Hostile FSIL "needs" a shower invitation

Jen4948 · February 2016

MyNameIsNot said:

Jen4948 said:

Stuck in box
From what the OP has posted about this family, they are already "alienated" even after 4 years of her being "civil" to them, and nothing she can say or do, including inviting the FSIL to the shower, will change that for one second. Continuing to do the same will just result in more of the same. So advising her to do nothing about her situation for fear of "alienating" people who are treating her with incivility and hostility, and who aren't going to stop, even though she keeps being civil, is not going to result in better treatment in any way, shape, or form - just more hoops for the OP to jump through on pain of accusations of "disrespect to the family." And that's no way to start off a marriage or new relationships either, by emotionally blackmailing the OP, because it gives all power to people who are already "alienated" regardless of whether or not the OP sets boundaries with them or not. What's clear is that by not setting boundaries that require respectful treatment, nothing will change for the better for the OP. Nobody needs to be married or "understand" what passes for "family dynamics" in this dysfunctional family to see that.

The FMIL asked OP to invite the FSIL to a shower, so now the whole family is dysfunctional and OP and her FI are already alienated from the rest of the family?

Can we please stop making grand assumptions and leaps of inference? This is really getting out of hand.

Check out other threads by the OP before you accuse me of "grand assumptions," "leaps of inference," and "getting out of hand," okay?

By the way, it's also a 'grand assumption" and a "leap of inference" that setting and maintaining boundaries with her future in-laws will totally and permanently alienate them to the point that no relationship with them at all is even possible - especially if she's always been civil with them up to now. It might even result eventually in respectful treatment by all concerned. But the only way to know for sure is if the OP sets and maintains some boundaries. It can be done with civility and respect for the FILs.

MobKaz · February 2016

MyNameIsNot said:

Jen4948 said:

Stuck in box
From what the OP has posted about this family, they are already "alienated" even after 4 years of her being "civil" to them, and nothing she can say or do, including inviting the FSIL to the shower, will change that for one second. Continuing to do the same will just result in more of the same. So advising her to do nothing about her situation for fear of "alienating" people who are treating her with incivility and hostility, and who aren't going to stop, even though she keeps being civil, is not going to result in better treatment in any way, shape, or form - just more hoops for the OP to jump through on pain of accusations of "disrespect to the family." And that's no way to start off a marriage or new relationships either, by emotionally blackmailing the OP, because it gives all power to people who are already "alienated" regardless of whether or not the OP sets boundaries with them or not. What's clear is that by not setting boundaries that require respectful treatment, nothing will change for the better for the OP. Nobody needs to be married or "understand" what passes for "family dynamics" in this dysfunctional family to see that.

The FMIL asked OP to invite the FSIL to a shower, so now the whole family is dysfunctional and OP and her FI are already alienated from the rest of the family?

Can we please stop making grand assumptions and leaps of inference? This is really getting out of hand.

Before you know it, this will turn into a musical and someone will have the OP singing!

bleve0821 · February 2016

Wow, thanks for all the insight, everyone. With the stress of the wedding, and traveling for work so much, I almost forgot I posted, so this is the first time I've checked in a while. I did not mean to "post and run."

It's probably irrelevant at this point, but no, my FI does NOT scream and yell at me. We've actually never had a fight about the issue, he just makes it clear that he doesn't want to be in the middle. I'm not asking him to put himself in the middle, because yes, I, too, feel like this is "high school drama," and her issue with me is not technically his problem, but, age-level aside, I unfortunately can't seem to reconcile the issue by being the bigger person. And that, in and of itself, is exhausting. We actually did have a conversation about it, and he did say "I support you."

FSIL has, herself, excluded me from intimate family events (not that I care, and nor have I ever demanded an invitation), and she often goes out of her way to conceal them from me. When FMIL invited me to a family dinner for her son's (FSIL's husband) birthday, she pretty much threw a tantrum and spent the three hour event sitting with her back to me (impressive, since she sat across the table from me). When I got up to use the restroom, I returned to find her berating my FI for not "making an effort to get to know" her, even though she's family now.

She hasn't beaten anyone, molested a child, or gone to jail, and it's hard to put into words exactly what she's done, because it isn't that she's done ANYTHING at all to me, but it seems like I am perpetually wronging her. She's hostile whenever we're in the same room. She makes pointed comments about things like putting china on our registry ("You don't want china, that's not what the registry is for"), or my puppy reacting when her dog backs it into a corner ("Well, your dog just isn't well trained, you're an irresponsible dog owner"), or her attitude towards my ering ("Well, he didn't buy you an ering because he didn't have the money"). It just wears a person down, trying to be nice and shrugging s*** like this off all the time. "I picked a china set that will go very nicely with my grandmother's wedding china. I like the idea of old and new and want to pass something of myself down to my granddaughter, the way my grandmother did for me." "I'm sorry that my dog reacted badly when your dog came up behind her and startled her." "I told him before he proposed that I wanted to wear my grandmother's ring. She passed a while back, and I feel like it brings me closer to her." That kind of thing.

This may not mean much, but my breaking point actually came at Christmas. I put a lot of thought into her gift, and it was a real struggle to get it for her. It had to be ordered three times and it took 10 months for me to actually receive the custom item to give it to her. When I buy gifts for people, especially family, I go to excruciating pains to ensure that the gift is practical yet personal, so I tailor my options to their particular tastes and interests. Like, for my bridesmaids, I want them to have something personal to each of them that can grow with their families, so I made a shadowbox for each of them with custom-made 2" Scrabble tiles spelling each family member's name. As their families grow, they can add to them, and they'll still have a special memento of their participation in my wedding day. I love doing this stuff because I love giving and making people happy. Despite the history between us, I really wanted this woman to have something special, and I was really, really excited to give it to her.

When she opened it, she gave it a half glance, said, "It's cute," and made a point to ignore that she even got it. Not even a thank you, or a pretend, "I can't wait to use it."

Yes, it's trivial, and yes, it probably equates to high school drama, but I was stung. I don't give gifts for the recognition or the thanks, but her reaction made me angry all the same. There was no reason for her to act like that. She didn't appreciate the lengths to which I went to get it, even though my FI recounted that story to the amusement of the rest of his family. She didn't acknowledge the thoughtfulness of the gift, or the attention to detail, or how it was, without a doubt, perfect for her. I even ran it past her husband and our MIL before I ordered it, just to make sure it was a gift she WOULD enjoy. So yes, it hurt my feelings, and yes, it's drama, but it's just part of her pattern of behavior towards me. If my FI had given her the gift and taken credit for it instead of me, you can bet the farm that her reaction would have been vastly different.

It is drama. It's drama I have never wanted any part of, and drama I have done my damnedest to try to ignore and shrug off. But emotionally, I feel like I'm beating my brains out against a brick wall, and it feels like if I don't put my foot down now, say "Enough is enough", I'll never have that chance again.

Only 15 people are invited to my shower (it's extremely intimate, and my wedding party and family are not huge), so her presence will be hard to ignore.

I'm not sure I'm getting my POV across, and I've probably made it sound truly trite (boohoo, my feelings are hurt, poor me, waaah), but it's a sucky situation that I feel like I have no control over. I don't want to dole out equal measures of spite and dislike, I just don't want it around me on such a happy, intimate occasion.

banana468 · February 2016

She sounds like no prize.

But this all sounds like drama. And it sounds like your FMIL wants her at these events for some weird reason.

If you put your foot down and say no, that can torment you forever. "And THEEEEEEEEEN she didn't invite me to the shower!!"

But, if you're gracious, she's the one that looks like a crazy case if she makes a scene.

That doesn't mean that your have a shower that's guaranteed to be drama free. However I think it's a decent idea to tell your hostesses your feelings about her. If they see her acting out, it's on THEM to say, "If you can't act like you are happy for the bride to be then why don't we fix you a plate of food that you can take with you." And if you keep smiling all along while she makes an insane fuss, people will think, "Man, that bride is gracious while her BSC SIL is terrible."

Instead, if you start to set up a wall for an occasion like this, it just gets awkward for everyone.

Similarly, she's going to be invited to your wedding. If she makes a scene or is awful, how you handle it will be the memory people have of you.

Stand up for yourself - but do it in a way that can't be used as a way that you intentionally excluded her when everything she's done thus far has simply been to act like a petulant child.

TrixieJess · February 2016

Maybe it's because I'm the type of person that doesn't take that kind of crap from anyone, especially family, but how about just telling her to "Fuck off". I mean you can do it in a nice way, but by now, I would have pinned her to a wall and told her where she could go and how I could help her along.

Stand up for yourself, if you insist on being a doormat, you will be treated like a doormat. Stop buying her gifts, stop trying to get on her "good" side. If she treats you badly, call her on it. Tell her she is being a bitch and you will no longer stand for it.

There are times when one needs to be nice, and then there are times when you have to stop letting people steamroll you.

ShesSoCold · February 2016

banana468 said:

She sounds like no prize.

But this all sounds like drama. And it sounds like your FMIL wants her at these events for some weird reason.

If you put your foot down and say no, that can torment you forever. "And THEEEEEEEEEN she didn't invite me to the shower!!"

But, if you're gracious, she's the one that looks like a crazy case if she makes a scene.

That doesn't mean that your have a shower that's guaranteed to be drama free. However I think it's a decent idea to tell your hostesses your feelings about her. If they see her acting out, it's on THEM to say, "If you can't act like you are happy for the bride to be then why don't we fix you a plate of food that you can take with you." And if you keep smiling all along while she makes an insane fuss, people will think, "Man, that bride is gracious while her BSC SIL is terrible."

Instead, if you start to set up a wall for an occasion like this, it just gets awkward for everyone.

Similarly, she's going to be invited to your wedding. If she makes a scene or is awful, how you handle it will be the memory people have of you.

Stand up for yourself - but do it in a way that can't be used as a way that you intentionally excluded her when everything she's done thus far has simply been to act like a petulant child.

I absolutely get your point, but I disagree, regarding the shower. FI's SIL is an asshole and OP shouldn't have to deal with it. The SIL has made it clear to everyone that she doesn't like OP so OP is doing her a favor by not inviting her. The same doesn't go for family /holiday parties since she's the brother's wife, but I don't see any reason to invite her to the shower.

I know that mother =/= SIL, but I had a very similar experience with my MIL. She never did anything to me that was outright horrible, but she was a general ass to me for years. Little jabs here and there, "jokes" that weren't really jokes, ignoring me, not caring about gifts I gave her and then bitching about not getting gifts, just general bullshit. Once H and I stopped allowing it (calling her out instead of ignoring, stopped including her in our lives, etc.), her behavior changed.

I'm not saying that this will happen for OP, but it's clear to me that OP doing the same old shit and just dealing with it will result in the SIL doing her same old shit.

flantastic · February 2016

Bleve0821 said:

Wow, thanks for all the insight, everyone. With the stress of the wedding, and traveling for work so much, I almost forgot I posted, so this is the first time I've checked in a while. I did not mean to "post and run."
It's probably irrelevant at this point, but no, my FI does NOT scream and yell at me. We've actually never had a fight about the issue, he just makes it clear that he doesn't want to be in the middle. I'm not asking him to put himself in the middle, because yes, I, too, feel like this is "high school drama," and her issue with me is not technically his problem, but, age-level aside, I unfortunately can't seem to reconcile the issue by being the bigger person. And that, in and of itself, is exhausting. We actually did have a conversation about it, and he did say "I support you."
FSIL has, herself, excluded me from intimate family events (not that I care, and nor have I ever demanded an invitation), and she often goes out of her way to conceal them from me. When FMIL invited me to a family dinner for her son's (FSIL's husband) birthday, she pretty much threw a tantrum and spent the three hour event sitting with her back to me (impressive, since she sat across the table from me). When I got up to use the restroom, I returned to find her berating my FI for not "making an effort to get to know" her, even though she's family now.
She hasn't beaten anyone, molested a child, or gone to jail, and it's hard to put into words exactly what she's done, because it isn't that she's done ANYTHING at all to me, but it seems like I am perpetually wronging her. She's hostile whenever we're in the same room. She makes pointed comments about things like putting china on our registry ("You don't want china, that's not what the registry is for"), or my puppy reacting when her dog backs it into a corner ("Well, your dog just isn't well trained, you're an irresponsible dog owner"), or her attitude towards my ering ("Well, he didn't buy you an ering because he didn't have the money"). It just wears a person down, trying to be nice and shrugging s*** like this off all the time. "I picked a china set that will go very nicely with my grandmother's wedding china. I like the idea of old and new and want to pass something of myself down to my granddaughter, the way my grandmother did for me." "I'm sorry that my dog reacted badly when your dog came up behind her and startled her." "I told him before he proposed that I wanted to wear my grandmother's ring. She passed a while back, and I feel like it brings me closer to her." That kind of thing.
This may not mean much, but my breaking point actually came at Christmas. I put a lot of thought into her gift, and it was a real struggle to get it for her. It had to be ordered three times and it took 10 months for me to actually receive the custom item to give it to her. When I buy gifts for people, especially family, I go to excruciating pains to ensure that the gift is practical yet personal, so I tailor my options to their particular tastes and interests. Like, for my bridesmaids, I want them to have something personal to each of them that can grow with their families, so I made a shadowbox for each of them with custom-made 2" Scrabble tiles spelling each family member's name. As their families grow, they can add to them, and they'll still have a special memento of their participation in my wedding day. I love doing this stuff because I love giving and making people happy. Despite the history between us, I really wanted this woman to have something special, and I was really, really excited to give it to her.
When she opened it, she gave it a half glance, said, "It's cute," and made a point to ignore that she even got it. Not even a thank you, or a pretend, "I can't wait to use it."
Yes, it's trivial, and yes, it probably equates to high school drama, but I was stung. I don't give gifts for the recognition or the thanks, but her reaction made me angry all the same. There was no reason for her to act like that. She didn't appreciate the lengths to which I went to get it, even though my FI recounted that story to the amusement of the rest of his family. She didn't acknowledge the thoughtfulness of the gift, or the attention to detail, or how it was, without a doubt, perfect for her. I even ran it past her husband and our MIL before I ordered it, just to make sure it was a gift she WOULD enjoy. So yes, it hurt my feelings, and yes, it's drama, but it's just part of her pattern of behavior towards me. If my FI had given her the gift and taken credit for it instead of me, you can bet the farm that her reaction would have been vastly different.
It is drama. It's drama I have never wanted any part of, and drama I have done my damnedest to try to ignore and shrug off. But emotionally, I feel like I'm beating my brains out against a brick wall, and it feels like if I don't put my foot down now, say "Enough is enough", I'll never have that chance again.
Only 15 people are invited to my shower (it's extremely intimate, and my wedding party and family are not huge), so her presence will be hard to ignore.
I'm not sure I'm getting my POV across, and I've probably made it sound truly trite (boohoo, my feelings are hurt, poor me, waaah), but it's a sucky situation that I feel like I have no control over. I don't want to dole out equal measures of spite and dislike, I just don't want it around me on such a happy, intimate occasion.

Your FSIL is perpetually hostile, and I am sorry that you have to deal with it. I am with others that if you do not want to deal with this shit at your shower, you don't need to invite her, and you can certainly cite your examples if FMIL wonders why. "FSIL doesn't seem to like me very much, and manages to make snide comments about everything I do. I don't think she'd enjoy my shower, and I don't think I'd enjoy her presence."

Others are also right in that forgoing that invitation for her will have later consequences. If your FI brings up that the two of you should "work it out," however calmly, you should say that you don't think that will happen because she clearly has no interest, and that civility in mutual family events is probably the best he can hope for, and that's not your fault.

On the Christmas gift front: She was kind of rude - I wouldn't exactly consider that a gracious thank you, and any gift should receive one - but I'm not sure you're as good at thoughtful gifts as you think you are. For example, I would not find a personalized Scrabble-tile shadowbox to be a practical gift, mainly because I really don't think that's something I would like to display in my home. If all your BMs' tastes and interests involve having shadowboxes throughout their homes, then you're in the clear. I can certainly believe that whatever you went to great lengths to customize may not actually be something your FSIL really wanted. She should still have been more gracious in the thank you.

OliveOilsMom · February 2016

I don't think that you should extend an invite to FSIL to the shower. Others have given you great answers to provide your FMIL with already. It is possible that FMIL might want FSIL invited to show some sort of family harmony, but that is just a guess. I can't imagine that FSIL actually wants an invite to the shower.

But I also want to add that you need to stop being a doormat. Lower all expectations you might have about FSIL to 0. If you need to give her a gift, just do a gift card. She does not deserve the personal gifts that you buy for everyone else. Let her look around the room when you have given thoughtful and personal gifts to each person and she got a gift card.

And while your FI may not want to get in the middle of you and FSIL. At some point he needs to step up for you. "FSIL, why must you always treat my FI this way? She has been nothing but kind to you, but you always seem to have a level of disdain for her. Why is that?"

bleve0821 · February 2016

While I agree that not everyone's tastes are the same, as these are my closest friends, I am pretty comfortable with my decision to move forward with this gift. At any rate, the Scrabble tiles are attached with velcro, so if for some reason they don't like it, they're free to do whatever they want with the tiles. Just because it's not something you would similarly value doesn't mean it's necessary to make snap judgments. FSIL makes no secret of her favorite interests, so I am confident in saying, especially since it was verified by her husband, that the gift she received was in line with her interests and her tastes, although I should make it clear it was nowhere near as ostentatious as a shadow box with Scrabble tiles. That, however, is neither here nor there.

flantastic · February 2016

Bleve0821 said:

While I agree that not everyone's tastes are the same, as these are my closest friends, I am pretty comfortable with my decision to move forward with this gift. At any rate, the Scrabble tiles are attached with velcro, so if for some reason they don't like it, they're free to do whatever they want with the tiles. Just because it's not something you would similarly value doesn't mean it's necessary to make snap judgments. FSIL makes no secret of her favorite interests, so I am confident in saying, especially since it was verified by her husband, that the gift she received was in line with her interests and her tastes, although I should make it clear it was nowhere near as ostentatious as a shadow box with Scrabble tiles. That, however, is neither here nor there.

It's not a snap judgment. One-size-fits-all gifts for a group of more than two are often not appreciated by at least one person, and despite the personalization of names, that's what these shadowboxes are. I am not assuming that these are bad gifts for your BMs - it's true, you know them best - but since I know many people who think they are great gift-givers and really are not, I just wanted you to consider that point.

To your FSIL, I think your "homework" was probably accurate. However, she is not worth the effort as PP mentioned, so you can stop doing said homework.

bleve0821 · February 2016

I told FI on the way home that weekend that he's in charge of all future gifts for her, no way am I going to that kind of effort again. It's not that I thought it would mend bridges, but I didn't think it would hurt them quite the way it did.

lembaslover · February 2016

flantastic said:

Bleve0821 said:

While I agree that not everyone's tastes are the same, as these are my closest friends, I am pretty comfortable with my decision to move forward with this gift. At any rate, the Scrabble tiles are attached with velcro, so if for some reason they don't like it, they're free to do whatever they want with the tiles. Just because it's not something you would similarly value doesn't mean it's necessary to make snap judgments. FSIL makes no secret of her favorite interests, so I am confident in saying, especially since it was verified by her husband, that the gift she received was in line with her interests and her tastes, although I should make it clear it was nowhere near as ostentatious as a shadow box with Scrabble tiles. That, however, is neither here nor there.

It's not a snap judgment. One-size-fits-all gifts for a group of more than two are often not appreciated by at least one person, and despite the personalization of names, that's what these shadowboxes are. I am not assuming that these are bad gifts for your BMs - it's true, you know them best - but since I know many people who think they are great gift-givers and really are not, I just wanted you to consider that point.

To your FSIL, I think your "homework" was probably accurate. However, she is not worth the effort as PP mentioned, so you can stop doing said homework.

Yea I agree that it isn't a snap judgement. Any time someone is getting all BMs the same thing (yes even personalized with names) most likely someone isn't going to like it. But hey if all of yours will then that's great.

I also want to add that just because something matches this persons interests/tastes doesn't mean it's a gift they will like. Example I love frogs and rodents, always have. For some reason everyone in my family thinks they are getting me the best gifts ever by buying me things with frogs or rodents on them. I pretty much hate every one of those gifts. (Really what am I supposed to do with kissing frog salt and pepper shakers? I have salt and pepper shakers that I use now. And the Christmas ornaments... I don't put up that kind of ornament, I like having my tree all matching!) Though I do smile say thank you and how cute it is so yes she should have done the same even if she hated it.

I also think that even though your FI doesn't want to get in the middle it is his job to stand up for you. He's the one who should be telling your MIL that she isn't invited to the shower and why. DH would never let his family treat me badly and I won't let mine treat him badly either.

charlotte989875 · February 2016

You SIL is rude. Full stop. She's clearly out of line and rude.

However what I can't figure out is why you keep trying to make her like you when she's clearly not interested. Maybe this is harsh, but I agree with PPs, stop taking it from her. If she does something that hurts your feels, tell her. If she insults you, call her out on it. You don't have to stoop to her level, but respond clearly and calming that you won't put up with her behavior anymore.

That being said I think with people like this not inviting her is going to cause more problems than it's worth. I'd want to keep my FMIL happy, but if you really don't want her there, no you don't have to invite her.

Jen4948 · February 2016

charlotte989875 said:

You SIL is rude. Full stop. She's clearly out of line and rude.

However what I can't figure out is why you keep trying to make her like you when she's clearly not interested. Maybe this is harsh, but I agree with PPs, stop taking it from her. If she does something that hurts your feels, tell her. If she insults you, call her out on it. You don't have to stoop to her level, but respond clearly and calming that you won't put up with her behavior anymore.

That being said I think with people like this not inviting her is going to cause more problems than it's worth. I'd want to keep my FMIL happy, but if you really don't want her there, no you don't have to invite her.

Sounds like inviting her is going to cause more problems than it's worth too.

SP29 · February 2016

I echo what OliveOilsMom said.

Only you can decide if it's worth it to invite her to the shower or not, but you definitely don't have to.

I also agree that you should stand up for yourself and not take her shit anymore. You don't need to be rude back, but if she says something to you, calmly respond back, "Why would you say something like that?" (got that from another poster here on a different thread) or "What are you hoping to achieve by bringing that up?". Point out to her that she is being an ass.

I get your FI doesn't want to get involved in drama but he does need to stand up for you when she is rude and dismissive in his presence. He also needs to be prepared and agreeable to support you, particularly in regard to his mother, should you not invite FSIL.

rosecoloredglasses81 · February 2016

I'd invite her. Then every time she says something rude, I'd laugh in her face then turn and walk away. She'll look like the a** hole. Everyone will catch on. Especially if its a small party. You don't even have to really respond.

banana468 · February 2016

Clearly we're all divided here. You know that going in either direction can have a perk.

The bottom line for you is that you need to hold your head high and own either decision. Remember, no one can make you feel bad without your consent. But the other side here is to stop looking for approval and validation from others. Know that you're doing the right thing and don't get upset when a gift or gesture isn't met with a big smile. It's never going to be her style.

OliveOilsMom · February 2016

rosecoloredglasses81 said:

I'd invite her. Then every time she says something rude, I'd laugh in her face then turn and walk away. She'll look like the a** hole. Everyone will catch on. Especially if its a small party. You don't even have to really respond.

Actually, I would think a guest of honor laughing in someone's face and turning to walk away would make the guest of honor look like the asshole.

As SP29 said, it would better for OP to ask FSIL "why would you say that?" and let FSIL stamper out a poor excuse for her behavior. (BTW, I think I might have advised that before! That is a classic Dear Abby technique!)

Moppet82 · February 2016

I don't have a comment about inviting her to the shower because I see both sides, however, I will say you need to stop letting her treat you like this. Be firm, but not heated, when she starts her passive aggressive bs.

"You don't want china, that's not what a registry is for."
"Actually, china is what a registry is for. And, yes, I do want china. You have never made an effort to get to know me, so stop making assumptions about my likes and dislikes."

"Your dog was backed into the corner because she isn't trained well."
"No, she was backed into the corner because YOU didn't train your dog well and are okay with her being aggressive."

"Well, he didn't buy you an e-ring because he didn't have the money"
"Not the case at all. Stop making ill-informed comments about his money when you are clueless about our financial situation."

If she responds and tries to make it sound as if you're the one being the bully, reply with, "If you're going to go there, be prepared to meet me there," and then let it go. (That's my go to line when someone is acting like an asshat and I call them out.)

Jen4948 · February 2016

OliveOilsMom said:

rosecoloredglasses81 said:

I'd invite her. Then every time she says something rude, I'd laugh in her face then turn and walk away. She'll look like the a** hole. Everyone will catch on. Especially if its a small party. You don't even have to really respond.

Actually, I would think a guest of honor laughing in someone's face and turning to walk away would make the guest of honor look like the asshole.
As SP29 said, it would better for OP to ask FSIL "why would you say that?" and let FSIL stamper out a poor excuse for her behavior. (BTW, I think I might have advised that before! That is a classic Dear Abby technique!)

Only if the FSIL is likely to learn from it and shut up -- not if she keeps being an a**hole for the whole party. And if she's going to do that, I think it's best to just not invite her, because using her as the party entertainment is to lower oneself to her level.

bleve0821 · February 2016

I really appreciate all the input, everyone. It's been an incredibly stressful last few weeks for me without all this petty nonsense (why must EVERYTHING go wrong in the two months before the wedding?). At times like these, I find that sometimes it's best to get a perspective from someone removed from the situation. Opinions are very divided, so I feel a little better knowing there really isn't a correct way to handle this.

The matter is mostly resolved, and I took a little bit of advice from both sides.

My FI and I talked. He offered to speak to his mother about the situation, showing his support, but I asked him not to until I had grown a pair and spoken to her myself. Then he could run interference if needed.

Last night, I told my FMIL exactly this (I know, because I asked my dad to give it a once over and make sure I didn't sound like a crazy person before I called her and read it to her):

"FMIL, FSIL is not particularly welcome at my shower. Her attitude towards me is toxic and hostile. It is clear she doesn't like me, and quite frankly, I am tired of her behavior towards me. She is rude and snide and unfriendly, and no amount of effort on my part has made a difference. I do not know what I did to her, the feeling is not mutual, but I am tired of being treated like I have no place in her life. From the moment FI and I started dating, her attitude towards me chilled and became increasingly hostile. I do not want to continue to be party to a lifetime of hostility for no discernible reason. I have gone out of my way to be the bigger person, and it has taken a toll on me mentally and physically, and I am very frustrated. I won't return dislike for dislike, but I have had enough of her hostility towards me and do not want that kind of attitude around me at my shower. Family is family, but I clearly am not part of hers, so please forgive me if I am reluctant to welcome her into mine with open arms. That being said, she did receive an invitation."

I went on to tell her that this was a difficult decision for me and that it has caused a great deal of stress and I was sorry that she was in the middle of everything, this is between me and FSIL and it wasn't fair for anyone else to be dragged into it.

I probably should have grown a pair and told her this when both FMIL and FI asked me to make her a BM way back when, but all I could do at the time was say "No," and would they please respect my decision. They did, and in retrospect it was probably more of a suggestion than a "You should really do this" kind of thing. But the aforementioned birthday dinner was still fresh in my mind, so my emotions probably definitely clouded my judgment.

FMIL was heartbreakingly supportive, so I guess on some level she's aware of the situation. I think it was a shock to her that I feel this way, but I've spent years pretending it doesn't bother me when family is together. Her reaction completely overwhelmed me, because I was expecting a not-so-nice lecture on "Well, she's family, and you're going to have to deal with her, so suck it up and get over it, etc." Not that my FMIL has a mean bone in her body, but you know Mama Bears.

It doesn't fix things. I'm still in limbo. FSIL got the requisite invitation, I don't know if she's coming, but my MOH and other BMs have been asked to monitor the situation if she does show. I know with their support, even if FSIL does attend, there will at least be no brawls. And they'll have my back if I do say something slightly less than tactful. And FMIL won't judge or condemn me for standing up for myself.

The biggest relief is that FMIL is supportive of my feelings, despite the fact that FSIL has been family far longer than I. Well, that, and knowing for sure that FI is on my team.

So I wanted to thank everyone again for all the input, advice, suggestions, etc. It was welcome and very much appreciated, and made me feel like a little less like the insane bridezilla I imagine my loved ones believe me to be.

Jen4948 · February 2016

Wow! Good for you for speaking up for yourself. I hope your FMIL continues to be supportive. I was expecting that same kind of "get-over-yourself" lecture that you mentioned. It's really great that your FMIL didn't react that way. She must just not have known how bad the situation between you and your FSIL was.

Hugs and support for you!

ShesSoCold · February 2016

Bleve0821 said:

I really appreciate all the input, everyone. It's been an incredibly stressful last few weeks for me without all this petty nonsense (why must EVERYTHING go wrong in the two months before the wedding?). At times like these, I find that sometimes it's best to get a perspective from someone removed from the situation. Opinions are very divided, so I feel a little better knowing there really isn't a correct way to handle this.
The matter is mostly resolved, and I took a little bit of advice from both sides.
My FI and I talked. He offered to speak to his mother about the situation, showing his support, but I asked him not to until I had grown a pair and spoken to her myself. Then he could run interference if needed.
Last night, I told my FMIL exactly this (I know, because I asked my dad to give it a once over and make sure I didn't sound like a crazy person before I called her and read it to her):
"FMIL, FSIL is not particularly welcome at my shower. Her attitude towards me is toxic and hostile. It is clear she doesn't like me, and quite frankly, I am tired of her behavior towards me. She is rude and snide and unfriendly, and no amount of effort on my part has made a difference. I do not know what I did to her, the feeling is not mutual, but I am tired of being treated like I have no place in her life. From the moment FI and I started dating, her attitude towards me chilled and became increasingly hostile. I do not want to continue to be party to a lifetime of hostility for no discernible reason. I have gone out of my way to be the bigger person, and it has taken a toll on me mentally and physically, and I am very frustrated. I won't return dislike for dislike, but I have had enough of her hostility towards me and do not want that kind of attitude around me at my shower. Family is family, but I clearly am not part of hers, so please forgive me if I am reluctant to welcome her into mine with open arms. That being said, she did receive an invitation."
I went on to tell her that this was a difficult decision for me and that it has caused a great deal of stress and I was sorry that she was in the middle of everything, this is between me and FSIL and it wasn't fair for anyone else to be dragged into it.
I probably should have grown a pair and told her this when both FMIL and FI asked me to make her a BM way back when, but all I could do at the time was say "No," and would they please respect my decision. They did, and in retrospect it was probably more of a suggestion than a "You should really do this" kind of thing. But the aforementioned birthday dinner was still fresh in my mind, so my emotions probably definitely clouded my judgment.
FMIL was heartbreakingly supportive, so I guess on some level she's aware of the situation. I think it was a shock to her that I feel this way, but I've spent years pretending it doesn't bother me when family is together. Her reaction completely overwhelmed me, because I was expecting a not-so-nice lecture on "Well, she's family, and you're going to have to deal with her, so suck it up and get over it, etc." Not that my FMIL has a mean bone in her body, but you know Mama Bears.
It doesn't fix things. I'm still in limbo. FSIL got the requisite invitation, I don't know if she's coming, but my MOH and other BMs have been asked to monitor the situation if she does show. I know with their support, even if FSIL does attend, there will at least be no brawls. And they'll have my back if I do say something slightly less than tactful. And FMIL won't judge or condemn me for standing up for myself.
The biggest relief is that FMIL is supportive of my feelings, despite the fact that FSIL has been family far longer than I. Well, that, and knowing for sure that FI is on my team.
So I wanted to thank everyone again for all the input, advice, suggestions, etc. It was welcome and very much appreciated, and made me feel like a little less like the insane bridezilla I imagine my loved ones believe me to be.

So, I'm really glad you said something, but telling your FMIL that you don't want her there and then sending an invitation feels sort of like you half-assed both sides and are following through with neither.

bleve0821 · February 2016

@scribe95 China, yes (and he thanked me for letting that one go since it was the very first thing she said to me at Christmas). Dog, no. Ring, no.

@ShesSoCold long story, but my MOH claims to have misunderstood when I asked her to WAIT til I had talked to my FMIL before she did anything, and sent the invitation out within an hour of that initial conversation with my FMIL. She also waited a week to tell me she'd invited her. My fault for bringing it to her attention at all, but as my BFF, she's my go to "I'm so angry just let me rant and blow off steam." No choice now but to roll with the punch, I guess

MairePoppy · February 2016

So I'm a bit of a MamaBear, myself. I don't like anyone disrupting the harmony between my adult kids and their SOs. I want to hug you right now for leveling with your FMIL. In doing so, you probably affirmed her suspicions that FSIL has a bug up her ass. If she was oblivious to it, then you put her on notice that there is a problem that you don't wish to aggravate, but you are also not a doormat. You did the right thing.

I hope you have a wonderful shower.,

Knottie1451694230 · April 2016

You are SPOT ON!!!! I would only ask, what do you think is the best way to deal with families like this?

Jen4948 · April 2016

Knottie1451694230 said:

You are SPOT ON!!!! I would only ask, what do you think is the best way to deal with families like this?

Set boundaries. As soon as you get treated with unwarranted hostility, make clear that it's not okay and has to stop on pain of specified consequences (you'll leave immediately or, if it happens on your turf, the other person will have to leave immediately, or whatever else is appropriate), and enforce those consequences if it doesn't stop.

Jen4948 · April 2016

@AtomicBlonde, has the shower taken place? Was your FSIL there? How did things go?

bleve0821 · April 2016

The shower went well! So much fun, it was good seeing family and everything. FSIL did not show up--she knew she had to work, but apparently pitched a bitch fit when she didn't immediately get an invitation, which is what prompted all of this in the first place.

So, yeah, for all you lurkers out there, don't do what I did and let it get to a breaking point. That can damage a lot of relationships, and it's just not healthy. I'm typically not the kind of person that lets shit like this fly... I've never really had a problem standing up for myself, but it's one thing to get into it with a blood sibling/relative/anyone on neutral ground, and another to be a guest in someone else's home/at intimate family events and know how best to respond.

In this situation, knowing what I wanted to do and knowing what I should do were two very different things. And I'm sure if I had set boundaries several years ago instead of trying to make nice, I wouldn't have felt so stuck.

Knottie1451694230 · April 2016

To be perfectly honest, this sounds a lot like the situation I have going on: I typically am very comfortable standing up for myself, but was initially very afraid to rock the boat with my future in laws, that led to a lot of issues festering and more problems later on, people thinking they could walk all over me, and now I am having to be even more firm than I would've had I just stood up for myself from the beginning.
These are growing pains....they hurt but we are better for them.
THe 2 things I have really come to learn recently are
1. Sometimes I just have to do things I don't want to do, I have to say to myself, I love my fiance so much, or else I wouldn't be doing X. An then I suck it up, and take one for the team, because it is better to see my partner happy than be right or prideful.
2. There are my needs, his needs and the needs of the relationship, and those are often 3 different things that need to be weighed and balanced.

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