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I'm surprised no one has brought up Baltimore..

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Re: I'm surprised no one has brought up Baltimore..

  • huskypuppy14huskypuppy14 member
    2500 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    I'm not dealing with boxes.

    I think this thread has been very educational, at least for me. I honestly had no idea that the word "thug" has racist connotations (and it seems many others didn't either). Whitey Bulger and his henchmen were called thugs (Irish Mafia, for those that don't know) so I just always thought it meant a violent criminal. 

    Lynda said it more eloquently than I, but when public officials (who are black) are using a word that is racist against blacks, how is the general public supposed to know you can't use that word. Of course public officials can be racist, but I don't think Obama is racist.You can't be mad at people for not knowing what they don't know. 

    All you can do is educate others and hopefully they'll stop using certain words.

    Calling chocolate sprinkles, jimmies,make me cringe. I live in Massachusetts but didn't grow up here. I always called sprinkles either or chocolate or rainbow. Jimmies come from the Jim Crow laws, and it's only the chocolate ones that are called this. Clearly racist.
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  • esstee33esstee33 member
    Ninth Anniversary 1000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    edited July 2015
    I think the main takeaway from the "thug" discussion is that words can become more racist over time, as they're used more and more to describe a certain kind of person or ethnic group. Even if it was originally a broader definition, language evolves and meanings change, so it's important to take that into consideration. Same goes for words like "ghetto." 

    I'd never heard of anyone calling anything jimmies until last year, and I had no idea it was racist at all. I just thought it was a fucking stupid name for sprinkles. 
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    edited June 2015
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  • ohannabelleohannabelle member
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    edited April 2015
    I think the main takeaway from the "thug" discussion is that words can become more racist over time, as they're used more and more to describe a certain kind of person or ethnic group. Even if it was originally a broader definition, language evolves and meanings change, so it's important to take that into consideration. Same goes for words like "ghetto." 

    I'd never heard of anyone calling anything jimmies until last year, and I had no idea it was racist at all. I just thought it was a fucking stupid name for sprinkles. 
    It almost certainly is just a dumb name for sprinkles, and the only evidence that it's not is because someone read it in the internet. Bonjour. 

    Snopes has this one listed as probably false. 

    "No valid reason exists to suppose that 'jimmies' carries a racist meaning or had a racially-charged origin. However, it's difficult to definitively disprove the claim because the term's entry into the English language is downright murky." 
    Read more at http://www.snopes.com/language/offense/jimmies.asp#JfgiOdfdCI26F8zL.99

    I personally think it sounds like some bullshit Facebook fact. 
    I need more evidence than "I read it on the internet." 

    ETA  And another story on the subject from the Boston Globe: http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2011/03/13/the_jimmies_story/

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  • ashley8918ashley8918 member
    2500 Comments 500 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    jdluvr06 said:

    Ok funny story about calling sprinkles jimmies. I had never heard sprinkles called jimmies before and a lot of people in my area call condoms jimmies. So I was working in this ice cream shop during college and this guy comes in and orders something and says he wants jimmies on it. Apparently I went a little pale and told the dude that we don't do that. He looked at me like I was fucking nuts. My co-worker explained what he was talking about and was super embarrassed. I didn't realize that it was specific to chocolate sprinkles. This guy got rainbow ones.

    Yep, I have only ever heard condoms being called jimmies.

    This is hilarious,
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  • FiancBFiancB member
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    Welp when I mentioned ghetto I really hoped no one would be all "but it uuuused to refer to Jews 60+ years ago! So you're wrong that it has any connotation to mean black people now!"

    When will I learn. 
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  • hellosweetie1015hellosweetie1015 member
    2500 Comments 500 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    I totally get the WHY of the riots. People are frustrated, they're justifiably furious, and no one seems forthcoming with answers. It's a systemic problem and it needs to be dealt with, but the people in power are not dealing with it. At some point, the constancy of a person's situation will force them to break - and when a large number of people are near that breaking point, all it takes is the slightest little spark to set off this huge reaction. It happens over and over again, throughout history, to all kinds of people who have been on the bottom of the totem pole.

    But it just feels like riots are just a bandaid. And under that bandaid is an ugly, infected sore, and it slowly goes septic until that bandaid gets ripped off again. And the downtrodden riot and the infection gets a little air and heals a little, and then another bandaid gets thrown over it and the cycle repeats. The wound doesn't ever truly heal, it just keeps getting covered up until it goes septic again. Someday, someone is going to get fed up with it and take a bottle of rubbing alcohol to it instead of slapping that bandaid on. And society will probably scream, and it'll be an ugly scar, but eventually I hope it'll be just that - an ugly scar, to remind us of how effective bandaids really are.
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  • Fran1985 Fran1985 member
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    esstee33 said:

    Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 


    In other news, water is wet. 

    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 
    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.

    Go ahead, I am listening.
    If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.

    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 

    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 


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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] member
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  • AlexisA01AlexisA01 member
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    AlexisA01 said:

    chibiyui said:

    I just read through this, and I want to say how wonderful you ladies on this forum are.


    Every single damn one of my FB friends in podunk PA (two hours from Baltimore) are posting all this "Pray for Baltimore", MLK non-violence quotes,  and generally being subtly racist dicks about it.

    Some not so subtly. 

    Yet the FB book friend who was actually holed up in a restaurant on South Ann for a few hours, before being able to safely get back to his girlfriends apartment, took the time to reflect and later post the Human Rights Watch report on police brutality in the U.S. 

    It's a damn shame how removed so many of us are from the life and fear that gives rise to these riots, and yet feel the need to proclaim ourselves superior.
    I bet they forget these quotes, "A riot is the language of the unheard." "Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor; it must be demanded by the oppressed."
    Martin Luther King, Jr.
     
    People are so quick to say they are thugs and animals since they are rioting. Nobody says anything when a team loses a sport event and the fans riot and ransack the city. 
    Relevant

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    I got a few more :) 

    "He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it.

    Discrimination is a hellhound that gnaws at Negroes in every waking moment of their lives to remind them that the lie of their inferiority is accepted as truth in the society dominating them.


    Property is intended to serve life, and no matter how much we surround it with rights and respect, it has no personal being. It is part of the earth man walks on. It is not man."
    Martin Luther King Jr.

    While MLK and Malcom X had different views on getting their points across, MLK was very expressive about how to the get point across in different methods. Sometimes you need a quiet protest or sometimes you need to riot. 


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  • esstee33esstee33 member
    Ninth Anniversary 1000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    edited July 2015
    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:

    Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 


    In other news, water is wet. 

    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 
    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.

    Go ahead, I am listening.
    If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.

    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 

    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 



    This is so fucking horrifying I can hardly even process it. 
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  • lyndausvilyndausvi mod
    Moderator Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its
    edited April 2015
    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:

    Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 


    In other news, water is wet. 

    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 
    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.

    Go ahead, I am listening.
    If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.

    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 

    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 



    I saw that live.  It was very creepy.   But it was about 30 minutes into the curfew.  I assumed he was picked up for that to make a point they were serious about the curfew.  And honestly, if you put in a curfew and do not enforce it, what's the point?  

    That said, the fact he was MIA for hours and hours after he was picked up puts a whole new spin on the story.  Why?   So he broke curfew?  Put him in a holding cell and give him his phone call.  Why was he missing for so long?


    ETA - and why block CNN from seeing you pick him up?






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  • huskypuppy14huskypuppy14 member
    2500 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    edited April 2015
    Fran1985 said: esstee33 said:Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 
    In other news, water is wet. 
    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 

    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.
    Go ahead, I am listening.If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.
    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 
    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 
    Sorry this ended up a novel. 
    WTF Boxes______________________


    While I agree with most of your post, people     were calling the riots in Vancouver stupid and idiotic. Pretty much any riot involving sports teams is dumb. People riot when they win, people riot when they lose. Why? It's stupid. I can't say I completely understand burning your city, but at least with the Baltimore riots there is a reason.



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  • lyndausvilyndausvi mod
    Moderator Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its
    edited April 2015
    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:

    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:


    lyndausvi said:

    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:


     Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 

    I saw that live.  It was very creepy.   But it was about 30 minutes into the curfew.  I assumed he was picked up for that to make a point they were serious about the curfew.  And honestly, if you put in a curfew and do not enforce it, what's the point?  

    That said, the fact he was MIA for hours and hours after he was picked up puts a whole new spin on the story.  Why?   So he broke curfew?  Put him in a holding cell and give him his phone call.  Why was he missing for so long?


    ETA - and why block CNN from seeing you pick him up?


    He was unarmed and non violent. I have been around/in law enforcement for years and I've never seen an arrest that looked like that. That looked like a fucking black ops. In a democracy an arrest should never look like that. An arrest for violating curfew should have gone like this. 

    One cop approachs Kent: "Sir its after 10 o'clock, if you don't leave now I am going to arrest you."
    Kent: No, I am not leaving. I have the right to be out here.
    Cop: "Sir please put your hands behind your back." Puts cuffs on. 


    That is how I would think it should happen.

    CNN reporters were commenting on what happened.   Then they switched over to an interview or something.   

    I watched a little longer and then my sleeping pills started kicking in and I turn off the TV.    I forgot this morning to see if any thing else was reported on that pick up.






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  • lyndausvilyndausvi mod
    Moderator Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its
    pinkrevenge said:

    I'm tired of "he had an arrest record" being an acceptable reason to execute a person. H has a drunk and disorderly from over a decade ago on his record, but I'd bet good money that no one would bring it up if his neck was broken or he was shot in the back.

    This is more akin to slut-shaming. "No one deserves sexual assault, but she used to sleep with lots of people and she was showing a decent peak of cleavage that night".

    - That's how idiotic justifying this shit via arrest records looks.

    ugh.    Seriously.   

    My husband has an arrest record too.   An attempted murder at that.  He was not convicted, but an arrest record is an arrest record.  

    I doubt anyone would accept it as an excuse either.






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  • ashley8918ashley8918 member
    2500 Comments 500 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    lyndausvi said:

    I watched a little longer and then my sleeping pills started kicking in and I turn off the TV.    I forgot this morning to see if any thing else was reported on that pick up.

    This is the white privilege-iest thing I have read all day.
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  • novella1186novella1186 member
    5000 Comments 500 Love Its Second Anniversary First Answer
    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:

    Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 


    In other news, water is wet. 

    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 
    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.

    Go ahead, I am listening.
    If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.

    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 

    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 



    That video is fucking horrifying. I hadn't seen it yet. I felt like I was watching a remake of 1984 or something. I get that he was out after curfew but the way they all swarmed him, the car never stopped moving, and then he was just gone. And gone for HOURS. Why not just tell him he needs to go home? 

    Fuck, we had a curfew in my hometown for a while. A few of my friends were caught out after curfew was going on. Sometimes they were just told to go home or they'd get picked up. Sometimes they were given a ride home. Never were they thrown into a moving vehicle and disappeared. And I know this situation is way different becaues of the violence and tension that has occurred but still. JFC. You don't expect to see that shit in the US, in 2015, being carried out by the same people who are supposed to "serve and protect." Who the fuck were they protecting with that? Who were they serving? That made the pit of my stomach go cold. 
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  • sarahuflsarahufl member
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    huskypuppy14 said:

    Fran1985 said:

    esstee33 said:

    Privileged white women don't "get" rioting? 


    In other news, water is wet. 

    In other, other news, you're part of the problem. 
    esstee33, Explain to me how I am part of the problem.

    Go ahead, I am listening.
    If you don't recognize that we have a serious problem with biases against minorities in this country and police violence than yes, you are part of the problem. People, in general, find black people more threatening than white people. They did a "what would you do" show where they sent white teenagers to vandalize a car. Dozens of people passed, and only one person called the cops. They got more calls about african american teenagers who were sleeping in a car. Same park, same people. They literally passed white teens vandalizing a car and didn't call the cops, but called it on sleeping people because "it looked like they were getting to rob someone." Again, they were sleeping. So the thing that made it look like they were getting to rob someone is their skin color. Its bad to be biased but its not a personal attack when someone calls on you to examine your own biases- its a call to action. Its not like anyone was born perfect - I am constantly examining what's going on in the country, examining my own luckiness/privilege for being born a certain a way, and seeing what I can do. And sometimes its not much honestly. But I think examining your own privilege is the first step.

    No one said shit on Facebook when there was 5 million dollars worth of damage done in vancouver over a hockey game. No one talked about "oh I just don't get it" or "those people should really find a different way to celebrate." Is rioting in general bad? Yeah, nobody is pro rioting. But to say you just don't get it is like looking at a third world country and going "ugh I just don't get how they can live in those slums!" If your first reaction to the protests and riots is "ugh riots" and not "my god, can you imagine the pain they must be feeling if its come to this," you need to ask why that's your first reaction. Destruction of property isn't right but its also always been a part of revolution and change. 

    If you (general you) have HBO I recommend watching an episode of VICE where they talk about the rise of the police state in America. Its a fascinating watch on how police have gone from community members who's main goal is to keep the peace to a culture where violence is rewarded. They train 10x more on swat-team like, shooting scenarios than they do on de-esclating a situation. That's going to lead to a shoot first mentality. Its only May and the most recent numbers have more people dead from Police activity than all of last year. Last night a man named Joseph Kent was straight up taken by the police on live TV. He is credited with helping keep the ferguson riots peaceful but last night the police drove a humvee toward him, using it to go in between the cnn camera and themselves, and he disappeared. No one could find him - social media went crazy and they called and called and raised the alarm until an attorney went on his own to go try to find him.  http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/04/29/joseph-kent-arrested-live-tv-missing/26565625/ To me that video is horrifying- can you believe thats in our own country? And its your proof that the people saying "well I dont break the law so that won't happen to me" isn't true. 

    Sorry this ended up a novel. 

    WTF Boxes______________________



    While I agree with most of your post, people were calling the riots in Vancouver stupid and idiotic. Pretty much any riot involving sports teams is dumb. People riot when they win, people riot when they lose. Why? It's stupid. I can't say I completely understand burning your city, but at least with the Baltimore riots there is a reason.





    FTR, I never said the riots over sporting events weren't ridiculous. I think they are horribly ridiculous.

    I also never said I don't see that race relations are an issue here. I said I don't get rioting. And I mean that across the board.
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  • esstee33esstee33 member
    Ninth Anniversary 1000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    edited July 2015
    pinkrevenge said:

    Rioting, in my mind, is actually pretty easy to understand.
    Ever been so mad you wanted to swipe everything off your desk or throw your phone against the wall or just break something? You're just so upset that even though you know destruction is a bad idea, your lizard brain is screaming for something to be broken?

    Imagine knowing your entire life that because of your skin color, you're going to be followed in shops and given less of a chance and always be treated lesser. Then a member of the law kills someone, very plainly, and gets away with it? All the anger you've had to keep down your entire life, all the times you had to go out of your way to appear harmless, and this is the reward.
    How mad are you?

    All of this, but also it's pretty short-sighted to say you don't "get" rioting, as though all forms of rioting are the same or stem from the same reasoning. 

    If you were saying you don't get why people riot over sports, or pumpkins, or Joe Paterno being fired, then OK. I could potentially see that. But to not understand why people who have been oppressed their entire lives would turn to rioting in circumstances like these just shows an incredible lack of awareness. 
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  • novella1186novella1186 member
    5000 Comments 500 Love Its Second Anniversary First Answer
    pinkrevenge said:

    Rioting, in my mind, is actually pretty easy to understand.
    Ever been so mad you wanted to swipe everything off your desk or throw your phone against the wall or just break something? You're just so upset that even though you know destruction is a bad idea, your lizard brain is screaming for something to be broken?

    Imagine knowing your entire life that because of your skin color, you're going to be followed in shops and given less of a chance and always be treated lesser. Then a member of the law kills someone, very plainly, and gets away with it? All the anger you've had to keep down your entire life, all the times you had to go out of your way to appear harmless, and this is the reward.
    How mad are you?

    Yeah, my initial reaction was "What will the riots help? Why?" but then I thought about the anger and frustration behind it, and what some people have to face every day of their lives. 

    I try to relate to situations as much as possible to gain some sort of understanding from another perspective, because I don't ever want to be the type to judge people unfairly-- especially based on a situation I've never faced and couldn't understand. 

    I remember feeling like I wanted to burn the whole city down when I was in high school and being bullied for being Jewish. The guy would scream things at me in class, in front of everyone (like "YOU STUPID JEWISH WHORE!" and "It's too bad Hitler didn't finish his good work! Someone should!") and some people would LAUGH. They would laugh. Sometimes the teachers weren't in the room when it happened but sometimes they were and didn't do a thing about it. Sometimes they would report it to the principal, and the principal never did a thing about it. This kid's dad was called in for a conference, during which the dad made anti-Jewish comments and no one fucking cared. 

    The kid and the dad then devised a plan to order a huge box of yarmulkes online, pass them out at school, and have everyone wear them while they danced around me and said racial slurs, to get back at me for having him called into the principal's office. Honest to god, this was a real plan that was in the works, and some other kids in school committed to it and wanted to join it. 

    This went on for more than 2 years and the kid was never punished for it and he never stopped. Even after high school he would call and leave long, screaming voicemails full of racial slurs. 

    The rage and frustration I felt was unbearable. Being in a minority group that is full of negative stereotypes that so many people think is completely acceptable is sometimes unbearable. 

    At the same time, I've always known I am lucky because I can easily conceal the fact that I'm Jewish. Anyone who doesn't know me doesn't know what I am, as long as I don't tell them. Black people don't have that. They don't get to conceal anything. People look at their skin color and it's game over. From a distance. Without even having to speak to them. I can't imagine that. My sitation doesn't even come close to comparing to that. 

    I can't imagine spending my entire life having people look at me with suspicion or thinking I somehow rose above something for not being a criminal or the billion other horrible, ignorant stereotypes and judgements. And a lot of these things are considered socially acceptable by a lot of people. Like the political figures who use the word "thug" on national TV. 

    I'd like to burn shit to the ground just watching what other people have to go through while no one does a fucking thing about it, and I'm not even a victim of that kind of treatment. 

    Sorry that this post became extremely long. Did not mean to do that. 
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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] member
    500 Comments 250 Love Its First Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited April 2015
    novella1186 said:

    pinkrevenge said:

    Rioting, in my mind, is actually pretty easy to understand.
    Ever been so mad you wanted to swipe everything off your desk or throw your phone against the wall or just break something? You're just so upset that even though you know destruction is a bad idea, your lizard brain is screaming for something to be broken?

    Imagine knowing your entire life that because of your skin color, you're going to be followed in shops and given less of a chance and always be treated lesser. Then a member of the law kills someone, very plainly, and gets away with it? All the anger you've had to keep down your entire life, all the times you had to go out of your way to appear harmless, and this is the reward.
    How mad are you?

    Yeah, my initial reaction was "What will the riots help? Why?" but then I thought about the anger and frustration behind it, and what some people have to face every day of their lives. 

    I try to relate to situations as much as possible to gain some sort of understanding from another perspective, because I don't ever want to be the type to judge people unfairly-- especially based on a situation I've never faced and couldn't understand. 

    I remember feeling like I wanted to burn the whole city down when I was in high school and being bullied for being Jewish. The guy would scream things at me in class, in front of everyone (like "YOU STUPID JEWISH WHORE!" and "It's too bad Hitler didn't finish his good work! Someone should!") and some people would LAUGH. They would laugh. Sometimes the teachers weren't in the room when it happened but sometimes they were and didn't do a thing about it. Sometimes they would report it to the principal, and the principal never did a thing about it. This kid's dad was called in for a conference, during which the dad made anti-Jewish comments and no one fucking cared. 

    The kid and the dad then devised a plan to order a huge box of yarmulkes online, pass them out at school, and have everyone wear them while they danced around me and said racial slurs, to get back at me for having him called into the principal's office. Honest to god, this was a real plan that was in the works, and some other kids in school committed to it and wanted to join it. 

    This went on for more than 2 years and the kid was never punished for it and he never stopped. Even after high school he would call and leave long, screaming voicemails full of racial slurs. 

    The rage and frustration I felt was unbearable. Being in a minority group that is full of negative stereotypes that so many people think is completely acceptable is sometimes unbearable. 

    At the same time, I've always known I am lucky because I can easily conceal the fact that I'm Jewish. Anyone who doesn't know me doesn't know what I am, as long as I don't tell them. Black people don't have that. They don't get to conceal anything. People look at their skin color and it's game over. From a distance. Without even having to speak to them. I can't imagine that. My sitation doesn't even come close to comparing to that. 

    I can't imagine spending my entire life having people look at me with suspicion or thinking I somehow rose above something for not being a criminal or the billion other horrible, ignorant stereotypes and judgements. And a lot of these things are considered socially acceptable by a lot of people. Like the political figures who use the word "thug" on national TV. 

    I'd like to burn shit to the ground just watching what other people have to go through while no one does a fucking thing about it, and I'm not even a victim of that kind of treatment. 

    Sorry that this post became extremely long. Did not mean to do that. 
    I'm so sorry this happened to you. I'm sorry anything like this has to happen to anybody. And I have to honestly say it has taken me reading things in this thread to begin to understand this type of rioting, but I fell like I am starting to see it, and it just makes me sick to think how far these people have been pushed, and how often they have been pushed, to make them turn to this. I know part of my lack of understanding is just because I don't handle anger in that way...which is probably abnormal and potentially unhealthy. But reading about this and hearing it from so many different people was really eye-opening to me. 

    I just want to know how we (the general "we") can start to address these problems. Obviously people in power are NOT doing enough or not doing it quickly enough.

    ETA: Spelling
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