Le Sigh

steph861

Girl, I just want to give you a big hug.

You are so brave for admitting that this is a huge problem and that you're not happy. You have options. 

Is it possible to tell through online banking statements when money was deposited/withdrawn? If so, you could probably determine who contributed what. If so, that would be the ideal way to split the money (and likely the way a small claims court would rule). He's not entitled to 100% of it if he didn't contribute that much. I would suggest getting pro bono legal advice from a non-profit law society in your area before proceeding. And even though the account is in your name, make sure that he has no access to it so that he can't just go clean it out.

I don't think it's fair for him to stay in the apartment, but to keep the breakup as clean as possible, it may be best to take your mom up on her offer and stay in her spare bedroom temporarily. It's all about picking your battles, and I think the savings account battle is more important than this one.

You know we're all here for you and want to see you happy. We'll continue to be here for you throughout this entire process.

PS (and this is directed at everyone): I find it really heartwarming that people feel comfortable enough to open up to the members of this forum when they feel like they can't tell anybody IRL.  You're all great people and offer tons of support to one another.

lc07

There are definitely some logistics you will need to work out that I know can make an already emotional situation feel overwhelming and harder. But I promise you, it's simple in the long run and the things that make it hard do NOT make it worth staying.

I am proud of you for talking to us about it. Talk to your therapist about it and ask them for help with these specifics and resources.

Also, wanna go on vacation at Christmas time?

doeydo

Again, thank you all so much for your advice and support.  @raissyrais yes, this is the same guy.  

I couldn't get a hold of my mom; she has been having issues with her home phone and her cell phone rarely gets any service when she's home (old cement building right by an escarpment).  

I told FI what I found and he didn't try to deny any of it, except for the local phone number texts.  He claimed it was only her texting him and that he never responded, that it was an old friend who he exchanged numbers with "when we were last at the bar" (the only girl I can think of him talking about seemed cool, though, and not the type to try to get with a "taken" man).  Anyways, so I asked "Well why didn't you tell her to stop?  Or bother to tell me that she was sending you these types of messages?" and he basically said he should have, was sorry, but he was worried I would get upset by it.  

Then, he deleted the questionable apps and handed me the phone.  I then looked through a bit more and found some websites that, IMO were pretty bad (guys anonymously sharing pictures of girls) he had visited early this morning and the past few days.  We talked about what we both want and how we were feeling about everything.  He said he is willing to do whatever it takes, so I suggested more solo visits with our councilor for him to try to deal with his addiction, figure out different coping strategies, etc. and he agreed.  He also said that I should be "in charge" of the cell phone from now on and was open to having a sort of nanny software installed on his laptop, so we installed one.  We'll talk more tomorrow at the therapist's and see, I guess.

I know you are all right, I do.  Some of you asked why I am putting myself through this, IDK.  Maybe it's my self esteem (it goes up and down and I beat myself up sometimes), and that we love each other and have been together for so long, it just hurts so much.  Hopefully with more therapy and if I can talk to my mom a bit, I can figure out what is best and be strong enough to go forward with it.  

doeydo

lc07 said: There are definitely some logistics you will need to work out that I know can make an already emotional situation feel overwhelming and harder. But I promise you, it's simple in the long run and the things that make it hard do NOT make it worth staying.
I am proud of you for talking to us about it. Talk to your therapist about it and ask them for help with these specifics and resources.
Also, wanna go on vacation at Christmas time?

What the heck happened to my boxes? LOL, vacation sounds awesome, but I don't know if I could pull a Christmas with the Kranks.  I love Christmas; I'm even an admin of a Christmas page on FB that runs all year long, :P.

jenajjthr

Ditto everything the PP's have said. Hugs and hugs and OMG even more hugs. Some here have read the horror stories of my ex. He was an abusive ex, mentally and emotionally. One of his favorite tactics was cheating, then keeping the women in his life, telling me that since he wasn't sleeping with them anymore, talking was okay. I was a mess from the abuse I suffered as a kid and this was his favorite form of control. Finally after almost 20 years of abuse I got into serious counseling. They helped me to escape his cycle of abuse. 

Honey, you don't want to suffer what I went through. Thinking I wasn't good enough for him to stay faithful, begging, pleading, hoping against hope that the next promise of change would be the one. Having kids and hoping that would be the be the key to change. Being sucked even further into the pit of darkness of despair that became my life. 

Just the act of physical separation cleared my head and helped me to "see the light."  Get your name off the lease or get his off the lease and one of you get out of that apartment. I don't care if he has a place to live, thats his problem, not yours. If you can afford the apartment, keep it and evict his ass, if you can't, go to your moms. As for money...I would find out to the penny what is his and give him exactly that. You owe him nothing more. DO NOT LET HIM GUILT/BULLY YOU INTO ANYTHING THAT ISN'T HIS!

What my ex tried to do...I moved out of the house...legally it was his, we refinanced and my name was not on the mortgage (Thank god for small miracles).  2 years after the divorce he had still not started paying child support on our 3 kids so I finally put in the paperwork with the state (yep, still trying to play nice with him..stupid me).  Well he lost his job, then was losing his house. He tried to short sale the house, but the state had put a lien on it due to unpaid child support. He wanted me to sign a legal document that said he was up to date on the child support for the short sale to go through. He tried to guilt me and bully me into signing it. Told me I was the worst mother on the face of the planet, the mortgage company would come after me, the kids would suffer, he would still owe the money, etc. 

What I'm saying is your guy will probably say and do anything to try and get you to give him more money, not take your name off the lease (make you legally responsible if he screws up/doesn't pay), stay with him, promise you the moon and stars if you just stay/he won't cheat/talk/KIK anymore!  Don't fall for it, don't be me. There is a guy out there who will love you, honor you, and cherish you.

LadyMillil

I've got to run, but after reading your update I had to say that it sounds like he will say whatever it takes to keep you. He has told you before that he will change and HE HAS NOT CHANGED. You can't keep giving him chances because he will not change. It sounds like every time you tell him that you're unhappy he says he can fix it. His actions have proved that he doesn't care enough about you to be better for you. If you aren't sure about leaving him for good, have a trial separation. Go to your mom's house. Take anything valuable that is yours from the apartment as a precaution, make sure he can't clean out the bank accounts, and end the lease. Tell him that you won't talk or see each other for a couple of weeks and live your life as normal. Use that time to think about what is best for you, does he make your life better, what your needs are, etc. When I was trying to get over my ex, whom I thought I loved, I signed up for eHarmony. I didn't have any intention of actually dating the guys, but just seeing the other guys out there, and finding out that they were interested in meeting me, made me realize that I deserved better than what my ex could give me, and that there were guys that were much better for me out there. (I did sign up and met DH 5 weeks later) I know it's hard because you love him, but love is not enough to make a relationship work. I wish you the best in figuring this all out.

AddieCake

Hugs to you! I hope that you can figure out and do what's best for you.

lc07

I know you have to figure this out on your own. We are here for you and to support you while you go through that process.

Just something to think about - I know you love him very much. I believe that love is a verb not an emotion. Meaning, it's not something you just feel it's something you DO. Every day. All the time. I don't think the feeling of love is enough to make a marriage work. It takes both people acting lovingly towards each other consistently. 

I hope you guys can find that or you can find that it's time to move on.

steph861

Do you love him, with all his flaws, or do you love the person that he was / you wish he could be?

He's just going to hurt you again. You know that. You said as much. I truly hope you find the strength to leave him.

We're all cheering for you!

RebeccaB88

He must be related to my ex. Have you ever read up on narcissists? Google it. See if you don't think it's fitting. I put mine up on cheaterville.com too. Do not believe what he said to you today. He is lying. I heard all that too. More than once. HE IS NEVER GOING TO CHANGE. He doesn't want to. Why should he? All he has to do is say a few right things to you and he'll be all good again. He's not going to change as long as you keep falling for his lines. Words are cheap. They come easy and cost little. Actions mean everything. Do his actions match his words, every single time? When they disagree, believe actions. I love my ex. But I really, really, really don't like him. And I have a much clearer view of him now that I'm away from him so long. He's a narcissist, possibly a sociopath. (Sociopaths aren't always serial murderers.) He'd be capable of so much if he wasn't so sick. We'd known each other 20 years. I love him enough to be really disappointed in him, but I know my worth and it's much greater than what he thought it was. So is yours. You can do this. No more chances. Game over. Go.

IrishPirate60

Maya Angelou once said: "People will tell you who they are. You just have to believe them." Your guy has told you.

theartistformerlyknownas

You know what he's doing by putting you in charge of the money and the phone and the nanny software? He's making it so NOTHING is his fault. When (not if) he fucks up again, he'll use your control to blame you. "You should have kept better watch. You should have stopped me. You should have known I'd find this other way to betray you." He's not taking responsibility because HE DOES NOT WANT TO CHANGE. He's not promising to get help, he's promising to place even more burden onto your shoulders. He will not change because it's too easy to blame his problems and blame you and he refuses to admit that HE is the problem. Not his disorder(s), not his addiction(s), not the phone, not the apps, not the girls, not the internet. HE IS THE PROBLEM. He will always be the problem. You don't deserve this heartache.

jdluvr06

You can do so much better. I think you need to go with what you feel is best but I'm worried he is just going to hurt you again.

NYCMercedes

lolo883 said:

You know what he's doing by putting you in charge of the money and the phone and the nanny software? He's making it so NOTHING is his fault. When (not if) he fucks up again, he'll use your control to blame you. "You should have kept better watch. You should have stopped me. You should have known I'd find this other way to betray you." He's not taking responsibility because HE DOES NOT WANT TO CHANGE. He's not promising to get help, he's promising to place even more burden onto your shoulders. He will not change because it's too easy to blame his problems and blame you and he refuses to admit that HE is the problem. Not his disorder(s), not his addiction(s), not the phone, not the apps, not the girls, not the internet. HE IS THE PROBLEM. He will always be the problem. You don't deserve this heartache.

What a wonderful perspective. I've never heard this before but it's so true. Are you a therapist?

theartistformerlyknownas

No @NYCMercedes‌ I just play one on tv.

climbingsingle

lolo883 said:

You know what he's doing by putting you in charge of the money and the phone and the nanny software? He's making it so NOTHING is his fault. When (not if) he fucks up again, he'll use your control to blame you. "You should have kept better watch. You should have stopped me. You should have known I'd find this other way to betray you." He's not taking responsibility because HE DOES NOT WANT TO CHANGE. He's not promising to get help, he's promising to place even more burden onto your shoulders. He will not change because it's too easy to blame his problems and blame you and he refuses to admit that HE is the problem. Not his disorder(s), not his addiction(s), not the phone, not the apps, not the girls, not the internet. HE IS THE PROBLEM. He will always be the problem. You don't deserve this heartache.

YES YES YES. This is so true. 

And nanny software? Is that really how you want to live the rest of your life? 

JCbride2015

doeydo said:

Again, thank you all so much for your advice and support.  @raissyrais yes, this is the same guy.  

I couldn't get a hold of my mom; she has been having issues with her home phone and her cell phone rarely gets any service when she's home (old cement building right by an escarpment).  

I told FI what I found and he didn't try to deny any of it, except for the local phone number texts.  He claimed it was only her texting him and that he never responded, that it was an old friend who he exchanged numbers with "when we were last at the bar" (the only girl I can think of him talking about seemed cool, though, and not the type to try to get with a "taken" man).  Anyways, so I asked "Well why didn't you tell her to stop?  Or bother to tell me that she was sending you these types of messages?" and he basically said he should have, was sorry, but he was worried I would get upset by it.  

Then, he deleted the questionable apps and handed me the phone.  I then looked through a bit more and found some websites that, IMO were pretty bad (guys anonymously sharing pictures of girls) he had visited early this morning and the past few days.  We talked about what we both want and how we were feeling about everything.  He said he is willing to do whatever it takes, so I suggested more solo visits with our councilor for him to try to deal with his addiction, figure out different coping strategies, etc. and he agreed.  He also said that I should be "in charge" of the cell phone from now on and was open to having a sort of nanny software installed on his laptop, so we installed one.  We'll talk more tomorrow at the therapist's and see, I guess.

I know you are all right, I do.  Some of you asked why I am putting myself through this, IDK.  Maybe it's my self esteem (it goes up and down and I beat myself up sometimes), and that we love each other and have been together for so long, it just hurts so much.  Hopefully with more therapy and if I can talk to my mom a bit, I can figure out what is best and be strong enough to go forward with it.  

He is lying to you and he was just on these websites THAT MORNING.  And you KNOW he is lying.

The websites where guys "anonymously share photos of girls?"  Is that like revenge porn?  Do the women know they are naked on the internet?  I'm guessing no.  You should know your Fi is committing a sexual offense by even visiting those sites and viewing those images that were posted without the subject's consent.  A sexual crime.  Your Fi could be convicted as a sex offender.  Think about that.

And I agree 100% with Lolo.  By putting all the responsibility on you (nanny software?  come on now) he is pushing any responsibility off of himself.  He just doesn't want to step up and have the responsibility to say "no" to sexual abuse of those anonymous women, or stop himself from betraying you over and over.  He WILL turn it around and blame you for not monitoring him close enough.

Do you really want to be in a relationship with a man you can't trust?  Do you want to spend the rest of your life monitoring nanny software?  Because by saying he wants nanny software, he's saying he WILL try again.

PineapplePopsicles

NYCMercedes said:

lolo883 said:

You know what he's doing by putting you in charge of the money and the phone and the nanny software? He's making it so NOTHING is his fault. When (not if) he fucks up again, he'll use your control to blame you. "You should have kept better watch. You should have stopped me. You should have known I'd find this other way to betray you." He's not taking responsibility because HE DOES NOT WANT TO CHANGE. He's not promising to get help, he's promising to place even more burden onto your shoulders. He will not change because it's too easy to blame his problems and blame you and he refuses to admit that HE is the problem. Not his disorder(s), not his addiction(s), not the phone, not the apps, not the girls, not the internet. HE IS THE PROBLEM. He will always be the problem. You don't deserve this heartache.

What a wonderful perspective. I've never heard this before but it's so true. Are you a therapist?

Seriously, @lolo883 gives FABULOUS advice and she's totally right here.  And you deserve so much more.  We all have self-esteem issues, but you are always kind and funny and you're the best at finding photo examples to SHOW someone what you mean when you're making a suggestion.  Obviously we don't know you in real life, but on the interwebz, you're the shit.  You deserve so much better.

lurkergirl

Oh, hon. You are so clearly unhappy. I do hope and pray that you can find the strength to take some of the very sound advice outlined by others here and leave.

OliveOilsMom

Do you want to be a girlfriend/wife or a mother? Because right now, he is making you his mother. You are not his equal in this relationship. You should not have to have nanny software on his phone or laptop because HE should be responsible for himself. He should not be making you responsible for him. Go back and re-read what Lolo said. I also think the trial separation suggestion is a great idea.

bethsmiles

Do you really want to be in a relationship where there is so little trust that you have to constantly look over his shoulder because he can't take responsibility for HIS choices, HIS actions, and HIS problems? 

The PPs have given you such great advice and support. I really hope you choose to take some of that advice, but of course it is your decision and you have to do what feels right for you.

sophhabobopha

LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE. Listen to him, he's telling what a shit he is.

MairePoppy

Doeye, I hope you'll find the courage to move on, soon. It's time. You should start packing your personal belongings and moving them to your mom's home. When you are finally able to leave, you'll just have to grab your cats and go.

flyingfoxes

Let me just say: after dating dirtbags for a really long time, when I met FI, I realized what love is SUPPOSED to be about, and it makes me wonder why on earth I ever put up with the bullshit I did for so many years with others.

beethery

Every time I read about that dude, this is ALL I SEE:

Just a whole shit ton of red flags. MOSEY ON, LADY. I believe in you!

sarawifenow

Oh @doeydo, my heart is aching for you right now.

 

Your situation sounds so similar to that of my situation with my ex FI. We were together for 3 years. 2 1/2 of which were my personal living hell. He manipulated me into thinking that he could change. Each time he cheated was the last time. Everytime he took little digs at me, it was my fault for making him feel that way. Once the mental and emotional abuse turned into physical abuse, it was my fault, again, because he was not responsible for his actions.

 

Your FI is manipulating you into thinking that he will change for you. @lolo883 is 100% correct; he is giving you this "power" so that he can avoid all responsibility when he does this exact same thing all over again. He is not a good person and you deserve better.

 

It took me 2 1/2 years, dozens of friends lost, familial relationships damaged, several trips to the hospital, and a complete drain on my self esteem to get out of that relationship. I thought I loved him. I thought no man would ever love me like he "did". I thought I would be alone forever.

 

Guess what? I met my FI 6 months later and have never looked back. I never knew what love really was until he gave me the most unconditional, true love I have ever had.  

 

There are thousands of others (many on this site) who have gone through what you are currently going through. I know that right now it feels like you have no choice but to stay, but I promise there is so much more out there for you. Some people cannot change. People like your FI and my ex-FI are some of them. Please reconsider this and leave. I know that at the end of the day, it can only be your decision to leave and you will have to do that when you are ready. PM me. I am always here to talk. 

theartistformerlyknownas

april182015bride said:

Let me just say: after dating dirtbags for a really long time, when I met FI, I realized what love is SUPPOSED to be about, and it makes me wonder why on earth I ever put up with the bullshit I did for so many years with others.

This is so true. I dated so many assholes that the first time I actually dated someone who was NICE to me, I got so weirded out that I pushed him away. Few more assholes... and then I met FI. I was amazed at how easy it was to love him, and to let him love me. It wasn't WORK anymore. Relationships, sure they require work and maintenance... but LOVE should be so easy and free and uncomplicated. 

When we first started dating, I would cringe and brace myself for criticism whenever I made a weird face or an only-funny-to-me joke. Instead, he'd laugh and say I was cute or he loves when I crinkle my nose like that. I'd get defensive the second we disagreed about something, expecting a fight... but the fight didn't come. I gradually let more of my personality and weirdness out... and found I didn't have to hide it from him like I had before. I let him see my strong and confident side, and he wasn't intimidated. Let him see my weaknesses, and he built me up. I wondered if it was too good to be true or if I had found some kind of unicorn... but this is how it's supposed to be! 

Partners should bring out the best in each other, not be nannies for their vices. You should find it hard to stay mad at each other, not struggle to feel happy. You should be yourself 100% of the time because you know your partner loves 100% of you, not feel uncomfortable or closed-off, like you can't speak your mind. 

This doesn't mean we don't have flaws and vices... but it's how they're managed that makes all the difference. FI is a recovering alcoholic. Hasn't had a drink in over 5 years. But one of the things they say in AA is that you don't stay sober for yourself, you stay sober for the people you love. He told me that he didn't understand what that meant until he met me. He saw his future, and wanted to protect it. He doesn't count on me to keep alcohol away from him. Heck, we have wine in the cupboard right now. We play trivia at the bar every week. He manages his addiction because our relationship and our future is worth that constant re-commitment. He knows when he drinks, he wouldn't deserve me. 

THAT IS WHAT YOU NEED. It's what you DESERVE. I really hope and pray that you realize how much more you're worth, and find the strength to go get it.

LittlePeachBlossom

Doeydo... I can relate to an extent. This sounds like codependency. I recommend taking immediate action to remove yourself from that hostile environment. It's a vicious cycle and the only way to stop it is to leave. Just flat out grab whatever fits in your car and leave. Sort everything from you mother's house.

I was in a similar relationship many years ago with a selfish & manipulative narcissist who always played the victim. It was years of online dating, texting and IRL women. I came to a point where I could not enjoy ANYTHING because I was always concerned about what he could be doing behind my back. I discovered him several times and each time there was lots of crying, begging and promising to change. Guess what... he never did change. It was so bad that I no longer confronted him immediately after finding him out rather I would compile it until I had a list of transgressions. He never appreciated my willingness to forgive him. In fact, he had the audacity to pick fights with me about these women. AFTER the fact. After being found out and after pleading for forgiveness. His argument was that he wanted to be free to have female friends. We all know what "friendship" he was looking for but to outsiders he made me seem like an obsessively jealous girlfriend.

Luckily for me, between him getting bored of our relationship and me getting fed up, we called it quits. That moment it was 'official' I searched for an apartment and moved out before the month was over. I didn't make much money and I didn't have any savings but thankfully the landlord was understanding and let me pay the security deposit in installments and sign a 6-month lease, JIC. It was a scary transition but let me tell you, I felt such a relief. I can't even explain it. I would break down crying sometimes, not because I missed him- I didn't. I'd cry for myself and the abuse I put up with for all those years. Soon after our break up he started coming around begging to start anew. I shut him out and never looked back.

A couple years later I met my FI. He is such a great guy. He has taught me what love really is and how to trust your partner and respect boundaries. It took me about a year to fully believe he was the real deal. My trust issues came to light after we'd been dating for several months. I found myself resorting to my old ways... checking his phone, his search history and all that nonsense. I felt like I needed to see for myself that he was telling me truth about everything and anything, his word meant nothing, I had to find proof. It's pretty sad, really. He caught me checking up on him and I saw the hurt in his eyes. Hurt. Not guilt. I felt like such a fool and this time it was me crying and begging him to forgive me. He did but it took me a while to really learn what trust meant. He continued to be the supportive and loving boyfriend while I worked on myself. I had to learn to trust for real and learn how to respect his (and my) privacy boundaries. I wouldn't want someone always checking behind me and going through my emails, so why would I do that to someone I love. I know I would have never learned this in my previous relationship.

Misery is all that comes to mind when thinking back to that horrid relationship. ((shudders))

Anyway, my point is that you're not in a healthy relationship. I can recognize that because I was in those shoes once before. You deserve trust and respect, neither of which your SO is capable of offering nor is worthy of. Take a deep breath, realize your worth, and, walk out that door.

LittlePeachBlossom

Just wanted to add... those lying bastards have an answer for everything, don't they?! Stop asking questions and start taking action. It will be like seeing daylight for the first time.

Wishing you the best.

jdluvr06

@doeydo how are you doing today?