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Advice-- When to eject a member of your wedding party

Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
First Comment
in Wedding Party
My fiance is letting me use her account to post this question:

I have a friend who I asked to be a groomsman in our wedding who is generally lazy and self centered. He was unemployed (by his own volition) and I specifically chose suits for the party to wear which were cheap, as to not create too much of a burden financially on anyone. Some people are flying across the country to be a part of this, as well.

I don't like the idea of renting a tuxedo, to pay $300 for something that in the end you don't get to keep. Aforementioned Party Member owns a tuxedo and immediately complained that we should all wear tuxedos, since that was what he already had. He complained about the burden on him to shell out money for a dark grey suit. He has green, brown, and a tuxedo, why can't he wear one of those?

Fast forward to two months before the wedding, and now he has (begrudgingly) become gainfully employed. Every other bridal party member has submitted their jacket and waist sizes to order their suits for the wedding and are happy to have cheap, stylish suits (slim fit cheap Italian imported things, they look pretty cool). Now that Aforementioned Party Member is no longer feeling the burn of $150 cutting into what little money he doesn't have, he has informed me that he plans to buy a dark grey suit of his liking. He said he plans to spend about double what I had set, on a different suit out to his liking, from my number which was to keep things reasonably priced for everyone.

So, I've pretty much had it. I'm at the end of my rope with him. We have also been roommates for the past year and having no job and no money has taken its toll on our friendship, because he's just as difficult to deal with in a living situation as he has been with this issue on the attire. We've known each other for 15 years, and I'm at the point where I am going to tell him to not worry about getting the suit for the wedding, since he is no longer welcome to be part of the wedding party. In my swirling mix of emotions, I'm tempted to tell him that if coming to the wedding is such a burden on him (protocol is that one gives a gift to the bride and groom as well, more money to spend), that he should not trouble himself with that, either.

I don't think that this is out of line, but I'm worried that in the long term I may regret giving such a large middle finger to a person I've known for 15 years.

Thoughts?
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Re: Advice-- When to eject a member of your wedding party

  • flantasticflantastic member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Knottie57918148 said:
    My fiance is letting me use her account to post this question:

    I have a friend who I asked to be a groomsman in our wedding who is generally lazy and self centered. He was unemployed (by his own volition) and I specifically chose suits for the party to wear which were cheap, as to not create too much of a burden financially on anyone. Some people are flying across the country to be a part of this, as well.

    I don't like the idea of renting a tuxedo, to pay $300 for something that in the end you don't get to keep. Aforementioned Party Member owns a tuxedo and immediately complained that we should all wear tuxedos, since that was what he already had. He complained about the burden on him to shell out money for a dark grey suit. He has green, brown, and a tuxedo, why can't he wear one of those?

    Fast forward to two months before the wedding, and now he has (begrudgingly) become gainfully employed. Every other bridal party member has submitted their jacket and waist sizes to order their suits for the wedding and are happy to have cheap, stylish suits (slim fit cheap Italian imported things, they look pretty cool). Now that Aforementioned Party Member is no longer feeling the burn of $150 cutting into what little money he doesn't have, he has informed me that he plans to buy a dark grey suit of his liking. He said he plans to spend about double what I had set, on a different suit out to his liking, from my number which was to keep things reasonably priced for everyone.

    So, I've pretty much had it. I'm at the end of my rope with him. We have also been roommates for the past year and having no job and no money has taken its toll on our friendship, because he's just as difficult to deal with in a living situation as he has been with this issue on the attire. We've known each other for 15 years, and I'm at the point where I am going to tell him to not worry about getting the suit for the wedding, since he is no longer welcome to be part of the wedding party. In my swirling mix of emotions, I'm tempted to tell him that if coming to the wedding is such a burden on him (protocol is that one gives a gift to the bride and groom as well, more money to spend), that he should not trouble himself with that, either.

    I don't think that this is out of line, but I'm worried that in the long term I may regret giving such a large middle finger to a person I've known for 15 years.

    Thoughts?

    You only kick someone out when you are ready to end the friendship permanently. If you are not ready for that, don't do it. If you are ready for it, I would take the wedding out of the equation - it's a cop-out. Just say, "I don't think we should be friends anymore." His involvement in the wedding will naturally end as a result.

    I get that you've tried to be helpful and budget-conscious, but buying a suit is not usually cheaper than renting a tux. I don't know if you would only have been okay with expensive tuxes, or what, but I'm not entirely clear on what the big deal is about him buying this other grey suit.

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  • Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
    First Comment
    Well, there you have it. The issue isn't that he's being shitty about the wedding. He's kinda shitty about everything.
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  • flantasticflantastic member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Knottie57918148 said:
    Well, there you have it. The issue isn't that he's being shitty about the wedding. He's kinda shitty about everything.
    Glad you got some clarity. Is this a recent development, or no? I'd check in with him to make sure everything's okay with him before I just decide he's being generally annoying and selfish and end the friendship.
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  • EllieAugustEllieAugust member
    100 Love Its 10 Comments First Anniversary
    edited February 2015
    The rule for the Wedding Party is that they have to show up, dressed in the outfit chosen sober (ish).  Let him know that you have picked out the suit that the groomsmen will be wearing; and if he wants to be included in the wedding party, you would like him to wear it.  If he chooses not to, then he will taking himself out of the wedding party.

    And it is really hard to find a full tux rental for less than $150!

    Edited:grammer is hard!
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  • novella1186novella1186 member
    5000 Comments 500 Love Its Second Anniversary First Answer
    I agree with Flantastic. If you're ready to end the friendship --wedding aside-- then do it. It sounds like he's not too great of a friend anyway, so maybe it won't be much of a loss to you. 

    If you're not ready to end the friendship, then this: 

    EllieAugust said:
    The rule for the Wedding Party is that they have to show up, dressed in the outfit chosen sober (ish).  Let him know that you have picked out the suit that the groomsmen will be wearing; and if he wants to be included in the wedding party, you would like him to wear it.  If he chooses not to, then he will taking himself out of the wedding party.

    And it is really hard to find a full tux rental for less than $150!

    Edited:grammer is hard!
    All he needs to do is show up on time for the wedding in the correct attire. If he can't handle getting the correct attire, then he has stepped out of the wedding party. 

    My fiance is in a similar situation with his best man; they've known each other since they were kids but the dude is kind of an asshole, and he's been really difficult about wedding stuff and refuses to get a gray suit (any gray suit in the world! His choice!) so I totally get that it can be super frustrating. 

    But when you put the frustration and history aside, it becomes pretty simple: you a) end the friendship and he's out or b) remind him to get the correct attire or he removes himself. That easy. 
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  • mikenbergermikenberger member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    Knottie57918148 said:
    My fiance is letting me use her account to post this question:

    I have a friend who I asked to be a groomsman in our wedding who is generally lazy and self centered. He was unemployed (by his own volition) and I specifically chose suits for the party to wear which were cheap, as to not create too much of a burden financially on anyone. Some people are flying across the country to be a part of this, as well.

    I don't like the idea of renting a tuxedo, to pay $300 for something that in the end you don't get to keep. Aforementioned Party Member owns a tuxedo and immediately complained that we should all wear tuxedos, since that was what he already had. He complained about the burden on him to shell out money for a dark grey suit. He has green, brown, and a tuxedo, why can't he wear one of those?

    Fast forward to two months before the wedding, and now he has (begrudgingly) become gainfully employed. Every other bridal party member has submitted their jacket and waist sizes to order their suits for the wedding and are happy to have cheap, stylish suits (slim fit cheap Italian imported things, they look pretty cool). Now that Aforementioned Party Member is no longer feeling the burn of $150 cutting into what little money he doesn't have, he has informed me that he plans to buy a dark grey suit of his liking. He said he plans to spend about double what I had set, on a different suit out to his liking, from my number which was to keep things reasonably priced for everyone.

    So, I've pretty much had it. I'm at the end of my rope with him. We have also been roommates for the past year and having no job and no money has taken its toll on our friendship, because he's just as difficult to deal with in a living situation as he has been with this issue on the attire. We've known each other for 15 years, and I'm at the point where I am going to tell him to not worry about getting the suit for the wedding, since he is no longer welcome to be part of the wedding party. In my swirling mix of emotions, I'm tempted to tell him that if coming to the wedding is such a burden on him (protocol is that one gives a gift to the bride and groom as well, more money to spend), that he should not trouble himself with that, either.

    I don't think that this is out of line, but I'm worried that in the long term I may regret giving such a large middle finger to a person I've known for 15 years.

    Thoughts?
    Ahhh the large middle finger. My favorite of all gestures. 

    Here's what I would do: 
    "Let's go have a beer." 
    ---Time passes for 2 beers each----
    "How's the new job? That's great/bummer/shitty! I just kinda wanted to check in with you because I noticed you've been extra shithead-esque lately. Anything you wanna talk about?"

    Who knows, he might bring up the wedding, you might bring up the wedding. But attempt to connect as friends first, wedding second. He was your friend before the wedding and hopefully after. But some people are just shitheads in general. It's just their personality. As long as he knows that he doesn't have to go all rogue and buy a suit that's 2x more expensive, that's fine. And when he brings it up "Dude, you decided to go all Clark Kent and buy a suit. I tried to help you, but you didn't take my advice." Just push it back on him -- it was his decision in the first place. 

    Sounds like the unemployment period and living together has taken a toll on each of you. Whether you're unemployed by choice or by force, it's not fun. It's kind of cool for like a week. Then you're like "WTF do I do with myself??" and then it all kinda goes downhill from there.

    It does sound though that you're not ready to totally shit on the relationship. And that's good. Just gotta figure out if he's in it with you. Who knows, he might change pace for the wedding and then you'll just slowly drift apart after you get married. It's been known to happen once or twice.

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  • levioosalevioosa member
    Knottie Warrior 5000 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Knottie57918148 said:
    Well, there you have it. The issue isn't that he's being shitty about the wedding. He's kinda shitty about everything.

    Kicking someone out of the WP is a friendship ending move.  If you are ready to move on from this friendship and if he's always a shitty friend, then that is your choice.  But just know that the friendship will most likely never recover. He's been a frustrating ass, but he does have the suit, which is all that is required of him (plus showing up sober, in good spirits, and on time on the day of the wedding). 

    If this is a recent way of acting, call him up and talk to him without mentioning the wedding.  Is he always like this?


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  • PrettyGirlLostPrettyGirlLost member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    Knottie57918148 said:
    My fiance is letting me use her account to post this question:

    I have a friend who I asked to be a groomsman in our wedding who is generally lazy and self centered. He was unemployed (by his own volition) and I specifically chose suits for the party to wear which were cheap, as to not create too much of a burden financially on anyone. Some people are flying across the country to be a part of this, as well.

    I don't like the idea of renting a tuxedo, to pay $300 for something that in the end you don't get to keep.   Where in the hell do you live that a full tux rental is a minimum of $300?!  My GM's wore nicer tuxes and their rental fee was $160. . . my Dad wore a morning coat and his tux rental was only like $160.  Those prices are about the price of a decent suit, too.  Aforementioned Party Member owns a tuxedo and immediately complained that we should all wear tuxedos, since that was what he already had. He complained about the burden on him to shell out money for a dark grey suit. He has green, brown, and a tuxedo, why can't he wear one of those?  I dunno, did you tell your friend he had to wear a grey suit?

    Fast forward to two months before the wedding, and now he has (begrudgingly) become gainfully employed. Every other bridal party member has submitted their jacket and waist sizes to order their suits for the wedding and are happy to have cheap, stylish suits (slim fit cheap Italian imported things, they look pretty cool). Now that Aforementioned Party Member is no longer feeling the burn of $150 cutting into what little money he doesn't have, he has informed me that he plans to buy a dark grey suit of his liking.  Ok, that sounds fine to me.  I know DH is particular about the suits he chooses to buy- he would never wear slim cut as it doesn't look flattering on him.  I fact, slim cu doesn't look good on anyone who has broud shoulders, is a little more buff, etc.  Those men end but looking ridiculous- like they are trying to stuff themselves into their old highschool suits.  And DH doesn't like wasting money on "cheap" suits either.  If he's going to spend the money on a suit, he's going to spend a bit more and get a decent quality, mid level, suit.  He said he plans to spend about double what I had set, on a different suit out to his liking, from my number which was to keep things reasonably priced for everyone.  Again, seems fine to me since everyone is buying their own suits.  It doesn't matter what each person chooses to pay for their own suit.

    So, I've pretty much had it. I'm at the end of my rope with him. Over him choosing to buy a more expensive suit?  Dude, what else is going on because that seems super melodramatic.  We have also been roommates for the past year and having no job and no money has taken its toll on our friendship, because he's just as difficult to deal with in a living situation as he has been with this issue on the attire. We've known each other for 15 years, and I'm at the point where I am going to tell him to not worry about getting the suit for the wedding, since he is no longer welcome to be part of the wedding party. In my swirling mix of emotions, I'm tempted to tell him that if coming to the wedding is such a burden on him (protocol is that one gives a gift to the bride and groom as well, more money to spend), that he should not trouble himself with that, either.

    I don't think that this is out of line, but I'm worried that in the long term I may regret giving such a large middle finger to a person I've known for 15 years.

    Thoughts?
    Obviously there are deeper issues going on here than just your wedding and his buying a suit.  LIke other PP's have suggested, put your wedding aside and decide if you still want to be friends with him.  If so, then you need to talk to him about what has been frustrating you about your friendship lately. . . the stuff that's unrelated to the wedding.

    "Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."


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  • southernbelle0915southernbelle0915 mod
    Moderator 10000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary
    Kicking someone out of a wedding party usually ends a friendship. That's all you really need to know to make a decision on what to do.
    *********************************************************************************

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  • MyNameIsNotMyNameIsNot member
    Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    edited February 2015
    You can kick him out if you're comfortable with never being friends with him again. (And when you're sure that your reasons for ending the friendship aren't going to make you look like a douche to all of your mutual friends.)

    Yes, he does have to get the attire you select, but you are required to ask for his budget first. It sounds like that wasn't done, and the $150 is chaffing him. It might not seem like a lot of money to you, but $150 is a lot of money to some people. 

    It sounds like you are awfully judgmental about his financial situation. It's none of your business why he left his last job or what he has to spend on what. If you didn't ask him for a budget first, you are out of line getting in a tissy about him not wanting to spend that much. 

    My advice? Just spring for the suit, or let him wear a suit he chooses. Whether you've got other issues or not, this is going to turn into you kicking him out because he didn't want to spend $150 on the suit you chose that he would never wear again. Don't be that person. 
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  • Bubblegum5586Bubblegum5586 member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    EllieAugust said:
    The rule for the Wedding Party is that they have to show up, dressed in the outfit chosen sober (ish).  Let him know that you have picked out the suit that the groomsmen will be wearing; and if he wants to be included in the wedding party, you would like him to wear it.  If he chooses not to, then he will taking himself out of the wedding party.

    And it is really hard to find a full tux rental for less than $150!

    Edited:grammer is hard!
    This was what I was thinking. Either he gets the suit you picked out and is in the wedding or he doesn't and he isn't in the wedding.
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  • flantasticflantastic member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    lyndausvi said:
    Knottie57918148 said:
    My fiance is letting me use her account to post this question:

    I have a friend who I asked to be a groomsman in our wedding who is generally lazy and self centered. 
    I think it's funny you think he would change for your wedding?

    Why did you even ask him?  Regardless he sounds like he hit par of the course for him.
    Odds are on even sides.
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  • ViczaesarViczaesar member
    Ninth Anniversary 5000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    I think you should let him wear a dark grey suit of his choice.  Apparently he isn't comfortable in the slim-fit one you chose and would rather spend more money to get something that he'll actually use again. 



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  • wack0032wack0032 member
    First Comment
    edited February 2015

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  • Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
    First Comment
    It should be noted that initially, I had asked him to be my best man, which he declined stating that he "didn't want all that repsonsibility", so I asked him to be a groomsman instead, which also seems like "too much responsibility" as well.
    What it boils down to is is that he doesn't want to have to lift a finger to do anything at all that is being asked of him.
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  • PrettyGirlLostPrettyGirlLost member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    Knottie57918148 said:
    It should be noted that initially, I had asked him to be my best man, which he declined stating that he "didn't want all that repsonsibility", so I asked him to be a groomsman instead, which also seems like "too much responsibility" as well. What it boils down to is is that he doesn't want to have to lift a finger to do anything at all that is being asked of him.
    I think you are just making assumptions.  Have you talked to him, directly, about the issues you are having?

    Other than buying a suit and showing up dressed in it, on time for your ceremony, there is nothing that he needs to do.  What else is being asked of him?

    "Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."


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  • Liatris2010Liatris2010 mod
    Moderator 5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its
    Viczaesar said:
    I think you should let him wear a dark grey suit of his choice.  Apparently he isn't comfortable in the slim-fit one you chose and would rather spend more money to get something that he'll actually use again. 

    This. You are fighting with your friend over a suit.

    Would it be nice if he just sucked it up and bought the suit you picked? Yes. But when you pick out clothes for other people and want them to buy them, you run the risk of them not wanting to buy and wear what you picked. Ending a friendship because you friend wants to dress himself only will make you look foolish, since wanting to choose and wear your own clothes is perfectly reasonable.


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  • Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
    First Comment
    That is literally all we are asking of him. We just want him in the same suit that everyone else will be in (which was met with zero objections by all the other members of the party). All we are asking for is a little visual consistency with the groomsmen.
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  • flantasticflantastic member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Knottie57918148 said:
    That is literally all we are asking of him. We just want him in the same suit that everyone else will be in (which was met with zero objections by all the other members of the party). All we are asking for is a little visual consistency with the groomsmen.
    But is not met with zero objections by him. Did he bring this up before you picked the suit, or only after? Did he have any input at all in choosing it?

    I get wanting everyone in the same suit, if only for the sake of the other groomsmen ("If we could have just bought any grey suit anyway, why'd I get this?"). But you're still basically fighting over a suit.
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  • Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
    First Comment
    I guess it boils down to this question: if a member of your wedding party isn't complying with your requests for them, then is it better to "demote" then or is it better to just deal with their antics, as if he is going to be the only person there who would be wearing something else if we allowed it. I'm sure everyone would rather show up in jeans and a t shirt instead of a suit, but this is a wedding. It seems pretty simple.
    The conversation should go something like, "here are the suits we would like you all to wear." And the response should be "Ok!".

    I think it's a little sever and dramatic to assume the friendship should be over just because he doesn't want to fulfill his role in the wedding, perhaps being a regular guest will be something he'd be better suited (pun unintentional) at handling. Trust me, giving him FEWER things to do isn't going to destroy our friendship as that is what he would probably prefer anyhow.
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  • Knottie57918148Knottie57918148 member
    First Comment
    And wouldn't it stand to reason that if just let him do whatever he wants, then the other attendants might have some sort of objection to that since they are also not being afforded the same privilege?
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  • flantasticflantastic member
    Knottie Warrior 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Knottie57918148 said:
    And wouldn't it stand to reason that if just let him do whatever he wants, then the other attendants might have some sort of objection to that since they are also not being afforded the same privilege?
    I said that above. And that's why I asked the questions I did. The answers to them are important when determining whether these are "antics" or reasonable objections. You can't just say "Here's your suit, buy it" if the guys didn't have their budgets asked for individually beforehand or have any input to say, "But I really won't look good in that and will never wear it again." The same goes for BM dresses.

    If you didn't ask him whether he'd be comfortable in this particular slim-fit suit, then you got yourself into this mess.
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  • PrettyGirlLostPrettyGirlLost member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    flantastic said:
    Knottie57918148 said:
    And wouldn't it stand to reason that if just let him do whatever he wants, then the other attendants might have some sort of objection to that since they are also not being afforded the same privilege?
    I said that above. And that's why I asked the questions I did. The answers to them are important when determining whether these are "antics" or reasonable objections. You can't just say "Here's your suit, buy it" if the guys didn't have their budgets asked for individually beforehand or have any input to say, "But I really won't look good in that and will never wear it again." The same goes for BM dresses.

    If you didn't ask him whether he'd be comfortable in this particular slim-fit suit, then you got yourself into this mess.
    This.

    "Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."


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  • thisismynickname2thisismynickname2 member
    5000 Comments Sixth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    OP, for what it's worth, (assuming my reading skills are up to par here) it sounds like he'll wear a suit in the color you wanted, just not the exact same suit. 

    It'll be ok if he doesn't exactly match the others. 

    My husband bought himself a new black suit for our wedding and the groomsmen wore black suits they already owned. Men have all different body types, so a "gray slim cut" is going to look no different to me than a "grey relaxed fit" or whatever, depending on who's wearing it.  Even if one guy chose flat-front pants and another chose the pants with the taper, I still wouldn't notice. For that matter, I just remembered that one of the groomsmen wore a black vest with his suit and the others didn't. I never noticed, nor do I care in retrospect. 

    The comfort of your attendants in their outfits supercedes any visual consistency you may desire. Having the same fit on all men of different body types can actually backfire. 
    ________________________________


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  • MyNameIsNotMyNameIsNot member
    Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    You're seriously making too big of a deal over this. No one cares if your GM are all in the same cut suit. Let him wear the freaking grey suit that's not slim cut. 


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  • redoryxredoryx member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    There's a reason we encourage brides to allow their bridal party to pick their own dresses in whatever style/length/fabric, etc., etc., they look most comfortable in. More often than not, BMs are forced to shell out a pretty penny for a dress they are never, ever going to wear again and it's not fun. 

    As has been pointed out, a suit is something that a man probably can and will wear again and I can understand not wanting to waste that money on a suit he doesn't find flattering or comforting or knows for a fact he will never wear again. At least by spending that money on a tux rental he can just return it and never have to worry about having this piece of clothing hanging out in his closet for years to come. (I cleaned out my closet the other day and found a bridesmaid dress from two years ago stuffed way in the back.) 

    Honestly, if I was a BM and given a choice and it was in my budget, I probably would undoubtedly prefer to spend more for a dress of my choosing than I knew for sure I'd be able to get use out of after the wedding than $X on whatever cheap "cool" looking thing the bride selected for me. 
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  • ViczaesarViczaesar member
    Ninth Anniversary 5000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    Knottie57918148 said:
    And wouldn't it stand to reason that if just let him do whatever he wants, then the other attendants might have some sort of objection to that since they are also not being afforded the same privilege?
    Then offer them the same privilege.  You're making this more of an issue than it needs to be.



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