NWR: Am I being unreasonable?

climbingsingle · December 2013

You've gotten some really good advice. I think your FMIL is acting like a brat. I hope you're able to get it all worked out!

PolarBearFitz · December 2013

HisGirlFriday13 said:

@CallaLily25 -- you're welcome! I have had my fair share of battles with DH's grandmother (actually, he has, because I refuse to speak to her unless I absolutely have to).

The other day, when she asked about doing something on an upcoming Saturday, he said, "Let me ask HisGirl if that works for her or if we have other plans."

His grandmother said, "Oh, so you have to ask HisGirl now. You didn't use to have to ask anyone for permission to do things -- before, when you were single."

He said, "But I'm not single. I'm a husband, and HisGirl is my wife, and my highest priority. You know that, you just don't like it, and that's not my problem."

She's also asked him, "So, are you happy, or are you going to divorce her and move back home and take care of me like I planned?" (She raised him).

This is why I don't talk to her.

That is probably the best thing I have read on the boards today. Good for you and your husband. As per usual, you demonstrate a great supportive structure in combating the She-GMIL-demon from the depths of Hades.

@kmmssg Loved reading your take/advice on this one as well. Truly logical, heart felt, and just plain great advice!

southernbelle0915 · December 2013

CallaLily25 said:

FI and I talked, and we definitely want to have Christmas Eve by ourselves...especially when we have kids. I know this isn't going to go well with FMIL.

My mom knows our future plans, so she thinks I should just "let FMIL have this one" since when we're married we can do our own thing. My mom often acts like until we're married, I don't have any right to say that FI spends holidays with me and not his family. I think it should always be a mutual decision and compromise regardless of if we're married or not.

I have to disagree with your mom here. You're engaged to be married. Just because you haven't had the wedding yet doesn't mean you aren't making decisions together. Together being the key word.

Since this is your first Christmas as an engaged (to be married) couple, I think you need to start establishing the boundaries that you expect to have as a married couple. And your FI needs to cut the cord and recognize that the two of you are starting your own family with your own holiday schedules.

CallaLily25 · December 2013

southernbelle0915 said:

CallaLily25 said:

FI and I talked, and we definitely want to have Christmas Eve by ourselves...especially when we have kids. I know this isn't going to go well with FMIL.

My mom knows our future plans, so she thinks I should just "let FMIL have this one" since when we're married we can do our own thing. My mom often acts like until we're married, I don't have any right to say that FI spends holidays with me and not his family. I think it should always be a mutual decision and compromise regardless of if we're married or not.

I have to disagree with your mom here. You're engaged to be married. Just because you haven't had the wedding yet doesn't mean you aren't making decisions together. Together being the key word.

Since this is your first Christmas as an engaged (to be married) couple, I think you need to start establishing the boundaries that you expect to have as a married couple. And your FI needs to cut the cord and recognize that the two of you are starting your own family with your own holiday schedules.

Thank you! My mom has me thinking I'm crazy over here. Her reasoning is that "When you're married you can establish your own traditions, but until then, I think FMIL feels like you should stick with each family's traditions. Just pick your battles and give her this one."

My thought process is...if we "give her" this one, then it sets a precedent for years to come. I don't think she will magically stop when we get married. And while my mom thinks that when we're married I'll "have more ground to stand on," I feel that as adults, that's all the ground we need. My FI is on board with me, but it's difficult fighting against a dramatic FMIL.

I really appreciate everyone's support and advice. My FMIL and mother are making me feel like the crazy, selfish one.

Jen4948 · December 2013

CallaLily25 said:

southernbelle0915 said:

CallaLily25 said:

FI and I talked, and we definitely want to have Christmas Eve by ourselves...especially when we have kids. I know this isn't going to go well with FMIL.

My mom knows our future plans, so she thinks I should just "let FMIL have this one" since when we're married we can do our own thing. My mom often acts like until we're married, I don't have any right to say that FI spends holidays with me and not his family. I think it should always be a mutual decision and compromise regardless of if we're married or not.

I have to disagree with your mom here. You're engaged to be married. Just because you haven't had the wedding yet doesn't mean you aren't making decisions together. Together being the key word.

Since this is your first Christmas as an engaged (to be married) couple, I think you need to start establishing the boundaries that you expect to have as a married couple. And your FI needs to cut the cord and recognize that the two of you are starting your own family with your own holiday schedules.

Thank you! My mom has me thinking I'm crazy over here. Her reasoning is that "When you're married you can establish your own traditions, but until then, I think FMIL feels like you should stick with each family's traditions. Just pick your battles and give her this one."

My thought process is...if we "give her" this one, then it sets a precedent for years to come. I don't think she will magically stop when we get married. And while my mom thinks that when we're married I'll "have more ground to stand on," I feel that as adults, that's all the ground we need. My FI is on board with me, but it's difficult fighting against a dramatic FMIL.

I really appreciate everyone's support and advice. My FMIL and mother are making me feel like the crazy, selfish one.

Your mother is the one being unreasonable. I tend to find that when someone is being unreasonable and another person tells you to just "let it go," they're really not being all that helpful to you; they're more worried about other items on their agenda.

It sounds to me like both you and your FI need to establish boundaries with your respective mothers. There's no reason why you need to "let it go" because you don't need to be married to be entitled to be respected as an adult.

RebeccaB88 · December 2013

You are absolutely not the crazy, selfish one here. No way.

HisGirlFriday13 · December 2013

southernbelle0915 said:

CallaLily25 said:

FI and I talked, and we definitely want to have Christmas Eve by ourselves...especially when we have kids. I know this isn't going to go well with FMIL.

My mom knows our future plans, so she thinks I should just "let FMIL have this one" since when we're married we can do our own thing. My mom often acts like until we're married, I don't have any right to say that FI spends holidays with me and not his family. I think it should always be a mutual decision and compromise regardless of if we're married or not.

I have to disagree with your mom here. You're engaged to be married. Just because you haven't had the wedding yet doesn't mean you aren't making decisions together. Together being the key word.

Since this is your first Christmas as an engaged (to be married) couple, I think you need to start establishing the boundaries that you expect to have as a married couple. And your FI needs to cut the cord and recognize that the two of you are starting your own family with your own holiday schedules.

^^^This. You're grown-ass adults, and as you said in your reply to southern, that's all the reasoning you need. And I also think you're right that if you give in now, you are setting a precedent for next year.

Being engaged is not the same as being married, but it's still a commitment to another person and you and your FI have made that commitment.

Also, if you 'give her this one,' what other 'this one' things will you have to give her?

And @aefitz29: Thanks!

kmmssg · December 2013

CallaLily25 said:

FI and I talked, and we definitely want to have Christmas Eve by ourselves...especially when we have kids. I know this isn't going to go well with FMIL.

My mom knows our future plans, so she thinks I should just "let FMIL have this one" since when we're married we can do our own thing. My mom often acts like until we're married, I don't have any right to say that FI spends holidays with me and not his family. I think it should always be a mutual decision and compromise regardless of if we're married or not.

Hey Calla - I don't think you are wrong at all, but I think your mom is coming from a place of generational expectations that have been handed down to her. Again, that line of thinking was the norm when I was growing up. I'm 53 now and I can see my older siblings running that line on their kids and thinking they are completely in the right.

It really is hard to give up those generational expectations and to learn new things when you have grown kids. Things are different now. Yeah, people lived together when I was a young bride (exh and I lived together in 1980 but it was still a minority kind of thing that drew the raised eyebrows of the parents.

I think you are right to set your boundaries now and march forward, just realize Mom is a product of our generation and I get where she is coming from. Just keep working with her - us older dogs CAN learn new tricks!

thelastdreamer · December 2013

FMIL sounds insane. I moved 900 miles away from my parents when I was 17, missed numerous holidays, and never got a bit of grief. Of course my parents missed me and wished I was there, but they understood I was an ADULT and I had my own life.

My aunt has the same FMIL problems as you and it has been terrible for her marriage. Her FMIL has bullied her, made her feel guilty because her and her DH do not have the same religious views as her, told her she is tearing the family apart because they will not go to church with her every Sunday, and, this is the most ridiculous, when my aunt and her DH decided to adopt a child, FMIL screamed at them that they were ruining her family by bringing in an outsider

Not saying your FMIL is this nuts, but just warning you that you need to establish boundaries NOW before it causes a huge problem in your marriage. Sit down with FI and say that you are now the main woman in his life and he needs to defend you to his mother. It's his responsibility to set boundaries, starting NOW.

delujm0 · December 2013

FI and I are fortunate that our families live within a 2 hour drive of each other - so we can always find time to see everyone over the holidays - though not necessarily on the same days. FI's sister alternates Christmas and Thanksgiving with her family and her in-laws (who are located a plane ride apart). So FI and I are going to get on her same schedule starting now.

This year we went to FI's family for Thanksgiving. I went to see my mother separately on Friday. Over Christmas, that means my family should get most of the time. FI's family has a tradition on Christmas Eve which is a lunch followed by presents with FFIL's family and then church. My family has no such Christmas Eve tradition. So this year, we will stay with FI's family through church on Christmas Eve and then drive to my mother's house so that we will wake up there Christmas morning. FMIL tried to guilt us becuse "FI has always woken up here on Christmas morning!" but we're 31 years old, and she understands how the future will be (since her daughter already does this).

Christmas day we will go to see my dad's family and then wind up back at FI's parent's house because the airport we are flying back out of on the 26th is much closer to them than it is to my family (it was the cheapest option).

Is it a lot of traveling around? Yes. But everyone is happy. Once we have kids, we don't be traveling for Christmas Eve or Christmas Day (because we will want our kids to open gifts in their own house), so this is the best they're going to get unless they come to us in the future. This is part of being an adult - you're not beholden to your parents' traditions. You make your own. Your FI needs to talk to his mother about this, as i'm sure once you have children it will vary even more than it does now. She needs to accept it.

bmydesigner · December 2013

I agree with all of the PP's, your FMIL is definitely the one being unreasonable here. I had a similar situation this Thanksgiving with my FMIL. It wasn't nearly as bad as this though. We wanted to spend Thanksgiving between both my mother's side of the family, and my dad's side (divorced) because we had spent the last two Thanksgivings at FI's family's. His mother guilt-tripped him, kept trying to say, "well you could stop over in the morning couldn't you?" Finally, I was like I'm sorry but no. I'm not going to three different houses in one day, that's just too crazy. We will see you next year. It's really hard to lay down these lines, they're very sensitive / touchy subjects. But it is important to lay down these lines and stand your ground now, or it will only continue to get worse. FMIl still says she missed us at Thanksgiving this year, but I think she is coming around and realizing that her baby boy has grown up. Best of luck to you!

hoffse · December 2013

calla, in your case I would stick to your guns. You think getting the holiday to yourself will be hard this year? Imagine what it's going to be like if you have children and grandma wants to have Christmas with the baby...

H and I didn't actually start spending Christmas and Thanksgiving day together until we got married this year. But a lot of it had to do with our schedules. I started practicing law last year and had to get used to being a slave to the billable hour, and H was still in law school and had a bunch of job interviews over the holidays. So it wasn't so much a "we're not married yet" thing as a "it's not convenient and not worth trying to force our schedules to line up this year" thing.

Our solution to this is the following: this year we did Thanksgiving day at his parents' house and we will do Christmas Eve & day at my parents' house. Next year we will swap. And then we're done. After that, people can come visit us if they want but we won't go visit them on the actual holidays unless it lines up well with our schedule. Frankly, our parents are all semi-retired or advanced enough in their careers that they can come and go as they please. We can't. So for us to travel is a much bigger deal than for them to travel, even though they are older. My parents gave us three cheers for this plan. H's parents did not. But they've gotten over it.

ashleyep · December 2013

misshart00 I still do that! I like waking up at my parents! This year he's probably coming with me to my parents and staying there for the night too.

Until we have kids, I just don't see the point of waking up at our place with just the two of us on Christmas morning.

ETA: Of course, my parents don't force it. They know we have family to see and we'll get to them at some point. My mom actually gets mad when split up for the holidays instead of choosing one place to go together (it works for us, I don't care if I don't spend thanksgiving with him haha)

ashleyep · December 2013

Musikalbunni said:

Holidays can be more stressful than planning a wedding.

I'm hispanic so we celebrate "Noche Buena" -- Christmas Eve, and we open our presents at midnight, and my Fiance's family opens presents on Christmas morning. Which leaves both of us tired, but we get to celebrate those holidays with our families. It works out!

Thanksgiving is going to be hard though. For my family, Thanksgiving is the ultimate family get together. Every year we have about 50 people at my parent's home and celebrate Thanksgiving there...

My fance's family has never celebrated Thanksgiving. EVER. They usually treat is as any other day. Which is okay-not a biggy. Christmas is their main holiday.
Well now, my FMIL wants to celebrate Thanksgiving at her house next year. There is nothing wrong with her wanting to celebrate now. So she spoke with my fiance and he told her, "I have to ask musikalbunni about that..." She got kind of upset that my fiance wouldn't demand I spend it with them.
I don't mind spending it at their house if that's what my fiance and I decide, but I don't like to be forced or manipulated into doing it. To be honest, I rather be with my family.

For the most part, she is a cool FMIL. Sometimes she's unreasonable.

When we were growing up, we would go to one set of grandparents for dinner, and one for dessert. Maybe you can do something like that this Thanksgiving? I have some cousins that leave after dinner to go visit their other family.

Lavender123 · December 2013

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

amakayeb · December 2013

I'm so thankful that both his mother and mine are so flexible. We managed to see both families for Thanksgiving, even though right now we are living along a giant rectangle (he is 5 hours west of me, it's 8 hours north to my parents, and then 5 hours west to his parents). But we were by his parents on Thursday and we just did my family's dinner on Saturday. We also spend the night at my parents over Christmas, but we are doing it Saturday night/Sunday morning--because everybody agrees that it doesn't matter what day we celebrate, and that way my siblings and their SOs can be there longer. My fiance and I will stay at my parents through Christmas morning, partly so he can meet the rest of my extended family at my grandparents on Christmas eve, and then drive to his parents for dinner on Christmas Day. Then we will stay by them for a few days.

And, after this year, everybody will have to stay flexible if they want to see us at all, since my fiance will be a pastor and Christmas Eve/Christmas Day are kind of busy days in that line of work...

We also have no idea where we will be living, so that's part of the reason we made sure to see everybody this year. But I do like the fact that, once we have kids, OUR family time ON Christmas Eve/Christmas morning will be pretty well protected!

seshat303 · December 2013

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

I don't think anyone here is being bratty. Some people have different family dynamics (like BSC GMILs you may not even want to see) and may want to start new traditions with their own new baby family (yup, you're still your own new family, kids or not). Other people may have limited time off around the holidays, or may have family members spread pretty far apart making it hard to see everyone who wants to see you. Deciding you're not going to see certain people over the holidays does not make you an ungrateful brat--there are 364 other days in which to spend time with these people and spending time with family doesn't automatically become less meaningful if it's not on a specific holiday.

FI and I have 3 different families to visit this year. Thankfully, my mom/step dad, dad/step mom, and his family all live within 30 minutes of each other (although 5+ hours from where we live) so we can usually see everyone if we can get the time off. It never fails though that every year my mom will try and guilt the shit out of me that I'm not spending "enough" time with her. Guess, what, when there are multiple families in the mix it's very hard to please everyone, but as a new family you have a right to start creating your own traditions. My mom and her siblings certainly don't still travel across the country to visit my Grandma on Christmas and those changes had to start somewhere.

lovesclimbing · December 2013

Jennja22 said:

misshart00 said:

Sorry, I couldn't get past that he stays at his parents house on Christmas eve so he can open presents with them. How old is he?

Actually - this is the tradition with my fiance's family, as well. (Staying on Christmas Eve, waking up to "santa" on Cmas morning) He is 34! It has never caused any problems and I think it is really sweet. This will probably still be our Christmas tradition even after we get married & have kids. His family is awesome, so that probably makes it easier. However, his mom would NEVER throw a fit like that and demand that he not be "shared". That's ridiculous.

----------------------

Yea, this is what I was going to say. I don't think him staying with his family on Christmas Eve, in and of itself, is a problem at all. My family is where we live for Christmas due to my sister getting married a couple days after. They are renting a large house for all the extended family and offered to have us stay the night before and then do stockings and presents the next morning.

I see nothing wrong with this. The issue is if your FI doesn't want to do it but his mom is pressuring him and he gives in. Or if she won't allow you to stay over as well.

I do agree with PPs that your FI does need to stand up to his mom on stuff like this and the two of you need to decide together what's happening with holidays.

natswild · December 2013

With us, I expect next year we'll be discussing which family we spend time with at Christmas-his family is on the east coast, and mine is on the west coast, so it won't be a matter of one day with one family, and one day with the other

HisGirlFriday13 · December 2013

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

JellyBean52513 · December 2013

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This says it all. Not everyone has a picture-perfect definition of "family." Some people have no family, some people have awful relationships with their family members, and some people see their "family" in individuals who they aren't even related to. Lavender, it sounds like you might have had a great familial experience growing up, so you can't understand what the OP and other posters are talking about. You should be able to understand, however, that a marriage is about making a commitment to your partner and if that includes starting your own traditions as you forge ahead in your new life with one another, than so be it and the other people in your lives will have to accept it.

lc07 · December 2013

This is why my husband and I have begun our own traditions. Our families are both welcome to join us if they wish to.

Lavender123 · December 2013

JellyBean52513 said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This says it all. Not everyone has a picture-perfect definition of "family." Some people have no family, some people have awful relationships with their family members, and some people see their "family" in individuals who they aren't even related to. Lavender, it sounds like you might have had a great familial experience growing up, so you can't understand what the OP and other posters are talking about. You should be able to understand, however, that a marriage is about making a commitment to your partner and if that includes starting your own traditions as you forge ahead in your new life with one another, than so be it and the other people in your lives will have to accept it.

Not one bit - divorce, affairs, abuse, alcoholism, nasty step parents etc. have all occurred in my family. However, I don't believe that family is an accident of DNA and we make it work... There's a reason they want to spend time with you and people can make mistakes in the past and be forgiven for them - leaving them alone at Christmas because you want to hang out alone just seems selfish. As someone else said, they're all just days - so if it's just another day for you but important for someone else to see you - how about just taking advantage of the fact that you have people that want to spend the holidays with you when many don't?

HisGirlFriday13 · December 2013

Lavender123 said:

JellyBean52513 said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This says it all. Not everyone has a picture-perfect definition of "family." Some people have no family, some people have awful relationships with their family members, and some people see their "family" in individuals who they aren't even related to. Lavender, it sounds like you might have had a great familial experience growing up, so you can't understand what the OP and other posters are talking about. You should be able to understand, however, that a marriage is about making a commitment to your partner and if that includes starting your own traditions as you forge ahead in your new life with one another, than so be it and the other people in your lives will have to accept it.

Not one bit - divorce, affairs, abuse, alcoholism, nasty step parents etc. have all occurred in my family. However, I don't believe that family is an accident of DNA and we make it work... There's a reason they want to spend time with you and people can make mistakes in the past and be forgiven for them - leaving them alone at Christmas because you want to hang out alone just seems selfish. As someone else said, they're all just days - so if it's just another day for you but important for someone else to see you - how about just taking advantage of the fact that you have people that want to spend the holidays with you when many don't?

Here is the point --> X

X <-- and here is you.

You have missed the point so entirely that I question your reading comprehension skills, I really, really do.

They may want to spend time with us -- but that doesn't mean we have to want to spend time with them. And you're right -- people CAN make mistakes and be forgiven. But to be forgiven implies that anyone involved in this has asked for forgiveness -- and no one has. As far as my husband's parents and grandmother are concerned, they have done nothing wrong, and they see no reason why we shouldn't like them.

We're not leaving them alone -- we're leaving them to each other, so the people with reprehensible behaviour can annoy each other.

As to your second bold -- this is such a bafflingly stupid statement, I just...I can't. "but important for someone else to see you" -- so my husband should see people who abused him, because THEY want to? So I should see people who call me names because THEY want to?

I. Don't. Fucking. Think. So. No way in hell.

Look, I'm glad your family is freaking perfect, and that apparently you're all hugging and singing kumbaya and you're just one big happy family. That's not the reality for my husband's family, and I'm not about to force a relationship with toxic people because THEY want it. If they wanted to have children who loved them, then maybe they should have thought about that 20 years ago when they were beating their kids.

Oh, and for the record, MY family of origin gets along wonderfully, loves DH, loves each other, and we'll be spending the holidays with them.

I feel sorry for the people (like my husband's parents) who don't have anyone to spend the holidays with, until I remember it's their own damn fault.

Actions have consequences. If your action is to be an abusive asshole, the consequence is that you will spend holidays alone. It's really just that simple.

loves2shop4shoes · December 2013

You do not have a FMIL problem. You have a FI problem.

If he can't get the peaches to tell his mother how you have collectively decided to spend the holidays, and stick by it, then that's a real issue. He needs to step up to the plate and say, "Mom, this is what's happening," and not, "Mommy, can I have permission to do XYZ?"

Also, she sounds like she needs to cut the cord. In a BIG way. He's not a little boy. He's a grown man.

Goooooood luck with that.

loves2shop4shoes · December 2013

CallaLily25 said:

I really appreciate all of your advice! I had a chance to talk a little bit with my FI last night, but we are continuing the conversation after work today.

BUT, now my mom is telling me I need to "let this go." She is insisting that I'm being unreasonable. Is there something I'm not seeing here?

You absolutely do not need to let this go. If you develop the pattern of giving in to your FMIL's demands, what do you think is going to happen when you get married…or have children?

You need to resolve how you will handle these challenges BEFORE you get married.

seshat303 · December 2013

Lavender123 said:

JellyBean52513 said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This says it all. Not everyone has a picture-perfect definition of "family." Some people have no family, some people have awful relationships with their family members, and some people see their "family" in individuals who they aren't even related to. Lavender, it sounds like you might have had a great familial experience growing up, so you can't understand what the OP and other posters are talking about. You should be able to understand, however, that a marriage is about making a commitment to your partner and if that includes starting your own traditions as you forge ahead in your new life with one another, than so be it and the other people in your lives will have to accept it.

Not one bit - divorce, affairs, abuse, alcoholism, nasty step parents etc. have all occurred in my family. However, I don't believe that family is an accident of DNA and we make it work... There's a reason they want to spend time with you and people can make mistakes in the past and be forgiven for them - leaving them alone at Christmas because you want to hang out alone just seems selfish. As someone else said, they're all just days - so if it's just another day for you but important for someone else to see you - how about just taking advantage of the fact that you have people that want to spend the holidays with you when many don't?

If you're referring to my comment, I think you may have misunderstood. To a lot of the PPs it sounds like the day is important to them and it's important for them to spend it with certain people, whether that be only one side of their family or just their FI/H. My point was that people aren't jerks for making their own plans on Christmas that don't include their entire family because there are plenty of other to see them (assuming you have family you actually want to see). However, as a new family, a lot of people like being able to create new traditions once they marry. They aren't being ungrateful to their families, they're building their new ones. That doesn't mean they're dissing their family of origin, but it does mean things may get rearranged.

aurorajanette · December 2013

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This 100%.

Last year we made the rounds. A hour at my mom's, an hour at my grandmother's, stopped in the hospital in early evening to see FI's grandfather who had a heart attack (we spent over an hour, and brought dinner for his grandmother who had been there all day with him), then we went to FI's parents for dinner. His mom (the physically abusive one who I've posted about before), threw a hissy fit because I was there --even though she invited me and begged me to come, then she threw her dinner plate full of food across the room and it shattered on the wall... because the mashed potatoes were overcooked. She then stood and screamed at the whole family for 10 minutes (probably more - we got up and left).

We haven't seen her since. She threatened to burn down our apartment and break all our windows if she ever found out where we live because FI dropped his sister from his cellphone plan after not receiving payment from her in 2 years.

Guess where we're not going for Christmas?

I love my family to death. I spend Christmas Eve at my mom's, and visit her on Christmas day. I also enjoy sleeping in my own bed at my own home, and my mom would never ever expect me to stay at her house on Christmas Eve. Since you've deemed that we're all selfish, Lavender, maybe you should re-evaluate the expectations of your family if they are seriously expecting you to do what they want with no regard to what you want.

HisGirlFriday13 · December 2013

aurorajanette said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Lavender123 said:

I absolutely love staying with my parents over Christmas... that being said, even if I didn't - I 100% still would. Honestly, I hope I don't end up with kids like some of you on here, acting like spending time with your family is a chore (or even worse, making your partner feel bad about spending time with his)... You're pretty selfish too, if it means a lot to a parent to see you on the holidays I think it's super bratty to just be like no we want to be alone *stomps foot*. If you had kids it'd be different, but you don't - so just get over it... you don't need Christmas Eve alone, you get plenty of nights alone and Christmas is for family (yours or his depending on the schedule).

You're both delusional and judgemental. To the first bold, for some of us, our families (or our partners' families) ARE a chore. To the second bold -- Family is an accident of DNA. A genetic similarity doesn't mean a social compatibility.

My husband's parents are (father) a recovering alcoholic who is also a born-again Christian who spends most of any holiday telling us why we're all going to hell because we believe in infant baptism and who spent my husband's childhood abusing him and (mother) a woman with diagnosed bi-polar disorder who is unmedicated and who spent her children's childhoods beating them.

So you know what? He doesn't want to see them, and I don't fucking blame him. And if you want to blame him for that, well, you go right ahead and be a Judgey McJudgerson, because your opinion matters not one bit to me.

My husband's grandmother, btw? Mother of the alcoholic father. Firmly believes we should "just try harder" to get along with him and that my husband should "get over" the fact his father beat him AND didn't stop his mother from beating him because "it's all her fault, she's a horrible woman."

Also? My husband's grandmother ROUTINELY says to him, "Your parents getting pregnant with you was the worst thing that ever happened to my son. I wish they hadn't gone through with the pregnancy."

So, before you put on your judgey pants, and before you say, "I hope I don't end up with kids like you," walk a mile in our shoes. Walk with the demons of our families and their problems. THEN tell me that you would willingly spend time with these people.

This 100%.

Last year we made the rounds. A hour at my mom's, an hour at my grandmother's, stopped in the hospital in early evening to see FI's grandfather who had a heart attack (we spent over an hour, and brought dinner for his grandmother who had been there all day with him), then we went to FI's parents for dinner. His mom (the physically abusive one who I've posted about before), threw a hissy fit because I was there --even though she invited me and begged me to come, then she threw her dinner plate full of food across the room and it shattered on the wall... because the mashed potatoes were overcooked. She then stood and screamed at the whole family for 10 minutes (probably more - we got up and left).

We haven't seen her since. She threatened to burn down our apartment and break all our windows if she ever found out where we live because FI dropped his sister from his cellphone plan after not receiving payment from her in 2 years.

Guess where we're not going for Christmas?

I love my family to death. I spend Christmas Eve at my mom's, and visit her on Christmas day. I also enjoy sleeping in my own bed at my own home, and my mom would never ever expect me to stay at her house on Christmas Eve. Since you've deemed that we're all selfish, Lavender, maybe you should re-evaluate the expectations of your family if they are seriously expecting you to do what they want with no regard to what you want.

A. FREAKING. MEN!!!

NWR: Am I being unreasonable?

Re: NWR: Am I being unreasonable?

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