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NWR: big sister rage

This is mostly a vent, but I'm open to suggestions.

CN: my sister is getting evicted for no good reason even though she pays her rent; I'm really pissed at her landlord company because they are assholes; we're thinking about getting a place all together but that's stressful, too.

My sister lives in a shithole apartment with her roommate, C.  The place really is a dump; she had an opportunity to move in with us for the same rent (we would have let her move in for the difference to add a second bedroom), but she wanted to be independent and have her own place.

Well.  In June she paid her rent online but apparently it didn't go through and she redid the payment on 6/14.  Then a few days later, after her rent went through, she and C got an eviction notice.  C marched down to the management office and gave them a piece of his mind.  According to him, the management office confirmed they received the rent and said they would drop the eviction proceeding.

Fast forward to today.  Sis comes home and finds a warrant of eviction stuck to her front door, including an order to vacate within three days and and authority for the marshal to dispossess her and C.  As far as I can tell, the management company either lied to C or just fucked up and continued the eviction proceeding anyway.

I advised her to run to Legal Aid first thing tomorrow morning, with every relevant piece of paper she can find.  Hopefully they can get a stay of eviction for her and work it out.  But at this point, it's obvious her management company are a bunch of asshole slumlords and she just wants to be out of that place.  I can't blame her.

First off, I'm just fucking pissed that her landlord is getting away with this shit, and I bet they have done this to a lot of tenants.  My sister is comparatively more privileged than most of her neighbors, has some college under her belt, and a law graduate sister who can read the legalese to her.  The company told C that it's their policy to start eviction proceedings after rent is 10 days late, without even calling the tenant or knocking on their door.  Not only is this illegal, but it's a total asshole move.  They'd rather just kick people out than even try to contact them.

Second, we are now considering trying to all find a place together.  I like the idea of moving somewhere else and saving some money; after we get married Sis can move out and we'll use the second bedroom as an office and guest room.  But we'd have to break our lease and I don't really want to incur extra fees unless we find a fantastic deal.  Also moving sucks ass.

I'm full of big sister rage, and sort of pissed I'm not a licensed attorney yet because otherwise I'd march my ass down there so fast that landlord's head would spin.

Gah.  Anybody else have experience with eviction? My poor sister is so upset.
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Re: NWR: big sister rage

  • No, but I am raging for you! She should definitely fight it if only to give herself more time to find something better! It's fucking illegal!

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  • Even though she wants out of the place she should still fight.  She doesn't want this to show up on her credit report and have it screw her when she is trying to find a new place.  I had a friend who got evicted and the only way she could get a new place was to have someone sign the lease for her.  
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  • mysticl said:
    Even though she wants out of the place she should still fight.  She doesn't want this to show up on her credit report and have it screw her when she is trying to find a new place.  I had a friend who got evicted and the only way she could get a new place was to have someone sign the lease for her.  
    Yes, this is our biggest worry.  Now that there is a judgment against her she needs to have it vacated even if she does move out.  It's such bullshit.
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  • She's lucky to have you!
  • I thought that landlords (at least in Massachusetts, not sure what state you are in) could start eviction proceedings when rent is10 days late, but as long as you pay withing 30 days, they can't continue. I also thought it was very hard to actually get people evicted. Definitely not one month.  But this is probably state specific.  It definitely doesn't sound like the management company is going about it the correct way.
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  • I thought that landlords (at least in Massachusetts, not sure what state you are in) could start eviction proceedings when rent is10 days late, but as long as you pay withing 30 days, they can't continue. I also thought it was very hard to actually get people evicted. Definitely not one month.  But this is probably state specific.  It definitely doesn't sound like the management company is going about it the correct way.
    The problem is that if people can't afford to pay their rent they probably don't have the resources to fight.  
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  • theexactleetheexactlee member
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    edited July 2014
    We had an eviction notice on our door in New York city. It was a nightmare. The situation was far different from yours but yes, we retained a lawyer. The eviction was not on us, it was on the man who actually owned the apartment who we paid our rent to. Then he paid his rant tio the owner. He stopped paying his side. Which btw, we paid 1800 and he paid 330 so wtf dude.
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  • I'm so mad for her! Stupid renting.
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  • Oh man!  I have no advice for you, but seriously.  You can pretty much do whatever you want to me and I'll just shrug it off...

     

    But mess with my little sister and I'll have your head.

    **The OMH formerly known as jsangel1018**
  • Yeah, I feel like we are missing some details. They can't evict someone without even contacting them after TEN DAYS. That is just ridiculous.
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  • That is very frustrating! I don't doubt the story but do you think there might be more to it? Eviction is a difficult and expensive process for the owners.
  • I don't have any advice but I would be putting on my big sister pants too if this were happening to my brother! This makes me angry for you!

  • sarahufl said:
    Yeah, I feel like we are missing some details. They can't evict someone without even contacting them after TEN DAYS. That is just ridiculous.
    They could if nobody has ever called their bluff and just believed whatever notice the douchenozzle put on their door. I doubt most tenants realize how many laws are tied up in a real eviction and what the process entails. 

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  • scribe95 said:
    sarahufl said:
    Yeah, I feel like we are missing some details. They can't evict someone without even contacting them after TEN DAYS. That is just ridiculous.
    They could if nobody has ever called their bluff and just believed whatever notice the douchenozzle put on their door. I doubt most tenants realize how many laws are tied up in a real eviction and what the process entails. 
    But if they are getting paid what purpose/reason would landlords have for regularly kicking out tenants for no reason? They have to then screen new renters; pay the costs of the eviction proceeding. It doesn't make sense. 

    I'm just thinking the sibling maybe has had other issues paying and this was a last straw type thing. Also there is another option - maybe C the roommate lied to the sister about "straightening it out." Just doesn't make sense.
    I agree with you.    Evictions are often costly for a landlord, ten days late on a normally regularly paying tenant would be ridiculous.

    I also feel like there is more to the story and C might be that missing piece.






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  • scribe95 said:
    sarahufl said:
    Yeah, I feel like we are missing some details. They can't evict someone without even contacting them after TEN DAYS. That is just ridiculous.
    They could if nobody has ever called their bluff and just believed whatever notice the douchenozzle put on their door. I doubt most tenants realize how many laws are tied up in a real eviction and what the process entails. 
    But if they are getting paid what purpose/reason would landlords have for regularly kicking out tenants for no reason? They have to then screen new renters; pay the costs of the eviction proceeding. It doesn't make sense. 

    I'm just thinking the sibling maybe has had other issues paying and this was a last straw type thing. Also there is another option - maybe C the roommate lied to the sister about "straightening it out." Just doesn't make sense.
    Definitely possible, but it's also possible they had the opportunity to rent it to someone for more money, or wanted to rent it to family, or any other number of shady reasons. There's definitely a piece of the story missing somewhere, but I could easily see a shady landlord getting rid of people he just didn't want there pretty easily if the tenant wasn't familiar with their rights. If he's getting unassuming/uninformed/trusting tenants to believe that a note on the door and threats of harming their credit is all it takes to kick them out, there wouldn't be any eviction proceedings to pay for.

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  • lyndausvi said:
    scribe95 said:
    sarahufl said:
    Yeah, I feel like we are missing some details. They can't evict someone without even contacting them after TEN DAYS. That is just ridiculous.
    They could if nobody has ever called their bluff and just believed whatever notice the douchenozzle put on their door. I doubt most tenants realize how many laws are tied up in a real eviction and what the process entails. 
    But if they are getting paid what purpose/reason would landlords have for regularly kicking out tenants for no reason? They have to then screen new renters; pay the costs of the eviction proceeding. It doesn't make sense. 

    I'm just thinking the sibling maybe has had other issues paying and this was a last straw type thing. Also there is another option - maybe C the roommate lied to the sister about "straightening it out." Just doesn't make sense.
    I agree with you.    Evictions are often costly for a landlord, ten days late on a normally regularly paying tenant would be ridiculous.

    I also feel like there is more to the story and C might be that missing piece.
    I am a landlord. My tenants last year were always HOPELESSLY late with the rent. But they always paid it. My house is in a college town and you just CAN'T rent it after August. For me, I was happy to accept the late payment just to ensure I actually got it.

    No way would I bother with eviction proceedings over a 10 day late payment. No chance.
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  • The only thing that I can add, because it does sound like something is missing from this story, is that if you have a larger unit available in your current building, you might be able to move into that one without breaking your current lease.  You would need to speak with your management office about that.
  • JC, you aren't a lawyer yet, but that doesn't really stop you from going there and yelling at them, does it? Of course it would be unethical to state or imply that you ARE a licensed lawyer already, but I imagine that a professional-looking, cutthroat lady in a suit spouting legalese in a high volume might actually yield some impressive results...
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  • JC, you aren't a lawyer yet, but that doesn't really stop you from going there and yelling at them, does it? Of course it would be unethical to state or imply that you ARE a licensed lawyer already, but I imagine that a professional-looking, cutthroat lady in a suit spouting legalese in a high volume might actually yield some impressive results...
    Hell... I have no lawyer training and when I show up anywhere with a raised voice, people listen and get stuff done.  
  • JC, you aren't a lawyer yet, but that doesn't really stop you from going there and yelling at them, does it? Of course it would be unethical to state or imply that you ARE a licensed lawyer already, but I imagine that a professional-looking, cutthroat lady in a suit spouting legalese in a high volume might actually yield some impressive results...
    Hell... I have no lawyer training and when I show up anywhere with a raised voice, people listen and get stuff done.  
    For my 25th birthday, I arranged an outing to a club in the city, and they promised me that guys would be free before 11, as long as they said they were my party. When I got there, I found out that a few of my male friends were charged $30. I marched up to the chick at the entrance and she basically tried to come up with some BS excuse. I think I had an email from someone else at the club confirming that info, and I showed it to her, she still refused. So I got all pissed, raised my voice, and I was like "Listen. I have this information in writing AND I also spoke with someone at your club and they assured me that guys would not be charged as long as they mentioned that they were in my party. Not only do I have it in writing here, but in case you did not know, a verbal contract is binding in the state of New York." Her mouth dropped open and FI started laughing and was like "Bet you didn't see that one coming." She then shook her head, looked at the other hostess chick and was like "Damn. Well I can't argue with that." 

    JC I think you should definitely march in there and give them a piece of your legalese mouth. That's just terrible what is going on with your Sis.
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  • I work in commercial property management in IL.  I can understand a policy of starting eviction proceedings after 10.  An eviction takes FOREVER. We are lucky to get a tenant out in 3 months.  It's usually more like 6+.   And the first step is always a 5 day notice.  That's an official notice to get caught up in rent in 5 days or a court date will be scheduled.  All parties concerned must be informed of the court date too.  I don't do residental, but it sounds like whatever was on your sisters door was not a judgement.  My guess is either the roommate knows more than they are telling, or the landlord is bluffing. 
  • That really sucks for your sister! 
  • I have no advice since I've never dealt with this but, my understanding was evictions take a long time to complete, as in several months. However, I'm sure this varies from state to state but, a month just seems like a really short turn around for an eviction to happen. There has to be something else going on in the background.
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  • I'm on shitty "guest" Wifi and can't quote/ like, but I'll do the best I can to fill in the missing pieces.

    My sister has definitely been 3-4 days late on her rent several times before.  Her payment in June she says she attempted to use their online payment thing and then realized later it never came out of her account, so she paid it when she realized the error-- 14 days late.

    She paid her July rent on June 30th and that payment has gone through.

    I trust C and don't think he would lie, but I do believe he could have misunderstood what they said to him.  I also believe the employee he spoke to could have told him they would drop the eviction, but then either didn't pass the information on or just blatantly lied to placate him.

    An eviction is not expensive if your tenants can't stand up for themselves.  Because Sis and C didn't show up in court, the LL got a default judgment without even having to argue anything.  It's a huge management company and they probably have a lawyer on staff where this is his whole job, so it doesn't cost them anything extra to pursue a particular case; the guy is probably just on staff and spends his whole day in housing court.

    The tenants in Sis' building are basically 100% immigrants who speak limited English and work blue collar jobs.  They probably don't have the language skills or money to really fight the landlord.  So if the landlord often has been screwed by tenants not paying their rent, I can see they would institute a policy to just start eviction proceedings as soon as legally permitted.  It's an asshole move but the process is (as you can see from my post) actually pretty quick here.

    I still don't fully understand their motivation, because even if the eviction itself doesn't cost much to administer, the apartment will still be empty until they can rent it out again.  However, rents here are skyrocketing here as the city becomes more popular, and her apartment is within walking distance of the PATH.  In looking up rents in my own building, I saw the price on our own unit has increased about $500 in the past six months.  So maybe the landlord is willing to have the apartment vacant for a couple weeks in order to jack up the rent for the next tenant.

    She hasn't contacted me yet today about legal aid.  I'm on a break from a practice bar exam in NYC and just texted her to see what's up.

    Oh and for those of you who said I should still show up and be mad: I really can't do that.  I'm not a party to the case nor a lawyer, and by showing up and arguing on her behalf, I'd be giving her legal advice, which would be illegal and prevent me from getting admitted to the bar.
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  • I would definitely march in there in your Lawyer Clothes and your Lawyer Face and spout off your Lawyer Mouth and get them to tell me what the hell is going on. I've spouted off at people messing with my siblings for WAY less, and I don't have Lawyer Clothes, a Lawyer Face, or a Lawyer Mouth.
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  • For those of you wondering about the timing, she was "served" sometime around June 20:

    Once the summons and complaint are served, a trial date is scheduled. The trial date is usually between 10 and 30 days from the date of service. No answer to the complaint is required; rather, the defendant is directed to appear at the trial and state a defense at that time.  http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/the-summary-dispossess-process-in-new-jersey
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    "I'm not a rude bitch.  I'm ten rude bitches in a large coat."

  • I'm on shitty "guest" Wifi and can't quote/ like, but I'll do the best I can to fill in the missing pieces.

    My sister has definitely been 3-4 days late on her rent several times before.  Her payment in June she says she attempted to use their online payment thing and then realized later it never came out of her account, so she paid it when she realized the error-- 14 days late.

    She paid her July rent on June 30th and that payment has gone through.

    I trust C and don't think he would lie, but I do believe he could have misunderstood what they said to him.  I also believe the employee he spoke to could have told him they would drop the eviction, but then either didn't pass the information on or just blatantly lied to placate him.

    An eviction is not expensive if your tenants can't stand up for themselves.  Because Sis and C didn't show up in court, the LL got a default judgment without even having to argue anything.  It's a huge management company and they probably have a lawyer on staff where this is his whole job, so it doesn't cost them anything extra to pursue a particular case; the guy is probably just on staff and spends his whole day in housing court.

    The tenants in Sis' building are basically 100% immigrants who speak limited English and work blue collar jobs.  They probably don't have the language skills or money to really fight the landlord.  So if the landlord often has been screwed by tenants not paying their rent, I can see they would institute a policy to just start eviction proceedings as soon as legally permitted.  It's an asshole move but the process is (as you can see from my post) actually pretty quick here.

    I still don't fully understand their motivation, because even if the eviction itself doesn't cost much to administer, the apartment will still be empty until they can rent it out again.  However, rents here are skyrocketing here as the city becomes more popular, and her apartment is within walking distance of the PATH.  In looking up rents in my own building, I saw the price on our own unit has increased about $500 in the past six months.  So maybe the landlord is willing to have the apartment vacant for a couple weeks in order to jack up the rent for the next tenant.

    She hasn't contacted me yet today about legal aid.  I'm on a break from a practice bar exam in NYC and just texted her to see what's up.

    Oh and for those of you who said I should still show up and be mad: I really can't do that.  I'm not a party to the case nor a lawyer, and by showing up and arguing on her behalf, I'd be giving her legal advice, which would be illegal and prevent me from getting admitted to the bar.
    Ah, shoot. Lawyers have so many rules to follow! (I mean, that's a good thing in general. Just not right this moment).
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  • That's awful!

    I had an attempt made at evicting me from an apartment once for a similar thing. My complex had an online payment system that I didn't want to use because of the ridiculous fees ($10/month each for apartment and parking). Instead, I had an automated check go sent 5 days before the end of each month.

    One month, the checks were cashed on time (I had copies of the canceled checks available online) but I got an eviction notice on the 15th giving me 3 days to be out (I was out of town when this happened so I wasn't packed/etc.). I argued, showed the canceled checks, etc. but I kept being told that the person in charge was on vacation. I was there when the sheriff showed up and showed the information I had collected, the email trail, phone notes, etc.

    I got lucky in that the sheriff wouldn't let them take possession of my stuff. I hired movers and got stuff out 2 days later. I was lucky that I could afford to move elsewhere, though I had to stay with friends for a few weeks while I looked. Ironically, the rental company kept threatening me that I needed to keep my contact, though they continuously denied that they cashed my check. It took me hiring a lawyer to get my security deposit back (last month's rent plus $1K) and to get them to stop leaving me threatening messages.

    Good luck to her! I remember how scary that situation is.
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  • scribe95 said:
    Why didn't they show up in court? At some point your sister is responsible for her own actions and big sister can't fix them. 
    QFT.
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