FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!

schint · June 2010

I've chosen my 4 BMs by asking myself "If I were seriously hurt/sick & in the hospital, who would be the 1st 4 females there?" I get along ok with the FILs but his sister aka "Drinky Smurf" (my FI cracks me up) is such a drama queen that she acted overly sweet when she agreed to be candlelighter complete w/ dress & hair but we know she complained to the FMIL that she's not a BM. They promised to 'watch her like a hawk' & try to keep her away from alcohol (which is akin to keeping my dogs away from the dinner table when the 6 year old drops food for them). She doesn't like me & neither of us like her but they were sneaky enough to have FIL ask, he's paying for the food. We ALMOST feel obligated but I'm really offended that they would have the gall to impose upon our WP. So much so that I want to be stubborn on principal. We've considered telling her to drop the whole thing & be happy w/ candlelighter or just be a guest. We're really @ a loss here, any advice?

banana468 · June 2010

You'd seriously use money as leverage?

Why not say that because she's your FI's sister, she'll stand on HIS side?

schint · June 2010

I had thought of that after I posted, and that would be worst case scenario. Don't want her in the WP, the WP pics, @ the head table, & definitely @ the bachelorette party. She's just such a worthless druggie/boozehound that neither of us really even wants to even invite her. She will do something to embarass everyone, it's as certain as death & taxes. Both of his parents know how he feels about her, we just don't understand why it's such a big deal or who's idea it is. This isn't just me being bridezilla, FI's totally against it too. Do you think we could just keep putting them off? Tell thwm we'll consider it or think about it & then just not mention it & keep it up until the programs are printed?

zitiqueen · June 2010

Completely off topic, but is it really easier to type SHIFT + 2 than to type A-T?

quotequeen · June 2010

Well I don't think you should have given her a crap job, especially one "complete with dress and hair" - who is paying for that anyway? If you don't want her in the WP then don't have her in the WP. But statements like "it's going to cost you the honeymoon" are just unreal - if I were your FFIL and you said that to me I would pull my funding of your food in a heartbeat.

baystateapple · June 2010

I think by saying "we'll have her in our WP, but it's going to cost you the honeymoon" is going to be a death knell for whatever relationship you have with your in-laws.

trix1223 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_wedding-party_fmil-ffil-want-fis-sister-wedding-party-grrrr?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:37Discussion:710d12cb-5dd1-4074-a81d-27ca91eb16f7Post:7edc76f0-8a59-499b-8bc3-d6bdd3934701">FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!</a>:
[QUOTE]I've chosen my 4 BMs by asking myself "If I were seriously hurt/sick & in the hospital, who would be the 1st 4 females there?" I get along ok with the FILs but his sister aka "Drinky Smurf" (my FI cracks me up) is such a drama queen that she acted overly sweet when she agreed to be candlelighter complete w/ dress & hair but we know she complained to the FMIL that she's not a BM. They promised to 'watch her like a hawk' & try to keep her away from alcohol (which is akin to keeping my dogs away from the dinner table when the 6 year old drops food for them). She doesn't like me & neither of us like her but they were sneaky enough to have FIL ask, he's paying for the food. We ALMOST feel obligated but I'm really offended that they would have the gall to impose upon our WP. So much so that I want to be stubborn on principal. We've considered telling them she can be in it but it'll cost them the honeymoon & we've even considered telling her to drop the whole thing & be happy w/ candlelighter (an upgrade from the orginal program hander-outer) or we tell her dad about her schmaschmortion. We're really @ a loss here, any advice?
Posted by schint[/QUOTE]

She has a drinking problem. You have an entitlement problem. I personally found your post offensive. Especially the bolded parts. I don't think you're actually mature enough to get married.

If you make a decision, make the flippin' decision and own it. But don't do childish, hold someone hostage things.

baystateapple · June 2010

I'm not surprised that she was offended about the offer of being the "candlelighter". It's a bullshit job, like being in charge of the guestbook.

And if she has a drinking problem, you and your FI should be showing her some concern and sympathy, and try to get her some help, instead of bribing and blackmailing your FILs to give you a free honeymoon. That is crap.

stina93446 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_wedding-party_fmil-ffil-want-fis-sister-wedding-party-grrrr?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:37Discussion:710d12cb-5dd1-4074-a81d-27ca91eb16f7Post:3b740661-e7e5-4faf-bf28-b09133618ff4">Re: FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!</a>:
[QUOTE]I had thought of that after I posted, and that would be worst case scenario. Don't want her in the WP, the WP pics, @ the head table, & definitely @ the bachelorette party. She's just such a worthless druggie/boozehound that neither of us really even wants to even invite her. She will do something to embarass everyone, it's as certain as death & taxes. Both of his parents know how he feels about her, we just don't understand why it's such a big deal or who's idea it is. This isn't just me being bridezilla, FI's totally against it too. Do you think we could just keep putting them off? Tell thwm we'll consider it or think about it & then just not mention it & keep it up until the programs are printed?
Posted by schint[/QUOTE]

<div>Um, she's going to be family, sweetie, and regardless of drugs or alcohol, she is going to be in your family wedding photos. Get over your "IT'S MY DAY" feeling, because it's really about the families and everyone coming together. Is this girl really going to ruin everything if she's in your BP? No, probably not. She's not going to be high or drunk walking down the aisle.</div>

schint · June 2010

I'm the 1st to admit those are crazy and flat out evil ideas, which is why they haven't been implemented & why I came here to ask for advice on a nice way to say no without resentment on either side. I won't extort the honeymoon & I won't rat her out, just using extreme examples (I'm a master of hyperbole) to express how much we really don't want her in the WP. I wouldn't hurt her on purpose, that's exactly what I'm trying to avoid. Again, that's why I'm here; I've seen some really good advice on other topics & need some help to handle this w/ finesse.

We've made the decision, the issue is how to make it stick without hard feelings. I'm afriad if we simply say 'no we've already chosen the wedding party' they'll continue to push. If we relent then they're the type of people to think they've got the foot in the door & it won't stop there. I think candlelighter is a good compromise and not a crap job, she wants the dress & the hair, but mostly the attention. She gets flowers & is in the program. We're paying for 1/2 the hair & all the jewelry & food all day, the dress is well within everyones' budgets.

Should we say something like 'we want you to be able to be w/ your family & enjoy the party' or 'we've been relying pretty heavily on the WP because we're planning everything ourselves & didn't want to impose on you & your family'?

We don't want to be mr & mrs groomzilla so if you have some constructive advice we're all ears. Please help us have a happy day for all involved.

Sorry to upset so many of you, I forget that tone of voice doesn't carry over into text too well & that none of you know me so I don't come across as intended. Apologies all 'round.

mbcdefg · June 2010

If both of you don't want her in the wedding party, then just say, "We've made our decision" and that's it. The more you argue or give explanations (not that you owe them to your in-laws), the more they will argue back. Change the subject or walk away.

However, I don't really get the point of having her as a candlelighter but not a BM. All the BMs have to do is get the dress and show up to the wedding ... they don't have to help you plan, they don't have to plan or attend the shower or bachelorette party, putting the bridal party without their dates at a head table is lame and useless (have a sweetheart table, or include the dates), and it's not like she'll be attached at the hip. Making her a candlelighter and giving her a special dress and hairstyle just seems like a passive-aggressive way of saying, "You're doing all the things a BM is required to do, yet we're not going to give you the satisfaction of having the title." Very petty and childish.

gottahavashorti · June 2010

She has an addiction. You have insulting ideas. Either ask her to be a groomswoman or don't ask her to be in the wedding. If she's a candle lighter, dont' dictate her clothes and hair.

trix1223 · June 2010

ditto malphabet and shorti. I'm glad to hear that you realize that your OP came across snotty. But what you're doing is, IMO, the proverbial reaching out to give something with one hand while snatching it away with the other.

I think requiring, or even offering, hair and special dress for the 10 second "duty" of lighting candles is insulting.

schint · June 2010

If she could be trusted to not be screwed up then it wouldn't be an issue & we'd be happy to have her & ask her make a toast.

She's been to rehab, been kicked out of rehab, doesn't 'need help' & won't go back or even consider therapy. 3 interventions later & it's still like talking to a brick wall. We've all tried to help her for her sake & her kid's.

I know it's about the families coming together, we're trying to keep everyone from being embarassed by her typical public behavior, especially her & her immediate family. She'll see pictures & video & not know how to handle it & do whatever it takes to forget it; then find someone else to blame for it. We don't want our wedding to be a bad memory we want everyone to enjoy themselves & come celebrate with us. We would've eloped if family didn't mean as much as it does.

elmulvey · June 2010

I personally think you are getting a lot of unwarranted slack here. Yes, your first post came across as snotty, but you have more than explained the situation (and even apologized); and whether its your belief or not that a candlelighter is a crap job (for the record I agree), its not what she is asking.

That being said, I think you put your foot down. His family just has to understand; and you can sit down with them in a calm manner, and without ever saying this is our day, explain what your concerns are and why you have chosen as you have. If they dont understand, ask them to agree to disagree at this time, and you are sorry they are upset with you but you and your FI have made a decision.

baystateapple · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_wedding-party_fmil-ffil-want-fis-sister-wedding-party-grrrr?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:37Discussion:710d12cb-5dd1-4074-a81d-27ca91eb16f7Post:fcde2498-3335-4496-b72b-b4cfabb08f83">Re: FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!</a>:
[QUOTE]If she could be trusted to not be screwed up then it wouldn't be an issue & we'd be happy to have her & ask her make a toast. She's been to rehab, been kicked out of rehab, doesn't 'need help' & won't go back or even consider therapy. 3 interventions later & it's still like talking to a brick wall. We've all tried to help her for her sake & her kid's. I know it's about the families coming together, we're trying to keep everyone from being embarassed by her typical public behavior, especially her & her immediate family. She'll see pictures & video & not know how to handle it & do whatever it takes to forget it; then find someone else to blame for it. We don't want our wedding to be a bad memory we want everyone to enjoy themselves & come celebrate with us. We would've eloped if family didn't mean as much as it does.
Posted by schint[/QUOTE]

You can't control what your guests do. I really do feel you on the drinking thing; I have relatives that are recovering alcoholics, and sometimes, they fall off the wagon. I can't babysit them all night. Their behavior is not a reflection on me. Nor is your FSIL's behavior a reflection on you. She has a serious issue, and she's not taking it seriously. That is all. You can't break yourself with worrying about whether or not she is going to create a scene. Because there is literally nothing you can do about it.

Trying to stop your guests from misbehaving at your wedding is impossible, and you are only going to drive yourself insane if you try. Please, just put all thoughts of trying to make things go perfectly out of your head. She can only ruin your wedding and make it an unhappy memory if you allow her to get to you.

bablingbrooke · June 2010

Just keep in mind that you have to deal with these people loooong after the wedding and make sure you're 100% okay with this possibly having repercussions for some time after the wedding.

If she's going to be there as a guest she's got just as many opportunities to drink as she would as a BM so I guess I don't get why the BM part makes it so bad? Or did I miss something in the OP/follow-up post?

AutumnFair · June 2010

If you nor your FI want her in the WP then tell them that, if they keep pressing the issue you just have to repeat the "Sorry, we chose are closest people in our lives". Basically this is what happens to engage couples who do not want siblings in their WP but the parents do. It sucks but its just something you to go through until the wedding passes. Parents need to realize that a person's siblings do not get an automatic pass to be in the WP, I have had a friend not choose her own sister to be a bridesmaid because she disliked her. Her mom kept giving her slack about it, but eventually after she told her mom why and I think her mom got the clue that she wasn't going to change her mind she let it go.

Laur0813 · June 2010

Ive read all the posts here. I personally am a very straight forward person. Have you ever sat down with her and actually asked her about it? why does she want to be a bridesmaid? Dealing with family who has alcohol abuse, drug abuse problems can be very stressful, frustrating, and angering. but that doesnt make them bad people. shes going to be family even if you dont like her, and you dont want her in teh party then SAY SO. in my opinion, if your adult enough to ge married, then be enough of an adult to say, in a ddecent way, to your FSIL, Im sorry you want to be in the wedding party, but i dont feel like we have a strong enough relationship, etc. regardless of whether or not she acts mature, you should have enough respect for your FI's family to tell them honestly, and respectfully, how you feel.

gottahavashorti · June 2010

Really, as a guest she has more opportunity to drink. She won't be spending as much of cocktail hour in family and bridal party formal pictures.

mbcdefg · June 2010

But if you feel that she'd "screw up" as a bridesmaid, then what's to stop her from "screwing up" as a candlelighter? Or a regular guest?

WTF does "she'd screw up" as a bridesmaid even mean? If she can get the dress and make it down the aisle and back, she's done her job. What are you afraid that's she's going to screw up, exactly? Lighting herself on fire, walking down the aisle and then punching your grandma in the face, not showing up to the ceremony at all? These are all things she could easily, EASILY do as a candlelighter or a regular guest.

Just be straight and say you don't like her. Using the "she's an addict and will screw up being a BM, so we gave her a less important role even though she's essentially doing the same thing as a bridesmaid" excuse is probably what's digging you into a deeper hole with your in-laws. They're probably pissed that you're obviously denying her the title just for the sake of sticking it to her that she's not a BM (whether you intend it that way or not).

I can understand you and FI not wanting her as a bridesmaid because you just plain don't like her. But to use the "screwing up" thing as an excuse, when you're giving her the exact same opportunities to "screw up" as a candlelighter (she's still wearing a specific outfit and participating in the ceremony), is bullcrap. I'm not trying to convince you to make her a bridesmaid, bur your excuses for not making her a BM are just crap.

schint · June 2010

I have edited my original post to be closer to the spirit I intended.
My BMs know this is a lot to plan (we both have HUGE families & over 300 guests without inviting 2nd cousins) & they have rolled up their sleeves & offered to help with just about everything-decorations, showers, parties, driving, you name it. They are wonderful friends & that's why they were chosen. I have 2 more sisters that aren't in the WP, one's doing readings & the other is doing programs & they are happy they be involved somehow & even though they're out of state have also offered a ton of other help. I just don't see that from the SIL. I let my outrage at the thought the PILs were using the caterer to cater to her get the better of me & I vented. When she wants to get help I'll be the 1st to babysit or drive her there or send inspirational & encouraging cards. Until then... (no I'm not shunning her)

The BMs are wearing black dresses, any style that suits/flatters them. One thing I appreciate about all the girls is their individuality, plus they have 4 very different body types. It's less expensive for them, they can wear it again & everyone gets to feel comfortable in their own clothes.

Thanks for the advice, my FI has offered to talk to her about it as he has more experience dealing with her behavior but I feel I need to be there too since we're a team now, any thoughts on that?

gottahavashorti · June 2010

[QUOTE]I have edited my original post to be closer to the spirit I intended. My BMs know this is a lot to plan (we both have HUGE families & over 300 guests without inviting 2nd cousins) & they have rolled up their sleeves & offered to help with just about everything-decorations, showers, parties, driving, you name it. They are wonderful friends & that's why they were chosen. I have 2 more sisters that aren't in the WP, one's doing readings & the other is doing programs & they are happy they be involved somehow & even though they're out of state have also offered a ton of other help. I just don't see that from the SIL. I let my outrage at the thought the PILs were using the caterer to cater to her get the better of me & I vented. When she wants to get help I'll be the 1st to babysit or drive her there or send inspirational & encouraging cards. Until then... (no I'm not shunning her) The BMs are wearing black dresses, any style that suits/flatters them. One thing I appreciate about all the girls is their individuality, plus they have 4 very different body types. It's less expensive for them, they can wear it again & everyone gets to feel comfortable in their own clothes. Thanks for the advice, my FI has offered to talk to her about it as he has more experience dealing with her behavior but I feel I need to be there too since we're a team now, any thoughts on that?
Posted by schint[/QUOTE]
BMs are not obligated to help plan the wedding or pre-wedding parties. Don't use that as an excuse.

Let your FI deal with his family. Including asking his sister to be a groomswoman if not having her in the WP is going to cause family strife.

gottahavashorti · June 2010

And again, if she's a candle lighter you can't have her wear a special dress. Even if it is just a certain color. You only get to choose the attire for your side of the wedding party and yourself. The same goes for your FI.

mbcdefg · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_wedding-party_fmil-ffil-want-fis-sister-wedding-party-grrrr?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:37Discussion:710d12cb-5dd1-4074-a81d-27ca91eb16f7Post:5022350a-5ad6-438f-95fc-782fc166b5a9">Re: FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!</a>:
[QUOTE]Thanks for the advice, my FI has offered to talk to her about it as he has more experience dealing with her behavior but I feel I need to be there too since we're a team now, any thoughts on that?
Posted by schint[/QUOTE]

You don't need to explain to someone why they were not chosen to be a BM. "We've chosen our wedding party already" is more than enough. Chaneg the subject or walk away.

Explaining why you don't want your FSIL in it is probably what's dragging you into the arguments with your in-laws. Because, again, the excuse of "she'll screw up if she's a BM" is crap ... she has just as much potential to "screw up" (whatever the heck you mean by this, because I'm still not sure what awful things you envision her doing) as a candlelighter or as a guest. She's still at the ceremony in as a guest. If she's a candlelighter, she's still participating in the ceremony, and she still has the potential to not get a specific outfit that you asked her to get.

Bridesmaids aren't required to attend or plan parties or help you with planning, so it's not like making her a bridesmaid would automatically obligate her to do more than get the dress and show up - exact same thing that you're asking of her as a candlelighter. That's why your in-laws keep pestering you about all this, because it's coming across as "We're asking her to do the same things as a bridesmaid, just without the title." It's splitting hairs to them at this point.

So, you've made your decision, now stand by it. No explanations, no excuses, no discussions. If the in-laws withdrawing their money, then let them withdraw it and fund it yourselves, or cut out whatever you cannot afford without their help. Don't continue the conversation and it won't be an issue.

schint · June 2010

WTF does "she'd screw up" as a bridesmaid even mean? If she can get the dress and make it down the aisle and back, she's done her job. What are you afraid that's she's going to screw up, exactly? Lighting herself on fire, walking down the aisle and then punching your grandma in the face, not showing up to the ceremony at all? These are all things she could easily, EASILY do as a candlelighter or a regular guest.

BE screwed up (high/drunk). She doesn't keep her balance so good a lot of times, she may just fall over/sway if she has to stand for a while, that would be obvious to all. If she were a guest & drunk (most of them will be by the end of the night) she'll be sitting, not swaying in front of everyone. She does flake out & not show up to events sometimes. She smokes & hasn't set herself on fire yet so she can handle a flame (a joke!) In the OP I did say we didn't like her & she doesn't like me. She just doesn't like the idea of not being center of attention more. I'm not a therapist but I don't have to enable her either.

Have fun, don't pass out, don't think whoever drives you home is a guy who's 'taking you home' (has done this to family member), don't puke on the other guests, or pick fights. In other words don't act like a dumb teenager that broke into the parents' liquor cabinet when you're 30 yrs old. Too much to ask? You wouldn't think so...so I'm not asking for it all night, just hold off until after all the pics.

schint · June 2010

you're absolutely right mbc, don't continue it. I know BMs aren't required to do anything & I have not asked them to or expect them to, they've all offered & it's a pleasant surprise every time a new idea comes around or planned thing is taken care of (my sister priced some stuff for me yesterday- I didn't even know it until I got her txt this morning). My BMs are awesome!

deepcovejackie · June 2010

OP-editing your original post just confuses people who are new to the thread. Trix, thanks for posting the unedited version of the post. I agree with what pp's have said, you've made your decision on your WP, so stick with it. Of note though, your FSIL is going to be a member of your family, so you'll need to find a way to deal with her in future.

mags0607 · June 2010

PP's have said most of what I was thinking, so i will just add a little something different.

You need to stick to your guns. If your own siblings are not BMs ( I think I read that correctly) then you shouldn't need to cowtow to your ILs by making FSIL a BM. Don't use any excuses (legitimate or not) just simply state "we chose our bridal party because they were the nearest and dearest to our hearts." End of discussion.

Let your Fi handle his parents, and let him stand up to them about your choices. Honestly, if she were to be on either side, it should be his since she is his sister, and you guys are not close. He should be the one dealing with his parents, and you should be staying out of it. These will be your family members too, so make sure to let him take the lead in how to handle them, and it will make for less tension in the long run.

Not related but- Make sure to thank your bridal party profusely for offering to help out. Its not their obligation, so make sure you are really appreciative of their time and effort.

banana468 · June 2010

I have to echo PPs. Stop making character references regarding why she's not in the BP. Just say, "I chose my BMs and that's it."

If your FI wants her on his side then fine. Beyond that:

1) Unless SHE wants to be in the dres, you can't require it

2) Unless she's cool with paying half the hair, again, you can't require it.

3) If you have a head table, PLEASE make sure you're seating anyone there with their significant other or date. To not do that is really rude to them.

megk8oz · June 2010

My take on having siblings in the BP, no matter what the back story is: if not including a sibling is something that is going to come back to bite you every single Thanksgiving and Family Reunion/Function spent with the injured party's family
"for as long as you both shall live", then just by the extra flowers and suck it up through the ceremony and pictures, and ignore them for the rest of the night. Trust me, it's not that hard.

If a couple does not want to include somebody and the family of the injured sibling will truly understand and not bring it up post-wedding, then don't bother asking unless you actually want to.

And if you're marrying somebody, you should know by now one way or the other how the family will react. If you know you're never going to hear the end of it, just ask her and be done with it to keep the peace.

Also, I speak from personal experience: if somebody makes an ass out of themselves at your wedding, it will not reflect poorly on you, it will reflect poorly on them. And if for whatever reason she drinks too much and makes a scene, your FI's family and friends are more than likely aware that this is her M.O. and your friend and family won't think about about for more than 5 seconds if they see that you're not making a scene over said scene.

FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!

Re: FMIL and FFIL want FI's sister in wedding party-Grrrr!

Choose Another Board

Search Boards