Babies do not ruin occasions. Parents/caretakers of those babies ruin (and I use that word lightly) occasions. @Jen4948 I see what you are saying. But the baby themselves are not ruining anything. They are just doing what babies do. It is the parents/caretakers of those babies that could make an event a little less nice by not immediately removing the child from the situation. I have been to a few weddings where a baby would start crying. The weddings where that sticks out in my mind the most is the one's where the parent/caretaker did not take the child out of the ceremony area but rather just let it cry while the wedding was going on. That is rude. But a few weddings, and I will talk about mine here, my niece began to cry right as our officiant started talking. I, of course, chuckled because she had such perfect timing, but my BIL took her immediately out of the area.
Anyways, the OP has the right to make whatever decision she wants regarding her MOH's kid. And no matter what decision she makes it is not the right or wrong decision, because there is no right or wrong answer in this matter, it is whatever OP wants to do.
Babies do not ruin occasions. Parents/caretakers of those babies ruin (and I use that word lightly) occasions.@Jen4948 I see what you are saying. But the baby themselves are not ruining anything. They are just doing what babies do. It is the parents/caretakers of those babies that could make an event a little less nice by not immediately removing the child from the situation. I have been to a few weddings where a baby would start crying. The weddings where that sticks out in my mind the most is the one's where the parent/caretaker did not take the child out of the ceremony area but rather just let it cry while the wedding was going on. That is rude. But a few weddings, and I will talk about mine here, my niece began to cry right as our officiant started talking. I, of course, chuckled because she had such perfect timing, but my BIL took her immediately out of the area.
Anyways, the OP has the right to make whatever decision she wants regarding her MOH's kid. And no matter what decision she makes it is not the right or wrong decision, because there is no right or wrong answer in this matter, it is whatever OP wants to do.
Oh, I agree. I guess my question is "If the baby's mother is standing up by the bride, can her husband, or mother, or whomever, be counted on to immediately take care of the baby, including taking it out, if necessary, without calling undue attention to it?" Because the answer can't be no. That would be rude and unfair to all concerned, baby included.
I guess part of the reason this is an issue for me is that I hate to see babies not taken care of when they need it. And in certain circumstances, such as weddings, make the issue a delicate one.
@Jen4948 you can never be sure if a parent/caretaker is going to immediately remove the crying baby or not. You just have to hope they have the sense to do so. If not, then it looks bad on the parent/caretaker, not the baby and not the bride.
And I agree, I am not a big fan of children, but I absolutely hate seeing a baby who is crying being almost ignored by their parent. I just want to shake the parent and be like, "this is how a baby gets your attention that it needs something, pay attention!!!"
@Jen4948 you can never be sure if a parent/caretaker is going to immediately remove the crying baby or not. You just have to hope they have the sense to do so. If not, then it looks bad on the parent/caretaker, not the baby and not the bride.
And I agree, I am not a big fan of children, but I absolutely hate seeing a baby who is crying being almost ignored by their parent. I just want to shake the parent and be like, "this is how a baby gets your attention that it needs something, pay attention!!!"
@Maggie0829, that's how it should be, but unfortunately the couple does get blamed, however irrationally, for anything that goes wrong during their wedding...even if it was caused by someone else's nursing baby.
@Jen4948 - I know that I would never blame the bride and groom if a child/baby starts crying or acting out during the ceremony. The couple is not in control of that child nor did they do anything to "set the kid off" so to speak. Now if I didn't have a chair and I had to pay for my drink, then I would blame the couple. But I don't know many people who would blame the bride and groom for a misbehaving or hungry kid that wasn't taken out immediately by that kids parent. But I can guarantee that many of those same people would blame the parent in question.
@Jen4948 you can never be sure if a parent/caretaker is going to immediately remove the crying baby or not. You just have to hope they have the sense to do so. If not, then it looks bad on the parent/caretaker, not the baby and not the bride.
And I agree, I am not a big fan of children, but I absolutely hate seeing a baby who is crying being almost ignored by their parent. I just want to shake the parent and be like, "this is how a baby gets your attention that it needs something, pay attention!!!"
@Maggie0829, that's how it should be, but unfortunately the couple does get blamed, however irrationally, for anything that goes wrong during their wedding...even if it was caused by someone else's nursing baby.
The type of person who would get mad at the couple for someone else's baby crying at a wedding (if such a crazy irrational person exists) would likely get mad about 50 other things outside the couple's control at a wedding (like the weather). It's not something I would tell the couple to worry about because that type of person is never going to be pleased.
Don't worry guys, I have the Wedding Police AND the Whambulance on speed dial!
@Jen4948 - I know that I would never blame the bride and groom if a child/baby starts crying or acting out during the ceremony. The couple is not in control of that child nor did they do anything to "set the kid off" so to speak. Now if I didn't have a chair and I had to pay for my drink, then I would blame the couple. But I don't know many people who would blame the bride and groom for a misbehaving or hungry kid that wasn't taken out immediately by that kids parent. But I can guarantee that many of those same people would blame the parent in question.
I wouldn't either, but this assumes that most people are rational. Most are, but there are those who do hold the wrong people responsible.
There's also the fact that the couple can't force the baby's parents or caretakers to deal with the baby's problems, and if they do nothing (and worse, sit there and smile about it or say something like "isn't it cute,") etiquette doesn't give any recourse against the offending parent/caretaker. Having to sit near to an uncared-for-baby and a parent who's oblivious to or deliberately ignoring its needs really does make for an unpleasant experience-regardless of who's responsible. It's not always avoidable or even ignorable.
But if nursing mothers always get a free pass to bring their babies, it's a losing situation for everyone else if someone doesn't take care of the baby. And I think that's what ticks people off-one person got an etiquette "get out of jail free" card while subjecting everyone else to the problems of their baby.
When I have occasionally been at weddings etc with fussy babies/toddlers, I have found that all it takes is for a few guests to turn around and give the parent/guardian a glare for them to get up and deal with their chidlren. I have no problem being that person.
You need to be invited to all weddings with babies/toddlers, then, so you can do glare duty!
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The problem with this is, it opens floodgates for everyone coming to want to bring their kids. Their argument will go: "If I'm close enough to you to be invited to your wedding, I'm close enough to you that you should invite my kids." Even if they're not in the bridal party.
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The problem with this is, it opens floodgates for everyone coming to want to bring their kids. Their argument will go: "If I'm close enough to you to be invited to your wedding, I'm close enough to you that you should invite my kids." Even if they're not in the bridal party.
Once again, how would anyone else know? You address invitations to those you are inviting. If someone RSVPs with extra guests (such as children), you inform them that the invitation was intended just for the couple (or the one parent as the case may be). You don't tell them that this is a "no kid wedding" or anything to that. You just state that the invitation was for the people it was addressed to and you can't accommodate extra guests.
Who else is on the guest list is none of your guests business.
Don't worry guys, I have the Wedding Police AND the Whambulance on speed dial!
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The problem with this is, it opens floodgates for everyone coming to want to bring their kids. Their argument will go: "If I'm close enough to you to be invited to your wedding, I'm close enough to you that you should invite my kids." Even if they're not in the bridal party.
Do you just really hate children or something? I agree with you that she certainly doesn't have to let the children come, but all of your responses in this thread have been "nope, don't let her do it, it doesn't matter how she feels." Ideally, all you should have to say (as you suggested) is that you're not allowing any children, but we all know it's never that simple - not when this is your maid of honor - the woman who is supposed to be your best friend.
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The problem with this is, it opens floodgates for everyone coming to want to bring their kids. Their argument will go: "If I'm close enough to you to be invited to your wedding, I'm close enough to you that you should invite my kids." Even if they're not in the bridal party.
Once again, how would anyone else know? You address invitations to those you are inviting. If someone RSVPs with extra guests (such as children), you inform them that the invitation was intended just for the couple (or the one parent as the case may be). You don't tell them that this is a "no kid wedding" or anything to that. You just state that the invitation was for the people it was addressed to and you can't accommodate extra guests.
Who else is on the guest list is none of your guests business.
They'd know if they asked about their own kids and were told it's a "kid-free" wedding and came to see that there was a baby there.
I think sometimes parents of babies need to just accept that the babies aren't invited-even if the mother is the MOH.
The only kids that will be attending our wedding are my fiancé's nieces and nephews. We wanted a child free wedding, but I realized that if we didn't invite the nieces/nephews, my fiancé's 2 brothers and sister would not have been able to attend the wedding as they all live12+ hours away. Once we decided to have some children at the wedding, I told my MOH she could bring her son. She declined, but I think that if someone is close enough to you to be your maid of honor, you should let her bring her kids if you are having a couple of kids at the wedding. If you said absolutely NO kids will be at the wedding then I wouldn't think you would have to.
The problem with this is, it opens floodgates for everyone coming to want to bring their kids. Their argument will go: "If I'm close enough to you to be invited to your wedding, I'm close enough to you that you should invite my kids." Even if they're not in the bridal party.
Once again, how would anyone else know? You address invitations to those you are inviting. If someone RSVPs with extra guests (such as children), you inform them that the invitation was intended just for the couple (or the one parent as the case may be). You don't tell them that this is a "no kid wedding" or anything to that. You just state that the invitation was for the people it was addressed to and you can't accommodate extra guests.
Who else is on the guest list is none of your guests business.
They'd know if they asked about their own kids and were told it's a "kid-free" wedding and came to see that there was a baby there.
I think sometimes parents of babies need to just accept that the babies aren't invited-even if the mother is the MOH.
Right, but there's no reason why they would have been told it was "kid free." We are only having like two kids at our wedding. If other people RSVP with their children we will call them and inform them that the invitation was just for them, the same way we would if they RSVPd with a friend or their mother or something. They don't get an explanation of why their kids weren't invited. The words "kid free" don't need to be spoken or written to have a kid free event.
I'm not saying the OP has to invite the MOH's baby, but it's her wedding, she can invite/not invite whomever she chooses. If someone is mad that their special snowflakes weren't invited but the MOH's baby was there, that's on them not on the bride. Life isn't fair. Just because someone else's children were invited doesn't mean that yours get to come too.
Don't worry guys, I have the Wedding Police AND the Whambulance on speed dial!
Personally, I would stick with the original intention to not invite children, whether they belong to the MOH or not. If you decided not to invite them to begin with, you had a reason so don't change your mind. Offer her options, babysitters, a nearby location that's not the actual wedding space, whatever, but don't change your mind without a VERY good reason. Offering her possible solutions is being a friend. Caving to her demands is being a doormat.
Personally, I would stick with the original intention to not invite children, whether they belong to the MOH or not. If you decided not to invite them to begin with, you had a reason so don't change your mind. Offer her options, babysitters, a nearby location that's not the actual wedding space, whatever, but don't change your mind without a VERY good reason. Offering her possible solutions is being a friend. Caving to her demands is being a doormat.
I don't think the MOH has issued any demands. I think he MOH is being polite by asking the question before assuming, and by offering a solution herself. She's prepared for the bride to say no.
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marry a Muppet Overlord.
Maybe "demands" wasn't the right word. As I understood it, OP had tried to tell her politely that the kids weren't invited but MOH was still pushing for them to be excepted. I believe the phrasing was "guilting" OP into it...
Maybe "demands" wasn't the right word. As I understood it, OP had tried to tell her politely that the kids weren't invited but MOH was still pushing for them to be excepted. I believe the phrasing was "guilting" OP into it...
I don't know that the MOH was guilting the OP into it. Since the OP has invited the MOH with her husband and the MOH's mother, it's reasonable for the MOH to let the bride know that one of her invited guests won't be able to come under the circumstances. I see it as her being upfront, even if she's hoping for the outcome she wants. It's better than the bride getting surprised by a "No" RSVP from the MOH's mom with a passive-aggressive note saying that she would love to be there but she has to baby-sit.
I know that some people think it was rude of the MOH to ask to bring the kids in the first place, but I would do the same thing if I was her (or tactfully word it like, "Will the kids be invited?") because I would rather ask than not and find out later that the bride would have happily said yes. Just like if I narrowed my childcare options down to my husband and my mom, I would let the bride, my best friend, know that, too, even if I didn't expect her to change the rules for me, just so she wouldn't be surprised when someone she thought was coming wound up declining.
Maybe "demands" wasn't the right word. As I understood it, OP had tried to tell her politely that the kids weren't invited but MOH was still pushing for them to be excepted. I believe the phrasing was "guilting" OP into it...
I don't know that the MOH was guilting the OP into it. Since the OP has invited the MOH with her husband and the MOH's mother, it's reasonable for the MOH to let the bride know that one of her invited guests won't be able to come under the circumstances. I see it as her being upfront, even if she's hoping for the outcome she wants. It's better than the bride getting surprised by a "No" RSVP from the MOH's mom with a passive-aggressive note saying that she would love to be there but she has to baby-sit.
I know that some people think it was rude of the MOH to ask to bring the kids in the first place, but I would do the same thing if I was her (or tactfully word it like, "Will the kids be invited?") because I would rather ask than not and find out later that the bride would have happily said yes. Just like if I narrowed my childcare options down to my husband and my mom, I would let the bride, my best friend, know that, too, even if I didn't expect her to change the rules for me, just so she wouldn't be surprised when someone she thought was coming wound up declining.
It's not the bride's fault (or anyone else's) that the MOH doesn't trust other people to babysit for her.
When I was a kid, my parents found plenty of people, not related to them (all their relatives lived hundreds of miles away), to babysit me and my brother, and we were never molested, neglected, or mistreated in any way. If we acted out towards our babysitters, they had the right to do whatever was necessary, short of corporal punishment, to make us behave. Our parents made the boundaries very clear to us and our babysitters, and that was that. No problems.
The fact that this MOH or other parents aren't willing to trust anyone else to take care of their children is their own problem, not something that the couple needs to plan their wedding around.
I'd say no. A no kids wedding is a no kids wedding. Whatever you have decided is your reason for no kids is your business and everyone, especially your MOH who is supposed to be your right hand woman, should respect that. Exceptions are exceptions regardless of who you make them for and are always a bad decision.
On a personal note...My FI and I both have young cousins with behavioral disabilities on both sides and expect push back form these families about not inviting them. Sorry but I'm not making exceptions for kids that are guaranteed to have outbursts during my wedding over well behaved children. We love kids and our families, we just decided to firmly have an adults only wedding and there is nothing wrong with that.
Maybe "demands" wasn't the right word. As I understood it, OP had tried to tell her politely that the kids weren't invited but MOH was still pushing for them to be excepted. I believe the phrasing was "guilting" OP into it...
I don't know that the MOH was guilting the OP into it. Since the OP has invited the MOH with her husband and the MOH's mother, it's reasonable for the MOH to let the bride know that one of her invited guests won't be able to come under the circumstances. I see it as her being upfront, even if she's hoping for the outcome she wants. It's better than the bride getting surprised by a "No" RSVP from the MOH's mom with a passive-aggressive note saying that she would love to be there but she has to baby-sit.
I know that some people think it was rude of the MOH to ask to bring the kids in the first place, but I would do the same thing if I was her (or tactfully word it like, "Will the kids be invited?") because I would rather ask than not and find out later that the bride would have happily said yes. Just like if I narrowed my childcare options down to my husband and my mom, I would let the bride, my best friend, know that, too, even if I didn't expect her to change the rules for me, just so she wouldn't be surprised when someone she thought was coming wound up declining.
Actually, I'm just going off what the OP said. OP said she felt her MOH was guilting her into allowing the MOH's children to come to the wedding. She never said she invited the mother of the MOH to the wedding, just that the mother might have to babysit if she couldn't bring her kids or MOH's husband, whom I assume was invited as that was proper etiquette might have to stay home. I don't know for sure the OP's MOH is guilting her into it intentionally, I'm just assuming the OP knows her situation better than we do.
OP told MOH that no kids other than the flower girls are invited, yet the MOH still asked for an exception. Personally, I see that as being awful, putting her friend (OP) on the spot, not "being upfront". And remember, being best friends works both ways. MOH could look at all her childcare options seriously and make plans to have them taken care of for HER best friend's wedding. MOH could respect her best friend's decision about who is and is not allowed at the wedding but she's instead putting pressure on OP to change her mind.
1) I would not make the exception. I assume that other parents will have to find babysitters for their children. Your MOH is not special in that regard. Some people do not like hiring babysitters; my aunt and uncle didn't attend my brother's wedding because children were not invited and they had NEVER been without their children (like, never ... and the oldest one was 14!). However, "I don't want to hire a babysitter," or, "My mom will have to babysit!" is not your problem.
2) I understand wanting to make an exception for a great friend, especially if that friend is your MOH. Instead of making an exception by letting her bring her kids, I would make an exception by offering to pay the full cost of babysitting, or whatever other costs are incurred by leaving her children at home. That way, she is not further inconvenienced financially (since as your MOH she's probably already spending a lot of money), and you're still making an exception for her (since you will not be doing this for other guests).
3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
HOWEVER, you will notice that the reasons I don't want kids at my wedding has nothing to do with their parents. I'm not going to insist that if my cousins attend that my aunts and uncles won't be able to properly focus on having fun. I don't believe I'm giving parents the night off (they can CHOOSE to leave the kids at home and take the night off if they want!). It's not about making sure that guests are properly present and not distracted for the wedding. It's because some weddings are not child-friendly, and it is not the obligation of the bride and groom to MAKE a wedding child-friendly if they can't afford it, or if there aren't a ton of young children.
I don't know what you've told your MOH already about why you don't want her to bring her kids (or, in general, why you're having a child-free wedding). But try to reframe the reasons so it's not about doing parents a favor/making sure parents aren't distracted while they're at the wedding.
@jen4948 I don't know why you are so against babies and feel they're the ones that will ruin a wedding. What about the old man who farts so bad you need a gas mask? What about the women with allergies who sneezes every 5 seconds? The pair of 13 year old girls who sit and whisper throughout the whole ceremony? Anyone can "ruin" a wedding (I say "ruin" because I don't believe that type of stuff ruins anything). As a guest you just have to hope the other guests have enough common sense to remove themselves when necessary and to be courteous. So yes, some parents, and other guests, aren't that smart or nice, but most are IMO. If you're so worried about your experience being ruined I wonder why you'd go at all.
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3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
That's not a child problem- that's a parent problem, and as a guest at your wedding I'd be annoyed and mad as hell if their parents allowed them to behave that way.
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
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3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
That's not a child problem- that's a parent problem, and as a guest at your wedding I'd be annoyed and mad as hell if their parents allowed them to behave that way.
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
I mean, yes, it's a parent problem in the sense that some people are not any good at teaching their children to behave respectfully. The point I was making was that the OP shouldn't frame it as, "We're having a child-free wedding because we're doing you a favor/we want you to not be distracted by your children."
The cousins I'm thinking about in particular will hopefully not be a problem by the time the wedding rolls around, but we'll probably have to sit down the their parents and explain what we're concerned about. My aunt and uncle know that their children are incapable of behaving, so it's not going to come as a surprise to them that we're worried about some of their kids crawling under tables and grabbing people's legs.
@jen4948 I don't know why you are so against babies and feel they're the ones that will ruin a wedding. What about the old man who farts so bad you need a gas mask? What about the women with allergies who sneezes every 5 seconds? The pair of 13 year old girls who sit and whisper throughout the whole ceremony? Anyone can "ruin" a wedding (I say "ruin" because I don't believe that type of stuff ruins anything). As a guest you just have to hope the other guests have enough common sense to remove themselves when necessary and to be courteous. So yes, some parents, and other guests, aren't that smart or nice, but most are IMO. If you're so worried about your experience being ruined I wonder why you'd go at all.
The issue is that if the bride and groom didn't want to invite any children, regardless of how old they are, then that's their right. Regardless of whose children they are, how old they are, how well-behaved they are, and if there's anyone else to take care of them.
If you read the whole thread, many others also take this position.
So stop trying to make this "my issue" or wonder why I do anything. That's none of your business.
3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
That's not a child problem- that's a parent problem, and as a guest at your wedding I'd be annoyed and mad as hell if their parents allowed them to behave that way.
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
I mean, yes, it's a parent problem in the sense that some people are not any good at teaching their children to behave respectfully. The point I was making was that the OP shouldn't frame it as, "We're having a child-free wedding because we're doing you a favor/we want you to not be distracted by your children."
The cousins I'm thinking about in particular will hopefully not be a problem by the time the wedding rolls around, but we'll probably have to sit down the their parents and explain what we're concerned about. My aunt and uncle know that their children are incapable of behaving, so it's not going to come as a surprise to them that we're worried about some of their kids crawling under tables and grabbing people's legs.
Do your Aunt and Uncle actively try to supervise your cousins at events like weddings, or are they of the mindset that @MuppetOverlord mentioned where they assume they can "check out" because there are so many other ppl around to watch their kids?
As long as they are actively running around after your cousins and correcting their bad behavior, them IMO that is ok. Kids can be a handful! But if they let their kids run amok and do nothing about it, that's where I'd enlist the help of a DOC.
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
That's not a child problem- that's a parent problem, and as a guest at your wedding I'd be annoyed and mad as hell if their parents allowed them to behave that way.
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
I mean, yes, it's a parent problem in the sense that some people are not any good at teaching their children to behave respectfully. The point I was making was that the OP shouldn't frame it as, "We're having a child-free wedding because we're doing you a favor/we want you to not be distracted by your children."
The cousins I'm thinking about in particular will hopefully not be a problem by the time the wedding rolls around, but we'll probably have to sit down the their parents and explain what we're concerned about. My aunt and uncle know that their children are incapable of behaving, so it's not going to come as a surprise to them that we're worried about some of their kids crawling under tables and grabbing people's legs.
Do your Aunt and Uncle actively try to supervise your cousins at events like weddings, or are they of the mindset that @MuppetOverlord mentioned where they assume they can "check out" because there are so many other ppl around to watch their kids?
As long as they are actively running around after your cousins and correcting their bad behavior, them IMO that is ok. Kids can be a handful! But if they let their kids run amok and do nothing about it, that's where I'd enlist the help of a DOC.
They do this very half-ass thing where they'll sort of reprimand their kids, but then they give up. Their kids have learned that if they keep doing whatever they want, there's no real punishment. Additionally, they've learned that if they ask for something enough times, their parents' "no" will turn into a "fine."
My aunt and uncle hire au pairs, which doesn't solve the problem. They get a new one every year (it's an exchange program), but the kids have learned how to circumvent the au pair to still get their way, and the au pair is encouraged to come to family events and bring a friend with them. The result is that my aunt and uncle and the au pair are all busy being social and the kids are running around.
Again, I'm trying to focus here on the OP's situation. In terms of my own, if my aunt and uncle are bringing their kids, we'll have to talk to them about the expectations, and we will likely ask them to leave early with their kids if their kids are misbehaving.
3) You need to change your mindset about why kids aren't invited to the wedding. I'd love a childfree wedding because I have some pain-in-the-ass little cousins who, even though the youngest is now 7 years old, still run all over the place, crawl under tables and poke at people's legs, break china, refuse to sit still or be quiet for more than a few seconds, and by all accounts annoy the hell out of everyone. We aren't planning to have any sort of child-appropriate activities at our reception, so there will be nothing for them to do except annoy everyone. I also don't want to pay to have these annoying cousins at my wedding when I could instead have a few more of my friends attend.
(My partner wants to invite all of our little cousins, though, and it's non-negotiable. So this'll be fun).
That's not a child problem- that's a parent problem, and as a guest at your wedding I'd be annoyed and mad as hell if their parents allowed them to behave that way.
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
I mean, yes, it's a parent problem in the sense that some people are not any good at teaching their children to behave respectfully. The point I was making was that the OP shouldn't frame it as, "We're having a child-free wedding because we're doing you a favor/we want you to not be distracted by your children."
The cousins I'm thinking about in particular will hopefully not be a problem by the time the wedding rolls around, but we'll probably have to sit down the their parents and explain what we're concerned about. My aunt and uncle know that their children are incapable of behaving, so it's not going to come as a surprise to them that we're worried about some of their kids crawling under tables and grabbing people's legs.
Do your Aunt and Uncle actively try to supervise your cousins at events like weddings, or are they of the mindset that @MuppetOverlord mentioned where they assume they can "check out" because there are so many other ppl around to watch their kids?
As long as they are actively running around after your cousins and correcting their bad behavior, them IMO that is ok. Kids can be a handful! But if they let their kids run amok and do nothing about it, that's where I'd enlist the help of a DOC.
They do this very half-ass thing where they'll sort of reprimand their kids, but then they give up. Their kids have learned that if they keep doing whatever they want, there's no real punishment. Additionally, they've learned that if they ask for something enough times, their parents' "no" will turn into a "fine."
My aunt and uncle hire au pairs, which doesn't solve the problem. They get a new one every year (it's an exchange program), but the kids have learned how to circumvent the au pair to still get their way, and the au pair is encouraged to come to family events and bring a friend with them. The result is that my aunt and uncle and the au pair are all busy being social and the kids are running around.
Again, I'm trying to focus here on the OP's situation. In terms of my own, if my aunt and uncle are bringing their kids, we'll have to talk to them about the expectations, and we will likely ask them to leave early with their kids if their kids are misbehaving.
I see. Well good luck!
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
To OP, You don't say how long this has been going on? Did MOH, know from the time you asked her to be MOH that it was a no kids wedding? Or did this just come up now after planning for some time? Regardless, it is your wedding and she has already offered to you to make the decision. So make one and move on, only you can make yourself feel guilty about it.
Re: MOH Wants to Bring Her Kids
I guess part of the reason this is an issue for me is that I hate to see babies not taken care of when they need it. And in certain circumstances, such as weddings, make the issue a delicate one.
There's also the fact that the couple can't force the baby's parents or caretakers to deal with the baby's problems, and if they do nothing (and worse, sit there and smile about it or say something like "isn't it cute,") etiquette doesn't give any recourse against the offending parent/caretaker. Having to sit near to an uncared-for-baby and a parent who's oblivious to or deliberately ignoring its needs really does make for an unpleasant experience-regardless of who's responsible. It's not always avoidable or even ignorable.
But if nursing mothers always get a free pass to bring their babies, it's a losing situation for everyone else if someone doesn't take care of the baby. And I think that's what ticks people off-one person got an etiquette "get out of jail free" card while subjecting everyone else to the problems of their baby.
I think sometimes parents of babies need to just accept that the babies aren't invited-even if the mother is the MOH.
I don't think the MOH has issued any demands. I think he MOH is being polite by asking the question before assuming, and by offering a solution herself. She's prepared for the bride to say no.
You'll never be subject to a cash bar, gap, potluck wedding, or b-list if you marry a Muppet Overlord.
I don't know that the MOH was guilting the OP into it. Since the OP has invited the MOH with her husband and the MOH's mother, it's reasonable for the MOH to let the bride know that one of her invited guests won't be able to come under the circumstances. I see it as her being upfront, even if she's hoping for the outcome she wants. It's better than the bride getting surprised by a "No" RSVP from the MOH's mom with a passive-aggressive note saying that she would love to be there but she has to baby-sit.
I know that some people think it was rude of the MOH to ask to bring the kids in the first place, but I would do the same thing if I was her (or tactfully word it like, "Will the kids be invited?") because I would rather ask than not and find out later that the bride would have happily said yes. Just like if I narrowed my childcare options down to my husband and my mom, I would let the bride, my best friend, know that, too, even if I didn't expect her to change the rules for me, just so she wouldn't be surprised when someone she thought was coming wound up declining.
When I was a kid, my parents found plenty of people, not related to them (all their relatives lived hundreds of miles away), to babysit me and my brother, and we were never molested, neglected, or mistreated in any way. If we acted out towards our babysitters, they had the right to do whatever was necessary, short of corporal punishment, to make us behave. Our parents made the boundaries very clear to us and our babysitters, and that was that. No problems.
The fact that this MOH or other parents aren't willing to trust anyone else to take care of their children is their own problem, not something that the couple needs to plan their wedding around.
OP told MOH that no kids other than the flower girls are invited, yet the MOH still asked for an exception. Personally, I see that as being awful, putting her friend (OP) on the spot, not "being upfront". And remember, being best friends works both ways. MOH could look at all her childcare options seriously and make plans to have them taken care of for HER best friend's wedding. MOH could respect her best friend's decision about who is and is not allowed at the wedding but she's instead putting pressure on OP to change her mind.
After 6 years and 2 boys, finally tying the knot on October 27th, 2013!
Do you have a DOC that you could give a heads up about these problem parents? That way if the kids start acting up and no one is doing anything about it, the DOC rather than you and your FI can approach the parents and ask them to get their kids in check or leave.
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
If you read the whole thread, many others also take this position.
So stop trying to make this "my issue" or wonder why I do anything. That's none of your business.
As long as they are actively running around after your cousins and correcting their bad behavior, them IMO that is ok. Kids can be a handful! But if they let their kids run amok and do nothing about it, that's where I'd enlist the help of a DOC.
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."