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What do you do when a parent wants to invade on your future plans?

MCmeowMCmeow member
500 Love Its 100 Comments Second Anniversary Name Dropper
edited March 2016 in Chit Chat
Hi everyone! This isn't an urgent issue, just something kinda tricky.

So my fiance and I love planning our future, cause we feel pretty optimistic (Unless Trump is president) when it comes to our jobs, wedding planning is going great, we know we want kids in about 5 years, blah blah. One of those plans is to get a house within two years of getting married. 

Ok problem is, my mom knows this. But first some info on my mom: She's divorced and lives with my younger brother and our adorable husky, but she is a lot to handle, (*edited out*). She spends a lot of her time trying to ruin my dad's reputation (who was a terrible husband to her but he's a perfect dad to us and she admits this). She spreads rumors about him, and rather spend her time talking about him than being happy spending time with her kids. Also she blows things out of proportion and thinks people are scheming against her when they do anything slightly negative towards her at work. It becomes very hard to be around her for too long, she takes out her anger on people around her, which was why I had to move out the second I got a stable job. When I lived with her and spent too much time indoors I was pretty depressed, so I spent a lot of time outside even in bad weather.

Now things are better because I'm not around her as often which makes her visits enjoyable, I never thought I'd become friends with her! My fiance can handle visits with her and they get along, but too much time with her drives both of us crazy. She goes to a therapist but it doesn't help. 

Ok, that explanation is out of the way. She's very excited for us and loves talking about the wedding, future kids and such, and then mentioned she's going to move into the basement of our future house... uh what? According to her the future kids need a babysitter. But I can picture this being chaotic, and unfair for us to not even get a say. Plus for my introverted fiance who loves peace and quiet. Building a life together and we don't get a chance to truly live it together? This is nyc so she has problems finding affordable apartments, so I'd be willing to help her find a place any day, but I don't want her living with us.
I feel bad and selfish for feeling this way but she's really bad at giving people space and we want to start our newly wed life happy and peaceful.

My cousins suggested finding a house without a basement or livable basement, ha. But have any of you dealt with parents that just refused to give you needed space? How do you deal with it without hurting their feelings?
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Re: What do you do when a parent wants to invade on your future plans?

  • luckya23 said:
    NO is a complete sentence.
    I'd just laugh it off and beandip the hell out of it.  How was her relationship with her MIL?  Surely she didn't want to live with her!
    I love that you brought this up. She hates her ex-MIL, she still does, she seriously would not shed a tear if she died today. It's bad.
    Her ex-MIL (my grandma) dislikes my mom too -_- she just doesn't show it. My mom loved my grandpa though, so it's not that she hates all of my dad's family haha. He died 8 years ago, he was a great man and really nice to her. Although if I brought up this comparison she probably wouldn't forgive me for a long time.
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  • MCmeow said:
    Hi everyone! This isn't an urgent issue, just something kinda tricky.

    So my fiance and I love planning our future, cause we feel pretty optimistic (Unless Trump is president) when it comes to our jobs, wedding planning is going great, we know we want kids in about 5 years, blah blah. One of those plans is to get a house within two years of getting married. 

    Ok problem is, my mom knows this. But first some info on my mom: She's divorced and lives with my younger brother and our adorable husky, but she is a lot to handle, (We believe she may be a little paranoid schizophrenic, we have several psychologists in the family who believe this). She spends a lot of her time trying to ruin my dad's reputation (who was a terrible husband to her but he's a perfect dad to us and she admits this). She spreads rumors about him, and rather spend her time talking about him than being happy spending time with her kids. Also she blows things out of proportion and thinks people are scheming against her when they do anything slightly negative towards her at work. It becomes very hard to be around her for too long, she takes out her anger on people around her, which was why I had to move out the second I got a stable job. When I lived with her and spent too much time indoors I was pretty depressed, so I spent a lot of time outside even in bad weather.

    Now things are better because I'm not around her as often which makes her visits enjoyable, I never thought I'd become friends with her! My fiance can handle visits with her and they get along, but too much time with her drives both of us crazy. She goes to a therapist but it doesn't help. 

    Ok, that explanation is out of the way. She's very excited for us and loves talking about the wedding, future kids and such, and then mentioned she's going to move into the basement of our future house... uh what? According to her the future kids need a babysitter. But I can picture this being chaotic, and unfair for us to not even get a say. Plus for my introverted fiance who loves peace and quiet. Building a life together and we don't get a chance to truly live it together? This is nyc so she has problems finding affordable apartments, so I'd be willing to help her find a place any day, but I don't want her living with us.
    I feel bad and selfish for feeling this way but she's really bad at giving people space and we want to start our newly wed life happy and peaceful.

    My cousins suggested finding a house without a basement or livable basement, ha. But have any of you dealt with parents that just refused to give you needed space? How do you deal with it without hurting their feelings?
    Man, she sounds a lot like my FMIL!  I had to read this to FI and he said "I swear, I don't have a sister!"

    You just need to maintain your boundaries.  "Mom, I'm glad you're excited about our future family, and we'll let you know if and when we need your help."  Then bean dip and bean dip hard!  

    Establishing boundaries is difficult, in our experience, but repetition and sticking to them has been the most effective tool.  She actually half apologized last month for the time she came in and rearranged our apartment in 2013.  

    Good luck and don't feel selfish.  There is nothing wrong with being an adult and wanting to maintain your own home without any additional residents.
    Thank you, I'll try my hardest haha. And oh my god, I would be furious if my mom came in and rearranged anything. Christ. Moms are just (understandably) too excited -_-
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    kimmiinthemitten
  • Wishing you the best with this situation.  Also when it comes to boundaries, definitely don't let her have a spare key to your new place (she'll probably ask for one "just in case").  Is she likely to try to "tag along" with you guys to look at houses?  That could be a sneaky way of trying to move in with you ("I helped you pick out the house," or "this would be a perfect house for US to live in").  When the time comes, make it clear this is something you and FI/H are doing.  When she asks about babysitting in the future, tell her you found the perfect sitter and you're all set.  If she's still encroaching too much on your space, don't be ashamed to use the "decline" button on your phone.  
    MCmeow[Deleted User]
  • SP29SP29 member
    Sixth Anniversary 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    For now, I think you can bean dip her, but eventually you will get to a point where you will need to put your foot down and say NO.

    I am in a similar situation as you. I'll share- sorry, this is going to be long.

    DH's parents are divorced. His dad lives on his own on a large farm about 2 hours away; his dad is 74 this year. Still very active, farms his land for produce that he sells at farmers markets, and does this all by himself. FIL wants this year to be his last year farming for the market. FIL is similar to your mom in that we (DH, SIL, myself... most people) can only take him in small doses, but DH was raised with the European belief of taking care of your older family members.

    FIL has offered, a few times, to give DH and SIL half the farm each, with the idea we'd build our homes on the farm with him and live a big happy family. Both DH and SIL said no- they aren't interested in the farm (too far away from work for anyone).

    Well this winter he pulled a big guilt trip on DH and SIL telling them, "If neither of you want the farm, then I'm selling everything and moving back to Hungary (where he is from) where I can pay for someone to take care of me". Both DH and SIL were quite upset by this. I said let him go- he's an adult, but DH is worried as FIL is the youngest of his siblings and soon he won't have anyone and the money will be gone. Again- that feeling of responsibility for taking care of your parents.

    FIL also said, "well if you won't live here, I'll sell the farm, give you guys the money to buy a farm where you are and move in with you". Financially, it's not a bad plan- BUT anything with a nice enough house on some land close to the city is still $$$. I'm not against buying an acreage, but it made me resentful that FIL is trying to dictate where and how we will live; this farm would still be a large mortgage payment, so DH and I would need to work full time where as when we have kids, I want to go down to part time, and we would need FIL's money first for the down payment- we would be waiting on his timeline to buy something (we rent right now, and we'd like to buy next spring, maybe sooner if the perfect house came up).

    DH has since had a lot of perspective and has decided to call his dad's bluff. We have decided that we will find a house that WE like WHERE we like, but that will allow FIL the option to live with us, whether that is an acreage with space to put a permanent trailer on the land for him, or a house with an in-law suite.

    I'm leaning toward the house with the in-law suite. Fortunately DH also agrees that this in-law suite will be a completely separate unit and FIL will not have a key to our home. That is something I can live with.

    Anyway OP- I feel you. The sense of responsibility to take care of your parent, particularly when things are not so great for them, balanced against your own independence and the fact of, "I don't *really* want to live with you".

    You have to decide with what you are willing to live with, and not. An in-law suite with separate entrance (essentially a house with a separate rental unit), may be an option for you, if you're considering it. But ultimately you have to put yourself and your FH first. Would you want your mom babysitting your kids all the time?
    MCmeow[Deleted User]short+sassy
  • levioosalevioosa Southern California member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    No no no no no.

    Boundaries are your friend. 


    image
  • holyguacamole79holyguacamole79 a taco truck in Houston member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    I think a firm, consistent "no" is in order next time she brings it up.   There was talk of my dad living with us (and he doesn't have any issues), and I point blank said no.  I got some flack for it, but it worked.  I said that my dad could live with me until we got married (which he did), but I wanted him to move out as soon as we got married. 
  • CMGragainCMGragain member
    10000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary 25 Answers
    edited March 2016
    MCmeow said:
    Hi everyone! This isn't an urgent issue, just something kinda tricky.

    So my fiance and I love planning our future, cause we feel pretty optimistic (Unless Trump is president) when it comes to our jobs, wedding planning is going great, we know we want kids in about 5 years, blah blah. One of those plans is to get a house within two years of getting married. 

    Ok problem is, my mom knows this. But first some info on my mom: She's divorced and lives with my younger brother and our adorable husky, but she is a lot to handle, (We believe she may be a little paranoid schizophrenic, we have several psychologists in the family who believe this). She spends a lot of her time trying to ruin my dad's reputation (who was a terrible husband to her but he's a perfect dad to us and she admits this). She spreads rumors about him, and rather spend her time talking about him than being happy spending time with her kids. Also she blows things out of proportion and thinks people are scheming against her when they do anything slightly negative towards her at work. It becomes very hard to be around her for too long, she takes out her anger on people around her, which was why I had to move out the second I got a stable job. When I lived with her and spent too much time indoors I was pretty depressed, so I spent a lot of time outside even in bad weather.

    Now things are better because I'm not around her as often which makes her visits enjoyable, I never thought I'd become friends with her! My fiance can handle visits with her and they get along, but too much time with her drives both of us crazy. She goes to a therapist but it doesn't help. 

    Ok, that explanation is out of the way. She's very excited for us and loves talking about the wedding, future kids and such, and then mentioned she's going to move into the basement of our future house... uh what? According to her the future kids need a babysitter. But I can picture this being chaotic, and unfair for us to not even get a say. Plus for my introverted fiance who loves peace and quiet. Building a life together and we don't get a chance to truly live it together? This is nyc so she has problems finding affordable apartments, so I'd be willing to help her find a place any day, but I don't want her living with us.
    I feel bad and selfish for feeling this way but she's really bad at giving people space and we want to start our newly wed life happy and peaceful.

    My cousins suggested finding a house without a basement or livable basement, ha. But have any of you dealt with parents that just refused to give you needed space? How do you deal with it without hurting their feelings?
    Schizophrenia is a physical disease which causes mental illness.  It can be treated with medication, but it cannot be cured.
    If your family does feel that your Mom is mentally ill, you must insist that she see a good psychiatrist for official diagnosis and treatment.  To avoid doing this is enabling, and you are shirking your responsibility as her offspring.  Her therapist can recommend one.

    It is your (and your brother's) responsibility to see that Mom gets adequate medical care.
    It is NOT your responsibility to let your Mom live in your basement.
    There are support groups for families dealing with mental illness of a family member.  Check with NAMI or your doctor for recommendations.

    I have a cousin who suffers from this.  Her condition has progressed to the point where she cannot be left alone.  Her two children's lives revolve around trying to get care for her.  Once her home is sold, she can qualify for medical aid, and they can place her in a safe environment.  Very sad.  She is my favorite cousin.  She has retreated into her delusional mind, now, and the person I loved is lost.
    httpiimgurcomTCCjW0wjpg
    OurWildKingdom
  • SP29 said:
    For now, I think you can bean dip her, but eventually you will get to a point where you will need to put your foot down and say NO.

    I am in a similar situation as you. I'll share- sorry, this is going to be long.

    DH's parents are divorced. His dad lives on his own on a large farm about 2 hours away; his dad is 74 this year. Still very active, farms his land for produce that he sells at farmers markets, and does this all by himself. FIL wants this year to be his last year farming for the market. FIL is similar to your mom in that we (DH, SIL, myself... most people) can only take him in small doses, but DH was raised with the European belief of taking care of your older family members.

    FIL has offered, a few times, to give DH and SIL half the farm each, with the idea we'd build our homes on the farm with him and live a big happy family. Both DH and SIL said no- they aren't interested in the farm (too far away from work for anyone).

    Well this winter he pulled a big guilt trip on DH and SIL telling them, "If neither of you want the farm, then I'm selling everything and moving back to Hungary (where he is from) where I can pay for someone to take care of me". Both DH and SIL were quite upset by this. I said let him go- he's an adult, but DH is worried as FIL is the youngest of his siblings and soon he won't have anyone and the money will be gone. Again- that feeling of responsibility for taking care of your parents.

    FIL also said, "well if you won't live here, I'll sell the farm, give you guys the money to buy a farm where you are and move in with you". Financially, it's not a bad plan- BUT anything with a nice enough house on some land close to the city is still $$$. I'm not against buying an acreage, but it made me resentful that FIL is trying to dictate where and how we will live; this farm would still be a large mortgage payment, so DH and I would need to work full time where as when we have kids, I want to go down to part time, and we would need FIL's money first for the down payment- we would be waiting on his timeline to buy something (we rent right now, and we'd like to buy next spring, maybe sooner if the perfect house came up).

    DH has since had a lot of perspective and has decided to call his dad's bluff. We have decided that we will find a house that WE like WHERE we like, but that will allow FIL the option to live with us, whether that is an acreage with space to put a permanent trailer on the land for him, or a house with an in-law suite.

    I'm leaning toward the house with the in-law suite. Fortunately DH also agrees that this in-law suite will be a completely separate unit and FIL will not have a key to our home. That is something I can live with.

    Anyway OP- I feel you. The sense of responsibility to take care of your parent, particularly when things are not so great for them, balanced against your own independence and the fact of, "I don't *really* want to live with you".

    You have to decide with what you are willing to live with, and not. An in-law suite with separate entrance (essentially a house with a separate rental unit), may be an option for you, if you're considering it. But ultimately you have to put yourself and your FH first. Would you want your mom babysitting your kids all the time?
    Damn, that is a lot of guilt-tripping and drama, I'm sorry. My mom does a lot of guilt tripping too. I wouldn't want her babysitting all the time, just occasionally of course, but then again I don't know what the childcare situation would be yet. I still wouldn't be ok with an in-law suite because she would constantly guilt-trip me to give her spare keys, wouldn't give us space, it would be a nightmare.

    CMGragain said:
    Schizophrenia is a physical disease which causes mental illness.  It can be treated with medication, but it cannot be cured.
    If your family does feel that your Mom is mentally ill, you must insist that she see a good psychiatrist for official diagnosis and treatment.  To avoid doing this is enabling, and you are shirking your responsibility as her offspring.  Her therapist can recommend one.

    It is your (and your brother's) responsibility to see that Mom gets adequate medical care.
    It is NOT your responsibility to let your Mom live in your basement.
    There are support groups for families dealing with mental illness of a family member.  Check with NAMI or your doctor for recommendations.

    I have a cousin who suffers from this.  Her condition has progressed to the point where she cannot be left alone.  Her two children's lives revolve around trying to get care for her.  Once her home is sold, she can qualify for medical aid, and they can place her in a safe environment.  Very sad.  She is my favorite cousin.  She has retreated into her delusional mind, now, and the person I loved is lost.
    Shoot, completely right. It's hard to convince her to do anything. My family has talked on our own that she should get help but haven't been motivated enough to tell her because we know she'd shut us down. But I know we need to try harder.
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
    SP29
  • I had a slightly similar-but-reversed situation with my MIL when H and I first moved in together (about a year before we got engaged). She definitely tried to push us into moving in with her and FIL and she clearly thought it was ridiculous we were spending money to live in an apartment in the same town they live in while we were both still in school and unmarried. 

    Honestly I handled it by looking at her like she'd grown two heads every time she brought it up to me and then having my H shut it down hard in a subsequent conversation with her. It didn't take long for it to be dropped and there were no lasting hard feelings- but that's just the type of person she is.

    The worst thing you can do is make your mom think you're in any way entertaining this idea of her moving in. Just be clear on that point and she should get it eventually.

    My bigger concern is- it sounds like this is an unstable and unpleasant person to be exposing your future children to. Are you really going to let her babysit them or even spend time with them at all if she's constantly badmouthing their grandfather to them? Because from the picture you paint here it seems that's unlikely to stop and I'd be wary about what even her role in my life was going to continue to be- much less if I was going to let her move in with me.
    banana468short+sassy
  • MCmeow said:
    SP29 said:
    For now, I think you can bean dip her, but eventually you will get to a point where you will need to put your foot down and say NO.

    I am in a similar situation as you. I'll share- sorry, this is going to be long.

    DH's parents are divorced. His dad lives on his own on a large farm about 2 hours away; his dad is 74 this year. Still very active, farms his land for produce that he sells at farmers markets, and does this all by himself. FIL wants this year to be his last year farming for the market. FIL is similar to your mom in that we (DH, SIL, myself... most people) can only take him in small doses, but DH was raised with the European belief of taking care of your older family members.

    FIL has offered, a few times, to give DH and SIL half the farm each, with the idea we'd build our homes on the farm with him and live a big happy family. Both DH and SIL said no- they aren't interested in the farm (too far away from work for anyone).

    Well this winter he pulled a big guilt trip on DH and SIL telling them, "If neither of you want the farm, then I'm selling everything and moving back to Hungary (where he is from) where I can pay for someone to take care of me". Both DH and SIL were quite upset by this. I said let him go- he's an adult, but DH is worried as FIL is the youngest of his siblings and soon he won't have anyone and the money will be gone. Again- that feeling of responsibility for taking care of your parents.

    FIL also said, "well if you won't live here, I'll sell the farm, give you guys the money to buy a farm where you are and move in with you". Financially, it's not a bad plan- BUT anything with a nice enough house on some land close to the city is still $$$. I'm not against buying an acreage, but it made me resentful that FIL is trying to dictate where and how we will live; this farm would still be a large mortgage payment, so DH and I would need to work full time where as when we have kids, I want to go down to part time, and we would need FIL's money first for the down payment- we would be waiting on his timeline to buy something (we rent right now, and we'd like to buy next spring, maybe sooner if the perfect house came up).

    DH has since had a lot of perspective and has decided to call his dad's bluff. We have decided that we will find a house that WE like WHERE we like, but that will allow FIL the option to live with us, whether that is an acreage with space to put a permanent trailer on the land for him, or a house with an in-law suite.

    I'm leaning toward the house with the in-law suite. Fortunately DH also agrees that this in-law suite will be a completely separate unit and FIL will not have a key to our home. That is something I can live with.

    Anyway OP- I feel you. The sense of responsibility to take care of your parent, particularly when things are not so great for them, balanced against your own independence and the fact of, "I don't *really* want to live with you".

    You have to decide with what you are willing to live with, and not. An in-law suite with separate entrance (essentially a house with a separate rental unit), may be an option for you, if you're considering it. But ultimately you have to put yourself and your FH first. Would you want your mom babysitting your kids all the time?
    Damn, that is a lot of guilt-tripping and drama, I'm sorry. My mom does a lot of guilt tripping too. I wouldn't want her babysitting all the time, just occasionally of course, but then again I don't know what the childcare situation would be yet. I still wouldn't be ok with an in-law suite because she would constantly guilt-trip me to give her spare keys, wouldn't give us space, it would be a nightmare.

    CMGragain said:
    Schizophrenia is a physical disease which causes mental illness.  It can be treated with medication, but it cannot be cured.
    If your family does feel that your Mom is mentally ill, you must insist that she see a good psychiatrist for official diagnosis and treatment.  To avoid doing this is enabling, and you are shirking your responsibility as her offspring.  Her therapist can recommend one.

    It is your (and your brother's) responsibility to see that Mom gets adequate medical care.
    It is NOT your responsibility to let your Mom live in your basement.
    There are support groups for families dealing with mental illness of a family member.  Check with NAMI or your doctor for recommendations.

    I have a cousin who suffers from this.  Her condition has progressed to the point where she cannot be left alone.  Her two children's lives revolve around trying to get care for her.  Once her home is sold, she can qualify for medical aid, and they can place her in a safe environment.  Very sad.  She is my favorite cousin.  She has retreated into her delusional mind, now, and the person I loved is lost.
    Shoot, completely right. It's hard to convince her to do anything. My family has talked on our own that she should get help but haven't been motivated enough to tell her because we know she'd shut us down. But I know we need to try harder.
    Telling your Mom to get psychiatric help will not work.  She will be in denial.  Talk to her therapist.  Start documenting any bizarre behavior.  You might have to take legal action.  My cousins children had to do this to protect her from herself and her delusions.
    Please, please telephone the therapist tomorrow and express your concern!  If Mom is mentally ill, as you have suggested, then she will not get better without medical help.

    httpiimgurcomTCCjW0wjpg
  • JediElizabethJediElizabeth member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its Third Anniversary First Answer
    edited March 2016
    CMGragain said:
    MCmeow said:
    SP29 said:
    For now, I think you can bean dip her, but eventually you will get to a point where you will need to put your foot down and say NO.

    I am in a similar situation as you. I'll share- sorry, this is going to be long.

    DH's parents are divorced. His dad lives on his own on a large farm about 2 hours away; his dad is 74 this year. Still very active, farms his land for produce that he sells at farmers markets, and does this all by himself. FIL wants this year to be his last year farming for the market. FIL is similar to your mom in that we (DH, SIL, myself... most people) can only take him in small doses, but DH was raised with the European belief of taking care of your older family members.

    FIL has offered, a few times, to give DH and SIL half the farm each, with the idea we'd build our homes on the farm with him and live a big happy family. Both DH and SIL said no- they aren't interested in the farm (too far away from work for anyone).

    Well this winter he pulled a big guilt trip on DH and SIL telling them, "If neither of you want the farm, then I'm selling everything and moving back to Hungary (where he is from) where I can pay for someone to take care of me". Both DH and SIL were quite upset by this. I said let him go- he's an adult, but DH is worried as FIL is the youngest of his siblings and soon he won't have anyone and the money will be gone. Again- that feeling of responsibility for taking care of your parents.

    FIL also said, "well if you won't live here, I'll sell the farm, give you guys the money to buy a farm where you are and move in with you". Financially, it's not a bad plan- BUT anything with a nice enough house on some land close to the city is still $$$. I'm not against buying an acreage, but it made me resentful that FIL is trying to dictate where and how we will live; this farm would still be a large mortgage payment, so DH and I would need to work full time where as when we have kids, I want to go down to part time, and we would need FIL's money first for the down payment- we would be waiting on his timeline to buy something (we rent right now, and we'd like to buy next spring, maybe sooner if the perfect house came up).

    DH has since had a lot of perspective and has decided to call his dad's bluff. We have decided that we will find a house that WE like WHERE we like, but that will allow FIL the option to live with us, whether that is an acreage with space to put a permanent trailer on the land for him, or a house with an in-law suite.

    I'm leaning toward the house with the in-law suite. Fortunately DH also agrees that this in-law suite will be a completely separate unit and FIL will not have a key to our home. That is something I can live with.

    Anyway OP- I feel you. The sense of responsibility to take care of your parent, particularly when things are not so great for them, balanced against your own independence and the fact of, "I don't *really* want to live with you".

    You have to decide with what you are willing to live with, and not. An in-law suite with separate entrance (essentially a house with a separate rental unit), may be an option for you, if you're considering it. But ultimately you have to put yourself and your FH first. Would you want your mom babysitting your kids all the time?
    Damn, that is a lot of guilt-tripping and drama, I'm sorry. My mom does a lot of guilt tripping too. I wouldn't want her babysitting all the time, just occasionally of course, but then again I don't know what the childcare situation would be yet. I still wouldn't be ok with an in-law suite because she would constantly guilt-trip me to give her spare keys, wouldn't give us space, it would be a nightmare.

    CMGragain said:
    Schizophrenia is a physical disease which causes mental illness.  It can be treated with medication, but it cannot be cured.
    If your family does feel that your Mom is mentally ill, you must insist that she see a good psychiatrist for official diagnosis and treatment.  To avoid doing this is enabling, and you are shirking your responsibility as her offspring.  Her therapist can recommend one.

    It is your (and your brother's) responsibility to see that Mom gets adequate medical care.
    It is NOT your responsibility to let your Mom live in your basement.
    There are support groups for families dealing with mental illness of a family member.  Check with NAMI or your doctor for recommendations.

    I have a cousin who suffers from this.  Her condition has progressed to the point where she cannot be left alone.  Her two children's lives revolve around trying to get care for her.  Once her home is sold, she can qualify for medical aid, and they can place her in a safe environment.  Very sad.  She is my favorite cousin.  She has retreated into her delusional mind, now, and the person I loved is lost.
    Shoot, completely right. It's hard to convince her to do anything. My family has talked on our own that she should get help but haven't been motivated enough to tell her because we know she'd shut us down. But I know we need to try harder.
    Telling your Mom to get psychiatric help will not work.  She will be in denial.  Talk to her therapist.  Start documenting any bizarre behavior.  You might have to take legal action.  My cousins children had to do this to protect her from herself and her delusions.
    Please, please telephone the therapist tomorrow and express your concern!  If Mom is mentally ill, as you have suggested, then she will not get better without medical help.

    I don't know offhand, but this doesn't sound like it would jive with HIPAA. I'm pretty sure that unless you have POA or a signed document giving them permission to speak to you, therapists are not even allowed to acknowledge that they have a specific client, never mind talk to them. They probably won't even listen to you, or a VM you may leave.

    Documentation may be a good idea in case there's future trouble, and you can call 911 if she's an immediate danger to herself, but adults can only very rarely be forced into psychiatric care without their consent. Even if she's taken into a hospital as an immediate danger to herself or others, they can only keep her for a set amount of time before she's discharged, unless they push her to commit herself (which some places may do). 

    EDIT: I'm not an expert, just a bit knowledgeable. Do your research, and possibly consult with an attorney if you feel the need to.
    CMGragainSP29
  • Maybe this is being blown out of proportion a bit. She's not actually a danger to herself or others, it's more that she becomes unpleasant to be around because of the things she says, and she says some delusional things. Maybe the worst she's ever done is steal keys to my dad's apartment to steal photos (Yeah I know that sounds bad typed out). Her visits are nice, it just becomes bad when living with her or being around her too long. But isn't an attorney a bit much?
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  • MCmeow said:
    Maybe this is being blown out of proportion a bit. She's not actually a danger to herself or others, it's more that she becomes unpleasant to be around because of the things she says, and she says some delusional things. Maybe the worst she's ever done is steal keys to my dad's apartment to steal photos (Yeah I know that sounds bad typed out). Her visits are nice, it just becomes bad when living with her or being around her too long. But isn't an attorney a bit much?
    I agree. We have some crazies in our family, but we leave them to themselves most of the time because it's how they're accustomed to living, and they're no danger to anyone. But it's good to CYA when you're bordering on giving legal advice in an online forum - that was why I added the edit. ;)
  • CMGragainCMGragain member
    10000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary 25 Answers
    edited March 2016
    MCmeow said:
    Maybe this is being blown out of proportion a bit. She's not actually a danger to herself or others, it's more that she becomes unpleasant to be around because of the things she says, and she says some delusional things. Maybe the worst she's ever done is steal keys to my dad's apartment to steal photos (Yeah I know that sounds bad typed out). Her visits are nice, it just becomes bad when living with her or being around her too long. But isn't an attorney a bit much?
    OP, you are the one who said she was possibly a paranoid schizophrenic.  That is a serious condition.
    Mental illness gallops in my family.  My dear cousin said delusional things for years.  One day she disappeared.  She was found on a dirt road in the middle of the night, 200 miles from home, out of gas and completely delusional.  The police called her son to come and get his mother.  This was after a number of years of fantasies about people at work who, she claimed, were trying to kill her.  It took years for it to get this bad, but thank heavens, she wasn't hurt.
    The courts awarded custody to her daughter.  She now tells me that her daughter is stealing her money and keeping her prisoner.  I am so sad for my cousin, and for her two kids, who are doing the best they can for their Mom.
    No, an attorney is not too much.  Suppose they had found my cousin dead on the road?  This is for your mother's protection, if it is needed, and only a professional can determine this.
    While your Mother's therapist might not be able to give you any information, he/she can listen to you and your concerns.
    http://schizophrenia.com/diag.php#

    PS.  Ask yourself how you would feel if your Mom needed help, and you didn't act until it was too late.
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  • not going to quote, but I agree with some previous posters. My H and SIL had to deal with this. MIL had some schizophrenic issues that compounded when she lived alone. I believe they were able to get a guardianship (not a POA). They had documented behavior about her, and she did get help first at the hospital and then the state helped get her into assisted living.
  • emmaaaemmaaa North Carolina mod
    Moderator 2500 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary
    My mom and MIL both have said at one point or the other that they need a MIL sweet at either mine and DH's or my brother and SIL's houses. I just laugh it off for now. Honestly, she can't move into your house unless y'all LET her move in with you. Maybe help her find an affordable place instead. I know you said that living in NYC that is difficult but that may be your only option.

  • OP, it sounds like you are trying to be delicate because of your newfound friendship with your mom. I can understand that but I really think STARMOON's direct approach is best. She needs to start getting it into her head now that this vision of her's isn't going to happen.

    In this case, I think bean dipping is just kicking the can down the road.

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  • Jen4948Jen4948 Houston member
    10000 Comments Sixth Anniversary 500 Love Its 25 Answers
    There aren't many times when "Just say no" is good advice, but I think it's your best course of action.

    Mom: "I'm moving in with you."
    You and FI together: "No, you're not moving in with us."
    Mom: "I'm going to show up on your doorstep."
    You and FI together: "No, you're not moving in with us."
    Mom: "You won't throw me out."
    You and FI together: "No, you're not moving in with us."

    I used to live in NYC and I totally get that it's hard to find affordable housing there.  But get her to sign up for it on NYC Housing Connect.  You do not have to let her move in with you.


    MCmeowcharlotte989875
  • I mean, I only said a little paranoid schizo just to give an idea on her behavior, it was only theories and speculation made when hanging out with cousins who have psychology degrees and are aspiring psychologists. I know we need to figure things out with her more and talk to her therapist but she gets defensive easily if we tell her there's anything wrong with her. She's not a physical danger at all. She just has a behavioral issue and that's really the extent. The concern is more where these behaviors come from. But I will take the advice to just say No with the housing thing, or let future me deal with it, ha. She brought it up over the weekend so I thought I'd ask some strangers :p 
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  • SP29SP29 member
    Sixth Anniversary 2500 Comments 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    edited March 2016
    Also- isn't her therapist, while maybe not a psychiatrist, required to take action if red flags present? It's not like OP's mom is sitting holed up in her apartment alone, she IS seeing someone and getting some form of treatment.

    Beyond calling the police to get her mother formed, there is not much the OP can do beyond support and encourage, since at this time, her mother is still an adult with capacity.
  • About the guilt tripping, perhaps you have a point, but I read that the OP is more concerned about hurting her mother's feelings than about getting needed medical attention.
    httpiimgurcomTCCjW0wjpg
  • I admit I don't know as much as I should about mental illness, and I'll try to learn more about it, so I'll try not to throw the word around casually anymore, (as someone with epilepsy, a neurological disorder, I should know how serious these labels are and learn more about other disorders) but yes I am more worried about her feelings at this point because in her case she is not a physical danger to herself or anyone, it's all just delusional talk. But for her own future happiness I will try to make contact with her therapist in the future. I just don't think police should be involved at all.
    Anyway, thanks all for the concern and advice! I promise to watch out for her and make sure she gets help, and to set our own boundaries!
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  • Thanks for clearing up some of the terminology OP- I also don't know that much about schizophrenia so when I saw you use that phrase I thought the situation was a little more dire (is there such a thing as a mild case of paranoid schizophrenia?). From your clarifications it seems like she's maybe more garden-variety wacky and difficult. 

    But my question stands- do you anticipate her animosity towards your father being a problem if and when you have children? That would be my big concern.
    CMGragain
  • Thanks for clearing up some of the terminology OP- I also don't know that much about schizophrenia so when I saw you use that phrase I thought the situation was a little more dire (is there such a thing as a mild case of paranoid schizophrenia?). From your clarifications it seems like she's maybe more garden-variety wacky and difficult. 

    But my question stands- do you anticipate her animosity towards your father being a problem if and when you have children? That would be my big concern.
    Oh yeah, that's definitely a problem I worry about. I imagine when we have kids, her being jealous whenever he visits them or takes care of them, she would take count of who sees the grandkids more and think we're picking favorites. Because I know and she knows that he would make grandpa of the year, but she likes to turn people, including her own kids, against him because of her personal feelings. And her "diagnosis" which were just observations, I know we should look more into, she is in no way dangerous, so they probably had the wrong conclusions and I shouldn't have taken them seriously, maybe she needs more time in therapy before we see a difference.
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