Hairy Bridesmaid

kefryar

So I have a slight delimma.

I have a bridesmaid who does not shave her armpits or her legs, nor does she wear deoderant. There is no religious or belief behind this-she just doesn't. I can deal with the legs and the no deoderant, but she has picked out her dress, and it is sleevless (i'm letting them all pick their own different dress), and I'm worried that you will be able to see it in pictures. By hair, I do not mean stubble. I mean a full on bush under her arms. She has dark hair.

I was not aware of this change in her habit until after I had asked her to be in my wedding, and It was a shock when I saw this. My question is; do I have the right to ask her to shave? I would never ask anyone to cover up a tattoo, take out a pericing, lose weight, or change in any other way. I know it is my gender stereotypes talking right now, but I find it gross. So does my fiance, and some of my bridesmaids have mentioned it as well.

Should I bring this up to her? If I do and she says no, then what? I can't force her. Should I just drop the whole thing and have the photographer photoshop the photos if it makes an appearance?

Opinions?

bunni727

kefryar said:

So I have a slight delimma.

I have a bridesmaid who does not shave her armpits or her legs, nor does she wear deoderant. There is no religious or belief behind this-she just doesn't. I can deal with the legs and the no deoderant, but she has picked out her dress, and it is sleevless (i'm letting them all pick their own different dress), and I'm worried that you will be able to see it in pictures. By hair, I do not mean stubble. I mean a full on bush under her arms. She has dark hair.

I was not aware of this change in her habit until after I had asked her to be in my wedding, and It was a shock when I saw this. My question is; do I have the right to ask her to shave? I would never ask anyone to cover up a tattoo, take out a pericing, lose weight, or change in any other way. I know it is my gender stereotypes talking right now, but I find it gross. So does my fiance, and some of my bridesmaids have mentioned it as well.

Should I bring this up to her? If I do and she says no, then what? I can't force her. Should I just drop the whole thing and have the photographer photoshop the photos if it makes an appearance?

Opinions?

No you do not have a right to ask her to shave. What a mean thing to do.

I would be so hurt if someone who I thought was my friend asked me to alter my appearance because they thought I was gross.

kefryar

It's more of an aesthetic thing than an "ew you're gross" thing. I don't want it coming out in pictures. But I guess that's what photoshop is for.

kefryar

I like the idea of letting the photographer know ahead of time, that way I guess a posing problem can be avoided. No mind changes, it is what It is, I guess. As I said, this is a recent development of "freedom" I guess, and I don't see her changing her mind anytime soon.I live in NC, so it's already pretty warm here-that is how I noticed in the first place.

bunni727

Just be warned that if she sees those pictures and you have photoshopped her appearance, you could really hurt her. Whether you think she looks gross or is gross is of no consequence; it's rotten to be so concerned with appearances that you would hurt someone that calls you a friend.

If you care more about aesthetics than your friend, go for it.

kefryar

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

bunni727

I want to look at happy friends. I don't care what they look like. They are my friends, and even if they were oozing pus out of every hairy orifice I would want pictures of them exactly how they are.

I'm not saying she would get offended; I'm saying it's very possible she would be hurt. You are paying someone to alter her physical appearance without her knowledge. That can't be easy to take.

It's not about how attached to armpit hair she is, it's about how attached to a superficial vision you are.

daria24

There are 800+ photos from my photographer. Not A. Single. One. has an exposed armpit in it, hairy or otherwise. We didn't have a bouquet toss, do the cliched "everybody jump in the air at the same time" photo, nor did we play 'Shout' so the most-armpitty instances did not occur at our wedding. I really think you are stressing out about it for no reason. 

jess1669

Bunni727, I think you're in the minority in this one. Kefryar is not being superficial. If she was photoshopping her friend who was a size 12 to a size 2, then that would be superficial. Photoshopping out armpit hair is not.

Kefryar, you know your friend and how she is. If you think you can ask her to shave and she won't get mad, then go for it. It's armpit hair, it can always grow back, it doesn't take that long. Or if you don't want to ask her then bring it up to her anyway and let her know what's going to happen by saying, "I'm not going to ask you to shave because if this is what you want, then this is what you want. I just want to let you know that if need be, the photographer will photoshop your armpit hair so it doesn't show. Or just don't say anything at all. You are the only one who can make the judgement on what to do and how she will take it. Just remember to be nice about it and not mean. Good luck!

 

kefryar

StageManager14 said:

kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

1.  As someone who has already HAD her wedding, I can tell you that photos matter soooooooo much less to you a year afterward than you ever imagined they would before.  And the photos of your friends will be cherished in the same way any other photos of friends are cherished.  The photos that make you "remember your wedding day" will be photos of you and your husband.  And even those won't be something you look at constantly like you think you will now.

2. So, if your friend had a "gross" mole or birthmark on her face, would you photo shop that out too?  

That was what I was making a point to say, it is a choice, not a physical issue.  If someone wanted to photoshop my half sleeve of tattoos off, fine. They were a choice I made that are not normative, so I get it.
I am not offended by photoshop, period, but I can see getting offended if I wanted to photoshop a scar or birthmark out. However, is your body hair really something that makes you who you are? Is it a part of you?  Unless it is a religious thing, I do not see why anyone would be offended by my coice to make sure this doesn't show, if I even need to go that far. As daria said, the need for photoshopping hairy armpits probably won't even come up.

bunni727

How is armpit hair not superficial? It is on the surface. Just like size or tattoos or wonky eyebrows. 

The reminder to be nice is a good one, but I can't come up with any situation where telling your friend you intend to photoshop her because you think she looks disgusting is nice.

MissMolly

Absolutely, but coming from a graphic designer's point of view: photoshopping costs extra money, depending on how much of it there is to do. And sometimes, it's not easy to do (which is why it costs). Hell, there was once time I was photoshopping a bunch of old photos for a friend's Mom, and she wanted me to remove the groom from the photo (the couple had gotten a divorce since the photo was taken). I had to rebuild the bride's veil, which took a couple hours. I did all of her 84 photos for a flat fee, but if I were to charge by the hour, it would've cost her much, much more.

Not trying to scare you, but just want to give you fair warning that this service will be an extra charge from your photographers.

kefryar said:

It's more of an aesthetic thing than an "ew you're gross" thing. I don't want it coming out in pictures. But I guess that's what photoshop is for.

kefryar

jess1669 said:

Bunni727, I think you're in the minority in this one. Kefryar is not being superficial. If she was photoshopping her friend who was a size 12 to a size 2, then that would be superficial. Photoshopping out armpit hair is not.

Kefryar, you know your friend and how she is. If you think you can ask her to shave and she won't get mad, then go for it. It's armpit hair, it can always grow back, it doesn't take that long. Or if you don't want to ask her then bring it up to her anyway and let her know what's going to happen by saying, "I'm not going to ask you to shave because if this is what you want, then this is what you want. I just want to let you know that if need be, the photographer will photoshop your armpit hair so it doesn't show. Or just don't say anything at all. You are the only one who can make the judgement on what to do and how she will take it. Just remember to be nice about it and not mean. Good luck!

 

She is stubborn, so chances are that If I asked her she wouldn't do it anyway, so it's pointless in all respects. The only reason the point of asking her even came up was because both my FI and all 5 of my bridesmaids are grossed out it and have all expressed concern over the photos. You make a good point that I don't even need to tell anyone but the photog that i'm doing it, chances are she won't even notice.
I can be and AM really blunt with her, just as she is with me, so it probably won't turn into an issue. Just wanted to know how people felt about this. I still don't agree that I'm being superficial, however. Like it or not, it is a societal norm and expected, at least here in the southern US, and it's one that I conform to.

tammym1001

Is it possible this could end up being a non-issue? I have a family member who has a mustache. She doesn't really care and doesn't do anything with it, but when there's a special occassion she gets it waxed. You said your friend isn't doing this for any kind of religion or belief so is it possible she's going to shave for your wedding since it's a special occassion?

kefryar

tammym1001 said:

Is it possible this could end up being a non-issue? I have a family member who has a mustache. She doesn't really care and doesn't do anything with it, but when there's a special occassion she gets it waxed. You said your friend isn't doing this for any kind of religion or belief so is it possible she's going to shave for your wedding since it's a special occassion?

no chance whatsoever. she has no social awareness.

MissMolly

I'm siding with the bride on this one. I'm sorry, but not shaving is a little grim, and not wearing antiperspirant is even grimmer. I get that what she's doing is a "freedom" thing, but methinks she doesn't quite realize how smelly she will be. On the other hand, I also get that you have to accept friends for who they are, but you don't have to agree with all their choices.

As for photoshopping your wedding pics if her pit-bushes show, I would do the same thing. It's not like you're asking her to change herself, but I'm with you, kefryar, in that I wouldn't want to see that in my wedding pictures either. If you hang one on your wall, and other people see it, that may well be the first thing they see and focus on. I could be wrong though.

As for how attached she is to her pit hair, well, pretty attached, literally and figuratively!


kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

bunni727

The only polite thing to do is to ask the photographer not to take any pictures in which armpits would be highlighted.

Even if you did talk to your BM, you've already said she is stubborn. You won't accomplish anything other than risking hurting her feeling or making yourself look controlling. It really isn't worth it.

jess1669

It's also the etiquette of being in the bridal party. I think she could shave her armpits and legs for that matter. It will grow back if she's really into that. It's not like you're asking her to cut off 12 inches of her hair to get a pixie cut for the wedding. THAT'S being superficial. Plus, what about dancing?? She's going to have those arms up for all your guests to see when dancing.

daria24

jess1669 said:

It's also the etiquette of being in the bridal party. I think she could shave her armpits and legs for that matter. It will grow back if she's really into that. It's not like you're asking her to cut off 12 inches of her hair to get a pixie cut for the wedding. THAT'S being superficial. Plus, what about dancing?? She's going to have those arms up for all your guests to see when dancing.

Um...how exactly is it against etiquette to not shave your armpits or leg hair? It's a personal choice. Yeah I'm not going au natural, but I don't hand my friends a Venus and tell them to lather up or sit in the audience like a commoner. 

Bubblegum5586

When people go against "the norm" like NOT shaving your armpits.... then they have to deal with the fact that not everyone is going to be comfortable with that! Like when Crazy tattoed and pierced people go "what are you looking at?"...... "I am looking at you!!! you decided to step out of "the norm" so yea I notice it!"

I am 100% for being your own person however that is.... but society will not tip toe around the decisions you make, be ready for comments.

OP, you know your friend best... only you can make the right decision. But I don't think you sound superficial and understand your side on this!!!

jess1669

It's etiquette because she is standing up in her friend's wedding and in front of the bride and groom's friends and family. This is the bride's day. Not her's and if she wants to do that at her own wedding, by all means. But I'm sure she knows that the bride does not like this idea of armpit hair so she should have the courtesy to shave it off until after the wedding.

QueerFemme

kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

It does make you a bad friend. It would be the same as photoshopping a chubby bridesmaid to make her look skinnier because you think your photos would look better. You are trying to change your friend, instead of just accepting her for who she is.

QueerFemme

jess1669 said:

It's also the etiquette of being in the bridal party. I think she could shave her armpits and legs for that matter. It will grow back if she's really into that. It's not like you're asking her to cut off 12 inches of her hair to get a pixie cut for the wedding. THAT'S being superficial. Plus, what about dancing?? She's going to have those arms up for all your guests to see when dancing.

it's HER body, and HER armpit hair. She doesn't shave for whatever her own reasons are, and that isn't the bride's business or anyone elses.  It is absolutely rude to ask someone to change their body in ANY way to accomodate a wedding. 

ETA: And seriously, etiquette?   Etiquette is not feeding your guests or giving them a place to sit. Someone's body doesn't violate etiquette.   That is ridiculous.

daria24

jess1669 said:

It's etiquette because she is standing up in her friend's wedding and in front of the bride and groom's friends and family. This is the bride's day. Not her's and if she wants to do that at her own wedding, by all means. But I'm sure she knows that the bride does not like this idea of armpit hair so she should have the courtesy to shave it off until after the wedding.

Yeah...no...sorry. Etiquette doesn't dictate the length/absence of body hair. 

kefryar

cmgilpin said:

kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

It does make you a bad friend. It would be the same as photoshopping a chubby bridesmaid to make her look skinnier because you think your photos would look better. You are trying to change your friend, instead of just accepting her for who she is.

I'm sorry? But you really have no right to call someone a bad friend over their choice of wedding photos. I don't really see how what I do to my own wedding photos is anyone else's business. If I want to photoshop ryan gosling into all of them, it shouldn't be anyone's business, and it sure doesn't mean that I'm a BAD FRIEND.

I'm not asking her to cover her tattoos, body peircings, love handles, or anything else. I'm saying I'm photoshopping pictures and when i'm paying $1500 for wedding photos, that should be my choice.

Peledreamsofrain

Post removed due to GBCK

kefryar

Peledreamsofrain said:

These aren't going to be the photos that you hang on your wall. Why you are so freaked out by hair is beyond me. God knows how you cross the street or leave your home if you are so easily set into a tizzy.

I wear blindfolds and have my butler lead me around whenever I am around people who I don't deem pretty enough. Is this unusual?

bunni727

kefryar said:

cmgilpin said:

kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

It does make you a bad friend. It would be the same as photoshopping a chubby bridesmaid to make her look skinnier because you think your photos would look better. You are trying to change your friend, instead of just accepting her for who she is.

I'm sorry? But you really have no right to call someone a bad friend over their choice of wedding photos. I don't really see how what I do to my own wedding photos is anyone else's business. If I want to photoshop ryan gosling into all of them, it shouldn't be anyone's business, and it sure doesn't mean that I'm a BAD FRIEND.

I'm not asking her to cover her tattoos, body peircings, love handles, or anything else. I'm saying I'm photoshopping pictures and when i'm paying $1500 for wedding photos, that should be my choice.

It's her buisness what you do to her body in pictures of her.

kefryar

StageManager14 said:

I am sure this probably pointless, but you are asking her to change a part of her body for your personal pleasure and doing so could cause physical discomfort and issues she will deal with for months afterwards. If she wont change what you dont like, you'll just do it FOR her in the photos. THAT is what makes you a bad friend. For the record, this would completely end our friendship and I would burn that bridge in the most public blaze of glory possible. There would be no one that wouldn't know how shallow you are when I was done.

by your logic i shouldn't even have bridesmaids. god forbid i ask someone to wear a dress or look nice.

QueerFemme

kefryar said:

cmgilpin said:

kefryar said:

Honestly, would you want to look at armpit hair for the rest of your life? They are my photos and I don't really see how it makes me a "bad friend" to not want to see something I find disgusting when i'm trying to remember my wedding day.

I get not asking her to shave, fine, but getting offended because I photoshop wedding photos? That would be self-centered on her part. It's not like she has a deformity that she can't help that i'm photo shopping out. It's armpit hair, how attached can you be to it, really?

Also, she is aware that I am not the crunchy type, so I doubt this will come as any surprise to her.  

It does make you a bad friend. It would be the same as photoshopping a chubby bridesmaid to make her look skinnier because you think your photos would look better. You are trying to change your friend, instead of just accepting her for who she is.

I'm sorry? But you really have no right to call someone a bad friend over their choice of wedding photos. I don't really see how what I do to my own wedding photos is anyone else's business. If I want to photoshop ryan gosling into all of them, it shouldn't be anyone's business, and it sure doesn't mean that I'm a BAD FRIEND.

I'm not asking her to cover her tattoos, body peircings, love handles, or anything else. I'm saying I'm photoshopping pictures and when i'm paying $1500 for wedding photos, that should be my choice.

Ryan Gosling isn't your friend. You don't have to worry about offending him. Changing what your FRIEND looks like, is not the same as photoshopping in someone else. 

If you don't want your friend and her body hair in your photos, don't have her in your wedding.

ETA:  PS I'm not calling you a bad friend for your choice of wedding photos. I'm calling you a bad friend because FRIENDS accept their FRIENDS for who they are. Not based on how good they look in a photo.

bunni727

That doesn't make sense. A dress is not part of your body, and looking nice is completely subjective.

You are wanting to change a part of your Bms body. Whether that is her body hair, her tattoos, her weight, or her buck teeth is completely irrelevant. A dress can be put on and taken off, with no lasting effects. You are wanting the way she physically looks to be different than what it is, and are going to underhandedly forcibly change it if she doesn't change it herself.