Discussion question.

J&K10910 · September 2009

Hopefully it's not too early for this. (Disclaimer, this may get gruesome and morbid, so it might not be the right post for the faint of heart or easily offended.)Do you think everyone is capable of killing for one reason or another? I'm going to be non-PC here and take those that are physically unable to, or those that do not have the mental capacity to appreciate the results of their actions, out of the equation. So for everyone else--do you think there is a situation for every person that could potentially drive them to kill? Or do you think there are some people who, no matter, are just not capable of killing another person. Please explain your answers. Bonus points for big words.

SarieP · September 2009

I think that everyone has the capacity to kill and that most people have the restraint to not. I think most people would agree that if someone was trying to hurt them or a member of their family, they could kill. I think everyone has a certain instinct to protect themselves and their families at all costs. As far as a pre-meditated killing, I think it takes a "special" person to be able to do that.

MandaBelle1211 · September 2009

I don't think I could ever take a human life, no matter what circumstances. The only possible exception to this would be self-defense. And, even then I do not see myself possessing the strength or will to do so.

J&K10910 · September 2009

I do think that most people could kill to protect themselves or their families. However, I strongly believe there are definitely people out there who, if given a gun, shown how to use it, and someone then says to them, "I'm going to torture you, rape you, and kill you if you don't kill me," they still won't do it. Even if said person goes ahead and starts doing these things, and then gives them another chance, I still think there are some people who wouldn't do it.Now bring a loved one into the equation and I think the number shrinks, but I still think there are people that wouldn't/couldn't. I think some of these people are likely incredibly religious, while others just couldn't do it, for whatever reason.

mocha beans · September 2009

That's a good question for a Monday morning brain wake-up.I think for every person there is a limit to how much they can take, and beyond that point anything can happen. If someone is trying to harm a person's family, I think many people could be pushed far enough to kill the attacker in self defense. I think any high-stress situation that continues for a long enough period of time can wear on anyone to the point that they mentally snap.

betrothed123 · September 2009

Yes, I do think everyone has the capacity to kill under certain circumstances. I won't go into the details of the story, but there was a time in my life where I was hurt very deeply, both physically and emotionally, by the actions of another person. If I had been able to kill that person, there's a possibility that I would have done so.That's not to say I would take someone out for looking at me wrong, but if my life, or the lives of people I care about, was at risk I'd do what had to be done.

MandaBelle1211 · September 2009

To clarify...I do think I could seriously hurt someone in order to protect myself and/or a loved one. I just don't think killing someone is in me.

aMrsin09 · September 2009

I think everyone can if they had to. I was assaulted in my own home. When I had to face that dip shiite in court, I could have very easily taken the guards gun, shot the SOB between the eyes, and gone home and slept like a baby.

ac_in_dc · September 2009

There's an evolutionary element to this too. More sinister. It's usually guys, and they will kill to obtain territory, ecomonic advantage, etc. Have you ever seen those nature channels where male chimpanzees form war parties and go out to kill chimps encroaching on their territory? It's terrifying.

tidetravel · September 2009

I do think that everyone has it in them somewhere to take a life. Life PPs said, there is a limit to how much someone can take, and that differs for everyone.I also think that someone who couldn't necessarily bring themselves to kill in self defense would kill in defense of a loved one. Sometimes the instinct to protect others is greater than anything.

mocha beans · September 2009

I think if I was in a situation where I was being threatened, if I did end up killing someone, it would be out of adrenaline fueled terror/rage. I could never kill someone if there was another way out, my morality is too strong.In that situation, J, I doubt I could kill the person until they actually tried to kill or harm me.I think a lot of it depends on how strong the person's survival instinct is.

AlexiaANDRobert · September 2009

Yes I think so. My whole family (minus me) went to Germany for Christmas and New Years a couple of years ago. My sister was holding her camera up when someone came running by her and snatched it. She screamed bloody murder and my brother and brother-in-law took off in hot puruit. They beat the crap out of the guy and my sister was screaming so loud she actually got sick. Longstoryshort - When they all told the story later, they couldn't believe the adrenaline they all had pumping through their bodies. The boys said they would've kept whacking the guy if the girls hadn't stopped them. Yes, I believe with extreme circumstances, anyone call kill.

Nebb · September 2009

I think with the fact that humans can be impulsive and angry creatures, it isnt impossible that anyone is capable of making a snap decision and lashing out. I think a lot of the deaths that happen, arent intentional (intended to hurt, or stop, or silence, but not kill). I hope that most people have the self control to step back from an angering or threatening situation rather than allow it to escalate to that point, but unfortunately some dont. You arent clear headed when certain hormones are pumping through you. Pre-meditated murders though, those people are just fuuucked. That is a whole other level of mental capacity that is seriously flawed.

J&K10910 · September 2009

I see I'm in the minority. I agree with a lot of the points brought up, and agree that most people WOULD act that way. But I still feel that there's a small amount of people who wouldn't. I think it's interesting, as most all-encompassing generalizations, as a rule, are not correct. But I had a feeling that most people would disagree with me.

tidetravel · September 2009

If you get a gun here in MD, you have to go through a safety course. In the course, they actually teach you that if you are shooting in self defense (like if someone breaks into your home), you shoot to kill, not to injure. If someone breaks into your home and you injure them, but don't kill them, they have the right (and do) to turn around and sue you for maiming.They also tell you to shoot more than once, but no more than 3x. (I guess once looks premeditated, but any more than 3 is excessive)

Nebb · September 2009

I think thats absolutely screwed up that someone could break into your house, be in a position to scare you/harm you, and if you hurt them youre at fault. They shouldnt have been inside your private property in the first place, but youre not allowed to defend yourself unles syou kill them??

tidetravel · September 2009

Yep Nebb. It's true. Woe be the person that breaks into my house if I'm home.

vallyhoo · September 2009

Nebb- I completely agree with you on that point. In Florida they changed the law that allows for the use of deadly force in self-defense so if someone comes into my house and hurts themselves, they better be thankful that that's all that happened to them.To answer the original question, I agree with you J&K for the most part. I think there are some people that just wouldn't be able to "pull the trigger" however, I think if someone has trained and taken self-defense courses they are more likely to not go into panic mode. I guess it goes back to the whole fight-or-flight argument.

squirrly · September 2009

I think a scenerio exists for each person that is drastic and awful enough to drive them to attack the person harming them/their loved ones, and attack visciously. I think for *most* people, that anger is enough to mask their ability to tell if the next blow they deal is going to kill the person they're attacking. I think they will simply keep attacking until the other person stops fighting back. Dead, unconscious, etc. I don't think it's a morality thing at all -- I just think there are some people for whom the fight or flight instinct always goes to flight, even if they can't run. I think there are some people who never hit that anger -- they're just terrified.

SarieP · September 2009

I think if someone has trained and taken self-defense courses they are more likely to not go into panic mode.I agree. That is why I think it is so important for everyone (including myself) to learn proper self-defense.

ac_in_dc · September 2009

J&K, I *do* think that there are some folks that wouldn't kill at all if threatened. But I think they are a very small minority. Not to get all religious, but isn't that the whole Christian idea of martyrs and saints? Or Jesus, for that matter? Or Tibetan monks? I think you have to have a very well developed pacifist morality to not kill under any circumstances.

jackie8582 · September 2009

When I first started reading this my first thought was, well if someone is hurting or trying to hurt my child (i.e. rape, abuse, etc..) I could easily kill them! But I think right a that moment with the gun in my hand, I would be thinking about how this would effect me and my daughter for the rest of our lives and wonder if it was really worth it. I would probably end up not pulling the trigger.

mocha beans · September 2009

I think you're probably right for a very small minority of people J, like the very religious ect, about some not ever being able to kill, no matter what.But to me, we're all still animals at the very base, and have a survival instinct that is overwhelming. Someone threatens your survival, your frontal lobe backs down and the hindbrain kicks in and takes over (big words, eh, eh? :-) ). I think it would take a very strong frontal lobe, or some sort of damage in the hindbrain that interrupts the survival instinct, to get through such a high stress, high risk situation without at least accidentally killing the attacker.

J&K10910 · September 2009

AC, I mentioned religion in my first post stating my opinion, so I agree with that statement. I think there are people who are so incredibly religious they'd think it was God's will, or that their attackers would go to Hell, or what have you, and they were not supposed to fight back. Because Jesus didn't fight the people that crucified him, ya know?I probably just showed my relative uneducated-ness pertaining to religion. So if someone out there wants to refute that, by all means, I'm open to your knowledge.

BecW2be · September 2009

I firmly believe in the fight or flight instinct in people. Some people would never kill another person, even if faced with unimaginable torture. They flee inward mentally and collapse. I know that if someone intentionally harms me (abusive man, etc), they'll get away with it perhaps the first time. If they come at me again, they'll have to sleep sometime and I have no problem depositing one bullet into their temple when they do. Should someone harm my children, they better hope they kill me quickly because I will do everything in my power to rip them limb from limb the moment I discover they've harmed my children. As a single mother alone in my house every night with my girls, I take regular target practice and I often imagine what steps to take depending on where someone gains entry to my house, and how to most quickly to incapacitate them before they reach my hallway where my girls are sleeping. I know that sounds BSC, but it's what I think about at night when I'm in protector mode.

SwedishChick2011 · September 2009

J&K, I think that MOST people under the right circumstances would kill if they had to, but I agree with you that there are some who probably could not.

J&K10910 · September 2009

But to me, we're all still animals at the very base, and have a survival instinct that is overwhelming. Someone threatens your survival, your frontal lobe backs down and the hindbrain kicks in and takes over (big words, eh, eh? :-) ). I think it would take a very strong frontal lobe, or some sort of damage in the hindbrain that interrupts the survival instinct, to get through such a high stress, high risk situation without at least accidentally killing the attacker.Bonus points for Mocha! No, I absolutely agree with you. I do think that's how it works for the vast majority of people. I just don't think you can say without question that EVERY SINGLE capable person would.

SwedishChick2011 · September 2009

mocha - I am going to attempt to use the word hindbrain as much as possible in daily conversation. It makes you sound smart.

mocha beans · September 2009

I had to dig deep in my frontal lobe to remember my basic brain functions and structures to come up with that one.From a brain chemistry, everyone is capable of a lethal response. But that same brain chemistry can effectively remove that ability if your frontal lobe is that well developed, like the monks or Christ or whoever else. Scary thing is, if I remember lectures and experiments right, a few scalpel cuts can disconnect your frontal lobe's control, and the hindbrain is in control again.OT, did you work for the state human services dept? I got a job offer that I took working with the Dept of Human Services. Thoughts or coments?

J&K10910 · September 2009

You talkin' to me? No, I worked for Olmsted County. Tell me about the job.

Travis&Cari · September 2009

I do think everyone is capable of killing. People were talking about animal instincts and it's a good point. When it comes down to it we are all programmed with a desire to survive and pass on our genes. When something threatens that basic instinct we will, without thinking, do anything to protect that. I also don't think it's a conscious decision. It's instinct. I don't think one has time to consider God or morality, or consequences. It's like a crime of passion, without rational thought. I think about being in high adreniline situations and I look back and say what the heck was I thinking, how did I do that? (i.e-running into a burning building). But you don't think. You go into almost a zombie mode and do what you are preprogrammed to do and in this case I think that's killing to protect yourself or your loved ones.

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