Venue rights

marissaskisses · October 2015

I am at a complete loss right now, and don't know if the venue can do this. Any insight would be welcomed...

I booked my venue based in large part on the fact that they offered 2 outdoor lots that were good size. This would allow me the ability to have the ceremony and reception outdoors but not in the same "area". I had planned on having a spiral wedding aisle, so a lot of space is needed. Contract was signed back in March and now I find out 8 months before the wedding that they have plans on adding a big barn to the ceremony lot....thus turning my outdoor wedding into a barn wedding. They plan on making this change during winter.....I am at a complete loss...they already have my deposit, the invites are done, so I can't even change venues! Has anyone gone through a situation where a venue has made drastic changes to their facility after you signed a contract? Legally CAN they do that???

artbyallie · October 2015

marissaskisses said:

I am at a complete loss right now, and don't know if the venue can do this. Any insight would be welcomed...

I booked my venue based in large part on the fact that they offered 2 outdoor lots that were good size. This would allow me the ability to have the ceremony and reception outdoors but not in the same "area". I had planned on having a spiral wedding aisle, so a lot of space is needed. Contract was signed back in March and now I find out 8 months before the wedding that they have plans on adding a big barn to the ceremony lot....thus turning my outdoor wedding into a barn wedding. They plan on making this change during winter.....I am at a complete loss...they already have my deposit, the invites are done, so I can't even change venues! Has anyone gone through a situation where a venue has made drastic changes to their facility after you signed a contract? Legally CAN they do that???

...What the hell is a spiral aisle for anyway?

And have you even talked to the venue yet since finding this out?

Also, why did you order invitations more than 8 months out? I just... so many questions.

jacques27 · October 2015

Well, what does your contract say?

I'm going to guess that you're not that rich and powerful so as to have a clause in your contract that states the venue is forbidden from making any property upgrades/changes/improvements until you get married, so you're probably SOL. I can't imagine why your wedding day means they cannot legally do with the property they own what they see fit. Heck, they could close-up shop entirely and sell off the business.

Now, that may mean you have a solid case to get your deposit back if it does in fact mean they are unable to provide exactly what is in your contract. If your contract is so specific that it says they will provide you two completely open spaces X ft. by Y ft. and there will never ever be a barn anywhere in those spaces - then you're golden and can probably get out of the contract without any repercussions and get your deposit back. Lucky for you, eight months is a lot of time to find a new venue and order new invitations - so the "can't" isn't exactly accurate. There's plenty of time to accomplish both of those things.

So, you can:

1. Cancel your contract and change your venue, or

2. Change your vision since whatever a spiral whatever is likely will not affect the comfort of your guests, which really is the most important thing. And on the bright side, unless you already had a solid back-up plan already in place for inclement weather, the barn means you'll probably be covered in that respect and don't have to worry about that anymore.

Either way, get out your contract, review it thoroughly, and then chat with the venue to see what your options are.

marissaskisses · October 2015

For starters, I purchased invites early because our budget is small and there was a killer deal that allowed us to get everything for a very good price. Secondly, since our budget is small, there is no money to simply redo things. .. I'm a planner, EVERYTHING had been planned around an outdoor ceremony, NOT an indoor one. Third, since I don't even live in the same state, finding another venue is not an option as I wouldn't be able to see them. Fourth I found out about the work through the venue rep, now that I have raised concerns he has neglected to reach back out to me. Fifth, I had already put deposits down on tents as a backup plan b, which really won't be needed since it's southern California in June.

Lastly, I have reviewed the contract, and it states we have access to the "property" so basically I'm hosed and I now have to have an indoor wedding when I booked on the presumption I would be able to have an outdoor wedding.

marissaskisses · October 2015

jacques27 said:

Change your vision since whatever a spiral whatever is likely will not affect the comfort of your guests, which really is the most important thing.

Ummm, no. It's my fiance and I's wedding, what's most important is us and what we want (an outdoor wedding). Yes, the seating arrangement doesn't make a difference as to the guests comfort level and yes they are also important...however I'm only doing this once, I don't want any regrets that I didn't get the wedding I wanted. I have worked hard to get that wedding within a tight budget and ensure the guests will be happy.
The venue has pretty much made it to where we get nothing we wanted out of a wedding all with the build of one barn.

ThxSugar · October 2015

Why can't you have the ceremony in the other open space and then the reception in the barn? Have you seen rendering of the plans? They may be saving you money by not having to rent a tent and porta-potties. You can still set up tables and things outside around the barn, but now you have a built in rain plan.

justsie · October 2015

I don't see how getting rid of one space means you can no longer have an outdoor ceremony at all. Plus, considering there are so many reasons why an outdoor ceremony becomes an indoor one (heat, cold, rain, snow, bugs, etc etc) I think your putting a lot of pressure on having something that might end up changing anyway for the comfort of your guests.

lyndausvi · October 2015

You said there were 2 outdoor areas. Why not have the ceremony in the other area and then reception indoors? That way you can get your spiral seating (which is ridiculous in my IMO).

BTW - I wanted a beach wedding. Dreamed of one for as long as I could remember. Booked the perfect venue for a ceremony on the beach. The reception was going to be under a tent. Why? Because no one likes to sit outside in the elements for the entire reception.

Mother nature had other plans. Wedding ended up under the tent too.

marissaskisses · October 2015

The point was I did not want ANYTHING indoors. I booked because they had 2 OUTDOOR lots. Yes they have sent me a photo and the thing is dreadful. The other outdoor lot is not big enough to have the reception and ceremony, so I HAVE TO use the lot with this ugly thing on it. The rep is claiming it's big enough, however having seen it in person, I guarantee it's not.

justsie · October 2015

marissaskisses said:

The point was I did not want ANYTHING indoors. I booked because they had 2 OUTDOOR lots. Yes they have sent me a photo and the thing is dreadful. The other outdoor lot is not big enough to have the reception and ceremony, so I HAVE TO use the lot with this ugly thing on it. The rep is claiming it's big enough, however having seen it in person, I guarantee it's not.

So what would happen if the weather didn't allow you to have it outdoors.........?

marissaskisses · October 2015

Then I would be forced to use the tents I have a deposit on. .. however the chances of that happening are slim and I sure do not want this ugly thing on a nice day!

marissaskisses · October 2015

Honestly, the thing is so hideous, I would RATHER use tents if it came to bad weather.

ThxSugar · October 2015

That is a roof, not a barn. Obviously, they won't have the feed troughs or steel gates (or at least I hope not) but a roof like that won't feel indoors if it has no sides.

How have you seen it in person if you just found out they are planning on building it?

marissaskisses · October 2015

It will have the steel on the sides, and one side will be completely closed per the information provided by the rep. I have seen the upper lot that will remain "outdoors". I have not seen the barn thing.

ThxSugar · October 2015

marissaskisses said:
It will have the steel on the sides, and one side will be completely closed per the information provided by the rep. I have seen the upper lot that will remain "outdoors". I have not seen the barn thing.

That makes more sense. How many people are you inviting? Would there be enough room if you didn't do the spiral aisle? I know it sucks but sometimes you have to accept the hand you are dealt. Your guest don't care about where you get married as long you feed them appropriately for the time of day, protect them from uncomfortable weather elements, have a place for them to sit, and have a little entertainment. I really don't see what you could do in an open field that you can't do under a roof. Except look at the stars, which clouds could obstruct anyways and people can just go outside to do, if they want.

marissaskisses · October 2015

The upper lot has lights in mason jars hanging from trees, the ambiance of it was exactly what I wanted for the reception, as well as it has a dance floor. The lower lot (where the "barn" thing is going) has a much smaller dance floor, NO lights and to top it off the dance floor isn't even in the freaking barn thing! Who's going to go outside to dance?!?!

There is NO ROOM to have the reception and ceremony in the same lot PERIOD, so even if I changed the seating arrangement it would not work. I am forced to use the monstrosity that they are building and paying a good chunk of our budget to be completely UNHAPPY with our venue.

justsie · October 2015

Whelp I guess you are right. Your wedding is ruined.

lyndausvi · October 2015

Your options are to find another venue or just deal with it. Sorry, but your contract just has use of the property. Venues have the right to change anything on their property when ever they want.

Note to lurkers: Shit happens. Often actually. There is ZERO reason to have invites printed out 8 months out. Just throw the money in a saving account until closer to the date. If you still choose to buy things way in advance, then you will just have to deal with maybe having to have them no longer useful.

marissaskisses · October 2015

Putting the money in a savings account would not have done anything, like I stated I got a good deal that was about to expire and wouldn't be available later on. Saving the money is still going to mean I would be paying 4 times the cost for the exact same invites.

JediElizabeth · October 2015

marissaskisses said:

The point was I did not want ANYTHING indoors. I booked because they had 2 OUTDOOR lots. Yes they have sent me a photo and the thing is dreadful. The other outdoor lot is not big enough to have the reception and ceremony, so I HAVE TO use the lot with this ugly thing on it. The rep is claiming it's big enough, however having seen it in person, I guarantee it's not.

Unfortunately, it seems like you have three options:

1. Keep the venue, but have the reception and ceremony in the same smaller area. I know you said there's not enough room for it, but see if you could make it work with a different kind of ceremony. Honestly, the spiral sounds kinda neat, but it's not going to be a make it or break it for your wedding day. Maybe you could have a ceremony in the round instead? You may also be able to negotiate a discount or other perks with the venue because you thought you would have 2 outdoor spaces, and now only have one.

2. Find another venue. See if you can get your deposit back. I'd actually consult with a lawyer and threaten legal action & to call local papers if not. It sounds like a bait-and-switch to me, especially if they knew about the construction and didn't tell you before you put the deposit down. In a lot of cases, people would rather just give you the money back than deal with any kind of headache. In this case, you'd need to get new invitations and there's no guarantee that you'll get the deposit back. You may be able to push the wedding out a few months further, though, which will give you more time to save. On the other hand, this is the most stressful option.

3. Keep the venue, and use the barn. Hopefully it'll be much nicer than the picture, and you'll be able to decorate it to your taste.

Come to terms with these 3 options, talk to your FI, and choose the best for you. Maybe have some wine and watch some crappy movies, or do whatever is best for you to deal with stress, and then think it through a bit later.

ThxSugar · October 2015

marissaskisses said:
The upper lot has lights in mason jars hanging from trees, the ambiance of it was exactly what I wanted for the reception, as well as it has a dance floor. The lower lot (where the "barn" thing is going) has a much smaller dance floor, NO lights and to top it off the dance floor isn't even in the freaking barn thing! Who's going to go outside to dance?!?!

There is NO ROOM to have the reception and ceremony in the same lot PERIOD, so even if I changed the seating arrangement it would not work. I am forced to use the monstrosity that they are building and paying a good chunk of our budget to be completely UNHAPPY with our venue.

Okay, so have the reception in the upper lot like you wanted and have the ceremony in the or around the barn. How big is the dance floor? How many people are you inviting? Does terrain prevent you from setting up outside of the barn? Is it impossible because of the spiral aisle?

marissaskisses · October 2015

While I appreciate your option one, as I stated even with traditional seating there is no room in the other lot for both. It is simply not big enough. All of the decor has already been purchased based on 2 outdoor events, so decorating this ugly barn thing would cost more money that I don't have in the budget (literally EVERYTHING was done 8 months in advance, I could get married tomorrow if it weren't for the fact I am waiting on my vacation time to accumulate in June). I have expressed my concern about pricing now that I'm not happy with the venue and I'm HOPING they will offer some sort of compensation. I also felt like it was a "bait and switch" which is why I am frustrated. The worst part is if I had not emailed them I would not have known until my wedding day. They made no effort to let me know they had planned this big change to the lower lot.

marissaskisses · October 2015

They are putting the barn right in the middle of the lot with 10 feet of space on each side....there would be no room for anything on the lower lot outside of the barn thing unfortunately. There will be approx. 75 people at the wedding (assuming everyone brings a date). They have essentially made that lower lot useless unless you want to use the barn thing

jacques27 · October 2015

marissaskisses said:

Putting the money in a savings account would not have done anything, like I stated I got a good deal that was about to expire and wouldn't be available later on. Saving the money is still going to mean I would be paying 4 times the cost for the exact same invites.

Lots of companies have lots of sales going on all year round. Maybe not those exact same invitations, but something. I googled wedding invitation sale and found four stationery companies having sales right this minute. So yeah, that was just you being convinced by a company that a "deal this good is never going to happen again" because that's what companies do.

As for just using one space - hire some people to do a change over of the space from ceremony to reception. Host a cocktail hour in the barn while they do that.

marissaskisses · October 2015

Again, money I do not have in my budget. ..I can't just pull money out of my butt to pay people to change the lot, and have a second bar in a separate lot

lyndausvi · October 2015

this is where some negotiation comes in. As the venue to pay for the switch over and the extra bar setup.

jacques27 · October 2015

marissaskisses said:

Again, money I do not have in my budget. ..I can't just pull money out of my butt to pay people to change the lot, and have a second bar in a separate lot

So, what you're saying is you want this to magically change into exactly what you have in your psychic vision without having to do anything on your part? Or do you just need more time to have your pity party before you're ready to consider all of the very serious, feasible suggestions people are throwing at you?

You said everything is all set and you could have the wedding tomorrow if you weren't waiting to accrue vacation time. That implies you also have the money to have the wedding tomorrow - so will you not be making any more money in the next eight months? And who said you have to have a second bar? They just have to be hosted properly during that time - set up some lemonade, a veggie tray, cheese and crackers and a few nibbles. Hire some high school or college kids looking to make a few bucks. (Yes, I realize you can't pull the money out of your butt - but you are capable of reworking your budget, getting a second/part-time job, babysitting, working overtime, eating ramen for a few weeks, etc.) You seem to be very set in what you have planned, but you have to deal with the reality that not everything is in your control and you have to roll with the punches when things don't go according to plan. So have your pity party for one more day, sit down with your FI and talk through your options, and readjust your vision and take some action.

marissaskisses · October 2015

The fiancé set the budget, it is in stone. (He's very frugal and even getting the budget I have was work) Yes, we have the money now, and will not be spending a Penney over the set budget. I am not having random strangers in charge of getting my wedding set up. I don't have any extra money in the budget to pay for things that would be a non issue if they had not changed the venue so drastically.

marissaskisses · October 2015

And I'm not NOT serving alcohol during cocktail hour, so a second bar would be necessary

lyndausvi · October 2015

Look, I do not think anyone is going to argue the situation sucks. However, you did not help the situation by buying everything so far in advance. You also didn't make sure your contract specified both outdoor locations.

The venue has a right to make changes. 8 months is a reasonable amount of time to make new plans. You can either find a new venue or deal with the one you have.

I'm sorry you are in this position, but you have to admit you added to the problem by making assumptions and buying everything so far in advance.

jacques27 · October 2015

Ok, so whining and being completely inflexible just hoping for magic to fix it, it is! Good luck with that.

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