Wedding Woes

Leave the kid home. For him, for you...but especially for him.

Dear Prudence,
Two years ago when my son was 10 he became very verbal about hating church and resisted going. My older son loves the teen group at Sunday school and assured his brother that when he made it out of the baby area, he, too, would love it. Well, he does not. Each Sunday morning he yells, pouts, and eventually succumbs to my threats. Then he takes his snarky and unhelpful attitude to Sunday school. He doesn’t believe in God, and his very cool Sunday teacher works with that. I hated my boring church as a kid, and looking back I wonder, had I not gone to church would I have been a worse person? My husband was forced to attend his church when he was little. Now, he sleeps late Sunday morning, then hikes and does other activities. He is supportive of the fact that both our sons’ spiritual development is important to me. Do I force my son to go or give up?

—Mad as Hell Mom

Re: Leave the kid home. For him, for you...but especially for him.

  • I like the husband's approach, but anyway.

    She's been at this for two years?  Lady, you gave it your best shot.  No one ever changed their mind because someone else forced them to, and compulsory church attendance isn't exactly going to inspire religious faith.  Let him go, mrs.conn.  Maybe he'll return to church when he's older, maybe he never will.  But you can't make someone believe what you do, and in the absence of religious belief, church is pretty pointless.
  • I find the best way to make an atheist is to force them to go to church when they don't want to.

    #goodwithoutgod #moralitycomesfromwithin 

    “The Question I get asked by religious people all the time is, Without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? And my answer is, I do rape all I want, and the amount I want is Zero. And I do murder all I want, and the amount is Zero. The fact that there people think that if they didn’t have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping rampages is the most self-damning thing I can imagine. “

    - Penn Jillete, Illusionist, Author and Atheist

    Please add whatever "bad" thing you'd like for murdering and raping
  • I need more info.  Based on the info provided, I would tell her to give up already.  HOWEVER, if the kid is generally a brat and never wants to do anything he is told to, bad attitude all the time - - I think she needs to beat the crap out of him.   Whoops!  I mean, she needs to come up with some consequences for his poor behavior.
  • VarunaTT said:

    I find the best way to make an atheist is to force them to go to church when they don't want to.


    #goodwithoutgod #moralitycomesfromwithin 

    “The Question I get asked by religious people all the time is, Without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? And my answer is, I do rape all I want, and the amount I want is Zero. And I do murder all I want, and the amount is Zero. The fact that there people think that if they didn’t have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping rampages is the most self-damning thing I can imagine. “

    - Penn Jillete, Illusionist, Author and Atheist

    Please add whatever "bad" thing you'd like for murdering and raping
    Whenever I see people make that argument, I think of this:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlberg's_stages_of_moral_development

    Like, are you seriously telling me that your moral development is stuck on Stage 1, and the only reason you don't commit horrible acts is because you're afraid your god will punish you?  How about some actual morals, a-hole?

    Oh, wait, that's not the only reason?  Well, me either.  So there.
  • I pph Penn Jillette.
  • I've had that argument of what would keep you from doing something bad, thrown at me.  Usually though, it's the last ditch effort to find something after we've discussed morality + religion vs. morality + humanism.  So most of the time, I don't think the person saying it even believes it either.

    Thanks for sharing that Heffa, I've never heard of it.  Now I want to read the stuffs.  

    (I'm an atheist b/c all that is referring is my level of belief in a supernatural higher power, my moral philosophy is secular humanism).  
  • I was forced to go to church every Sunday, youth group on Wednesdays, and other activities. I can think of very few things that got me out of it. My sister was forced to go as well. As an adult, it was hard to reconcile the fact that church felt like an obligation instead of something I was supposed to enjoy and grow spiritually from. It felt false going when I didn't believe.

    Also, as a parent you pick your battles. This would sooo not be worth fighting over for me. He doesn't want to go and it makes everyone miserable in the process? Not gonna fight about it. He's not losing out on anything because being a Christian doesn't automatically ensure you're a good person.
  • I need more info.  Based on the info provided, I would tell her to give up already.  HOWEVER, if the kid is generally a brat and never wants to do anything he is told to, bad attitude all the time - - I think she needs to beat the crap out of him.   Whoops!  I mean, she needs to come up with some consequences for his poor behavior.

    I don't condone forcing the kid to attend church, but at 12, the kid should not be throwing tantrums. 

    I was dragged to church every week as a kid, forced to go to CCD, etc. As soon as I left the house/went to college, I stopped attending weekly and would only go on holidays with my family or DK. I haven't been to a church in ~3 years now since my goddaughter was baptized. I would consider myself agnostic - I'm basically indifferent to religion (other than a slight interest with weird cult-y groups like the FLDS.)
  • Being a Christian doesn't keep you from sinning. You can be a Christian and commit some horrible things. Everything comes down to choice and desire to live this life as Christ like as you can.

    If I was this Mom, I would want to know his feelings on the subject. His true feelings, and where all of the hate is coming from. Does he not like that specific church, is he bored, does he question his faith. There is more to the story, IMO.

    If he still has a problem with going, then that's something that I would truly have to pray about. Many people have left church or their faith at one point, but it doesn't mean it's forever. The power of prayer is awesome and some things take time. Would I have a problem with my kid being this aggressive about not believing in God or attending church? Yep, probably. But, you have to walk through every journey with your kid. This one is no different, than others.

    I do think that sharing your faith and how it impacts every part of your life usually helps with this. You can't just roll up to church on Sunday and that's the only time you model, discuss and share your faith with your kids. If that is the only time, then yes, you shouldn't be surprised when you kids don't feel a connection to God.

     

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  • I think it's time she shows this kid some respect and how to behave through her own actions.  She threatens him to get him to go to church.  OF COURSE he's going to push back.

    I'm really appalled at how persistent she is in controlling her child's beliefs that she threatens him until he gives in and goes to a place where he is not happy or interested.

    I think she should have a mature discussion with him as nola suggested but she has to prepare herself for her child's honest answers and accept them.
  • *Barbie* said:


    I was dragged to church every week as a kid, forced to go to CCD, etc. As soon as I left the house/went to college, I stopped attending weekly and would only go on holidays with my family or DK. I haven't been to a church in ~3 years now since my goddaughter was baptized. I would consider myself agnostic - I'm basically indifferent to religion (other than a slight interest with weird cult-y groups like the FLDS.)


    Yep, I'm the same way.  DH will get a hair up his ass to go to church once in a blue moon and he and the kiddo will go.  But I just have no interest. 
  • Also, you don't have to go to church to have Christ in your heart.  So there's that.

    Here's my story:
    From the age of 3 to maybe 12, our family did not go to church regularly.  Every now and then, my mom would get a bee in her bonnet that we should go to church, at which point I was forced to go.  I was PAINFULLY shy (like, just thinking about it makes my heart hurt, all these years later) and I had to endure that pain 5 days a week at school.  The weekend was my break!  How could they make me go to a place with a bunch of strangers?  I would do just about anything I could to get out of it.  Sometimes that meant throwing a tantrum.  Looking back, I was suffering from extreme anxiety and panic attacks and didn't know how to handle myself.  I think in this day and age, a parent would recognize that there is a problem and get help for their child.  My parents failed me in that regard (and a few others, but that's another story).  
    My point is, that none of this had to do with church and beliefs, really.  It was my own personal anxiety.  So I think this parent should have a good long talk with her kid, and make sure there's nothing else going on.  Maybe it's not anxiety.  What if he doesn't like that particular church for whatever reason?  Churches are not "one size fits all".  Maybe as a family they should find a different church that meets their needs better.  If it IS indeed about not believing in God, or Chris - - find out what his beliefs are and let him know that they are respected.



  • arrrghmateyarrrghmatey member
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Love Its First Answer
    edited February 2015
    I was forced to go to church every week when I was a kid. And during lent we would attend Stations of the Cross on Friday evenings, mass on Saturday evenings, and CCD/Sunday School on Sunday. I HATED it.

    Needless to say, I don't go to church anymore. I still consider myself Catholic, and I certainly have my faith, but I wasn't a fan of the judgmental people I was surrounded by (I know not all are like this). My mother forcing me to go every week and some bad things that were going on within our church really tarnished my view of church. And I don't believe you have to worship in the house of Christ to be a good follower/practitioner/whatever. Just my opinion.
                                     Wedding Countdown Ticker

                                                   image
  • i love that varunatt uses "bad" in quotes, lest anyone on here be okeydokey with rapin' and murderin'.
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  • I can't help it:

    Well, it's b/c one counter is that, "well I didn't mean the REALLY bad stuff, just like, shoplifting or something".  Like there's a moral ranking of "bad" that doesn't somehow still include, "don't do that".
  • well, how about when target posts the wrong price and then refuses to honor it?
    image
  • That's a crime against humanity, Hmo. 
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