Devastated. Please help me sort this out.

wittykitty14

runpipparun said:

wittykitty14 said:

PrettyGirlLost said:

kmmssg said:

Based on your last post, I'd say to calmly say to her, "Mom, if you aren't going to pay for the reception, we need to cancel the contract and contact the guests.  FI and I will take it from here" and walk away.

I'm not trying to second guess your therapist here, but just exactly when is mom supposed to face the reality of how hurtful she is and take responsibility for her actions?  Or face the consequences of her actions?

Yes, and please don't take this the wrong way- I am very sorry for your situation all around, and good on ya for seeking help- but I might be inclined to seek a new therapist.

I appreciate your feedback.  My therapist has been wonderful throughout this ordeal and worked with me on all my problems.  I've been seeing her for almost 5 years now.  She and FI are the ones helping me get through this.  She hasn't said a whole lot about how the relationship between my mom and I will change once or move, or how she'll feel about this whole thing. Right now we're mostly focused on making sure I don't have another meltdown before that point. 

When you're dealing with controlling parents, they often have some underlying trauma that causes them to lash out when they feel their world is out of control (you're getting married, you're moving, things are changing). It's a very "fear-oriented" existence for those folks, which is not to say that you should work to allay their fears by giving in to their demands. But they see things in terms of how everything happens TO them, which keeps them from accepting responsibility for their actions. This allows them to feel like a victim and often makes their children feel like the villain. (We just got an email from my FI's mom last night... She still can't accept responsibility for her crazy behavior in the last year. She still is blaming other people. We've cut her off, not invited her to our wedding, it's extreme, and she is still blaming us and other people for the estrangement, when it reality, it was her actions and her words that caused it.)

Your therapist is right. You may not be able to change your mom, because to her, everything is someone else's fault, but managing your responses to her tantrums is crucial.

Bingo.  That's exactly what's been happening.  There's no way I could have worded it as well as you just did!

I've been trying to be sensitive to what she's going through, without walking on eggshells or sacrificing my own happiness.  Finding a balance is hard.  Regardless of how she's treating me, I'm trying very hard to not retaliate in any way.  Just to remain calm and cope with the situation as best as I can.

To give everyone an update-I just talked to my mom during our lunch breaks.  It was a short, but mature conversation.  She expressed her concerns in a more nurturing way, which made me more receptive and then I was able to explain my side more clearly.  The topic of the reception never came up, but she did apologize for getting on FI's case so much.  I'm still really on edge, because this sense of calmness is likely temporary.  But I'm going to keep riding this out, and hope that we can continue to talk to each other like we just did.  She'll probably continue to get on our case, but I'm hoping that the reception nonsense was just an empty threat that won't resurface.  Maybe it's naive to wish for that, but I'll do what I can to keep things running smoothly. 

Thanks everyone for all your help.  Your advice has really been helpful

KDM323

Wishing you luck!  The other ladies have excellent advice.

One thing your fiancee may want to consider is signing up at a true "temp agency" for potential day work (either laborer or office work...filling in for a receptionist, etc when they call out sick or take a vacation day, etc)

This might help get your Mom off your back a little bit and perhaps get you both a few extra dollars in addition to the project he is doing.

wittykitty14

drexelkathy said:

Wishing you luck!  The other ladies have excellent advice.

One thing your fiancee may want to consider is signing up at a true "temp agency" for potential day work (either laborer or office work...filling in for a receptionist, etc when they call out sick or take a vacation day, etc)

This might help get your Mom off your back a little bit and perhaps get you both a few extra dollars in addition to the project he is doing.

He's tried.  There isn't much in my area.  Between FI's availability, lack of transportation, and qualifications, he has no options here.  It really stinks.  Except for the money he's going to be making from my uncle (which is basically a full-time job at this point), we have no options other than getting temporary unemployment (which he's been looking into).  We look for jobs every single day.  Given the fact that he can only work for another 4 weeks or so, there's just nothing.  My mom has it in her head that there's a lot more available than there actually is.

QueerFemme

Honestly, I think I would try to postpone the wedding for a year or two, or just cancel it and lose your deposits and get married privately.  It sounds like you are going to be walking on eggshells for the next month until you know for sure whether or not mom is going to pull funding.  I might consider sitting down and talking to her and say "your threat about not paying for the reception is scaring me and really causing me stress."  See how she replies. If she doesn't give you a check for the remaining balances then, or pays the vendors directly then, I would cancel and notify your guests ASAP.

wittykitty14

scribe95 said:

I hope it works out. We tell other brides to get the money upfront to avoid this exact situation. Any chance that could happen so she doesn't stick you with the contract?

Also from a mother's perspective I can see her concern. It sounds like your FI's work history is less than stellar, you are staying for free at her house, and you can't pay for your own wedding. So I think it's fair for her to be worried about your future as a whole and how this is all going to work out.

I can ask her about that.  She might consider it, but I'm not sure.

As for the second part, yeah, I get where she's coming from too.  She told us not to pay rent for months, that it was fine for us to stay there.  She tried to use that as blackmail a couple months ago.  In terms of the wedding, we were planning on paying for it ourselves, but it would have been very different than what we're doing with my mom's help.  She offered, saying she would be hurt if she didn't do this for us.  We eventually accepted.  Now that we're really close to the wedding she's using this as a means to control us too.  I wish I had declined the money for the wedding, and lived somewhere else or made her accept rent from us.

wittykitty14

NYUgirl100 said:

Does the area you are moving to have more jobs that fiance might qualify for?

Yeah.  It's a much more populated area.  Plus, he'll be able to use the car, which will make it even easier for him to travel to a job.  He's already started looking and will be applying to places out there within the next couple of days.

Jen4948

I'm really sorry you're going through this and I hope things get better for you.

tinambride

I'm sorry you're going through this. Perhaps your mom just needs some time to cool down. She may have been trying to make a statement, but when things are said and done she will follow through with her promises.

Living with parents when engaged can be difficult. Perhaps sit down with her and have a calm and rational conversation about how you and your FI's relationship is between the two of you. These are decisions that you both need to make together (regarding jobs, moving, etc.). By living with her for a while, you may have given her the impression that she has more say in your relationship than she actually does. This definitely isn't a healthy way to start out a marriage and it sets a precedent that you're going to have to overcome.

You've only got a month to go before you move away. Regardless of what you do about the wedding, I would set some boundaries in the future about how much say she has regarding your life and your marriage.

Good luck! I hope it works out!

jarednmegan

Love all the input that's been given here. There is a lot of love on TK, regardless of what some of my fellow newcomers have been led to believe.

@wittykitty14, my heart goes out to you and your FI. I know this has gotta be devastating and makes for a rough start to your life together, but like many PPs have said, putting distance between you and your mom could be the best thing for your relationship. You sound like someone who has her head on straight, and your FI seems to be doing the best he can to provide. I'm sure it goes without saying that sometimes the expectations our parents set for us are, well, unrealistic to say the least. How sad that she's holding this job setback over your heads after offering so much financial help. I really hope it all gets straightened out, at least in a way that allows you and your FI to move on and focus on your marriage.

Hang in there.

Kristin789

The call after your therapist should be to your officiant.  Schedule a meeting with you, your FI, your mom, your dad, your officiant, and FI's parents if they are local, and let your officiant handle getting everyone - including your mom - refocused on what the upcoming wedding and resultant marriage are all about, and what roles the parents are to play in these events, etc. 

misssunshine17

OP, you've gotten great advice. I hope it all works out in your favor and I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. 

@CMGr, grandbaby is absolutely stunning! Congratulations!

runpipparun

Harry87 said:

You guys certainly made me think. Replace the pronouns and you guys could be talking about my dad.
I really do not look forward to seeing him this Sunday, because I know he is going to be a crabby shit. But if I don't go and kiss his ass then my stepmother, grandmother, sister, aunts, and him will all call and flood my phone with talk of how horrible I am and all the hoops I will have to jump into to be a good person again. I will also have it brought up from time to time for years to come.

Hey! Join the club. We've gotten calls, texts, and FB messages from FI's mom's friends and family about how horrible we are, including one from a total evangelical nutjob who is married to my FI's mom's friend (yeah...). His FB message was a gem. He said that FI was "living outside God's Will" because he's "engaging in sex outside of marriage," but that it is OKAY, because at one point in his life, he, too, "walked a dark and dangerous path." He said FI just needed to turn aside his "sinful ways" and come back to his family. *sigh*

wittykitty14

Thanks for the continued advice!  Hearing all the feedback has been really helpful.

I don't think she has Narcissitic Personality Disorder.  It's been a while since I've read the criteria, but from what I recall it doesn't really fit her.  @leighbie87-you're spot on about how she doesn't see it and plays the victim.  She'll have everyone convinced that I'm the bad guy, who treats her like crap.  I've always known that our relationship is....off.  Something wasn't quite right.  But I've been conditioned to hate myself and blame myself for everything.  FI is the only person who's really able to see what it's been like for me.  I'm finally starting to accept the fact that maybe it's not my fault.  That I'm ok just the way I am.  Now it actually makes sense why the treatment I've been getting for the last 11 years hasn't worked entirely...and why my problems have gotten worse the past year.

But all any of us can do is move forward, right?  I know who I am and how I turned out this way.  FI are excited for our new life together, and to be away from home for a while.  Even if we have to change our wedding vision a bit under the circumstances, we'll still get married next month.  That's what I'm focused on.

Thanks for your help, everyone

jarednmegan

runpipparun said:

Harry87 said:

You guys certainly made me think. Replace the pronouns and you guys could be talking about my dad.
I really do not look forward to seeing him this Sunday, because I know he is going to be a crabby shit. But if I don't go and kiss his ass then my stepmother, grandmother, sister, aunts, and him will all call and flood my phone with talk of how horrible I am and all the hoops I will have to jump into to be a good person again. I will also have it brought up from time to time for years to come.

Hey! Join the club. We've gotten calls, texts, and FB messages from FI's mom's friends and family about how horrible we are, including one from a total evangelical nutjob who is married to my FI's mom's friend (yeah...). His FB message was a gem. He said that FI was "living outside God's Will" because he's "engaging in sex outside of marriage," but that it is OKAY, because at one point in his life, he, too, "walked a dark and dangerous path." He said FI just needed to turn aside his "sinful ways" and come back to his family. *sigh*

As a Christian who tries really hard not to judge other people's decisions, this just makes me cringe. I'm sorry about how your FMIL's friends are trashing you and your FI. It's not their place to say those things. I'm sure they think they're "speaking the truth in love," but all they're doing is alienating the two of you.

runpipparun

jarednmegan said:

runpipparun said:

Harry87 said:

You guys certainly made me think. Replace the pronouns and you guys could be talking about my dad.
I really do not look forward to seeing him this Sunday, because I know he is going to be a crabby shit. But if I don't go and kiss his ass then my stepmother, grandmother, sister, aunts, and him will all call and flood my phone with talk of how horrible I am and all the hoops I will have to jump into to be a good person again. I will also have it brought up from time to time for years to come.

Hey! Join the club. We've gotten calls, texts, and FB messages from FI's mom's friends and family about how horrible we are, including one from a total evangelical nutjob who is married to my FI's mom's friend (yeah...). His FB message was a gem. He said that FI was "living outside God's Will" because he's "engaging in sex outside of marriage," but that it is OKAY, because at one point in his life, he, too, "walked a dark and dangerous path." He said FI just needed to turn aside his "sinful ways" and come back to his family. *sigh*

As a Christian who tries really hard not to judge other people's decisions, this just makes me cringe. I'm sorry about how your FMIL's friends are trashing you and your FI. It's not their place to say those things. I'm sure they think they're "speaking the truth in love," but all they're doing is alienating the two of you.

Supposedly the guy is an ordained minister, too, which makes me sad. We're actively practicing Christians as well, though our denomination is generally at odds with a lot of the more fundamentalist denominations. My FI's switch from his childhood faith to the Episcopal faith has not been well received by his family and his family's friends. My mom has been a lot more accepting of me leaving the Catholic church.

wittykitty14

Kristin789 said:

The call after your therapist should be to your officiant.  Schedule a meeting with you, your FI, your mom, your dad, your officiant, and FI's parents if they are local, and let your officiant handle getting everyone - including your mom - refocused on what the upcoming wedding and resultant marriage are all about, and what roles the parents are to play in these events, etc. 

I meant to respond to this earlier but I forgot!

Normally, I would seriously consider doing this, even though chances are it would cause more drama.  But our priest has known my family for decades.  He knew both of my parents growing up before my parents even knew each other.  If i thought it would make things better I'd try it.  Most likely my mom would be annoyed that I brought extra people into the situation, and would feel like I ganged up on her.  She was a bit annoyed that I called my therapist yesterday morning too.  Oh well.  Thanks for the suggestion, I'll still keep it in mind!

jarednmegan

runpipparun said:

jarednmegan said:

runpipparun said:

Harry87 said:

You guys certainly made me think. Replace the pronouns and you guys could be talking about my dad.
I really do not look forward to seeing him this Sunday, because I know he is going to be a crabby shit. But if I don't go and kiss his ass then my stepmother, grandmother, sister, aunts, and him will all call and flood my phone with talk of how horrible I am and all the hoops I will have to jump into to be a good person again. I will also have it brought up from time to time for years to come.

Hey! Join the club. We've gotten calls, texts, and FB messages from FI's mom's friends and family about how horrible we are, including one from a total evangelical nutjob who is married to my FI's mom's friend (yeah...). His FB message was a gem. He said that FI was "living outside God's Will" because he's "engaging in sex outside of marriage," but that it is OKAY, because at one point in his life, he, too, "walked a dark and dangerous path." He said FI just needed to turn aside his "sinful ways" and come back to his family. *sigh*

As a Christian who tries really hard not to judge other people's decisions, this just makes me cringe. I'm sorry about how your FMIL's friends are trashing you and your FI. It's not their place to say those things. I'm sure they think they're "speaking the truth in love," but all they're doing is alienating the two of you.

Supposedly the guy is an ordained minister, too, which makes me sad. We're actively practicing Christians as well, though our denomination is generally at odds with a lot of the more fundamentalist denominations. My FI's switch from his childhood faith to the Episcopal faith has not been well received by his family and his family's friends. My mom has been a lot more accepting of me leaving the Catholic church.

Sometimes clergy can be the worst "judges." This is a bit OT but I know a couple who left a church because they lost both of their children to cancer and the pastor actually suggested that it was God's way of punishing the parents for some hidden sin. What an awful thing to say.

Regardless of whether your FI's family agrees with decisions regarding his faith, they could at least try to be a bit more supportive. He's an adult, so the way he worships and lives his life is between him and God, not between him and his family. It's not like he's committing polygamy or doing something else illegal.

I know families have a hard time being supportive when their children don't live up to their expectations (my mom and I have dealt with this in the past to a lesser degree), but if a parent truly loves his/her child, he/she will be there for them when it's all said and done.

msdds51

Even though it might be uncomfortable and not ideal for your guests, it might be best for YOUR sanity to cancel your big party and doing something more intimate that you can afford (if that is an option).  If that's not an option, whose name is on the contracts?  If it's your mom's then ultimately she HAS to pay.

wittykitty14

katelinsmallwood said:

Even though it might be uncomfortable and not ideal for your guests, it might be best for YOUR sanity to cancel your big party and doing something more intimate that you can afford (if that is an option).  If that's not an option, whose name is on the contracts?  If it's your mom's then ultimately she HAS to pay.

I considered it.  After counting up immediately family, members of the WP and their SOs, and people involved in the wedding in some way, we're still around 50 people.  If I cancelled all of that, I would have to reimburse a lot of people for various things, which would end up costing more than it would if fed those 50 people.  So in that sense, it's not really worth it.  We also have zero wiggle room in our budget.  We've made significant cuts already just to pay for the rest of the stuff for the wedding, and still keep a little left over to move away.  But I think that uninviting all our guests would be more detrimental to my sanity overall.  I don't want to involve more people in this than I have to.

My mom is paying, and paid for the deposit, but the contract is in my name.  If we're able to pull out of it now, the worst that could happen is that my mom would lose the deposit.  But the absolute worst possible outcome (which didn't cross my mind until just now) is that she waits until the day of the wedding to tell me that she's not paying for it.  THEN I would be in deep shit, because it would be on me entirely.  However, no matter what my mom does or threatens to do, I know that there's absolutely no way she would do that to me.  I really don't think that she'll pull the money at all, considering her history.  I feel like she's just trying to scare me into doing what she says.  She's done it before, and she'll keep trying.  She doesn't follow through with any of these threats, but they've gotten worse because I've been better about not giving in to her.  I just wanted to be prepared in case she follows through with this one.

Jen4948

I still wouldn't take the chance that she jerks you around on your wedding day, based on what you've described.  Even though uninviting your guests would cost you some money and be inconvenient for them, it would cost you even more money and be even more inconvenient on your wedding day for her to pull the rug out from under you, and I wouldn't put it past her to do just that with a big smug smile on her face.

wittykitty14

Jen4948 said:

I still wouldn't take the chance that she jerks you around on your wedding day, based on what you've described.  Even though uninviting your guests would cost you some money and be inconvenient for them, it would cost you even more money and be even more inconvenient on your wedding day for her to pull the rug out from under you, and I wouldn't put it past her to do just that with a big smug smile on her face.

I definitely see your point.  One of my biggest problems with this though is that there is no more money to pay these people back right away.  Within a couple months, sure, maybe.  If I do that, then I can't move or go to graduate school, because I will have used all my moving/settling in funds.  I can't jeopardize my education for anything.  I just don't know what to do.  I've made a list of all possible options and what it would take to execute them properly.  I can bring them to my therapist tomorrow and go through them.

Jen4948

@Harry87, you may be right but we'll never know for sure until the day of the wedding.  If the OP's mom is as bad as she suggests, it still just might happen.  While this boundary is one your father wouldn't cross, we really don't know what the OP's mom will or won't do-we thought she wouldn't pull this kind of threat in the first place.

wittykitty14

Harry87 said:

@Jen4948 I'm with the OP that her threat is empty, though. OP's mom is like my dad; she needs the attention and control over her children to feel validated, important, and he mind that's what love is. She knows that if she does this to her daughter, that it will be the last straw. That would be hurtful enough to make sure that the daughter would cut ties for good. And then what would the mom have?

In the OP's mom's twisted way, this is how she thinks she loves people. Part of her truly does love the OP. I agree that no way she would risk it, even if I also agree that the OP should be prepared to have to make payments plans and deals with the reception hall if something snaps and the mother does the unthinkable. My father has always mocked, scolded, needled me, and given gifts with strings. Even Christmas and birthday presents aren't safe. He demands I give him extravagant ideas and come to him when I need things, because if I didn't he would be hurt. At the same time, if I accept any of his gifts or favors he will later use them to emotionally blackmail me. I'm given the choice to hurt him or give him something to hurt me with. I've learned to never ask for things I can't live without, and to bring him in on things I was going to do anyway so he can feel like the heroic father. At the same time, while my dad can be needling and hurtful, there are set boundaries he would never cross because I would cut him off completely. And deep down, some part of him loves me desperately enough that he would never cross those lines.

My father was a jerk throughout most of the planning process, but he took his FOB duties very seriously. He was going to be there, come hell or high water and he was going to do right by me on that day. I know that he loves me, but his life has lead him to be the kind of person who doesn't really know how to love someone without also being cruel. Part of that is his fault and part of that is how he was treated and raised. There's nothing I can do to change him, but I can plan for his tantrums and dodge my way around them. I suspect OP is doing much the same. After the wedding, she'll likely have to cut a lot of ties, like I did, but her mom will always be a part of her life. The best thing you can do when your parent is like this is show them compassion, but also strength and reserve. Live a good, strong life without them and invite them to be a part of it so long as they behave. Leave them when they don't.

I hope that made some kind of sense. OP mom's loves her the best a broken person can, and OP will always love her mom, but she doesn't have to like her much. For some reason, that tenuous relationship is why I bet the mom won't take the money away.

You're spot on with the situation and how I'm feeling about my relationship with her.  And yes, it made perfect sense

I really don't think she'll follow through with it either.

wittykitty14

sierrahaynes574 said:

Your FI sounds like he's going to end up being a deadbeat. Just saying.

I realize this is an open forum, but why would you even say that?  I'm asking a little out of shock, but also out of genuine curiosity.

jarednmegan

wittykitty14 said:

sierrahaynes574 said:

Your FI sounds like he's going to end up being a deadbeat. Just saying.

I realize this is an open forum, but why would you even say that?  I'm asking a little out of shock, but also out of genuine curiosity.

I was wondering if she was directing that at you and not another PP. No matter who she was referring to, that's not what I consider "constructive criticism." Plus, I don't think she knows nearly enough about your FI to form such an opinion, based on a forum thread.

@sierrahaynes574, take your sweeping judgments somewhere else.

arrippa

 

sierrahaynes574 said:

Your FI sounds like he's going to end up being a deadbeat. Just saying.

Wow, that was really harsh. I know a few people who have been laid off due to the economy and I would not classify any of them as deadbeats.

Peledreamsofrain

I smell a troll AE...

MuppetFan

Witty, I'm late to the thread but just read through it all and agree that you got a lot of good advice.

How terrible for you to be so vulnerable right now. I'm glad you're moving away from her soon.

It sounds like you're going to stick with it and take the risk that she may stick you with the bill.

I imagine it's only going to be a few more weeks before full payments are needed on the reception, right? So I guess you'll know then?

I'd just try to be non confrontational, give her some compliments, let her think about your dress and mother daughter photos until then etc..

BUT, I'd also prepare a backup plan for how you're going to pay the venue in the event that she doesn't (whether you need to take out a loan or use a cc). It's not ideal. It's not the recommended path, but if it happens, at least you'll be prepared

I really wish you good luck

harper0813

sierrahaynes574 said:

Your FI sounds like he's going to end up being a deadbeat. Just saying.

Well that's rude. (Flany reincarnation, anyone?)

winelover123

sierrahaynes574 said:

Your FI sounds like he's going to end up being a deadbeat. Just saying.

That's a terribly rude thing to say.