UPDATE-Possibly uninvite an evil boss?

[Deleted User] · June 2013

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MsYeck · June 2013

That is why you don't send a STD to anyone you are to 100% sure about. You at committed now to inviting him. However if you find another job he will likely decline.

Jen4948 · June 2013

Unfortunately, if you send someone an STD, even an evil boss, you have to invite that person. But he may well decline, especially if you find another job. Even if he doesn't, the only attention you have to pay him at your wedding is just to politely greet him and thank him for coming-nothing more, and you can walk away from him if he is rude.

Kate61487 · June 2013

Do you really think your work situation will improve if you un-invite him?

AddieCake · June 2013

Daizy914 said:

The title of my discussion is awful, but it is the truth. Let me try to sum up my issue, my boss is a bully. I sent him a save the date to be courteous, and respectful. However, since I have been here, it just gets worse and worse. I don't want to go into detail about the daily degrading comments he makes, I do fight back and tell him you cannot speak to me that way, but he doesn't stop. And my HR dept, is a joke, it is one person who is actually BFF with my boss, so that won't work. I am actually seeking a new job, which I am not happy about being that my wedding is in three months and I am going on a week and half honeymoon. Who is going to hire someone that is going away for that long and they are new? Anyway, I know that the answer is to suck it up and invite him, and that I shouldn't have invited him in the first place, but I really don't want him there seeing how he acts outside of the job (which I didn't find out till after I sent him the save the date, I don't want someone making a fool of themselves at my wedding. (We went to a company party, that's how I know how he acts outside of work.) Has anyone else had to deal with inviting someone like this? My fiance said that we can just lie and say that we had to make cuts to the invitation list due to budget? But this might not work being that I am still inviting some co-workers and it will get back to him that they went.I feel stupid, because I wish I didn't invite him at all. I made a mistake and I don't think I can fix it.

STD=invitation. Odds are, he won't come anyway.

lisabeats · June 2013

As to the "who will hire someone when they need that much time off right away" part, in my experience, as long as you're honest and open about it, this hopefully won't be too much of a deterrent. Hiring managers know people are people and have lives, so this should hopefully not be held against you. When talking to a potential new boss, I would try to be accommodating, and maybe offer to do leave without pay or something like that if it's an option. Best of luck with the job hunt!

southernbelle0915 · June 2013

I'm really sorry you're in such a stressful spot, especially when this is supposed to be such a happy time in your life. Etiquette wise, anyone who gets a save the date, gets an invitation. Period. If you decide to toss etiquette to the wind here, I would make sure you have accepted a new job elsewhere and put in your notice before your invitations go out because this will likely not improve your already decaying employee/boss relationship.

To anyone else out there, this is a great example of ensuring you really want to invite everyone to whom you send a save the date AND separation between work life and personal life.

MoonlightSilver · June 2013

Uninviting him will probably make your work situation worse. If HR isn't doing anything, can you go higher up the command chain?

As for who will hire you, my last two jobs hired me just before I went on vacation. So that is possible.

[Deleted User] · June 2013

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aurianna · June 2013

Daizy914 said:

The title of my discussion is awful, but it is the truth. Let me try to sum up my issue, my boss is a bully. I sent him a save the date to be courteous, and respectful. However, since I have been here, it just gets worse and worse. I don't want to go into detail about the daily degrading comments he makes, I do fight back and tell him you cannot speak to me that way, but he doesn't stop. And my HR dept, is a joke, it is one person who is actually BFF with my boss, so that won't work. I am actually seeking a new job, which I am not happy about being that my wedding is in three months and I am going on a week and half honeymoon. Who is going to hire someone that is going away for that long and they are new? Anyway, I know that the answer is to suck it up and invite him, and that I shouldn't have invited him in the first place, but I really don't want him there seeing how he acts outside of the job (which I didn't find out till after I sent him the save the date, I don't want someone making a fool of themselves at my wedding. (We went to a company party, that's how I know how he acts outside of work.) Has anyone else had to deal with inviting someone like this? My fiance said that we can just lie and say that we had to make cuts to the invitation list due to budget? But this might not work being that I am still inviting some co-workers and it will get back to him that they went.I feel stupid, because I wish I didn't invite him at all. I made a mistake and I don't think I can fix it.

Definitely do NOT do the bolded. Don't lie to your boss. And even if it were true, it would still be insanely rude. It's essentially telling guests "We were irresponsible with our wedding planning / budget so we have to cut back our guest list instead of things flower/photos/dress/venue etc because people aren't as important to us as our "wedding vision" . And you're one of those lucky people that we don't like as much as everyone else, so sorry, you're not invited anymore."
So definitely do not tell him that because even if it weren't a lie, it would still be a really bad idea.

PhoneCardLady · June 2013

And this is the reason why I do not want to send STD's....and a waste of money that I can spend somewhere else.

tinambride · June 2013

Unfortunately I agree with the other posters. I would really worry about my work situation if I uninvited my boss, etiquette aside. Hopefully he'll either decline or realize that this is a nice event and behave appropriately. You likely won't have much time to talk to him personally during the reception anyways.

Good luck!

32daisies · June 2013

It goes without saying, etiquette be damned, that if you get a new job, don't invite your old evil boss. I don't care if you gave him a STD, because you'll never set eyes on that jerk again. YMMV, but that's my feeling.

I've had some terrible bosses who made my life miserable. I'm sorry you're in this bad situation.

Ditto what PP have said about a new job -- there's no reason you can't just explain your pre-existing trip to them, right upfront. I'll be doing that exactly; I'm getting married and moving, and whatever new job I find, I'll have to tell them right off the bat that I need to take a week and a half of unpaid leave for my honeymoon. It's a wrinkle, but a lot of bosses understand that people have to plan their lives in advance, and a boss that doesn't understand, I probably don't want to work for.

emeejeeayen · June 2013

No advice for the invites, but you should use the words "hostile work environment" with HR. That tends to get their attention quickly.

AJuliaNJ · June 2013

If you are still working there at the time you send invitations, you have to invite him. It is proper etiquette and he can use this to make your life hell. I would send it and just hope he declines.

If you don't work there anymore when you send them out and don't need him as a reference, I would absolutely skip sending him an invite. It would be rude of me to do that, but I would do it anyway.

A new job should be understanding about pre-planned vacation. The best time to bring it up is at the time of the job offer before you accept. This is the time when you are in the best position to negotiate for extra money, time off, additional benefits, etc.

jessicabessica · June 2013

@AndreaJulia gave you the best advice about your job search. Do not bring up your vacation before you have an offer. Then, when you are negotiating, tell them that you will need time off for your wedding. I would not tell them before you get an offer.

annathy03 · June 2013

Agree with PPs, if you are still working there you have to invite and hope he declines so he doesn't make your work life even worse. If you're not working there however I'd screw etiquette in this particular case. And in the meantime, if he is saying things that are truly out of line you need to start recording him and take that to HR, or higher.

Peledreamsofrain · June 2013

Post removed due to GBCK

lovesclimbing · June 2013

lisabeats said:
As to the "who will hire someone when they need that much time off right away" part, in my experience, as long as you're honest and open about it, this hopefully won't be too much of a deterrent. Hiring managers know people are people and have lives, so this should hopefully not be held against you. When talking to a potential new boss, I would try to be accommodating, and maybe offer to do leave without pay or something like that if it's an option. Best of luck with the job hunt!

Ditto. My husband lost his job and was rehired about a month before the wedding. We had our two week honeymoon with no issues. He just told them during his interview and they were ok with it. And our honeymoon was Dec 20-Jan 2 - the time when lots of people are wanting time off for the holidays.

annathy03 · June 2013

Agree with Stage and Pele, recording is just one way to document. Your workplace has an obligation to prevent hostile work environments, but they aren't typically responsible for anything they don't know about, so you have to communicate what is going on. Often, and with a paper trail such as email. FWIW I'm no law expert, I've just had to manage contractors and had to go through some HR seminars about this stuff on what would have made us culpable.

LAM524 · June 2013

StageManager14 said:

Document, document, document. Then document more. In any way you can. Every incident. Document your boss being an ass, document your interactions with HR, and document any medical costs that may be incurred from being placed under extreme stress.

Then take your case to the state. There are avenues available to you, you just have to document like crazy to take advantage of them.
This. The job of HR isn't actually to protect the employees, it is to protect the company from litigation and other forms of legal action by making sure the company is operating within the confines of state and federal workplace laws. They don't MAKE the laws, and them ignoring them does not mean they aren't BREAKING them. Document everything and then talk to your Labor board. They won't do anything directly most likely, but they will be able to help lay out your options.

Def. document everything! Every word, every look, every thing! If he "brushes up" against you....document it!! If he picks lint off of you...document!

I personally, would exclude him from your wedding. I dont care what "etiquette" dictates. He obviously does not! You shouldnt be forced to have this man in your personal space, especially not your wedding. Besides, what kind of case will you have if the "authorities" question you and ask, "If he is/was so inappropriate, why did you invite him to your wedding?" You could explain, as you did here, why you sent him a STD but the "etiquette" for a wedding invite wont hold up.

Kate61487 · June 2013

LAM2228 said:

StageManager14 said:

Document, document, document. Then document more. In any way you can. Every incident. Document your boss being an ass, document your interactions with HR, and document any medical costs that may be incurred from being placed under extreme stress.

Then take your case to the state. There are avenues available to you, you just have to document like crazy to take advantage of them.
This. The job of HR isn't actually to protect the employees, it is to protect the company from litigation and other forms of legal action by making sure the company is operating within the confines of state and federal workplace laws. They don't MAKE the laws, and them ignoring them does not mean they aren't BREAKING them. Document everything and then talk to your Labor board. They won't do anything directly most likely, but they will be able to help lay out your options.

Def. document everything! Every word, every look, every thing! If he "brushes up" against you....document it!! If he picks lint off of you...document!

I personally, would exclude him from your wedding. I dont care what "etiquette" dictates. He obviously does not! You shouldnt be forced to have this man in your personal space, especially not your wedding. Besides, what kind of case will you have if the "authorities" question you and ask, "If he is/was so inappropriate, why did you invite him to your wedding?" You could explain, as you did here, why you sent him a STD but the "etiquette" for a wedding invite wont hold up.

I think "I was afraid if I uninvited him it would get even worse" is legit.

LAM524 · June 2013

@Kate61487...Yes, its a terrible situation, for sure. Very legit!

32daisies · June 2013

Kate61487 said:

LAM2228 said:

I personally, would exclude him from your wedding. I dont care what "etiquette" dictates. He obviously does not! You shouldnt be forced to have this man in your personal space, especially not your wedding. Besides, what kind of case will you have if the "authorities" question you and ask, "If he is/was so inappropriate, why did you invite him to your wedding?" You could explain, as you did here, why you sent him a STD but the "etiquette" for a wedding invite wont hold up.

I think "I was afraid if I uninvited him it would get even worse" is legit.

Yeah, that's the thing. Because I was tempted to say, screw it, it's not correct etiquette, but you gave a STD to someone you feel threatened by and miserable about, there's no rule of manners that makes it worthwhile to have that person at your wedding. But if you're still working for this guy, uninviting him could have bad bad consquences at work.

LAM524 · June 2013

@daizy914...What seems the lesser choice of 2 evils? If you are going to push this with HR, they may not find any credibility in your complaints, if he gets invited. You've indicated that HR is a joke...if you are going to hold your breath and get out of there and need him as a reference, then invite him...knowing that its for the sake of securing employment. Idk...in his "jerkness" I question if he would even give a good recommendation.

I feel proper etiquette isnt important here. Your future employment is. If you dont "need" him, and you can deal with his continued harassment until you leave, which seems inevitable, (his harassment) whether he is or isnt invited, then dont bother inviting him.

Of course this all totally goes out the window if he is being physically inappropriate! (which I know you didnt indicate)

[Deleted User] · June 2013

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[Deleted User] · June 2013

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[Deleted User] · June 2013

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annathy03 · June 2013

Congratulations on the new job! That's fantastic!!!

And like others have said, no way I'd be inviting him now.

southernbelle0915 · June 2013

GREAT news!!! What a relief!

I hope you do something fun this weekend to celebrate new professional beginnings and the lifted stress of not working for that jerk anymore! Good riddance!

Jen4948 · June 2013

Congratulations on your new job! Best wishes!

UPDATE-Possibly uninvite an evil boss?

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