Very Excited

Teddy917

Something my husband said a few nights ago confused me. He started talking about future plans. Like 10-20 year future plans. We weren't necessarily 100% sure we were getting divorced or even sure it would happen soon if it did. But you'd think you would make sure there was a future before planning it. So I stopped him and asked him what about the divorce. I asked if it was still 50/50 or what. He said that he didn't want to divorce me anymore and it was (like I had thought) a impulsive decision. So next question was obviously, did he love me? Answer was that he still didn't know. So I asked if he found out that he didn't, what was he going to do about it? He said he would learn to love me, if that was an okay plan with me. Of course I said it sounded good. Next question was what bothered him that he wouldn't explain to me. He said that he doesn't even remember. All he remembers is being angry that I didn't know what it was. Apparently it must've been something i do a lot that I try to change but he doesn't always see the change. For example he likes his space. I used to be clingy but I'm definitely better at it now. He still complains although some days he will notice and point out that I did good. I guess it's easier to find faults than to find good things. He just asked that I try. So I insisted he had to try too. And I gently pointed out some specific areas that he needed to try in. 1. Cleaning 2. Sex or at least more sexual attention if he can't do actual penetration right now 3. Using my name more. He calls me Honey which is sweet but there's something about using a person's name. I like being called Honey but still. 4. Telling me what I do wrong. If he expects me to fix it, I need to know what broke.

HisGirlFriday13

Where are you on therapy?

Teddy917

Not yet there. I can't afford therapy on my own.

sarahufl

It is nice that you seem to be making progress in communication, that is a first step. But a lot of this still sets off alarms for me. I don't think anyone should impulsively start talking divorce. That is serious.

Keep looking into options for therapy. Good luck.

climbingsingle

Teddy, this still makes me very sad for you. You deserve love. I don't see what you're getting out of this marriage. You're so young! Don't you want to be with someone that is madly, head-over-heels in love with you and shows you sexual attention and wants to be with you?

mbross3

I'm sorry for all of this! Like PP have said, some of the things you're saying are pretty big red flags. You deserve someone to love you, not "maybe learn to love you". But I understand every relationship is different and I sincerely hope that you two can work it out.

I just had one suggestion in terms of therapy. Do you live anywhere near a university? Many universities have clinical programs and grad students take clients (under supervision). I know a lot about it since, not to make this long or detailed, but my BF recently lost his brother in law to pancreatic cancer. They were very close, his sister is 15 years older than him so her husband was sort of like an older brother to my BF. BF and I moved to a new state for me to attend law school and he started seeing a therapist at the university to work through some grief issues. He pays less than $10/session as they are sessions with a student, he started when we first moved here and he hadn't found a job/didn't have a ton of extra money for therapy. But we've been here six months, he's got a great job and he still sees the student because it's turned out really well. Some community center offers similar programs with clinical students, maybe there is one in your area!

Good luck!

Fran1985

The fact that you found that conversation exciting makes me sad. 

artbyallie

Fran1985 said:

The fact that you found that conversation exciting makes me sad. 

This is where I am. Having that kind of conversation with my husband would sicken me, not excite me. There are options for therapy if you can't afford to pay for it. You work, right? You may be able to get a low-cost option through your employer. Or just start calling therapists out of the phone book and ask what they offer. You will likely find somebody willing to work with you and do some sort of reduced cost or payment plan.

Not being able to afford therapy is never an excuse. You can't afford mentally and emotionally *not* to have it.

AprilH81

Teddy917 said:

Something my husband said a few nights ago confused me. He started talking about future plans. Like 10-20 year future plans. We weren't necessarily 100% sure we were getting divorced or even sure it would happen soon if it did. But you'd think you would make sure there was a future before planning it. So I stopped him and asked him what about the divorce. I asked if it was still 50/50 or what. He said that he didn't want to divorce me anymore and it was (like I had thought) a impulsive decision. So next question was obviously, did he love me? Answer was that he still didn't know. So I asked if he found out that he didn't, what was he going to do about it? He said he would learn to love me, if that was an okay plan with me. Of course I said it sounded good. Next question was what bothered him that he wouldn't explain to me. He said that he doesn't even remember. All he remembers is being angry that I didn't know what it was. Apparently it must've been something i do a lot that I try to change but he doesn't always see the change. For example he likes his space. I used to be clingy but I'm definitely better at it now. He still complains although some days he will notice and point out that I did good. I guess it's easier to find faults than to find good things. He just asked that I try. So I insisted he had to try too. And I gently pointed out some specific areas that he needed to try in. 1. Cleaning 2. Sex or at least more sexual attention if he can't do actual penetration right now 3. Using my name more. He calls me Honey which is sweet but there's something about using a person's name. I like being called Honey but still. 4. Telling me what I do wrong. If he expects me to fix it, I need to know what broke.

First I want to send internet hugs to you...  

(first bold)I can understand wanting to know what makes him angry so that you can avoid doing it, but you have to be careful that you are not changing who you are in the process.

For example, physical touch is my love language.  I like to touch H, hold hands with him, snuggle on the couch when we watch tv, etc.  If he ever told me that I touch him too much I would be crushed and to change who I am to make him happy would make me miserable.  Please be careful about "changing" to make him happy.

(second bold) This worries me...  It sounds like you are desperate for any crumb of affection from him.  No one, regardless of age, should be that excited about an offhand comment that basically says "hey, good job at not making me angry today".  That is emotional abuse.

There has to be some cheap/free counseling around your area.  PLEASE find some.

doeydo

You need to go to therapy or find some kind of professional help.  Please, do it.  
PPs were right, that is a sad conversation, not one that should make you excited.  Saying that you did good some days is like something someone would say about a dog "He didn't chew up any socks today, he's been pretty good" not about their life partner or their equal.  "Learn to love you", are you kidding me?  You can't love someone you don't love!  And why would you want to settle for that?  Do you not think you can get any better than this guy?  Because I promise you that you can.  An example of something that I do that irks my FI: slurping my tea because it is too hot.  That is a fine thing for me to change, I simply add more milk or wait until it cools off before drinking it so that I don't have to slurp it (I slurped because it added air and cooled it off a bit).  Something else that is more 'serious', though, might not have been OK because I can't change who I am and I have faults and if my FI is going to be with me and love me, he should accept that.  Do you understand what I mean?

Cokezerofreak

Teddy:  find out if your employer offers an Employee Assistance Program (EAP) usually the first few therapy sessions are free (paid for by your employer) and it covers everyone in your household so if you wanted to go couple's therapy, you could go for free.

I'm sorry you're going through this but I agree with AprilH81, you need to work on valuing yourself.  You're a good human being and you deserve to be loved for you, not for whatever attention is thrown at you when that person feels you were "good."

Lots of hugs.

Teddy917

My employer has no therapy options for me. I also don't live near a university. I could go through my church but my husband would rather we do all counseling through someone we already know. I like the person too so it's ok. The person is working with us already the best she can. She is going to bill our couples sessions as if it were just him so it's cheaper (he's on Medicare and individual counseling is cheaper) but can't work something like that for just me.

jdluvr06

If going through your church is your only option then I think that is what you should do.

HisGirlFriday13

Teddy917 said:

My employer has no therapy options for me. I also don't live near a university. I could go through my church but my husband would rather we do all counseling through someone we already know. I like the person too so it's ok. The person is working with us already the best she can. She is going to bill our couples sessions as if it were just him so it's cheaper (he's on Medicare and individual counseling is cheaper) but can't work something like that for just me.

You need a dispassionate, detached therapist. Not someone who knows you two.

I'm glad you're going as a couple, but that is only a small, tiny first step. It does not even begin to address the other problems.

bethsmiles

You need to get into therapy and if the church is your only option right now then that's what you should do.

sarahufl

A licensed therapist should actually not be seeing you if they know you both well. You need to go to someone who is impartial.

Couggal12

I'm a lurker so don't comment much but, I agree with PP that you need to use your church for therapy if that's your only option right now. Using someone you know isn't necessarily a good thing even if that's what your husband wants. What do YOU want?

If my FI told me he didn't know if he loved me I would be beyond devastated. My heart is breaking for you.

firebabe6519

There is all kinds of free or very low cost counseling and assistance available to you @Teddy917 as a woman in an abusive relationship. Your H whether he intends to or not is emotionally abusive to you. From your posts, he treats you like a dog! Frankly, I wouldn't even treat my dog that way. That is truly sad. You deserve way more than any pet in life!

ETA: spelling

singinchick13

Someone you both know cannot truly provide the type of help that you need. This person cannot possibly have an unbiased perspective, and this presents a conflict of interest. You and your H will not be totally comfortable discussing every aspect of yourselves with her as you would be with a total stranger who has no personal relationship with either of you. Because of this you will not be able to deal with issues on as personal a level as you would with someone who is an anonymous third party. If you want to really achieve something I highly recommend you seek out such a person who is qualified to not only counsel the two of you as a couple, but individually as well.

shaylagirl

Teddy917 said:

My employer has no therapy options for me. I also don't live near a university. I could go through my church but my husband would rather we do all counseling through someone we already know. I like the person too so it's ok. The person is working with us already the best she can. She is going to bill our couples sessions as if it were just him so it's cheaper (he's on Medicare and individual counseling is cheaper) but can't work something like that for just me.

I'm -pretty- sure that's unethical for her to see you both when she knows both of you outside of sessions.

I'm also fairly sure that it's considered Medicare fraud for her to fraudulently bill Medicare for individual sessions when she's offering couple's sessions.

I'm seeing red flags with your therapist, nevermind with your husband.   

There ARE sliding scale therapists.  I've been in therapy for myself, my son's been in therapy and my ex-boyfriend and I did couple's therapy.  4 different places, all did sliding scale based on income.

Have you looked in to that at all? 

If not, go through your church.  So what what your husband wants?  A healthy relationship is about compromise, and sometimes that compromise means you get your way.  Why does he ALWAYS get his way? 

RebeccaB88

Why are you allowing your abusive husband to choose your therapist for you?  It doesn't matter if you like them.  It's no one's choice but yours.  You can most likely get free or almost free help through your local domestic violence help center.  They help with nonviolent abuse too. I personally might not start at your church unless they provide you with a licensed therapist. A pastor or deacon is not equipped with the education to understand the complex nature of your husband's disability. They can't understand why he can't just make a conscious effort to change and do it.  They might, however, help provide the financial help you need to see a professional. 

We are not saying your husband is a bad guy, and we aren't saying there's something wrong with you for being with him.  We're saying that we think his disability makes him unable to understand how to be a husband to you and what the right way to treat you is.  We aren't saying he is abusive on purpose. Just that he may not be able to understand that what he's doing is not fair or right to you.  

sarahufl

shaylagirl said:

Teddy917 said:

My employer has no therapy options for me. I also don't live near a university. I could go through my church but my husband would rather we do all counseling through someone we already know. I like the person too so it's ok. The person is working with us already the best she can. She is going to bill our couples sessions as if it were just him so it's cheaper (he's on Medicare and individual counseling is cheaper) but can't work something like that for just me.

I'm -pretty- sure that's unethical for her to see you both when she knows both of you outside of sessions.

I'm also fairly sure that it's considered Medicare fraud for her to fraudulently bill Medicare for individual sessions when she's offering couple's sessions.

I'm seeing red flags with your therapist, nevermind with your husband.   

There ARE sliding scale therapists.  I've been in therapy for myself, my son's been in therapy and my ex-boyfriend and I did couple's therapy.  4 different places, all did sliding scale based on income.

Have you looked in to that at all? 

If not, go through your church.  So what what your husband wants?  A healthy relationship is about compromise, and sometimes that compromise means you get your way.  Why does he ALWAYS get his way? 

Pretty much all of this. Before we got engaged, my therapist suggested FI talk to someone about his hesitance to get engaged. She said she would rec couple's therapists if we wanted to talk to someone but that she was unable to meet with both of us.

Ended up being a non-issue, but point is she can't see him because of her relationship with me.

flyingfoxes

This whole post makes me so sad too.  This is not a good marriage, or something that you should be trying to stay in.  You are so young - you deserve passionate love and affection - not to be in this type of relationship that you are currently in.  There is so much better out there for you to discover. 

pumpkinsandturkeys

I agree with @shrekspeare that *sometimes*, Church counselling can lean more towards, "ride it out." However, this is not true as an all-encompassing statement, and I think that any kind of therapy you can get for yourself is better than none at all. Even if it needs to follow Church doctrine, you can both likely learn valuable things about relating to each other.

I'm also in the camp that can't believe that this was an exciting exchange. When I read it, my heart dropped into my stomach and I kept waiting for the good part to come. It didn't.

He still doesn't know if he loves you. He wanted to divorce you one day; he doesn't want to divorce you now... who's to say that he won't change his mind in the blink of an eye again? He says he doesn't remember what bothered him, but I call bullshit on that, because it bothered him enough that he felt the need to speak to someone else about it, when he wouldn't even tell you what it was. You're also practically begging him to concede on things that shouldn't ever be one-sided, like taking care of a household (it's a balance, no matter what lifestyle you have) and being sexually intimate.

Basically, you're trying so hard to work around him, and all he's doing is saying, "Yeah, maybe" to everything you want and need. And if he doesn't love you now, the most you can probably hope for is a strong fondness later in life, and that's no way to go through a marriage. There's a reason why the incidence of arranged marriages is dropping dramatically -- because people want and need LOVE.

@Teddy917 -- I'd like to know why you're settling. Honestly. And don't just say, "because I love him." We know that. We also know that's not enough for a lasting, satisfying relationship. I'd like to know why you're so desperate to make this work with someone who withholds affection, attention, and love. I'd like to know why you don't think you deserve everything that we're telling you is missing from your relationship. I'm not being antagonistic or challenging you -- I genuinely would like to know.

And once again -- therapy. ASAP. Anywhere. Any time. However you can get it.

Edited for spelling because the excitement from the CAN - US hockey game fried my brain. You guys lost, you get to keep Biebs

mimiphin

pumpkinsandturkeys said:

I agree with @shrekspeare that *sometimes*, Church counselling can lean more towards, "ride it out." However, this is not true as an all-encompassing statement, and I think that any kind of therapy you can get for yourself is better than none at all. Even if it needs to follow Church doctrine, you can both likely learn valuable things about relating to each other.

I'm also in the camp that can't believe that this was an exciting exchange. When I read it, my heart dropped into my stomach and I kept waiting for the good part to come. It didn't.

He still doesn't know if he loves you. He wanted to divorce you one day; he doesn't want to divorce you now... who's to say that he won't change his mind in the blink of an eye again? He says he doesn't remember what bothered him, but I call bullshit on that, because it bothered him enough that he felt the need to speak to someone else about it, when he wouldn't even tell you what it was. You're also practically begging him to concede on things that shouldn't ever be one-sided, like taking care of a household (it's a balance, no matter what lifestyle you have) and being sexually intimate.

Basically, you're trying so hard to work around him, and all he's doing is saying, "Yeah, maybe" to everything you want and need. And if he doesn't love you now, the most you can probably hope for is a strong fondness later in life, and that's no way to go through a marriage. There's a reason why the incidence of arranged marriages is dropping dramatically -- because people want and need LOVE.

@Teddy917 -- I'd like to know why you're settling. Honestly. And don't just say, "because I love him." We know that. We also know that's not enough for a lasting, satisfying relationship. I'd like to know why you're so desperate to make this work with someone who withholds affection, attention, and love. I'd like to know why you don't think you deserve everything that we're telling you is missing from your relationship. I'm not being antagonistic or challenging you -- I genuinely would like to know.

And once again -- therapy. ASAP. Anywhere. Any time. However you can get it.

Edited for spelling because the excitement from the CAN - US hockey game fried my brain. You guys lost, you get to keep Biebs

Amen Sister! I also think Obama now owes Harper a couple cases of beer.


Ok Sidebar over;
Teddy this breaks my heart. To me reading this it sounds like you are a glorified dog/housekeeper in the household. "although some days he will notice and point out that I did good."

I don't normally agree with the Duggars but I like this line  "Anyone can fix him lunch, but only one (wife) person can meet that physical need of love that he has"
Its really hard for me to think of you being in such an unhappy marriage where you not only are in emotional pain but physical too. Your Husband needs to address why he fights and hits things in his sleep, You currently can't drive due to him hitting your eye during the night.

Please Teddy, take the advice of PP's and go to an unbias, stranger for your counseling, or even to the church if that is all that is available.

SammiNJonni

Teddy all I see in your posts are that you will change everything to be with him but that he will never commit to doing anything for you. You deserve better than this and my heart is breaking for you. You saying "although some days he will notice and point out that I did good." that is not a loving relationship that is obedience training what you do with animals rewarding them for good behavior. Go talk to the people at church you need an unbiased therapist to talk to. I do not care if your husband doesn't want you to go there he gets no say in who you go to for your personal therapy. Also realize that abuse is not always physical and he is abusing you I would go seek help through a domestic violence organization they may be able to find you cheap or free counseling/therapy.

pumpkinsandturkeys

@mimiphin -- I'd be scared to see Harper half in the bag. He makes enough questionable choices while sober.

jenniferurs

Teddy, please explain to me the part that was "very exciting" to you, because I'm trying and trying to find it and end up feeling even more depressed each time I read the original post.

rajahmd

Just FYI, for those that are getting stuck on the impulsive divorce part, it may have been a truly impulsive thought that he can't control. OP has said before that his disability involves injury to his frontal lobe. The frontal lobe is the part of the brain responsible for impulse control. It's not necessarily a sign of a bad relationship, just a sign of the symptoms of his disability. He may not be able to filter his thoughts and thus may have actually blurted out divorce without meaning it.

OP, please go see a therapist, for two reasons: one to help you process your own feelings and two to help you recognize what your husband's limitations are. You need to figure out what's realistic to expect of him. Holding him to standards he cannot meet will only lead to disappoint, resentment, and frustration on both sides.

artbyallie

Teddy917 said:

My employer has no therapy options for me. I also don't live near a university. I could go through my church but my husband would rather we do all counseling through someone we already know. I like the person too so it's ok. The person is working with us already the best she can. She is going to bill our couples sessions as if it were just him so it's cheaper (he's on Medicare and individual counseling is cheaper) but can't work something like that for just me.

This is such a red flag. This makes me feel like he thinks he can stay in control if he knows the therapist.

And really, I hate to say it, but it seems like you're not even really trying that hard to find cheap/free counseling. It's there, truly it is, though it may take a considerable bit of digging to find.

Teddy917

RajahBMFD said:

Just FYI, for those that are getting stuck on the impulsive divorce part, it may have been a truly impulsive thought that he can't control. OP has said before that his disability involves injury to his frontal lobe. The frontal lobe is the part of the brain responsible for impulse control. It's not necessarily a sign of a bad relationship, just a sign of the symptoms of his disability. He may not be able to filter his thoughts and thus may have actually blurted out divorce without meaning it.

OP, please go see a therapist, for two reasons: one to help you process your own feelings and two to help you recognize what your husband's limitations are. You need to figure out what's realistic to expect of him. Holding him to standards he cannot meet will only lead to disappoint, resentment, and frustration on both sides.

I'm glad that you were able to understand that it truely was impulsive. He's said some other things that the next day, he either won't remember or say he didn't mean it. For example, we're both poor and have decided to put off kids until we're more financially stable. One night, I'm almost asleep and he says "Honey, let's have a kid. " I told him "Honey we agreed to wait until we have more money." "Come on. Let's make one right now." (One of the few times he's been the one to initiate anything sexual) Sadly I couldn't just roll with it, enjoy the sex and have a chance that we actually have a kid when we're not ready, since of course it would be unprotected. So I said "Honey, I'm too tired for sex. How about in the morning?" By morning he was back on board with the no baby yet plan.

I already recognize my husband's limitations. I've even talked to his physchiatrist myself. And I've already processed through my feelings.

Another concern with counseling anywhere but either where he goes or the one other clinic in town (which he might have to transfer to, so still doesn't help with the seeing someone else) is transportation. Our bus system sucks and we don't have taxis out here. Even the church counseling (they are professional ones), we would have to go to SLC for it.