Torn: update

decembergrl2014

A few weeks ago I posted about being stuck in the middle between someone I know from high school and my FI. For those that didn't read it, basically the punch line is that "John" (friend) refused to meet "Paul" (FI) when we started dating. John and I didn't speak until a mutual friend's block party. At the block party, John approached Paul and introduced himself to Paul, and they started talking. Fast forward to today: Paul is still holding a grudge. When I reminded him that I was doing a walk for Epilepsy next week and that John is going to be there, Paul got mad. (Side note: John is gay!) Paul is saying that I'm gullible for allowing John to be in my life. I told him that I was raised to forgive, and that if John chooses to hurt me again, that it's his fault, not mine. Paul says he would prefer not to invite John to the wedding, but if he's there it's not a big deal. Paul and I did our PreCana in the summer, and one thing they emphasized was that "the spouse always comes first." John was 100% wrong for not even giving Paul a chance. John and I have been texting (mainly work stuff...we are both teachers), and I have told Paul about it. I don't want Paul to feel betrayed, which he obviously does, but part of me feels like he's trying to control me. I fully plan on still doing the Epilepsy walk. (My friend and my brother are both epileptic). Paul was originally going to go but once he found out John was going to be there he decided not to go. (Babyish, I know!) He said he will just do something with his kids that day. I don't know what to do.

AddieCake

Why didn't John want to meet Paul in the first place? And is that the only reason Paul doesn't like him?

RebeccaFlower

Is your FI homophobic? I remember reading your OP, but I don't remember all the details. I don't get why he's so anti-your friend.

missdelilah

Good on you for still doing the walk even if Paul won't accompany you.  I think it's a wonderful cause, and your friend and brother will fell great that you're supporting them.

I ditto the questions AddieCake raised.

I'm very sorry about all the trouble this is causing you.

decembergrl2014

John has been trying to find a boyfriend for years, but keeps striking out. He and I have a lot of the same mutual friends from high school, who are all married or recently married. After my divorce John and I were the only 2 singles ones left, and we got very (platonically) close. Then Paul came along. John admitted to me that he was jealous, and let his jealousy affect his judgment and his friendship with me.

decembergrl2014

@RebeccaFlower: yes, I'm sorry to say, but he is against homosexuality. He has coworkers that he is friendly with who are gay, but he does not support the lifestyle.

missdelilah

If Paul can be friends with his coworkers without supporting their lifestyle, why can't he get along with John?  I just don't understand this.  Is he worried that John is secretly attracted to either one of you?  

falsara

If I remember correctly from the earlier post the problem originally was that John was jealous when OP and Paul got together so he refused to meet Paul until the block party.  Now Paul is mad that John was so judegmental and is being a big fat baby over spending any time with him.

  ETA: sorry if the term baby is harsh, but OP did use it in her own post.

bethsmiles

I think you FI is being very childish. Yes, your friend should have given him a chance and not refused to meet him early on but it seems that now that he has met him has been civil and even admitted he was wrong.

I do agree that spouses/SO should come first but there also needs to be a conversation. He can't just throw a fit and get what he wants. Honestly, nothing about what your friend did seems unforgivable and I don't see what your FI can't get over it and give the guy a chance.

decembergrl2014

You can say babyish, it's fine. John wasn't even supposed to be at the block party. He was going to go to a gay pride event in NYC. When we got to the block party, I saw John first, and pointed him out to Paul, in case he wanted to leave. Paul was fine with staying, and was receptive when John approached him. Paul later told me that he was uncomfortable talking to John, but he didn't want to embarrass anyone, so he talked to John.

ohannabelle

This sounds a lot like my ex. He and my best friend clashed immediately. Homophobic and judgmental on one side, feeling abandoned and frankly appalled by my choice on the other.

I made the wrong choice.

 I married a man who whose tolerance was impaired, who cared more about his "morals" than my feelings, and justified his homophobic bigotry with religion and culture as excuses.

It was a sign of things to come. More control, more judgement, more intolerance. 

I hope your story plays out better than mine did, but if you feel emotionally manipulated, controlled, and forced to choose between your husband and a close friend, it's not respectful or loving behavior. 

Do not abandon your own sense of what you know to be right.  In doing so, you will compromise your very self. You are an intelligent adult, and have the right to choose your own friendships and have your choices and those friends treated respectfully.

Do not buckle to emotional and childish blackmail. It's setting a bad precedent for future behavior, and saying clearly that it's acceptable.

JCbride2015

decembergrl2014 said:

@RebeccaFlower: yes, I'm sorry to say, but he is against homosexuality. He has coworkers that he is friendly with who are gay, but he does not support the lifestyle.

To me, this is like saying, "My Fi is against Muslims (or black people, or women, etc.).  He is friendly with some of his Muslim coworkers, but he doesn't support the lifestyle of Islam."  [ETA: see how intolerant that sounds?]

This would have been a deal breaker for me personally very early on in the relationship.  You won't like any advice I have to give you about this.

bethsmiles

Honestly, it seems like your FI has a problem with John being gay. This just seriously doesn't seem like a big deal at all. I don't even understand why you pointed out John at the block party to ask if your FI wanted to leave how could he have had such a big problem with someone he's never met.

decembergrl2014

@bethsmile: When I look back on it, I know I shouldn't have. That was me basically giving him control over whether to stay or go. Luckily we all stayed, and had a great time.

ohannabelle

JCbride2015 said:

decembergrl2014 said:

@RebeccaFlower: yes, I'm sorry to say, but he is against homosexuality. He has coworkers that he is friendly with who are gay, but he does not support the lifestyle.

To me, this is like saying, "My Fi is against Muslims (or black people, or women, etc.).  He is friendly with some of his Muslim coworkers, but he doesn't support the lifestyle of Islam."  [ETA: see how intolerant that sounds?]

This would have been a deal breaker for me personally very early on in the relationship.  You won't like any advice I have to give you about this.

This x 1000. You are being asked to compromise your own beliefs and principles, and tolerate what you know to be wrong. 

This isn't a red flag, it's 100 red flags being carried by a parade of dancing bears blowing air horns.

beethery

decembergrl2014 said:

@RebeccaFlower: yes, I'm sorry to say, but he is against homosexuality. He has coworkers that he is friendly with who are gay, but he does not support the lifestyle.

I can not get with this at all, and I totally understand why your friend would not want to speak to him or be around him.

That is a bullshit view for him to hold, and John is 100% okay for not wanting to be around someone who subscribes to that utter nonsense.

Paul needs to grow the fuck up.

decembergrl2014

FI knows how I feel about this. I told him already that I feel like he's trying to control my thoughts, and that I didn't appreciate it. I also told him that I have a job, I have friends and I have a life, and that even though he is a huge part of my life, he's not the only part. It's not something he's used to, but I think he just needs to get used to John being part of mine/our par of my life, and the Epilepsy walk is the first step.

beethery

decembergrl2014 said:

FI knows how I feel about this. I told him already that I feel like he's trying to control my thoughts, and that I didn't appreciate it. I also told him that I have a job, I have friends and I have a life, and that even though he is a huge part of my life, he's not the only part. It's not something he's used to, but I think he just needs to get used to John being part of mine/our par of my life, and the Epilepsy walk is the first step.

He doesn't get to choose your friends, and if he tries to, that's grounds for telling him to fuck right off.

steph861

decembergrl2014 said:

FI knows how I feel about this. I told him already that I feel like he's trying to control my thoughts, and that I didn't appreciate it. I also told him that I have a job, I have friends and I have a life, and that even though he is a huge part of my life, he's not the only part. It's not something he's used to, but I think he just needs to get used to John being part of mine/our par of my life, and the Epilepsy walk is the first step.

Are you saying that he's used to being the only part of his SO's life? Or that he's not used to John being in your life?

decembergrl2014

He's not used to John being in my life.

Ndelible

John and Paul oughta just get together and write some great music.  You know, like, All You Need Is Love.

RebeccaB88

JCbride2015 said:

decembergrl2014 said:

@RebeccaFlower: yes, I'm sorry to say, but he is against homosexuality. He has coworkers that he is friendly with who are gay, but he does not support the lifestyle.

To me, this is like saying, "My Fi is against Muslims (or black people, or women, etc.).  He is friendly with some of his Muslim coworkers, but he doesn't support the lifestyle of Islam."  [ETA: see how intolerant that sounds?]

This would have been a deal breaker for me personally very early on in the relationship.  You won't like any advice I have to give you about this.

I'm with JC here.  We wouldn't get past the first date if I found out someone had this attitude. Frankly, I don't blame John for not wanting to hang out with someone who holds *these kinds of* feelings towards him, even though he doesn't know him at all. I wouldn't want to either.

Being gay is not a 'lifestyle'. It's life.

*euphemism for what I really wanted to say that might be a little too honest

esstee33

As long as you maintain a friendship with John, this is going to continue to be an issue. Although, TBH, if I were in John's shoes and a friend with whom I was very close chose her unapologetically bigoted FI over me, I'd be dropping that friend ASAP. 

If you're planning to have children with him, what happens if you have a child who turns out to be gay?

Just really confused about why you're willing to compromise on something you believe to be wrong, since you are clearly not homophobic and are ashamed that he is. And that's not even to mention the controlling behavior. He clearly wants to control who you can and can't be friends with, to suit his bullshit beliefs, and that's completely unacceptable.

decembergrl2014

John doesn't know that Paul doesn't like the fact that he's gay. John thinks that he "broke the ice" with Paul at the block party, and that everything is good. He and I aren't going to have kids. He has 3 kids from his previous marriage, and I can't have kids. I love his kids as if they were my own, and I know they love me. FI is very stubborn. I'm not afraid to tell him how I feel, as I have before. I think that once he sees that John isn't leaving, then he will learn to accept it. After all, if he wants to keep me around, then he won't have a choice!

holyguacamole79

I'm just as ragey about this as @jcbride2015 is, and I'm a conservative Catholic. @decembergrl2014, did this come up in any of your marriage prep? This is something that you & your FI need to have respect and understanding regarding it. "Supporting the lifestyle" doesn't necessarily involve going to pride events and being a vocal supporter of marriage equality. He just needs to respect and love your friends as they are. If your FI is a devout Catholic, I can see him not wanting to attend Johns wedding someday, but he should be able to manage to go on a walk with him, for crying out loud!!

doeydo

JFC, that's like saying you don't "support the lifestyle" of brunettes, because trust me, I did not choose to be bisexual nor does my sexuality determine my "lifestyle".  WTF does that even mean?  I fall in love and have relationships like any "normal straight" person.  I cannot tolerate people like your FI, I don't know how you seem to.

esstee33

decembergrl2014 said:

John doesn't know that Paul doesn't like the fact that he's gay. John thinks that he "broke the ice" with Paul at the block party, and that everything is good. He and I aren't going to have kids. He has 3 kids from his previous marriage, and I can't have kids. I love his kids as if they were my own, and I know they love me. FI is very stubborn. I'm not afraid to tell him how I feel, as I have before. I think that once he sees that John isn't leaving, then he will learn to accept it. After all, if he wants to keep me around, then he won't have a choice!

He may learn to accept the fact that John is in your life, but he's not going to learn to accept John's sexuality, especially when you're so tolerant of his intolerance. And if this continues like this, Paul is either going to push such a wedge between you and John that you give up the friendship to appease him, or John just walks away. And do you really think John's never going to be like "Hey, why does your FI/H dislike me so much?" It's not just going to go away because you don't want to acknowledge the problem. 

decembergrl2014

@esstee33‌...I respectfully disagree. True, Paul doesn't like/accept homosexuality, but his main issue with John is the fact that he refused to meet Paul when he and I started dating. That hurt both of us. John extended an olive branch to Paul at the block party, but Paul is still upset that he was pre judged by John. Paul's issue with John's sexuality is secondary, even though it's none of Paul's business.

beethery

decembergrl2014 said:

@esstee33‌...I respectfully disagree. True, Paul doesn't like/accept homosexuality, but his main issue with John is the fact that he refused to meet Paul when he and I started dating. That hurt both of us. John extended an olive branch to Paul at the block party, but Paul is still upset that he was pre judged by John. Paul's issue with John's sexuality is secondary, even though it's none of Paul's business.

Paul. Needs. To. Get. Fucking. Over. It.

Here's the summary:

John made a mistake* and has tried to mend fences.

Paul is still being a petulant child about it, and on top of it, he is a homophobe. Super.

I'll say it again, Paul needs to grow the fuck up and get over it.

*(at this point I'm thinking it might have been better of him not to waste time meeting him)

lc07

decembergrl2014 said:

@esstee33‌...I respectfully disagree. True, Paul doesn't like/accept homosexuality, but his main issue with John is the fact that he refused to meet Paul when he and I started dating. That hurt both of us. John extended an olive branch to Paul at the block party, but Paul is still upset that he was pre judged by John. Paul's issue with John's sexuality is secondary, even though it's none of Paul's business.

Do you trust this? This sounds like an excuse to me.

Honestly, all else aside assuming you are okay with his intolerance, I could never marry someone who I thought was trying to control my thoughts. That's a horrible thing. Why would you want a partnership with someone like that?

ashley8918

Whoa. Other issues aside, I could NEVER marry a bigot. Actually, I could never even be casual acquaintances with a bigot.