Islam in Catholic ceremony...somehow?

NYCCleopatra · July 2013

First my apologies if this is a repeat but I've gotten lost searching already!

So my fiance and I are having a wedding in a Catholic church (my family would disown me if I didn't) but his family is extremely supportive and understanding (it's actually happening in the middle of Ramadan so that we could have it on the day we first met). Although the Catholic ceremony seems pretty rigid, has anyone come across any ideas of how to incorporate Islam into it in any way? I would love to be able to do that for them (especially as they're flying in from Egypt for this too), but am at a complete loss as to 'how'. Any insight/ideas would be immensely appreciated!

KDM323 · July 2013

Do you attend a Catholic church and have you talked to your priest about a wedding already?

itzMS · July 2013

NYCCleopatra said:

First my apologies if this is a repeat but I've gotten lost searching already!

So my fiance and I are having a wedding in a Catholic church (my family would disown me if I didn't) but his family is extremely supportive and understanding (it's actually happening in the middle of Ramadan so that we could have it on the day we first met). Although the Catholic ceremony seems pretty rigid, has anyone come across any ideas of how to incorporate Islam into it in any way? I would love to be able to do that for them (especially as they're flying in from Egypt for this too), but am at a complete loss as to 'how'. Any insight/ideas would be immensely appreciated!

I think you and your FI need to set up a meeting at your Church with a Catholic priest ASAP. You shouldn't be marrying in the Catholic Church because your family wants you to. You're an adult, and should be making your own decisions with your FI. There are several pre-marital requirements in the Church that you and your FI must participate in.

You should also meet with the clergyman that your FI identifies with to discuss your upcoming marriage.

southernbelle0915 · July 2013

My cousin married a Muslim man. They did a laylat al henna in which both sides of the family participated. It depends on how he practices though - because a lot of Islamic wedding rituals vary depending on geography. I would ask him. I doubt you'll be able to incorporate much into the ceremony, but you can probably do a few rituals before or after.

I do think it's a bit of a red flag that you'd rather appease your family than have a marriage ceremony that pleases both you as a Catholic and him as a Muslim. Your family needs to accept that you are an adult who is marrying a Muslim man and the Catholic church may not be the best fit for YOUR marriage (obviously it was the right choice for THEIR marriage). Personally, I would hire a neutral officiant and incorporate Catholic and Muslim traditions - your parents are going to have to get used to the fact that you're making your own choices now and they just so happen to accommodate your future life partner.

NYCCleopatra · July 2013

Thank you all for your responses (even some not so 'friendly'). To clarify, while my family strongly believes in a Catholic church wedding, I'm in no way opposed to it and in need of "standing up for myself". It is very much my own choice and one I am making based on my upbringing. Call it a cultural thing. My family is very much accepting that I am marrying a Muslim and my post in no way indicated they are not - that is your assumption for whatever reason. And yes, i'm fully aware of the pre-marital requirements for the Catholic church and we are actually a week away from completing them. It was actually our Catholic deacon who suggested incorporating Islam into the ceremony, although he is not the one marrying us and so was unable to advise on how specifically.

Any suggestions of those familiar with both a Catholic ceremony and an Islamic one who can offer advise on potentially a prayer or custom that is used, I'd really appreciate your insight.

Peledreamsofrain · July 2013

I would encourage you to look at pre or post ceremony traditions for Islamic culture. A Catholic priest is highly unlikely to stray from church tradition for the ceremony.

itzMS · July 2013

NYCCleopatra said:

Thank you all for your responses (even some not so 'friendly'). To clarify, while my family strongly believes in a Catholic church wedding, I'm in no way opposed to it and in need of "standing up for myself". It is very much my own choice and one I am making based on my upbringing. Call it a cultural thing. My family is very much accepting that I am marrying a Muslim and my post in no way indicated they are not - that is your assumption for whatever reason. And yes, i'm fully aware of the pre-marital requirements for the Catholic church and we are actually a week away from completing them. It was actually our Catholic deacon who suggested incorporating Islam into the ceremony, although he is not the one marrying us and so was unable to advise on how specifically.

Any suggestions of those familiar with both a Catholic ceremony and an Islamic one who can offer advise on potentially a prayer or custom that is used, I'd really appreciate your insight.

You need to talk to your priest.

A bunch of Internet strangers can't help you here. Every priest and every Church will have different requirements.

southernbelle0915 · July 2013

I think you and your FI should as his family about wedding rituals and customs in their family. Then present the ones you want to incorporate to your priest. See if he approves. I'm thinking you won't get as receptive a response as you're hoping for, but there are lots of things you can do before/after the ceremony.

HisGirlFriday13 · July 2013

In order to 'have a wedding in a Catholic Church,' as you so blithely and naively put it, you must go through pre-Cana, during which you will be asked to promise to being your children up Catholic. You cannot just 'have a Catholic wedding.' It's not an option on an a la carte menu. Also, since your FI is Muslim, he's not baptised (I am assuming), which means you can't have the full Mass, because it's not a sacramental marriage because he's not baptised.

There will be huge hurdles for you to try to do this. Meet with your priest ASAP. I know Ramadan is usually in the winter months, and that it's a moveable feast. But I don't know when it is this year. However, you'll need several months to complete the pre-reqs as requires by the Catholic Church.

NYCBruin · July 2013

I would ask FI what traditions or rituals he would like to include/what is important to him and then go from there. I'm personally very opposed to including cultural elements that aren't important to at least one of the people getting married; it feels disingenuous and forced to me. Once you and FI have discussed what you might like to include, then speak to a priest about what you may be able to include in the ceremony. As other posters have mentioned, this will be very priest specific so we can't really give you a definite answer.

Since you're marrying in the Catholic church, that means you'll be raising your children Catholic. I think this is a really great opportunity to discuss how you can/will incorporate your FI's culture and beliefs into your family life when your children will be Catholic.

daria24 · July 2013

lemclane said:

In order to 'have a wedding in a Catholic Church,' as you so blithely and naively put it, you must go through pre-Cana, during which you will be asked to promise to being your children up Catholic. You cannot just 'have a Catholic wedding.' It's not an option on an a la carte menu. Also, since your FI is Muslim, he's not baptised (I am assuming), which means you can't have the full Mass, because it's not a sacramental marriage because he's not baptised. There will be huge hurdles for you to try to do this. Meet with your priest ASAP. I know Ramadan is usually in the winter months, and that it's a moveable feast. But I don't know when it is this year. However, you'll need several months to complete the pre-reqs as requires by the Catholic Church.

She already said they have almost completed Pre-Cana.

OP, I agree with SouthernBelle that since your Deacon brought it up, you and your FI should come up with some possible things to include and present them to the Deacon or priest performing your ceremony. I have seen a Catholic-Jewish wedding, in a Catholic Church, where someone read the 7 Blessings. I've also seen a protestant Pastor give the homily instead of a priest.

You could also ask someone from your FI's faith to give the blessing before your meal at your reception.

tiny speck · July 2013

lemclane said:

In order to 'have a wedding in a Catholic Church,' as you so blithely and naively put it, you must go through pre-Cana, during which you will be asked to promise to being your children up Catholic. You cannot just 'have a Catholic wedding.' It's not an option on an a la carte menu. Also, since your FI is Muslim, he's not baptised (I am assuming), which means you can't have the full Mass, because it's not a sacramental marriage because he's not baptised. There will be huge hurdles for you to try to do this. Meet with your priest ASAP. I know Ramadan is usually in the winter months, and that it's a moveable feast. But I don't know when it is this year. However, you'll need several months to complete the pre-reqs as requires by the Catholic Church.

1. Ramadan is a month of fasting. Not a feast.

2. This year's Ramadan just started today. It is not currently in winter and hasn't been for many years. (it is moveable though, as it's based on the lunar calendar)

To the OP: I find it very surprising that his family is willing to attend the wedding during Ramadan as it is a time of solemnity. It sounds like you are trying to include both religions, but you aren't going to do either of them justice, if that makes sense, going about it like this.

HisGirlFriday13 · July 2013

In this case, "feast" didn't mean the literal "eat a lot of food," but the older "holiday or holy days." Lent, which is a time of fasting, is a moveable feast. So is Yom Kippur, a Jewish holiday of fasting.

tiny speck · July 2013

I know. Still, Lent isn't the moveable feast. Easter is.

NYCCleopatra · July 2013

Lemclane, you really should try to find a better target to vent your personal disconent with life instead of being an internet troll in a wedding forum where (most) people are quite happy and seeking advice and not insults such as "blithely" or "naively" - it's actually just pathetic on your part.

YES WE ARE ALMOST DONE WITH PRE-CANA. I PROBABLY KNOW BY NOW WE CAN'T HAVE A FULL MASS. OBVIOUSLY BEING BAPTISED WOULD MAKE HIM.....NOT MUSLIM. Thank you for informing me of the 'huge hurdles to do this' however.

His family is supportive of our marriage during Ramadan as I said they understand the significance of the day we met to us and they're not very strict Muslims, who also as they are traveling are excused from fasting and will make up the time when they return to Egypt.

For the very supportive and kind ladies in this forum - Daria and Kristan, I especially appreciate your comments - the Ramadan blessing seems minor enough for the priest to at least consider it. I also thought of something like starting the ceremony with the priest saying "in the name of God the merciful and the compassionate" which is the starting line of most important ceremonies/documents in Islam. Minor, but at least it's something. I haven't come across on Goodle any specific wedding prayer blessings though but will keep searching.

Thank you again for your help : )

itzMS · July 2013

NYCCleopatra said:

Lemclane, you really should try to find a better target to vent your personal disconent with life instead of being an internet troll in a wedding forum where (most) people are quite happy and seeking advice and not insults such as "blithely" or "naively" - it's actually just pathetic on your part.

YES WE ARE ALMOST DONE WITH PRE-CANA. I PROBABLY KNOW BY NOW WE CAN'T HAVE A FULL MASS. OBVIOUSLY BEING BAPTISED WOULD MAKE HIM.....NOT MUSLIM. Thank you for informing me of the 'huge hurdles to do this' however.

His family is supportive of our marriage during Ramadan as I said they understand the significance of the day we met to us and they're not very strict Muslims, who also as they are traveling are excused from fasting and will make up the time when they return to Egypt.

For the very supportive and kind ladies in this forum - Daria and Kristan, I especially appreciate your comments - the Ramadan blessing seems minor enough for the priest to at least consider it. I also thought of something like starting the ceremony with the priest saying "in the name of God the merciful and the compassionate" which is the starting line of most important ceremonies/documents in Islam. Minor, but at least it's something. I haven't come across on Goodle any specific wedding prayer blessings though but will keep searching.

Thank you again for your help : )

@NYCCleopatra, Your original post came accross as you having a very flippant attitude towards Marriage in the Catholic Church. "My family would disown me" "the Catholic ceremony seems very rigid" immediately dipict you as immature and not someone who is getting married in the Church because she wants to. While you later explained yourself, I still can't get over the attitude of your original post.

Regular posters like @lemclane and I are understandably irritated with posters who come to these forums acting like a Catholic ceremony is something they're doing out of obligation or for a pretty church wedding versus true desire and choice. We take it very seriously...because it is a Holy Sacrament for us.

Your insult of lemclane is completely uncalled for.

NYCCleopatra · July 2013

I'm sure she appreciates the commroderie but please note the insult of being "naive" came from her first and was completely uncalled for as my post in no way denoted any sort of naivete.

Second, I've gone to Catholic school for 8 years of my life - and the ceremony IS rigid with little room for incorporating any other traditions.

Honestly, it'd be great if some people here would have the ability to stick to the actual topic question of "has anyone come across any ideas of how to incorporate Islam into (the ceremony) in any way?" before doing psychological evaluations of my 'family issues' and 'marriage preperation' and my 'views of Holy Sacraments".

LovelyBride229 · July 2013

Im muslim, we are having a "traditional" ceremony and very untraditional reception. I would highly recommend getting married outside the month of Ramadan. If his family is muslim and traveling from Egypt for your wedding that is a lot to ask to do during the month of Ramadan. Ramadan is a very special time and also while fasting many people try to limit outside activities and focus mostly on building a stronger spiritual connection with God , increasing prayers ect. Not trying to be mean at all. I know this is the day you met and it falls in Ramadan but it will likely be a big inconvenience to muslim guest. Also not sure what time you are planning things but guest will not be able to eat or drink all day for fasting. I know people who got married right before Ramadan and it worked out well. Sunset and the time when you can eat is very late these days . Current Ramadan break fast time is 8:52 pm (earliest time guest could eat.) If you need ideas mixing the two religions into one day i could try to help, but i encourage you to do it outside of Ramadan.

tiny speck · July 2013

LovelyBride229 said:

Im muslim, we are having a "traditional" ceremony and very untraditional reception. I would highly recommend getting married outside the month of Ramadan. If his family is muslim and traveling from Egypt for your wedding that is a lot to ask to do during the month of Ramadan. Ramadan is a very special time and also while fasting many people try to limit outside activities and focus mostly on building a stronger spiritual connection with God , increasing prayers ect. Not trying to be mean at all. I know this is the day you met and it falls in Ramadan but it will likely be a big inconvenience to muslim guest. Also not sure what time you are planning things but guest will not be able to eat or drink all day for fasting. I know people who got married right before Ramadan and it worked out well. Sunset and the time when you can eat is very late these days . Current Ramadan break fast time is 8:52 pm (earliest time guest could eat.) If you need ideas mixing the two religions into one day i could try to help, but i encourage you to do it outside of Ramadan.

I agree with all of this. It sounds like OP is going ahead with it all anyways, though, and that they are getting married during this year's Ramadan (ie now). I may have misunderstood and it is planned for next year, but still, OP seems pretty stubborn on this.

outtafresca · July 2013

outtafresca · July 2013

Viczaesar · July 2013

FYI - prophet, not profit.

outtafresca · July 2013

Wow. Note to self: Don't try to help.

heidirs731 · July 2013

Wouldn't asking your soon-to-be husband be the best person to pose this question to since one would assume he'd be the most knowledgeable about the subject and be best able to gauge what would work best for his parents and the religious views of the two of you?

No one on this forum understands the needs and beliefs of his parents or the two of you. We're all just putting out our own experiences, and that doesn't seem to getting us anywhere.

Ajuliana · July 2013

No one was being rude to you, OP. Not even the teensiest, tiniest bit.

icecreamS04 · August 2013

I'm not sure whether this is just a Turkish wedding tradition, or if it applies to Islam in general, but the girls I know have done this
a) bridesmaid's/ not married female guest's names are written on the sole of the bride's shoes. if one of the names can be read at the end of the night, that girl is the next one to get married (similar to boquet toss)

b) the groom usually picks up the bride at her parents house. He is accompanied by his friends and family. At the door he has to pay his way in (the father of the bride decides whether the groom values his daughter enough and hands over the envelope to his daughter, if he thinks it's fine and opens the door). The groom or the father of the bride put a red bow around the brides waist which symbolizes purity. After that bride and groom leave the house together. Two musicians play traditional music on the street during this event.

if you cannot incorporate elements of other religions into the ceremony, this might be a nice idea...

c) the kiss
the groom usually kisses the bride on the forehead, which symbolizes that the groom respects the bride and takes her as his destiny. This is easy to incorporate into a Catholic ceremony.

.

Islam in Catholic ceremony...somehow?

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