Really torn with this decision. WWTKD?

novella1186 · January 2015

One of my BMs (let's call her Betty) is planning a bachelorette party for me. Yay! She asked me the other day if I wanted her to invite my sister, because she knows the gist of all the bullshit that has happened between my sister and me during the past 6 months (some of which was pretty recent).

I keep going back and forth. Yesterday I was 100% sure I would just invite her, because then the ball is in her court. By not inviting her I'd just be giving her more fuel to be nasty to me, to play the victim, to run to my mom about how horrible I am, to stay mad, etc.

Today I was 100% sure I would not invite her. Honestly I'm still really hurt about her most recent hateful e-mail from a few weeks ago, and I'm not ready to just get over it and pretend everything is fine. Not that I'm gonna sit here being pissed off, but I don't feel like being around her yet. I think the healthiest thing I can do for myself at this point is keep my distance from her for a while. It struck me (thanks to the advice from you knotties) that just because she's related to me does not make her entitled to treat me like garbage, and does not make me required to take her abuse. And I feel like by inviting her and acting like things are fine, it's the equivalent of saying that all those horrible things she's said to me are ok, and her behavior is ok. But it's not ok. FI even said I should not invite her because of how nasty she's been.

Betty and I tried to talk this out and figure out what was the best thing to do, and we're both pretty torn on it. She recommended that I just text my sister and see if she'd like to be involved, and I said I'm honestly afraid to contact her because it just gives her an opening to attack me again and I'm not ready for all the hurt yet again. Betty brought up a good point, that if I invite sister then I'm giving her a choice, and if she chooses to be mean again, then there's nothing she can say when she's not included in things.

And if I don't invite her, it could genuinely hurt her feelings, and potentially make the rift between us much worse, neither of which I want to do at all. But also, I don't think I want her in my life right now. Ugh. I really can't figure out what the best decision would be.

Advice and/or opinions, please!

holyguacamole79 · January 2015

How far out is the party ?

WinstonsGirl · January 2015

That's a tough call. I have a similar experience, but not sure if it will help. My Uncle has distanced himself from the family. It was over the estate of my 2 Great Aunts, so nothing to even do with me as I had no say in anything that happened. He does talk to my Mom/Aunt but only when necessary and usually for dealing with the estate. He also didn't attend my wedding in Hawaii. He was in Hawaii at the time. I actually ran into him the night before while waiting in the hotel lobby for my MOH. She was staying at the same place.

My Mom didn't want to invite him to the AHR, cos she said he wouldn't come. While I agreed he wouldn't come, I still wanted to invite him to ensure that the pettiness wasn't coming from myself as well. In that case, I say invite her so you're not stooping to her level in a sense.

On the other hand, there isn't really any animosity between us. Nothing rude or hurtful has been said and aside from not talking to us, we don't really have problems like what you're describing with your sister. On the terms of how she's been treating you and thinking this might be ok, I'd say don't invite her.

Maybe I'm not much help. But, I wonder what will happen in the future if she does grow up and decides she wants a relationship with you. Not inviting her might make that harder. But you know her best. Is this going to be an ongoing thing?? Do you see the relationship getting better as she gets older/more mature??

esstee33 · January 2015

Nope. I wouldn't invite her. She has continually been nasty and abusive to you despite you reaching out to her with kindness and apologies. Stop putting the ball back in her court and giving her more opportunity to be a hateful bitch.

The more you chase her, the more she's going to torment you. Stop chasing her and let her feel the damage she's done.

novella1186 · January 2015

holyguacamole79 said:

How far out is the party ?

It's in about a month. Originally my sister was the MOH and was going to plan something, so I'm also a little worried that now she'll be mad Betty planned something (even though it's very clear that my sister is definitely not going to plan anything for me anymore).

Betty suggested that if I ask my sister now, then she can still be involved in the planning process and feel included. Which is why I'm now feeling so much pressure to decide on what to do.

novella1186 · January 2015

WinstonsGirl said:

That's a tough call. I have a similar experience, but not sure if it will help. My Uncle has distanced himself from the family. It was over the estate of my 2 Great Aunts, so nothing to even do with me as I had no say in anything that happened. He does talk to my Mom/Aunt but only when necessary and usually for dealing with the estate. He also didn't attend my wedding in Hawaii. He was in Hawaii at the time. I actually ran into him the night before while waiting in the hotel lobby for my MOH. She was staying at the same place.

My Mom didn't want to invite him to the AHR, cos she said he wouldn't come. While I agreed he wouldn't come, I still wanted to invite him to ensure that the pettiness wasn't coming from myself as well. In that case, I say invite her so you're not stooping to her level in a sense.

On the other hand, there isn't really any animosity between us. Nothing rude or hurtful has been said and aside from not talking to us, we don't really have problems like what you're describing with your sister. On the terms of how she's been treating you and thinking this might be ok, I'd say don't invite her.

Maybe I'm not much help. But, I wonder what will happen in the future if she does grow up and decides she wants a relationship with you. Not inviting her might make that harder. But you know her best. Is this going to be an ongoing thing?? Do you see the relationship getting better as she gets older/more mature??

That's part of what's making this so hard. I don't want to cause permanent damage over a stupid bachelorette party. But I also don't see her changing much. She was really horrible and nasty to me our entire lives, until for whatever reason we were in our early 20s and started getting along really well. We were close for several years, and now she's being nasty again, except I think part of it is due to the awful, manipulative asshole she's dating (whole other story) and part of it is maybe that she's a little jealous that I'm getting married cuz I'm younger than her. I don't see her getting any more mature unless something major happens to really change her. She's 30.

flyingfoxes · January 2015

I'm in the camp of not inviting her.

novella1186 · January 2015

esstee33 said:

Nope. I wouldn't invite her. She has continually been nasty and abusive to you despite you reaching out to her with kindness and apologies. Stop putting the ball back in her court and giving her more opportunity to be a hateful bitch. The more you chase her, the more she's going to torment you. Stop chasing her and let her feel the damage she's done.

Ok I was going to bold the most important part of that and respond to it, but I ended up bolding the whole thing because you have a really really valid point. I agree with this, I need to stop chasing her because all it does is gives her an opportunity to torment me. That's exactly it.

larrygaga · January 2015

You would just be opening yourself up to more attacks. Leave her out of it and if your mom says somethjng tell her it's not her business and to kindly fuck off.

What amazes me is that you still have hope for this relationship! I still think it's time to cut your losses, you don't deserve this.

huskypuppy14 · January 2015

I wouldn't invite her. Are you going to invite her to the wedding? If you invite her to the bachelorette you're obligated to invite her to the wedding.

Weesh · January 2015

Novella, I'm more of a lurker and less of a poster but I've seen some of the posts you've written about your sister. Didn't she ruin your engagement party by saying horrible things to you and about you?

Estee said it best, don't give her the opportunity to hurt you anymore. If she wants to hold against you that you didn't invite her, that's her loss. I think someone said it on here, and I've remembered the phrase that actions have consequences. You can't continually treat someone like garbage and expect to maintain those relationships and be afforded the opportunity to participate in important events in their lives.

That being said, I realize how hard it must be to think of not inviting your sister. But, do you want her to continue to torment you? This event that your sweet friend is planning for you is about you-not her. I would vote to not invite her.

WinstonsGirl · January 2015

novella1186 said:
That's part of what's making this so hard. I don't want to cause permanent damage over a stupid bachelorette party. But I also don't see her changing much. She was really horrible and nasty to me our entire lives, until for whatever reason we were in our early 20s and started getting along really well. We were close for several years, and now she's being nasty again, except I think part of it is due to the awful, manipulative asshole she's dating (whole other story) and part of it is maybe that she's a little jealous that I'm getting married cuz I'm younger than her. I don't see her getting any more mature unless something major happens to really change her. She's 30.

Ok, and I'll admit, I'm not up to date on the background with your sister. But by 30, I find people tend to have grown up enough. If you think it's her SO causing it more, then I'd lean to not inviting her but leave yourself to being available should things not work out with him. I don't know. Family makes it so much harder cos you're stuck with them in more of a way that you are with friends.

holyguacamole79 · January 2015

novella1186 said:

holyguacamole79 said:

How far out is the party ?

It's in about a month. Originally my sister was the MOH and was going to plan something, so I'm also a little worried that now she'll be mad Betty planned something (even though it's very clear that my sister is definitely not going to plan anything for me anymore).

Betty suggested that if I ask my sister now, then she can still be involved in the planning process and feel included. Which is why I'm now feeling so much pressure to decide on what to do.

That's pretty soon. I agree with PPs and say not to invite her or involve her. Let sleeping dogs lie with her.

jacques27 · January 2015

I remember reading the other thread, though I didn't comment.

Honestly, I am of the mindframe that toxic people don't deserve a place in my life, regardless of how much DNA we may share. I didn't choose my DNA, but I can choose who I spend my time with and who I let hurt me.

Reading your other thread, I would have no qualms about cutting this person out of my life. I realize that's easy for me to say (though I have done it with my own unique situation) and it's easier said than done. But you have to be ready to do it and committed to do it. There's no halfway.

The fact of the matter is, if you keep her in your life in any capacity, she's going to find a way to hurt you regardless of whether you invite her to the party or not. Maybe all will be right with the world for the few hours you have your party, but the minute she figures out she was excluded, do you really think there won't be nasty voicemails or emails or badmouthing you to your parents? All you're doing is delaying it.

I'm not saying that inviting her is the right choice (I'm firmly in the "cut her out completely and forever camp" but you don't seem ready for that). But not inviting her because you don't want it to seem like you're condoning her actions is really only an exercise in futility. Based on what you've posted about her, do you really think she is capable of the type of introspection to recognize that your not inviting is her a direct result of her actions instead of just more "evidence" of how horrible of a person you are in her eyes? Do you think that by not inviting her and thereby not "condoning her behavior" that she's going to learn a valuable lesson about the consequences of her actions and will never hurt you again?

I'm not saying you deserve to be beat up and must extend an invitation to her. I totally get needing to take a break from a situation. But, I also think that making decisions about not wanting her in your life "right now" can be pretty short-sighted if you haven't made up your mind about whether you want her in your life long-term and could inadvertently make the decision for you given how volatile she seems to be. I also think that if you're not prepared to cut someone out completely, you also can't decide to be fair weather about it and say you don't want someone "for right now" or you do want someone "for right now". People are a package deal - you can't just pick the parts you like. It sucks and it's a horrible situation to be in and there probably isn't a right answer. If excluding her is the right answer for you right now and that's all the farther you're able to decide right now if you can't decide long-term, then you do what you need to do but should be prepared for the eventual fall-out because there likely will be fall-out.

(As an aside, since you shouldn't be planning your bachelorette party, I'm not sure why you would be texting her to see if she would be involved. That should fall on whoever is hosting the party. At the very minimum, it buys you more time before you have to have contact with her.)

novella1186 · January 2015

larrygaga said:

You would just be opening yourself up to more attacks. Leave her out of it and if your mom says somethjng tell her it's not her business and to kindly fuck off. What amazes me is that you still have hope for this relationship! I still think it's time to cut your losses, you don't deserve this.

To the bolded, thank you. And you're right. I'm so worried about not causing any harm or hurting any feelings that I keep forgetting she's the one who caused the harm.

novella1186 · January 2015

huskypuppy14 said:

I wouldn't invite her. Are you going to invite her to the wedding? If you invite her to the bachelorette you're obligated to invite her to the wedding.

Yes, I feel like I have to invite her to the wedding, but she hinted to my mom several times that she won't come, which is fine. If she does come, I'm giving a few people a heads up about her so they can keep an eye on her and remove her if necessary.

flutteringinfl · January 2015

novella1186 said:

holyguacamole79 said:

How far out is the party ?

It's in about a month. Originally my sister was the MOH and was going to plan something, so I'm also a little worried that now she'll be mad Betty planned something (even though it's very clear that my sister is definitely not going to plan anything for me anymore).

Betty suggested that if I ask my sister now, then she can still be involved in the planning process and feel included. Which is why I'm now feeling so much pressure to decide on what to do.

Wait, do you want her to be involved in the planning process? I don't think it's worth the trouble. I'm Team Not Inviting Her. Life's too short to spend time with nasty bullies, even if you're related to them.

bethsmiles · January 2015

I agree with the PPs who said to not invite her. You don't need her toxicity in your life. If one day she really grows up and decides to have a relationship with you, well then she would have had to realize how horrible she was and understand why you didn't invite her.

AddieCake · January 2015

I don't think you should invite her. I had to cut toxic family members out of my life, and it has greatly improved my life. I know you are not looking to do quite that, but she is hateful to you, and she shouldn't be rewarded by being invited to fun parties.

novella1186 · January 2015

Weesh yep, you remembered correctly. The original blow-up happened when she went nuts at my engagement party and it was quite the shit show. You have some really good advice, thank you.

jacques27 you're totally right. The whole reason I keep saying "right now" is because I'm hopeful that some day in the future she'll calm down and treat me like a human again instead of like garbage. But You're right that I can't go back and forth on having her in my life or not.

@flutteringinftmyers good question. No, I don't want her involved! I was only considering it as a way to prevent her from blowing up about yet another bullshit thing. But you guys are right, if she doesn't attack me this time, she'll find some other reason to attack me some other time, so it's pretty pointless to keep trying to appease her.

flutteringinfl · January 2015

Another thing to add: Which scenario do you feel better about?

The one where she is invited and could therefore come and treat your horribly, but hey, at least you'll be secure in the knowledge that you once again made the effort to include her?

Or the one where you don't invite her, so you know either way you'll be able to have fun during your party and not worry about her, and if anyone has a problem with that you can point out the dozens of times she's treated you horribly in the past?

I say this because I care. Don't invite her.

novella1186 · January 2015

Thank you, everyone. You've all given me a lot of clarity on this situation. I love how wise you all are! I think I'm more worried about the backlash of not inviting her (or Betty not inviting her on my behalf I guess I should say) because honestly I don't want her around me, so why would I consider inviting her to my party?

flutteringinfl · January 2015

Let the backlash wash over you if it comes. I don't think the potential for backlash is worst than the potential for the bad time you'll have if she's there.

You will be okay! Promise!

esstee33 · January 2015

novella1186 said:
Thank you, everyone. You've all given me a lot of clarity on this situation. I love how wise you all are! I think I'm more worried about the backlash of not inviting her (or Betty not inviting her on my behalf I guess I should say) because honestly I don't want her around me, so why would I consider inviting her to my party?

To me it seems she's probably going to lash out and be awful whether you invite her or not, so why bother forcing yourself to be around her when the result is going to be the same either way? I can imagine if you do invite her she's probably going to be just as offended by it as she would if you didn't invite her, because absolutely everything you do is somehow wrong to her. Why even fucking bother?

MobKaz · January 2015

novella1186 said:

holyguacamole79 said:

How far out is the party ?

It's in about a month. Originally my sister was the MOH and was going to plan something, so I'm also a little worried that now she'll be mad Betty planned something (even though it's very clear that my sister is definitely not going to plan anything for me anymore).

Betty suggested that if I ask my sister now, then she can still be involved in the planning process and feel included. Which is why I'm now feeling so much pressure to decide on what to do.

If you invite her, it opens the door for your sister to twist and manipulate the party planning.

Imagine some of the potential comments:
"Oh, I see you went behind my back and had someone else plan this party".
"I guess you decided I couldn't plan a party good enough for you".
Those would be some of the tamer comments, I am sure.

Kudo's for you for taking the high road time and time again. It's time to get off this road and start a new path of your own.

LadyMillil · January 2015

How many chances are you going to give her? When will enough be enough? You have tried to mend things with her several times and each time she has been awful to you. You don't deserve that, and I don't think she deserves another chance. You've tried to Fix things with her and she has rejected this, and I think the ball is in her court now. You reached out and she was nasty. You do not need to reach out to her again. If she wants to mend this relationship she needs to come to you. DNA does not make a family. If a friend treated you this way you wouldn't keep them in your life. Random genetic similarity doesn't give a person the right to treat someone horribly, and it doesn't mean you need to accept that horrible treatment.

novella1186 · January 2015

LadyMillil said:

How many chances are you going to give her? When will enough be enough? You have tried to mend things with her several times and each time she has been awful to you. You don't deserve that, and I don't think she deserves another chance. You've tried to Fix things with her and she has rejected this, and I think the ball is in her court now. You reached out and she was nasty. You do not need to reach out to her again. If she wants to mend this relationship she needs to come to you. DNA does not make a family. If a friend treated you this way you wouldn't keep them in your life. Random genetic similarity doesn't give a person the right to treat someone horribly, and it doesn't mean you need to accept that horrible treatment.

You are so right. Maybe I'll just copy and paste some of these responses to my mom if she gets upset that I didn't invite my sister :P

rcher912 · January 2015

Agreed with all. At least this way, you get to enjoy your party! Deal with the backlash later. Just have fun!

novella1186 · January 2015

MobKaz said:

novella1186 said:

holyguacamole79 said:

How far out is the party ?

It's in about a month. Originally my sister was the MOH and was going to plan something, so I'm also a little worried that now she'll be mad Betty planned something (even though it's very clear that my sister is definitely not going to plan anything for me anymore).

Betty suggested that if I ask my sister now, then she can still be involved in the planning process and feel included. Which is why I'm now feeling so much pressure to decide on what to do.

If you invite her, it opens the door for your sister to twist and manipulate the party planning.

Imagine some of the potential comments:
"Oh, I see you went behind my back and had someone else plan this party".
"I guess you decided I couldn't plan a party good enough for you".
Those would be some of the tamer comments, I am sure.

Kudo's for you for taking the high road time and time again. It's time to get off this road and start a new path of your own.

Damn straight. Thank you for saying that!

jacques27 · January 2015

novella1186 said:

Weesh yep, you remembered correctly. The original blow-up happened when she went nuts at my engagement party and it was quite the shit show. You have some really good advice, thank you.

jacques27 you're totally right. The whole reason I keep saying "right now" is because I'm hopeful that some day in the future she'll calm down and treat me like a human again instead of like garbage. But You're right that I can't go back and forth on having her in my life or not.

@flutteringinftmyers good question. No, I don't want her involved! I was only considering it as a way to prevent her from blowing up about yet another bullshit thing. But you guys are right, if she doesn't attack me this time, she'll find some other reason to attack me some other time, so it's pretty pointless to keep trying to appease her.

From your posts, I think you really do know what you want long-term, you're just afraid to be the one to pull the plug. I'm not sure what the underlying reason for that is - whether it's because you want to know you tried everything you could first or because you don't want the guilt of it or because you're afraid you may end up losing more than just your sister (i.e. other family members if they choose sides).

Leaving the door open is admirable, but at a certain point when all you're left with is hoping for something that may never come all you've done is leave yourself vulnerable to more attacks and more hurt for however long either one of you shall live. It would be like not putting money into your retirement fund because you're hopeful you'll win the lottery. 50 years later when you haven't won the lottery you're left flat broke and full of regret.

Perhaps if you reframe what you really want it would make the decision to cut her out easier? From what I've read, it seems like you want two things:
1. To not be hurt anymore and not have any further contact with a person who is spiteful and mean to you (this is something you can control), and
2. To have a sister in your life who is not spiteful and mean and with whom you can have a relationship (this is not in your control).

You are cutting off your nose to spite your face. You are giving up the one thing you can control to chase the dream of something that will never be in your control. You are leaving the door open for her to make it easier to come back to you in this dream incarnation of a sister that you want while also making it easier for her to hurt you in the meantime. And truthfully, do you want a relationship with a sister who was able to take the easy way back into your good graces, potentially never learning anything or exhibiting remorse, because you left the door wide open just waiting for her to be decent? Because I think that's also an easy way for her to take advantage of the situation - anyone can play-act decency for a short a period of time. Closing the door doesn't mean the dream can't still come true - it just means you'll stop forsaking your other dreams for it and she will need to work harder and really want to be that sister for you instead of floating in and out the door at her whim. And don't you want a sister who WANTS to be that sister for you? If she ever becomes that sister, I guarantee you that she will understand why you shut the door because she will have done some serious reflection about how she treated you and be remorseful and then you have the control to open the door back up when she comes to knock on it.

Shut the door and make her knock.

VulgarGirl · January 2015

If every time you put a ball in someone's court they pick it up and pelt you with it then it's time to take your ball and go home.

Really torn with this decision. WWTKD?

Re: Really torn with this decision. WWTKD?

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