Immigration.

ChelleLouise · July 2010

Hi from Calgary! (It's my last day, alas! I'm sneaking online while FI is asleep, but I really haven't had time to knot since I've been here, let alone contemplate begging for an Alberta GTG. Sorry for dropping that ball...)

The last time I checked processing times on a fiance(e) visa, it was 5 months, so we planned to file for ours while I was here. But after talking to a friend who is going through the immigration process with his Brazilian fiancee, I am totally freaked out. Apparently, only two of the processing centers we could be routed through are turning around fiance(e) visas in 5 months; the other two are running 9 months, which is way too late to be useful for us. (The wedding is in February and he is hoping to move in January.)

I'm trying to figure out what our best course of action is now. Has anyone else been through this? I'd love to hear how it went it for you. My friend with the Brazilian fiance(e) -- who also met her through our WoW guild, believe it or not! -- is JOPing it in December and then having the religious ceremony in Brazil next July. He thinks the fiance(e) visa is a huge waste of time and money, since it could take anywhere from 5 to 9 months to arrive and is only good for 90 days. It's hard to plan a wedding on such a variable timeframe.

ChelleLouise · July 2010

Ugh, this is Celles. I'm apparently logged onto my laptop under my original Knot name. It doesn't get along well with FI's internet; every other computer in this house flies, but my laptop craaaaaawls.

crfische · July 2010

I don't know jack about immigration, but MANDY IS FROM CALGARY.

Lucky duck.

tidetravel · July 2010

Are you asking about US immigration or Canadian immigration?

ChelleLouise · July 2010

Oh, US immigration. Sorry.

noelle24 · July 2010

Immigration issues suck. My best advice is to talk to a lawyer. I *think* you might be able to get married outside the U.S. and then apply to bring him in as your spouse. But as you probably already know, it's hugely complicated. Give a lawyer a call. You'll probably want one when you need to go for the green card interview later anyway.

Anysunrise · July 2010

I'm doing the same thing. Your only other real option than a fiance visa is to get married while you're (or he's, I wasn't quite sure) in the States.(ETA: I wasn't trying to suggest she do this, just that it was the only other way I'd heard about people doing it) However, this means a much longer and much more complicated wait on your adjustment of status to a green card, and from what I hear, is rather expensive. But, you get to stay in the country while it happens. You know, as long as you don't plan on leaving anytime soon.

Also, to the best of my knowledge, I don't think you can be in the country while you're filing a visa. It's meant to be used as a legal entry for the specific purpose of getting married, kind of defeats the point if you're already there.

We're going through the Vermont processing center. The average time there is 3-5 months. The Nebraska center however, is at something ridiculous like 41 months last time I checked.

I know what you mean about the time frame : / Despite all the crap people get on here for having a "fake" wedding, we're going to sign the papers within our 90 day limit and have a wedding later that year, since the wedding itself would be a 6 hour drive from where FI lives right now, and it'd be hard enough to do it locally. Let alone when we have no idea when it's going to be possible. Everyone knows our situation and what a pain in the ass immigration is, so I doubt we'll actually see any of the judging that you'd get here for it.

We're still at the initial review right now. We filed in June, but they first lost our application, then gave it the wrong case number. It's frustrating as hell.

ETA: We met through WoW too =D He was my raid leader, lol.

tidetravel · July 2010

Have you spoken with an immigration attorney? It may be beneficial to have someone help you through the process, as opposed to doing it all on your own. They may have other ideas.

K-1 visas only allow your FI to come to the US for purposes of getting married. Once married under a K-1 visa, you can file for an adjustment of status to get a permanent resident card.

If you were to get married outside of the US, you would have to file directly for a greencard, which is a more lengthy process.

A lot of couples do the JOP thing first, and then plan the big ceremony/reception after the immigration proceedings are complete, because it is so unpredictable. This is one instance where I think it's totally acceptable.

tidetravel · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:54cdedda-0dca-4275-8de2-ca3c7e2f5cf0">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm doing the same thing. Y<strong>our only other real option than a fiance visa is to get married while you're (or he's, I wasn't quite sure) in the States. </strong>However, this means a much longer and much more complicated wait on your adjustment of status to a green card, and from what I hear, is rather expensive. But, you get to stay in the country while it happens. You know, as long as you don't plan on leaving anytime soon. Also, to the best of my knowledge, I don't think you can be in the country while you're filing a visa. It's meant to be used as a legal entry for the specific purpose of getting married, kind of defeats the point if you're already there. We're going through the Vermont processing center. The average time there is 3-5 months. The Nebraska center however, is at something ridiculous like 41 months last time I checked. I know what you mean about the time frame : / Despite all the crap people get on here for having a "fake" wedding, we're going to sign the papers within our 90 day limit and have a wedding later that year, since the wedding itself would be a 6 hour drive from where FI lives right now, and it'd be hard enough to do it locally. Everyone knows our situation and what a pain in the ass immigration is, so I doubt we'll actually see any of the judging that you'd get here for it. We're still at the initial review right now. We filed in June, but they first lost our application, then gave it the wrong case number. It's frustrating as hell.
Posted by Anysunrise[/QUOTE]

Just an FYI - this is illegal. He cannot enter under a tourist visa and then get married. You cannot legally enter as a non-immigrant with the intention of living in the US. If CBP were to find out his true intentions prior to being admitted, he risks being denied entry and barred from entering the US for 5 years. Also, I would imagine that if he were to enter under a tourist visa, get married, and then file for an adjustment of status, someone with CIS would realize that he violated US immigration law. This could adversely affect his chances of being granted a permanant resident card, and could trigger deportation proceedings.

That particular change of status clause is aimed at people who are here in the US for long periods of time (school, work, etc.) who meet and marry their FI while living in the US under a valid visa.

Anysunrise · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:26cc583b-cf26-486a-a900-6bd16649cf13">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Immigration. : Just an FYI - this is illegal. He cannot enter under a tourist visa and then get married. You cannot legally enter as a non-immigrant with the intention of living in the US. If CBP were to find out his true intentions prior to being admitted, he risks being denied entry and barred from entering the US for 5 years. Also, I would imagine that if he were to enter under a tourist visa, get married, and then file for an adjustment of status, someone with CIS would realize that he violated US immigration law. This could adversely affect his chances of being granted a permanant resident card, and could trigger deportation proceedings. That particular change of status clause is aimed at people who are here in the US for long periods of time (school, work, etc.) who meet and marry their FI while living in the US under a valid visa.
Posted by tidetravel[/QUOTE]

Yes, sorry, you're very much right. I assumed he was going over on something more than a tourist visa for some reason, not sure why.

ChelleLouise · July 2010

Noelle & Tide - We haven't spoken with an immigration attorney yet. I was hoping to avoid the expense, but the more I research the process, the more confused I become. It will probably become our next step.

Anysunrise - Thanks for sharing your experience! We are seriously considering JOPing it on our next three day weekend and having the ceremony as planned in February. TK tends to be fairly forgiving of immigration issues, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't worried about being judged. I think I could live with the Internet's collective disapproval, but it would break my heart if I found out that the Canadian guests, for example, resented traveling to Arizona for a "fake" wedding because we had to JOP it to get around immigration issues.

On a side note, I get Javascript issues while attempting to log-out (to switch to Celles) and I cannot turn off Knot TV. I'm in TK hell.

tidetravel · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:e0a18fb4-9565-4fd5-8e97-ed5e80f59b9f">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]Noelle & Tide - We haven't spoken with an immigration attorney yet. I was hoping to avoid the expense, but the more I research the process, the more confused I become. It will pro<strong>bably become our next step. Anysunrise - Thanks for sharing your experience! We are seriously considering JOPing it on our next three day weekend and having the ceremony as planned in February.</strong> TK tends to be fairly forgiving of immigration issues, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't worried about being judged. I think I could live with the Internet's collective disapproval, but it would break my heart if I found out that the Canadian guests, for example, resented traveling to Arizona for a "fake" wedding because we had to JOP it to get around immigration issues. On a side note, I get Javascript issues while attempting to log-out (to switch to Celles) and I cannot turn off Knot TV. I'm in TK hell. :(
Posted by ChelleLouise[/QUOTE]
NO! Do not do that (please see above post). Unless you plan on JOPing in Canada, in which case, you will need to petition for him to come over as your spouse, which is a more lengthy process.

If you JOP, it would have to be during the 90 days granted by the FI visa in order to be valid.

Anysunrise · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:6b007357-72a7-4ce2-9245-ee82680e29e0">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Immigration. : NO! Do not do that (please see above post). Unless you plan on JOPing in Canada, in which case, you will need to petition for him to come over as your spouse, which is a more lengthy process. If you JOP, it would have to be during the 90 days granted by the FI visa in order to be valid.
Posted by tidetravel[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I definitely defer to Tide on this. I tend to leave important things out />.< I'm also the idiot that got herself almost permanently banned from the States because she didn't realize that when it says Canadians can't stay more than 6 consecutive months without a visa, that doesn't mean you can just go back for two weeks and be fine.

In my defense, that's totally how it sounded. And if I wasn't allowed to, why'd they let me back in the second time! /sigh

flyjawn · July 2010

this all sounds very messy and stressful.

i agree that an immigration lawyer is probably the way to go.

i'm canadian and my SO is american but we are lucky and can avoid the immigration issues.

i did however go through the immigration process many years ago in australia. not fun at all.

ChelleLouise · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:f0e379a6-b2d8-4b4e-8971-663b578d6e28">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Immigration. : Yes, sorry, you're very much right. I assumed he was going over on something more than a tourist visa for some reason, not sure why.
Posted by Anysunrise[/QUOTE]

He's Canadian, so he doesn't need a tourist visa. He can enter the country on a passport and live here legally without papers of any kind for up to 182 days a year. Even so, I realize it's illegal to enter the US with the intention of remaining permanently; if we end up doing the JOP thing and applying for his green card prior to the actual ceremony, then -- worst case scenario -- he would return to Canada to wait out the remainder of the processing time.

tidetravel · July 2010

I think you're underestimating the worst case scenario. You should probably consult with a lawyer before you do anything to see what your options are.

Anysunrise · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:91c6e062-b24c-46d6-b427-01e3a5be2e5a">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Immigration. : He's Canadian, so he doesn't need a tourist visa. He can enter the country on a passport and live here legally without papers of any kind for up to 182 days a year. Even so, I realize it's illegal to enter the US with the intention of remaining permanently; if we end up doing the JOP thing and applying for his green card prior to the actual ceremony, then -- worst case scenario -- he would return to Canada to wait out the remainder of the processing time.
Posted by ChelleLouise[/QUOTE]

Yeah, that's what I did. Hell, at the time, I didn't even need a passport. Just wish someone had mentioned the "a year" thing to me...

From the sounds of it though, doing it that way and applying for a green card could be a much longer process than if you had just waited for the K-1.

redheadfsu · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:dad0bf5b-82ee-411e-b252-2c5f2de0f888">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]I think you're underestimating the worst case scenario. You should probably consult with a lawyer before you do anything to see what your options are.
Posted by tidetravel[/QUOTE]

This.

Please speak to a lawyer. The immigration process is expensive and you need advice to do it properly. You will spend a few thousand just on the paperwork & filing fees. (Also, every permanent resident gets a "greencard")

Anysunrise · July 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_immigration?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:eeb9435e-e09c-4e0e-bf95-fb3ee85c3d67Post:1b1c7716-9b86-441c-9b51-b523f05fd2c9">Re: Immigration.</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Immigration. : This. Please speak to a lawyer. The immigration process is expensive and you need advice to do it properly. You will spend a few thousand just on the paperwork & filing fees. (Also, every permanent resident gets a "greencard")
Posted by redheadfsu[/QUOTE]

/nod

It was...$450ish just to file for the K-1. The adjustment of status for permanent residence is $1,010 according to the USCIS site.

Also, if you do file for it, which is almost assuredly your best bet at this point and will likely also be the easiest in the long run, make sure you double, triple and quadrouple check EVERYTHING, and make several copies of every form. The last thing you want is to have it bounced back with a request for more information, and he'll need everything you sent in for his interview as well, or so I'm told. Make sure he has his immunization records, background check, etc done in advance as well, so you don't end up having to wait for that when you need it.

I'll let you know how it goes for us, if you want. I don't imagine we'll hear anything for another month at least, but I know I could use some stories about the interview in particular. I'm scared to death I'm going to do or say something that ends with them saying no.

amclausen · July 2010

Thought I should chime in on this as I watched my FMIL and FSFIL go through this. My FMIL married a German man (they'd been together for 5+ years at this point) while he was over here on a tourist visa. He still had to leave the country when his three months of allowed visiting time were up! While they were in the process of getting his status changed, he still was not allowed to be in the country for more than three months at a time, six months a year. The process to get him permanent residence status and a greencard was even longer and more expensive that it would have been otherwise.

BTW, it took a total of threeish years and several thousand dollars to get him his permanent greencard. I hope this helps you avoid the stress and pain they went through!

Holly117B · July 2010

As an immigration attorney, I will tell you that you really do need an attorney to navigate all of this before you get married, whether you JOP it or not. Definitely don't do anything until you've talked to someone. It might be expensive now, but it saves a LOT of time, energy and money down the road.

Generally speaking, K-1 visas are much easier and cheaper to get than getting a LPR card for a spouse. I have clients that are waiting years to bring spouses and children to the U.S.

noelle24 · July 2010

Seriously, get an attorney. I know it's expensive. All the filing fees for us will be around $1400. Add on attorney fees, and we're looking at $3-4k. This means we're having a small JOP wedding with closest family and friends and then heading out to dinner. It's not what either of us dreamed of, but absolutely the #1 priority is to get the immigration paperwork filled out correctly. The last thing you want is to get married, find out you did something illegally, and have one of you deported for an indefinite period of time (if not permanently).

Get references for attorneys in your area and go talk to them. Many will give free consults or low-cost consults. We talked to 4 different attorneys before deciding who we're going to hire. One attorney was totally skeezy and tried to rush us down to city hall that day, one was just "ok", one was great (but expensive), and another was okay (but much cheaper).

Also, I've heard horror stories (from lawyers) about couples who go to the interviews without legal representation.

I can't stress enough that taking care of legal issues is much, MUCH more important than the wedding itself.

aplatanada · July 2010

Looks like all has been discussed, but thought I'd throw my $0.02 in with our experience.

We filed for K-1 in Sept. 09, processing center was in VT. We received NOA1 within 3 weeks, and NOA2 within 4. We were super excited, thinking we wouldn't be separated *that* long.

We didn't even get notice of our interview at the embassy until 2 weeks before the interview (end of Feb 2010), so I had to scramble to get down there, and he really had to scramble to get all the doctor appointments. We finally got approved in late March, about 6 months from when we started. (We JOP'ed in May and are doing the family/friends thing in October.)

Then comes the *fun* wait of AOS. We had a minor problem turn major, thanks to a bureaucrat mistyping a birthdate. Seems minor, but that one typo caused big delays because the date in their system did not match the date on all the official documents. Stuff got switched around centers, and 2 months later we are still waiting on temp. green card and work authorization, crossing fingers that everything will be approved soon.

Having said that, our process has gone much more quickly than the friend who married someone who entered on a tourist visa and then filed for AOS.

It's a stressful process as is, so make it less stressful by consulting with an attorney. And my unsolicited $0.02 is to be financially ready as well, because in addition to the actual filing costs, you are supporting another person on one salary for an undetermined amount of time.

Immigration.

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