MOH is off the grid

HandBanana

I repeat.  She has disappeared.  It isn't a life issue or problem but she simply refuses to respond to communication.  She missed the b party last night (glad for that) and has pushed it to the point where my father wants to call her. She is crazy beyond repair and selfish beyond belief.  She owes my mom a little bit of money and deleted the evite for the b party friday.  Without going into a long drama of the history of how horribly difficult she has been (i have postesd about it in my month board), I can safely say I have done nothing to merit this vindictive behavior.

Can I send her a certified letter just saying "You are free from any obligation to me on April 30th."?  I'm not sending it to be dramatic but I'm literally worried she will show up and do something even more vindictive and I do not think there is any other way to be sure she receives the message.  I know it a no no to ex a WP member but I do not see any other way and I'm just looking for how to where to what to do with this.

Still so mad at myself for picking her over my best friend because I just thought since the best friend has a far busier life it would be easier.  So wrong.  Lesson learned.

marinabreeze

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:16516b8a-d1b0-44c0-9134-b8904430e7fb">MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]I repeat.  She has disappeared.  It isn't a life issue or problem but she simply refuses to respond to communication.  She missed the b party last night (glad for that) and has pushed it to the point where my father wants to call her. She is crazy beyond repair and selfish beyond belief.  She owes my mom a little bit of money and deleted the evite for the b party friday.  Without going into a long drama of the history of how horribly difficult she has been (i have postesd about it in my month board), I can safely say I have done nothing to merit this vindictive behavior. Can I send her a certified letter just saying "You are free from any obligation to me on April 30th."?  I'm not sending it to be dramatic but I'm literally worried she will show up and do something even more vindictive and I do not think there is any other way to be sure she receives the message.  I know it a no no to ex a WP member but I do not see any other way and I'm just looking for how to where to what to do with this. Still so mad at myself for picking her over my best friend because I just thought since the best friend has a far busier life it would be easier.  So wrong.  Lesson learned.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]
I don't know if this post will be received the way you like, just giving you a heads-up.

Snippylynn

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:16516b8a-d1b0-44c0-9134-b8904430e7fb">MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]I repeat.  She has disappeared.  It isn't a life issue or problem but she simply refuses to respond to communication.  She missed the b party last night (glad for that) and has pushed it to the point where my father wants to call her. She is crazy beyond repair and selfish beyond belief.  She owes my mom a little bit of money and deleted the evite for the b party friday.  Without going into a long drama of the history of how horribly difficult she has been (i have postesd about it in my month board), I can safely say I have done nothing to merit this vindictive behavior. Can I send her a certified letter just saying "You are free from any obligation to me on April 30th."?  I'm not sending it to be dramatic but I'm literally worried she will show up and do something even more vindictive and I do not think there is any other way to be sure she receives the message.  I know it a no no to ex a WP member but I do not see any other way and I'm just looking for how to where to what to do with this. Still so mad at myself for picking her over my best friend because I just thought since the best friend has a far busier life it would be easier.  So wrong.  Lesson learned.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

So uh, the way you've written this seems snotty, self-serving and completely obnoxious.  I'm guessing you've done nothing but chat at her about the wedding for months or you've pushed and pushed her.

This may be completely not the case, but the whole attitude that's coming across in your post is literally disgusting.

mica178

I think I'm missing some back story that can help explain what's going on.

People get busy and forget to communicate with others what's going on in their lives.  Is there a reason other than general annoyance that you don't want her to be your MOH?  I mean, if she recently swindled the FOG of his money or had sex with a married groomsman (and his wife is also in the WP), I can see why you'd want her to skip her MOH duties.  But if she's just been MIA and poorly communicative, I'd just suck it up and allow her to stand up front with you when you take your vows.

[Deleted User]

I think sending a letter at this point is a bit over the top. Besides, don't you have better things to worry about with only a week to go?

I would just things ride. I do believe there is something you aren't telling us here, but that is beside the point this close to the wedding. If she shows up, fine. If she doesn't, fine. It sounds like you have other BM's that will stand beside you. A MOH is not required.

vicki0508

You sound kind of intense.  You want to send your friend a certified letter "releasing her from her obligations?"  Her obligation to come to your wedding?  If you don't want her there, call her up and say so, or send her a regular letter.  It's not like this is a legal predicament that would warrant a certified letter. 

If you kick her out of your wedding, you need to reimburse her for the dress and any other wedding related expenses she has incurred, regardless of the fact that she owes your mom some money.

HandBanana

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:73afd014-d017-4259-b526-a7b6289c8092">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to MOH is off the grid : So uh, the way you've written this seems snotty, self-serving and completely obnoxious.  I'm guessing you've done nothing but chat at her about the wedding for months or you've pushed and pushed her. This may be completely not the case, but the whole attitude that's coming across in your post is literally disgusting.
Posted by Snippylynn[/QUOTE]


Actually no.  She got engaged in December and I have gone dress shopping with her for her dress, talked to her about her house shopping, house buying, furniture, driven out to see her new house, admire her new furniture, etc.  I have constantly been asking her about her wedding and the venue she picked out.  I understand that this is the internet and there is going to be attitude in my post but I have not talked to her much about my wedding.  The extent of her responsibility has been asking her to show up to the shower and the wedding.  She didn't plan the bachelorette party and then threw it in my face that she was hurt that the BM had planned it.  The BM planned the b party after the MOH did not respond to 2 weeks of phone calls, texts, emails.

I'm trying not to go into it too much because I pretty much cried my eyes out after the b party last night realizing just how little MOH cared about my friendship with her and how dumb I had been and I had hurt my BM so badly when I picked the other one as the MOH.

marinabreeze

How do you know she's doing just fine?

As far as the meat of your post is concerned, all she has to do to fulfill her "duties" are to get the dress, show up to the wedding and participate.  Everything else is not required nor should it be expected.  And for other brides who read this...this is why you choose your MOH or BM based on who is close to you rather than who you assume will help you out the most.

Now back to you, HandBanana. if there are issues in terms of your friendship that are NOT wedding-related, that's separate, and it's hard to know where to go with this since you haven't explained on this board how she is "vindictive."  But I will say this - not everything should revolve around the wedding and too many brides seem to frame interpersonal issues in the context of the wedding when that's really not appropriate.  Please make sure you're not using the wedding as a yardstick for how much of a "friend" she is being.

If you want to end the friendship, end the friendship.  But you can't kick her out of the wedding without ending the friendship AND making yourself look like the bad guy.

ETA: you posted while I was replying, so one more thing.  I don't think you should've been in the middle of the situation between the MOH and BM.  They're adults, they should've resolved the issue between themselves.  Prewedding parties are not a requirement for a MOH or BM to plan or attend, if people can't make it, they can't make it.  It doesn't make them a crappy friend.

mica178

While I agree that the MOH should attend the bachelorette party, I don't think being a no-show is an offense so bad that you should throw her out of the WP.

Snippylynn

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:53d4dc33-585c-4f16-802f-48a0db451f6d">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]Now back to you, HandBanana. if there are issues in terms of your friendship that are NOT wedding-related, that's separate, and it's hard to know where to go with this since you haven't explained on this board how she is "vindictive."  But I will say this - not everything should revolve around the wedding and too many brides seem to frame interpersonal issues in the context of the wedding when that's really not appropriate.  Please make sure you're not using the wedding as a yardstick for how much of a "friend" she is being. If you want to end the friendship, end the friendship.  But you can't kick her out of the wedding without ending the friendship AND making yourself look like the bad guy.
Posted by marinabreeze[/QUOTE]
Excellent way to frame this Marina.

HandBanana

I'm planning on ending the friendship.  As far as responsibilities, I am well aware that her only responsibility is the dress and the showing up at the wedding.  It isn't that she didn't come to the b party, it is the way everything has happened, the way she has treated my mom.

I don't know she is fine.  I do know that I have seen her do this to other people before and at the time when it was going down I never had the whole story. It was always how "crazy" they were and how they just won't leave her alone.

Again, lesson learned.

Snippylynn

So, you picked her because you thought she would do a lot for you or what?  I don't get it.

vicki0508

So if you were already confident in your decision, what was the point in posting this? 

HandBanana

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:c36bd09c-9f16-434f-9d46-99f69cc53746">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]So, you picked her because you thought she would do a lot for you or what?  I don't get it.
Posted by Snippylynn[/QUOTE]


I'm not sure how you got that out of what I posted but sure.

And I posted in here because it is possible someone could have had a similar situation.

regan117

This isn't meant to start a fight - I'd never give a WP member the boot. I am just genuinely curious.

The common response around here whenever anyone asks about kicking out a WP member is "she shows up, she's in...if she doesn't, she's not", which I get. But my question is - am I the only one who thinks about the money involved in a WP member who just no-shows???

For instance, I am paying for hair and makeup for my bridesmaids, which is all pre-paid and I had to sign a contract - $45 for makeup and $55 for hair. So I have to pay for it whether the girl uses it or not. My bridesmaid bouquets were $65 each. And my reception is $85 a head. I also gave all my bridesmaids a plus one. Their WP gifts were $50 each. If she no-showed on the day of the wedding, it would obviously be too late to change flowers or head counts. So if one of my bridesmaids dropped out, and I didn't know ahead of time she wasn't going to show, I would be out $385 for one bridesmaid.

I don't know...I don't think I'd be willing to leave that to chance! I'm not at all condoning kicking someone out, but I wonder if anyone who answers the question that way has ever thought about the expense?

HandBanana

That is why I'm kind of looking for a "been there done that" cause I know it a no no.  Repeating that to me does nothing.  I'm not being purposely obtuse but I'm trying to avoid a train wreck on our wedding.

The cost isn't even the biggest thing to me because money is money.  I don't even want her name in the program and I realize that is vindictive.

regan117

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:e7654fbb-b46a-4f77-a981-8a8490a1ffdb">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]The cost isn't even the biggest thing to me because money is money.  I don't even want her name in the program and I realize that is vindictive.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

No, I know. That was my thing. It just made me think. You didn't say anything about cost. Sorry I hijacked your post.

HandBanana

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:f792d151-c04e-4886-8518-358f719fe196">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: MOH is off the grid : No, I know. That was my thing. It just made me think. You didn't say anything about cost. Sorry I hijacked your post.
Posted by regan117[/QUOTE]


No you are right.  Even down to the fact we have a head table and I was seating her fiance with people he has met and knows which pushes one of FH friends from his all friends table.  Just little things like that.

em01092

Regan, the BM would likely also be out as well, if she paid for her own dress and any accessories, travel expenses, time off work, etc.

Edit: But I agree that I would not want to leave it up to chance, especially if I was doing all of that for the BMs. 

regan117

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:3536bcaa-8c42-48a2-b8da-6b910db7c634">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]Regan, the BM would likely also be out as well, if she paid for her own dress and any accessories, travel expenses, time off work, etc.
Posted by em01092[/QUOTE]

I get that...but if <strong>she</strong> was the one dropping out, the lost money would be her own fault. And if she lived locally (all my bridesmaids are local) and hadn't gotten a dress yet, then she wouldn't be out anything... I don't know. I wouldn't kick someone out, but I wouldn't want to leave an expense like that to chance. $385 is a lot of money - and if she dropped out, why should the bride be financially punished?

I guess I can just see both sides. In my personal situation, with the cost, I'd want to know if there was a remote chance she wasn't going to show up. That being said, I have no reservations about my girls.

em01092

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:96e7fddc-eed9-492f-a2eb-d3775aa4c07a">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: MOH is off the grid :I wouldn't kick someone out, but I wouldn't want to leave an expense like that to chance. $385 is a lot of money.
Posted by regan117[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>Definitely. I wouldn't either! 

</div>

regan117

Yep. Just a hypothetical! I'm not kicking anyone out. My bridesmaids are awesome.

Snippylynn

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:bb357f54-90db-48ea-a965-2461c823d850">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]This isn't meant to start a fight - I'd never give a WP member the boot. I am just genuinely curious. The common response around here whenever anyone asks about kicking out a WP member is "she shows up, she's in...if she doesn't, she's not", which I get. But my question is - am I the only one who thinks about the money involved in a WP member who just no-shows??? For instance, I am paying for hair and makeup for my bridesmaids, which is all pre-paid and I had to sign a contract - $45 for makeup and $55 for hair. So I have to pay for it whether the girl uses it or not. My bridesmaid bouquets were $65 each. And my reception is $85 a head. I also gave all my bridesmaids a plus one. Their WP gifts were $50 each. If she no-showed on the day of the wedding, it would obviously be too late to change flowers or head counts. So if one of my bridesmaids dropped out, and I didn't know ahead of time she wasn't going to show, I would be out $385 for one bridesmaid. I don't know...I don't think I'd be willing to leave that to chance! I'm not at all condoning kicking someone out, but I wonder if anyone who answers the question that was has ever thought about the expense?
Posted by regan117[/QUOTE]

At the end of the day, only YOU know how far you're willing to go.  If you are confident in not being friends with her past this moment, then hey... do what you want.  But don't think that it makes you (random you) a better person for it.

crfische

I kicked out an MOH once. Because she slept with my fiance.

I TOTALLY get what you're going through.

Only, I don't.

I think if you want people to see this from your perspective, you're going to have to elaborate about all of these horrible things she has done.

Otherwise, you kind of sound like the ass here.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown

I need more details. How does one get from MIA to vindictive, unless there is back story you're not communicating. (I would assume details of vindictive behavior would have been covered in the OP, and since they weren't, I think you're overreacting.)

Snippylynn

And man do I really hate when there's no one around but beebee's who put money potentially lost over and above an actual person.

No one will ever say that it isn't tough, it isn't difficult, frustrating, angering, etc etc.  But damn yo's.  Do you know how many people will RSVP yes and not show?  You'll have some- promise. Are you going to go back to those people and say "You cost me $400.  Send me a check or we're not friends/relatives/coworkers anymore."  No, I'm sure you don't. 

Snippylynn

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:51418188-1fb7-4df5-b730-a58cb3cb6049">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]I kicked out an MOH once. Because she slept with my fiance. I TOTALLY get what you're going through. Only, I don't. I think if you want people to see this from your perspective, you're going to have to elaborate about all of these horrible things she has done. Otherwise, you kind of sound like the ass here.
Posted by crfische[/QUOTE]

Thank GOD.  For a moment, I felt like I was on a fucking month board here!!

marinabreeze

HandBanana, I think Snippy got the idea that you picked your MOH based on what she could do for you from my own statement saying the same.  I came to that conclusion because of this in your OP:

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:16516b8a-d1b0-44c0-9134-b8904430e7fb">MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]Still so mad at myself for picking her over my best friend because I just thought since the best friend has a far busier life it would be easier.  So wrong.  Lesson learned.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]
If i misinterpreted this, I'm sorry.  But could you explain this a little more?

Also, one other thing,

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:e7654fbb-b46a-4f77-a981-8a8490a1ffdb">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]That is why I'm kind of looking for a "been there done that" cause I know it a no no.  Repeating that to me does nothing.  I'm not being purposely obtuse but<strong> I'm trying to avoid a train wreck on our wedding</strong>. The cost isn't even the biggest thing to me because money is money.  I don't even want her name in the program and I realize that is vindictive.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]
I still fail to understand what specifically you're afraid will happen to where she'll try to ruin your wedding.  Bowing out of a prewedding party, getting butthurt over b-party planning, or even failing to pay your mom back (which I agree is really shiitty of her) isn't the same as no-showing or causing a huge scene at your wedding.  Please help me understand because this is what I'm not getting, and that's why I'm kind of wondering if you're conflating "wedding" with "friendship."

crfische

I could feel you struggling, buddy.

Wah wah wah, gimme a reason why this person is so horrible.

99.9% of my friendships are worth more than 385 dollars. Who calculates how much a bridesmaid costs you anyway. THESE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE YOUR BEST FRIENDS, and you're worried that you'll have an extra flower bouquet to pay for?

What in the sam hell.

regan117

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_moh-off-grid?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:066cb0da-511c-4328-bd0a-7796ce7b74bePost:49d90084-1ea1-4f4d-a214-ad23edb302bc">Re: MOH is off the grid</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: MOH is off the grid : At the end of the day, only YOU know how far you're willing to go.  If you are confident in not being friends with her past this moment, then hey... do what you want.  But don't think that it makes you (random you) a better person for it.
Posted by Snippylynn[/QUOTE]

Good point. I guess it just varies from person to person, and depends on the level of friendship, budget, cost of the wedding, etc. Like, I know my own personal cost wouldn't necessarily be someone else's. And I do agree, it is unforgivable to kick out a WP member.

But you know your friends well (well, at least you <strong>should</strong> if they're your bridesmaids)...and usually you can tell if something is wrong or if they're not "into" being in the wedding. I'd just hate to think that if I had a feeling about someone, that I would follow the advice here and keep her around, and then be out all that money (and a friend) come my wedding day. Because honestly, I think if my best friend agreed to be my bridesmaids and then just didn't show up on my wedding day and it wasn't because of an emergency - we probably wouldn't be friends anymore. Deserting a bride on the day is just as bad, and friendship-ending, as kicking someone out of your wedding.

I actually had a bridesmaid drop out 3 months ago, for financial/personal reasons. And thankfully she came to me about it, and we're still friends and she is coming as a guest. But if she had known she didn't want to be in the wedding and couldn't afford it, didn't tell me, and then didn't show...we probably wouldn't be friends.

crfische

So...you base your friendships on how people participate in your wedding?

I would gather that if one of your bridesmaids just DIDNT show up on the wedding day, that you probably weren't very good friends to begin with, and if you get burned that badly and you couldn't pick up on that maybe your friend was struggling? Well then... I don't know what to tell ya.

But I would think I would have to be pretty self-absorbed to not be able to pick up if a friend of mine was having a hard time. Especially someone who I had asked to be a bridesmaid.