that, actually. At our wedding, MOH and I sat on two chairs on the left side of the sanctuary, and best man and DH sat on the right side. After our vows, DH and I sat together on the right and MOH and BM sat on the left. I actually thought it was pretty neat, because it was a visual and physical indication that something had changed once we said our vows.

If I were you, I'd try talking to the priest again when you next meet with him. Take some time to vent to others (like you're doing here), so that when you talk to him the conversation can go calmly and as smoothly as possible. GL.

Morfudd · January 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_priest-vent?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:07ff1e5a-47e8-4633-a53a-ea19748eeb14Post:01cba553-d99f-42bb-aa56-0bfd28fa9f0c">Re: Priest Vent</a>:
[QUOTE] As far as the seating goes... Every Catholic wedding I've been to has done that, actually. At our wedding, MOH and I sat on two chairs on the left side of the sanctuary, and best man and DH sat on the right side. After our vows, DH and I sat together on the right and MOH and BM sat on the left. [/QUOTE]

Huh, I've never seen it. I wonder if it's regional?

kmt_cas · January 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_priest-vent?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:07ff1e5a-47e8-4633-a53a-ea19748eeb14Post:40d3b103-5d63-4a09-b167-f77114656e2c">Re: Priest Vent</a>:
[QUOTE]Sorry to hijack your priest vent with my own. I'm sorry! I
Posted by Morfudd[/QUOTE]

You didn't hijack the thread! Sometimes its comforting to hear that you aren't the only one having issues, although I'm sorry that you are having some problems as well. I would definitely write that letter. Whether it embarrass him or not, he should know historical facts since it is bound to come up at one point in time or another. And frankly, reading about the issues in a letter is easier (less embarrassing) than getting called out in front of others.

As far as the seating goes, it must be a regional thing, but where I'm from it's really unheard of. I have never seen this done, or heard of this being done before we attended a wedding at our church (we're fairly new to this town). And while I understand the idea behind it, when you grow up watching ceremony after ceremony performed the same way and you dream about your day being like that, I really can't imagine going through the ceremony not seated next to my FI.

kmt_cas · January 2010

And thanks for the luck everyone! I need it and I really appreciate it

I'm going to try and set up a meeting for sometime next week.....

EKobrenski · January 2010

Aw, that really stinks. I've heard so many horror stories, but so far, knock on wood, i've lucked out. For instance, the boston knottie whose priest shut the lights off while they were taking pictures so he could go to a sports game. Awesome. Or my friend who was asked "Are you having a big wedding?". She said yes, and the priest responded "this is a sacrament, not a party". True, but there's nothing wrong with celebrating!

I don't know if I would say something. The sarcasm (if you want to call it that) isn't really appropriate, but I might let that go to make sure he didn't cause you more grief if he gets offended. The ceremony is the most important part of the day and you dont want to have to stress about him returning your calls, being there on time, running the rehearsal, etc. I absolutely think you have a right to say something, and he should not get offended, but realistically you never know.

I would totally stand my ground on the sitting separately thing and the readings. The ceremony is what makes you married and it should have some say in how that happens, within Catholic guidelines. I think a lot of priests (totally generalizing here) forget that while marriage is a sacrament, it is also administered by the two people marrying each other, and they should get some say in how things happen.

Sorry I wrote a book, I got fired up on your behalf lol!

GulfCoaster · January 2010

[QUOTE] As far as the seating goes, it must be a regional thing, but where I'm from it's really unheard of. I have never seen this done, or heard of this being done before we attended a wedding at our church (we're fairly new to this town). And while I understand the idea behind it, when you grow up watching ceremony after ceremony performed the same way and you dream about your day being like that, I really can't imagine going through the ceremony not seated next to my FI.
Posted by kmt_cas[/QUOTE]

It might be a regional thing, I guess -- I've seen it across the Midwest and in PA, and at the one wedding I attended in Louisiana. But traditions may be different in the Boston area or East Coast. I only shared my experience to let you know that this isn't just this particular priest's idiosyncrasy, and that it can turn out OK if you guys end up sitting across from each other prior to the vows. (Our seats were angled towards the altar in a way that we could easily look at each other, and we kind of liked it.)

Anyway, if you want to sit next to your FI, I'd bring it up with the priest. Politely let him know -- as you did with us here -- that where you're from, the tradition is for the bride and groom to sit next to each other. This is what you always saw at weddings, and so this is what you always dreamed of doing. Ask him what his objections are to the two of you sitting next to one another, and why it would make a difference.

ootmother2 · January 2010

It sure isn't a Boston regional thing. Half the weddings I have attended were in Boston and I never even heard of this.

You are in a tough position here. Yes, you are the "consumer" and your wishes should be honored unless they violate church law.

Speak up about what you want for your wedding. If the priest doesn't listen or doesn't want to listen, there are tons (actually most) priests that will

bel138 · January 2010

Definitely not a regional thing. That's a weird priest thing. And honestly, I can't even understand the "symbolism" of it. DH and I walked down the aisle together and stood together for the entire Liturgy because as our pre-Cana priest said, "You're in this together."

Morfudd · January 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_priest-vent?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:07ff1e5a-47e8-4633-a53a-ea19748eeb14Post:dd1f542e-f519-4927-be8f-f13f839e6048">Re: Priest Vent</a>:
[QUOTE]Definitely not a regional thing. That's a weird priest thing. And honestly, I can't even understand the "symbolism" of it. DH and I walked down the aisle together and stood together for the entire Liturgy because as our pre-Cana priest said, "You're in this together."
Posted by bel138[/QUOTE]

Yes, that's the attitude our priest has. Once he's done theorizing about my television habits, that is.

kmt_cas · February 2010

Thanks again for the advice everyone. FI and I talked this over this past weekend and have decided that rehashing some of what I said above is unnecessary and would probably hinder moving forward at this point. However, we said that if he does say something along those lines in the future, we will tell him at that time that we are uncomfortable with his "humor". That way we won't feel completely stifled but we wouldn't be going backwards either.

We have a meeting coming up soon. This is the first time we'll actually be talking ceremony talk instead of the pre-cana like meetings before. I'm sure there are some compromises that both we can make and he can make and everyone will be happy. If not, I'm definitely calling my old church and getting recs (that church is 3 hours away...).

Oh and EKob - I just saw some of those horror stories! Luckily I know we don't have to worry about that happening on our wedding.

theredskittle · February 2010

Dude! Major props to your grandmother!

I'm sorry you have a tough situation on your hands with your priest. I don't know what I would do....I would feel pretty intimidated to talk to him about it, since I wouldn't just want him to say "ok well if that's how you're going to be, you can't get married here anymore" because I would then be left up the creek without a paddle.

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