Grooms father and Brides mother

Viczaesar · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

Viczaesar said:

southernbelle0915 said:

levioosa said:

southernbelle0915 said:

But y'all...they can't just kick FFIL to the curb. 1) He solely paid the mortgage for years until her FI got more established, 2) he's on the title, and 3) he's paying part of the mortgage now. He has money invested in that house too.

This was an objectively terrible idea, probably agreed to in grief.

It's not as simple as being like "hey, you have no money into this place and, we've just been letting you live here, so bye." They really are going to need attorneys to sort this out and, if I had to guess, it ain't gonna be pretty. My prediction is that they either mediate it by coming to a LEGAL agreement and (probably) selling the house and splitting the profit. OR they go to court, pay a fuck ton in court fees and, likely, ruin a relationship with a civil court battle.

I think you have a rough road ahead of you, OP. I really do commend you for being so loyal to your FI.

No, I agree that this is a really terrible situation, but it doesn't sound like at any point FI had a real conversation with his father about what their lives should look like post wedding. That's a big red flag. I don't agree that FIL should just be kicked out without any ceremony. He obviously has put money into the house. Depending on the DP and mortgage, he might even have more money into it than FI. But all of this shit should have been discussed like adults, instead of the clusterfuck that's happening now.

Sure, I agree - and it sounds like it has been (see her posts and clarifications). She also said on page 1 that her FI is now talking with an attorney. I'm not sure what else the FI can do? I mean, the dad won't leave, FI has too much money tied up in the house to say "fuck it, have the house", and a nasty, relationship ending battle is on the horizon...all with assets that came from the death of a woman they both loved. Nothing about the situation sounds simple or easy.

Something like this, that was likely agreed to while they were both grieving the loss of their mom/wife, seems destined for a clusterfuck. It's all just coming out of the woodwork now that FI wants to move on with his life. I think they can talk "like adults", but it doesn't mean they'll come to an agreement. It'd probably still be messy and necessitate attorneys.

I agree with you, except for blaming the decision to co-buy a house on grief. FI's mom and dad were divorced and FI's mom was married to someone else when she died. Either way, though, it's going to be messy for sure.

I really do appreciate everyones input here. Trust me it wasn't the ideal situation that I had hoped for. But all of the ideal relationships that i had i was miserable. Now granted I may not be completly happy with my living situation, but doesnt make me want to cancel the wedding or leave my fi or nothing. We have a time set aside to talk to his father. Explain to him how it needs to be for all of us to have a relationship with one another going forward and after the wedding.

So how does it need to be, exactly? Are you guys going to pay him back all of the money he put into the house? Equity?

MyNameIsNot · January 2017

southernbelle0915 said:

But y'all...they can't just kick FFIL to the curb. 1) He solely paid the mortgage for years until her FI got more established, 2) he's on the title, and 3) he's paying part of the mortgage now. He has money invested in that house too.

This was an objectively terrible idea, probably agreed to in grief.

It's not as simple as being like "hey, you have no money into this place and, we've just been letting you live here, so bye." They really are going to need attorneys to sort this out and, if I had to guess, it ain't gonna be pretty. My prediction is that they either mediate it by coming to a LEGAL agreement and (probably) selling the house and splitting the profit. OR they go to court, pay a fuck ton in court fees and, likely, ruin a relationship with a civil court battle.

I think you have a rough road ahead of you, OP. I really do commend you for being so loyal to your FI.

This. There's no such thing as a primary and secondary deed holder. FI can't just kick the father out. He can't even legally evict him because of the name on the deed. FI can ask the father to leave, but the father has every right to refuse.

He needs to put on his big boy pants and have a conversation with his father. He should have done that long before getting engaged. If they can't agree to a mutually acceptable plan, he's going to have to file a lawsuit, which will probably involve selling the house and dividing the equity somehow.

Of course, if the FI had put on his big boy pants a long time ago, he could have had this conversation with his father without a looming wedding day, and he probably would have had a lot more room to come up with a compromise. But why would he have? The FI has shown much more interest in avoiding conflict with his father than in making a life with his future wife. Which is exactly why it's a huge mistake to move forward with wedding planning before this has been resolved.

OP, your mom can walk with whomever she wants. You have bigger problems.

MairePoppy · January 2017

Your fi and his father made an agreement to purchase a house together because neither would have been able to manage it alone. Fi and father are both responsible for the repayment of the mortgage, even if one leaves and even if one is removed from the title. It's not fair to ask the father to leave with no compensation. Fi should buy his father out of the property, perhaps with a down payment on a small house or condo, if the lender will allow the father to be removed from the mortgage.

If it isn't possible to buy the father out, you and fi should go for counseling to help you learn how to be a couple within this family arrangement. Some people can be successful living in multi generational homes. I would think it would be necessary for you to find a way to like your FFIL and for everyone to learn about boundaries.The alcohol problem and the teen from a previous marriage add dimension to the situation. I sincerely wish you good luck.

As for the processional - the MOB should choose her own escort and should not be expected to walk with someone she doesn't like. Tell your fi that your mom is walking with her escort of choice and his father may choose his own escort. Stand up for yourself and your mom.

MandTFebruary62011 · January 2017

I just want to pipe in with one thought. You have said several times that you are marrying your fiance and not his father. But his father won't go away. Even if he physically leaves the house, he will still be your fiance's father and from the things you have said is not likely to disappear and leave you two alone. When you marry someone you DO marry their family. You don't have to love or even like them but they will not be absent because you're the wife now. I'm going to guess your fiance has a strong connection to his father at this point even if it's mostly guilt or concern and not always characterized as love. That is not likely to move on. You may also need to consider how you want this man's role to be in your life from now on because he will have a role in it.

kimmiinthemitten · January 2017

Man, what a mess.

After reading all of this I'm still stuck with one thought: if your FI *really* knew (cared?) how you felt about his father, he would have never pitched it to his dad, let alone given it more than a seconds thought himself.

Best of luck to you.

LondonLisa · January 2017

I guess I don't understand why he would talk to an attorney before he spoke to his father to see what his plans were. Maybe his father will move out after the wedding anyway or maybe he wants to be bought out of his share.

Why has your fi not said 'Dad, after the wedding we would like to live in this house alone. What are your plans?'

Just be prepared that a very real possibility is that the house will be sold and the money split, or you and fi will need to buy out the equity from ffil. All I can say is your fi needs to talk to his dad and see what is going on. And if it can be done fairly, out of court, you will save loads.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

Viczaesar said:

Jaime6166 said:

Viczaesar said:

southernbelle0915 said:

levioosa said:

southernbelle0915 said:

But y'all...they can't just kick FFIL to the curb. 1) He solely paid the mortgage for years until her FI got more established, 2) he's on the title, and 3) he's paying part of the mortgage now. He has money invested in that house too.

This was an objectively terrible idea, probably agreed to in grief.

It's not as simple as being like "hey, you have no money into this place and, we've just been letting you live here, so bye." They really are going to need attorneys to sort this out and, if I had to guess, it ain't gonna be pretty. My prediction is that they either mediate it by coming to a LEGAL agreement and (probably) selling the house and splitting the profit. OR they go to court, pay a fuck ton in court fees and, likely, ruin a relationship with a civil court battle.

I think you have a rough road ahead of you, OP. I really do commend you for being so loyal to your FI.

No, I agree that this is a really terrible situation, but it doesn't sound like at any point FI had a real conversation with his father about what their lives should look like post wedding. That's a big red flag. I don't agree that FIL should just be kicked out without any ceremony. He obviously has put money into the house. Depending on the DP and mortgage, he might even have more money into it than FI. But all of this shit should have been discussed like adults, instead of the clusterfuck that's happening now.

Sure, I agree - and it sounds like it has been (see her posts and clarifications). She also said on page 1 that her FI is now talking with an attorney. I'm not sure what else the FI can do? I mean, the dad won't leave, FI has too much money tied up in the house to say "fuck it, have the house", and a nasty, relationship ending battle is on the horizon...all with assets that came from the death of a woman they both loved. Nothing about the situation sounds simple or easy.

Something like this, that was likely agreed to while they were both grieving the loss of their mom/wife, seems destined for a clusterfuck. It's all just coming out of the woodwork now that FI wants to move on with his life. I think they can talk "like adults", but it doesn't mean they'll come to an agreement. It'd probably still be messy and necessitate attorneys.

I agree with you, except for blaming the decision to co-buy a house on grief. FI's mom and dad were divorced and FI's mom was married to someone else when she died. Either way, though, it's going to be messy for sure.

I really do appreciate everyones input here. Trust me it wasn't the ideal situation that I had hoped for. But all of the ideal relationships that i had i was miserable. Now granted I may not be completly happy with my living situation, but doesnt make me want to cancel the wedding or leave my fi or nothing. We have a time set aside to talk to his father. Explain to him how it needs to be for all of us to have a relationship with one another going forward and after the wedding.

So how does it need to be, exactly? Are you guys going to pay him back all of the money he put into the house? Equity?

If we have to so be it. But truly I know my fiance doesn't look at it like that. Because he put 90k down on this house paid his dads debts so that they could get this house. His dad hasn't put anywhere close to what my FI put down into the house. (no updates, no repairs,) Once my Fiance was established and stable he took over paying the mortgage. That was when i came along his dad gives money like rent if you will. So really in my honest opinion. He doesn't get shit. But that is my anger talking about the crap he has pulled and done to us in the last few yrs. So no in my thoughts he doesn't get shit.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

LondonLisa said:

I guess I don't understand why he would talk to an attorney before he spoke to his father to see what his plans were. Maybe his father will move out after the wedding anyway or maybe he wants to be bought out of his share.

Why has your fi not said 'Dad, after the wedding we would like to live in this house alone. What are your plans?'

Just be prepared that a very real possibility is that the house will be sold and the money split, or you and fi will need to buy out the equity from ffil. All I can say is your fi needs to talk to his dad and see what is going on. And if it can be done fairly, out of court, you will save loads.

I understand that. Attorney is a close personal friend of ours. He wanted to understand if we have to go that route what the outcome could be. There is a conversation and a time and date to have in place. Because of his father's drinking problem obviously we want him sober to have said conversation. So we shall see what happens from here.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

MandTFebruary62011 said:

I just want to pipe in with one thought. You have said several times that you are marrying your fiance and not his father. But his father won't go away. Even if he physically leaves the house, he will still be your fiance's father and from the things you have said is not likely to disappear and leave you two alone. When you marry someone you DO marry their family. You don't have to love or even like them but they will not be absent because you're the wife now. I'm going to guess your fiance has a strong connection to his father at this point even if it's mostly guilt or concern and not always characterized as love. That is not likely to move on. You may also need to consider how you want this man's role to be in your life from now on because he will have a role in it.

Let me further clairfy it is not that i hate him i really dont. I really do not mind him for the most part. But it is him taking advantage of me and his son that piss me the fuck off. He doesn't clean he doesn't cook he doesn't buy food. We have to ask for like "rent money" he doesn't just offer it. He makes triple what me and my Fiance do. That is not the point but he doesn't contribute anything to the household. Since i have been around he doesn't do anything, and i guess before either. He is lazy an alcoholic and i do not want that in my day to day life.

He is more the welcome to leave still come around hangout whenever. But go home to another home that isnt with us. He has made it a very volatile living situation. With me having a teenage son it is not a very healthy situation for my son either. I have had to make my son turn a blind eye to a lot of the things that have gone on. Because he shouldn't be exposed to that. Now mind you his dad left for 6 months. We didn't expect him to come back he went off with some woman and we never saw him. Which was fine. Then that went south and he came back at Thanksgiving. That is when the conversation should've been had. But hind sight being for sight it didn't happen.

In my Fiance's defense his father isn't the easiest person to talk to or deal with. He knows how I feel it is the actions and the demeanor during drinking i can't stand. I generally like him when he is sober. (which is never)
I do get that he is never going to completely go away. But i need him to not be apart of our day to day lives. (meaning living under the same roof it is not healthy for any of us.)

LondonLisa · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

Viczaesar said:

Jaime6166 said:

Viczaesar said:

southernbelle0915 said:

levioosa said:

southernbelle0915 said:

But y'all...they can't just kick FFIL to the curb. 1) He solely paid the mortgage for years until her FI got more established, 2) he's on the title, and 3) he's paying part of the mortgage now. He has money invested in that house too.

This was an objectively terrible idea, probably agreed to in grief.

It's not as simple as being like "hey, you have no money into this place and, we've just been letting you live here, so bye." They really are going to need attorneys to sort this out and, if I had to guess, it ain't gonna be pretty. My prediction is that they either mediate it by coming to a LEGAL agreement and (probably) selling the house and splitting the profit. OR they go to court, pay a fuck ton in court fees and, likely, ruin a relationship with a civil court battle.

I think you have a rough road ahead of you, OP. I really do commend you for being so loyal to your FI.

No, I agree that this is a really terrible situation, but it doesn't sound like at any point FI had a real conversation with his father about what their lives should look like post wedding. That's a big red flag. I don't agree that FIL should just be kicked out without any ceremony. He obviously has put money into the house. Depending on the DP and mortgage, he might even have more money into it than FI. But all of this shit should have been discussed like adults, instead of the clusterfuck that's happening now.

Sure, I agree - and it sounds like it has been (see her posts and clarifications). She also said on page 1 that her FI is now talking with an attorney. I'm not sure what else the FI can do? I mean, the dad won't leave, FI has too much money tied up in the house to say "fuck it, have the house", and a nasty, relationship ending battle is on the horizon...all with assets that came from the death of a woman they both loved. Nothing about the situation sounds simple or easy.

Something like this, that was likely agreed to while they were both grieving the loss of their mom/wife, seems destined for a clusterfuck. It's all just coming out of the woodwork now that FI wants to move on with his life. I think they can talk "like adults", but it doesn't mean they'll come to an agreement. It'd probably still be messy and necessitate attorneys.

I agree with you, except for blaming the decision to co-buy a house on grief. FI's mom and dad were divorced and FI's mom was married to someone else when she died. Either way, though, it's going to be messy for sure.

I really do appreciate everyones input here. Trust me it wasn't the ideal situation that I had hoped for. But all of the ideal relationships that i had i was miserable. Now granted I may not be completly happy with my living situation, but doesnt make me want to cancel the wedding or leave my fi or nothing. We have a time set aside to talk to his father. Explain to him how it needs to be for all of us to have a relationship with one another going forward and after the wedding.

So how does it need to be, exactly? Are you guys going to pay him back all of the money he put into the house? Equity?

If we have to so be it. But truly I know my fiance doesn't look at it like that. Because he put 90k down on this house paid his dads debts so that they could get this house. His dad hasn't put anywhere close to what my FI put down into the house. (no updates, no repairs,) Once my Fiance was established and stable he took over paying the mortgage. That was when i came along his dad gives money like rent if you will. So really in my honest opinion. He doesn't get shit. But that is my anger talking about the crap he has pulled and done to us in the last few yrs. So no in my thoughts he doesn't get shit.

That's not how it works. You need to break this down methodically, rather than who you think 'deserves' the house. Your FFIL is entitled to the equity in the house regardless. This is what happens when you cosign a mortgage with someone, you aren't equally responsible 50/50 per se, but rather you two are considered one unit and need to pay regardless of who puts in the money.

In many places it doesn't matter who pays what into the house (this is to protect stay at home parents who don't make contributions to the house financially), if you are on a joint mortgage, you are usually entitled to 50%. Also, your FFIL could argue that the debt payments were a gift and unrelated to the mortgage.

You need receipts.

Write down FFIL debts, pull out bank statements that show transfers, etc. Calculate who made mortgage payments and when. Calculate the amounts paid by FFIL as a percentage towards the mortgage.

So hypothetically:
Purchase price 143K

Fi Payments:
FFIL Debt 10K
contributions towards Mortgage payments Jan 2012-jan 2017 15K
Down payment 90K

FFIL Payments
Contributions towards mortgage Jan 12-17 20K
Mortgage fees 6K

Remaining mortgage: 13K

So broken down in this hypothetical, there has been 131K total amounts of contributions towards the house. So your FFIL has contributed roughly 20% towards the house (26K). You need to get a professional appraiser to authenticate the value of the house currently. Let's say it is now 168K. You would need to then need to buy out the father in law with 33,600 (20% of current value) for his contributions towards the house. Now your fi has paid off 10K of his debt, so you would need to make this 23,600 to pay off what he has put in.

But, this would only be if your FFIL is willing to walk away from this house. He has every right to 50% of it, depending on how things are broken down in the law where you live.

You can talk to a solicitor who will be able to advise, but this will be expensive and costly. And it will most likely end with a forced sale of the house and division of the proceeds.

But your fi needs to talk to him first about what his plans are. It may be a simple lump sum payment worked out to what he put in as a percentage.

All I can advise is don't marry this person whilst this is ongoing. This needs to be sorted before you come into the picture as it is just going to make it so much more complicated.

cowgirl8238 · January 2017

OP, I have read through all of the comments made and it is a bit too much to address everything individually. These are my personal thoughts.

1. Don't go through with this marriage yet. You have a lot of factors to consider and a lot is going on here. I would put the breaks on the marriage for right now.

2. Go to counseling...I repeat...Go. To. Counseling. This is not meant to be a dig at you, I think everyone should do this. But you especially are going to need help here:
As a Couple: You need to work on your communication skills with your FI. I know you keep saying to "Trust You" but I wonder if you think you're communicating more clearly than you really are. Both of you would benefit from this.
As an individual: Your FFIL is not going to magically disappear from your life after your wedding day. He is going to be around whether you like it or not. I think it would be wise to speak with a counselor now about his alcoholism and ways for you to understand and cope with this. THIS WILL NOT BE AN EASY ROAD.
Your FI: I think he would benefit from learning both better communication skills, and how to deal with his father. You can't force him to go, but I don't feel like he is putting enough effort into this whole thing. I would not be happy if my FI spent 5 YEARS not addressing a problem!

3. The house thing is a mess, and despite who paid what, the laws will determine what will happen in your state. Your FI needs to sit down with his father and ask him what the plan is. You may have to buy him out, you may have to sell the house and split the profits.

4. Where is your son in all of this? You say you forcing him to turn a blind eye to things...does he live with you, FI and FFIL?

I think you need to take a step back from the wedding planning. Take some time to think about your situation and consider seeking more advice from a professional. This relationship just feels "off" to me, like you are giving more than your FI is. Maybe its just the way I am reading everything, but I would not continue on as if nothing is wrong...the wedding and marriage will only COMPLICATE things, it won't FIX anything.

kimmiinthemitten · January 2017

You don't pay rent when your name is on the mortgage, that's not how this works.

Look, it's pretty clear nothing anyone has said here has impacted you or made even a dent in even the slightest way. But in each and every response you 100% blame your FFIL and completely ignore that your FI, the man you intend to make all major life decisions with moving forward, has allowed this to happen.

1. He cosigned a mortgage with his father
2. He paid off his debts (seemingly with no documentation, written agreement etc)
3. He has allowed him to stay and in the 5 years since meeting you has never truly addressed the living situation. It doesn't sound like he addressed it in regards to you moving in, and he clearly isn't addressing the transition for him to move out.
4. He has allowed his father to create a volatile situation and treat you poorly.
5. And after all of that, he still thought his father should walk your mother down the aisle, and unilaterally addressed it without your consent. To me, this is the lest egregious of his decisions, but is very symbolic.

In the interim, you're an ostrich with your head in sand ignoring the realities of your own life and assuming it will work out. Get some ore-marital counseling and legal advice for you. Depending on your states law, you deserve to know your rights and responsibilities regarding the house if FFIL doesn't just agree to move out (ETA or sell).

TheMostHappy15 · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

If we have to so be it. But truly I know my fiance doesn't look at it like that. Because he put 90k down on this house paid his dads debts so that they could get this house. His dad hasn't put anywhere close to what my FI put down into the house. (no updates, no repairs,) Once my Fiance was established and stable he took over paying the mortgage. That was when i came along his dad gives money like rent if you will. So really in my honest opinion. He doesn't get shit. But that is my anger talking about the crap he has pulled and done to us in the last few yrs. So no in my thoughts he doesn't get shit.

OP, this kind of thinking is why other posters in this thread are concerned you really don't understand the magnitude of the situation you are in.

It doesn't matter "how your fiance looks at it." It doesn't matter what you think FFIL deserves. No court in the world is going to agree with your assessment that FFIL is basically "paying rent" and nothing more, because he legally co-owns the home, so there is no such thing as paying rent in that situation.

I'm sorry you feel like he doesn't deserve to get anything, because he's definitely going to. You need to prepare yourself for the likely possibility you/your FI are going to lose a lot of money and probably also the house itself in this situation, because a court isn't going to force FFIL to vacate a house he legally co-owns so if he won't go willingly the only way to settle this is to sell and split the profits from the sale- and yes, you almost definitely will not get back as much as you put into it. I really hope for your sake that your FFIL allows his share of the house to be bought out and goes quietly, because that's the only way you are getting out of this situation without a ton of heartache and financial loss.

ahoywedding · January 2017

kimmiinthemitten said:

Man, what a mess.

After reading all of this I'm still stuck with one thought: if your FI *really* knew (cared?) how you felt about his father, he would have never pitched it to his dad, let alone given it more than a seconds thought himself.

Best of luck to you.

This. A coworker married a guy who had purchased a house with his sister a few years before he met his now wife. They didn't live together before getting married, but it was made VERY clear that the sister was to leave preferably before the wedding, but at least by the time they returned from their honeymoon. Before the wedding, coworker & her now husband re-did the mortgage to include her name and remove the sister. It was not messy at all (sister ended up taking over coworkers apartment lease!).

TALK TO YOUR FI. This should have been worked out (or at the very least discussed) AGES ago.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

ahoywedding said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Man, what a mess.

After reading all of this I'm still stuck with one thought: if your FI *really* knew (cared?) how you felt about his father, he would have never pitched it to his dad, let alone given it more than a seconds thought himself.

Best of luck to you.

This. A coworker married a guy who had purchased a house with his sister a few years before he met his now wife. They didn't live together before getting married, but it was made VERY clear that the sister was to leave preferably before the wedding, but at least by the time they returned from their honeymoon. Before the wedding, coworker & her now husband re-did the mortgage to include her name and remove the sister. It was not messy at all (sister ended up taking over coworkers apartment lease!).

TALK TO YOUR FI. This should have been worked out (or at the very least discussed) AGES ago.

Ok we didn't think it would be that simple. But I did talk to him last night. We are going to have this conversation with his father and go from there. Because we have to do when he is sober. I think that he may have thought it may be to complicated but that sounds simpler.

kimmiinthemitten · January 2017

Jaime6166 said: Ok we didn't think it would be that simple. But I did talk to him last night. We are going to have this conversation with his father and go from there. Because we have to do when he is sober. I think that he may have thought it may be to complicated but that sounds simpler.

I can't believe I neglected this in my earlier posts: Al-Anon, Al-Anon, Al-Anon.

Sober FFIL still has the brain of an addict and is never truly sober and your FI needs to learn to manage his codependency and establish boundaries.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said: Ok we didn't think it would be that simple. But I did talk to him last night. We are going to have this conversation with his father and go from there. Because we have to do when he is sober. I think that he may have thought it may be to complicated but that sounds simpler.

I can't believe I neglected this in my earlier posts: Al-Anon, Al-Anon, Al-Anon.

Sober FFIL still has the brain of an addict and is never truly sober and your FI needs to learn to manage his codependency and establish boundaries.

Umm you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. In this case stop drinking. FI doesnt drink like that niether do i. So telling him he needs to go to AA yea right. I will be better off beating my head against a brick fricking wall.

LondonLisa · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said: Ok we didn't think it would be that simple. But I did talk to him last night. We are going to have this conversation with his father and go from there. Because we have to do when he is sober. I think that he may have thought it may be to complicated but that sounds simpler.

I can't believe I neglected this in my earlier posts: Al-Anon, Al-Anon, Al-Anon.

Sober FFIL still has the brain of an addict and is never truly sober and your FI needs to learn to manage his codependency and establish boundaries.

Umm you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. In this case stop drinking. FI doesnt drink like that niether do i. So telling him he needs to go to AA yea right. I will be better off beating my head against a brick fricking wall.

Al-anon is a programme for family members of alcoholics, not a support group for alcoholics themselves.

MairePoppy · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said: Ok we didn't think it would be that simple. But I did talk to him last night. We are going to have this conversation with his father and go from there. Because we have to do when he is sober. I think that he may have thought it may be to complicated but that sounds simpler.

I can't believe I neglected this in my earlier posts: Al-Anon, Al-Anon, Al-Anon.

Sober FFIL still has the brain of an addict and is never truly sober and your FI needs to learn to manage his codependency and establish boundaries.

Umm you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. In this case stop drinking. FI doesnt drink like that niether do i. So telling him he needs to go to AA yea right. I will be better off beating my head against a brick fricking wall.

Kimmi suggested that YOU and fi got to Al-Anon. We all know you can't force an alcoholic to attend AA meetings or quit drinking.

kimmiinthemitten · January 2017

Thank you @LondonLisa and @MairePoppy .

The first step in Al Anon is admitting and accepting that you are powerless over the addict. Yes, my advice was for you and your FI. FFIL has been enabled and runs all over your FI due to a lack of boundaries. Protecting him from consequences of his behavior because he isn't sober isn't protecting him.

mollybarker11 · January 2017

Look, I almost always think it's out-of-line and dramatic when posters here go "You should postpone your wedding until [interpersonal issue] is resolved." But I strongly encourage you to analyze whether A. legally binding yourself to someone facing a potential legal battle and B. trying to budget an event when your financial situation is up in the air could have a negative impact on you or your son.

Jaime6166 said:
My fiance and I want the same things. To start our life together on our own without the burden of his father. We have mentioned TO his dad about no longer living there, but his DAD has not taken action to leave. His DAD said he understood and would work on it. Took that as he is leaving, but do not see any action.

With all due respect, it took a page and a half of black & white ink to make it clear to us that you* asked FFIL to move out, so I just gotta say: Did you make it clear to him? Did you give him a firm date, (ie. "May 31, 2017" not "once we're married")? Did you discuss what steps he's taking to find a new residence? Did you tell him you're already speaking with attorneys about how to proceed if he can't come to an agreement out of court? These are not the types of things you can just mention to a person.

I wish you luck whenever you sit down for that sober conversation you've been waiting for. Since you've said that your FFIL is never sober, it sounds like you're in for a long wait. I too encourage you & your FI to join Al-Anon and/or find a counsellor to help you navigate your relationship with FFIL in a healthier way.

*Using the plural "you" because you said "we", but your FI should be leading while you support him from the side. This post implies that you think you (singular) will work it all out once you're married by getting "loud & boisterous", as if your FFIL will suddenly put down the bottle and start valuing your opinion just because you're a wife instead of a fiancée. Sadly that's not how it works. I sincerely hope you're able to come to a resolution without damaging the relationship further.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

**********update*********************

I appreciate all of the input that was provided. FI and I had a conversation with his Dad on Saturday. It went really well, and he has agreed to move out on his own. We are going to go to the bank this coming Saturday to change mortgage around. As well as getting the paperwork started for a Quitdeed. (this will transfer the deed into my name and leave my FI as well)

Once that is completed his dad says that hopefully before then he will find an apartment/house or something between then. He said that he can be out by no later then the 15th of Feb.

His dad was very good about the whole thing. He understands where we are coming from, and why this is a good thing for all involved. He also feels like he will be better off on his own.

So none of the worse case scenarios that were brought up by the PP didn't come up. As well as I talked to my FI. He agrees he jumped the gun on his dad walking my mother down the aisle. So he told his dad during the same conversation that will not be taking place. So I will let me mother decide who walks her down.

Thank you again for all of your input!

southernbelle0915 · January 2017

So glad that there's a drama free plan in place, OP! I hope everything goes off without a hitch. Good luck!

kimmiinthemitten · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

**********update*********************

I appreciate all of the input that was provided. FI and I had a conversation with his Dad on Saturday. It went really well, and he has agreed to move out on his own. We are going to go to the bank this coming Saturday to change mortgage around. As well as getting the paperwork started for a Quitdeed. (this will transfer the deed into my name and leave my FI as well)

Once that is completed his dad says that hopefully before then he will find an apartment/house or something between then. He said that he can be out by no later then the 15th of Feb.

His dad was very good about the whole thing. He understands where we are coming from, and why this is a good thing for all involved. He also feels like he will be better off on his own.

So none of the worse case scenarios that were brought up by the PP didn't come up. As well as I talked to my FI. He agrees he jumped the gun on his dad walking my mother down the aisle. So he told his dad during the same conversation that will not be taking place. So I will let me mother decide who walks her down.

Thank you again for all of your input!

I'm really glad everything went well and hope your FFIL keeps his word and moves out when he says he will.

To the bolded, we can only respond to what you tell us, and according to your posts your FFIL is an alcoholic with an anger problem and an opportunist who took advantage of your FI. I'm glad the conversation went well, but that doesn't mean that the worst case scenarios people brought up weren't warranted concerns, or even things to be concerned about going forward. He's just moving out of the house, not out of your lives.

MairePoppy · January 2017

Good for you that your fi worked things out with his dad. I hope you appreciate that dad is cooperating and not creating an ugly mess.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said:

**********update*********************

I appreciate all of the input that was provided. FI and I had a conversation with his Dad on Saturday. It went really well, and he has agreed to move out on his own. We are going to go to the bank this coming Saturday to change mortgage around. As well as getting the paperwork started for a Quitdeed. (this will transfer the deed into my name and leave my FI as well)

Once that is completed his dad says that hopefully before then he will find an apartment/house or something between then. He said that he can be out by no later then the 15th of Feb.

His dad was very good about the whole thing. He understands where we are coming from, and why this is a good thing for all involved. He also feels like he will be better off on his own.

So none of the worse case scenarios that were brought up by the PP didn't come up. As well as I talked to my FI. He agrees he jumped the gun on his dad walking my mother down the aisle. So he told his dad during the same conversation that will not be taking place. So I will let me mother decide who walks her down.

Thank you again for all of your input!

I'm really glad everything went well and hope your FFIL keeps his word and moves out when he says he will.

To the bolded, we can only respond to what you tell us, and according to your posts your FFIL is an alcoholic with an anger problem and an opportunist who took advantage of your FI. I'm glad the conversation went well, but that doesn't mean that the worst case scenarios people brought up weren't warranted concerns, or even things to be concerned about going forward. He's just moving out of the house, not out of your lives.

To the bolded I just need him out of the house, and our day to day lives. (meaning morning - night) We even told him that doesn't mean he can't come over etc. It just means that when its time to go home its time to go. He agreed, and even stated that yea this is for the best with us getting married.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

MairePoppy said:

Good for you that your fi worked things out with his dad. I hope you appreciate that dad is cooperating and not creating an ugly mess.

Yes i do appreciate that all together. He agreed that this was for the best. He said he didnt expect to live with us forever. He said until we brought it like we did he didn't really think about it too much. (eye roll). FI told him "Dad I love you, and you will always be apart of our lives. But we need to have our day to lives to ourselves. Meaning would you be willing to move out? So that "we" can have our day to day lives to ourselves? Because it is becoming hard on us, because of the severity of the situation."

Dad response. Sure kid all you had to do was ask. I mean that is the least that I can do. Considering everything we have been through mush mush blah blah. (very boring weird emotional stuff left out here) ha ha

holyguacamole79 · January 2017

Glad to hear that went well!

MobKaz · January 2017

Jaime6166 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said:

**********update*********************

I appreciate all of the input that was provided. FI and I had a conversation with his Dad on Saturday. It went really well, and he has agreed to move out on his own. We are going to go to the bank this coming Saturday to change mortgage around. As well as getting the paperwork started for a Quitdeed. (this will transfer the deed into my name and leave my FI as well)

Once that is completed his dad says that hopefully before then he will find an apartment/house or something between then. He said that he can be out by no later then the 15th of Feb.

His dad was very good about the whole thing. He understands where we are coming from, and why this is a good thing for all involved. He also feels like he will be better off on his own.

So none of the worse case scenarios that were brought up by the PP didn't come up. As well as I talked to my FI. He agrees he jumped the gun on his dad walking my mother down the aisle. So he told his dad during the same conversation that will not be taking place. So I will let me mother decide who walks her down.

Thank you again for all of your input!

I'm really glad everything went well and hope your FFIL keeps his word and moves out when he says he will.

To the bolded, we can only respond to what you tell us, and according to your posts your FFIL is an alcoholic with an anger problem and an opportunist who took advantage of your FI. I'm glad the conversation went well, but that doesn't mean that the worst case scenarios people brought up weren't warranted concerns, or even things to be concerned about going forward. He's just moving out of the house, not out of your lives.

To the bolded I just need him out of the house, and our day to day lives. (meaning morning - night) We even told him that doesn't mean he can't come over etc. It just means that when its time to go home its time to go. He agreed, and even stated that yea this is for the best with us getting married.

My brain always skews to the downside of things. You just might want to change the locks on the doors once FFIL moves out. You certainly don't want a blanket invitation to "come over" turn into a situation when he shows up and lets himself in without warning.

Jaime6166 · January 2017

MobKaz said:

Jaime6166 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Jaime6166 said:

**********update*********************

I appreciate all of the input that was provided. FI and I had a conversation with his Dad on Saturday. It went really well, and he has agreed to move out on his own. We are going to go to the bank this coming Saturday to change mortgage around. As well as getting the paperwork started for a Quitdeed. (this will transfer the deed into my name and leave my FI as well)

Once that is completed his dad says that hopefully before then he will find an apartment/house or something between then. He said that he can be out by no later then the 15th of Feb.

His dad was very good about the whole thing. He understands where we are coming from, and why this is a good thing for all involved. He also feels like he will be better off on his own.

So none of the worse case scenarios that were brought up by the PP didn't come up. As well as I talked to my FI. He agrees he jumped the gun on his dad walking my mother down the aisle. So he told his dad during the same conversation that will not be taking place. So I will let me mother decide who walks her down.

Thank you again for all of your input!

I'm really glad everything went well and hope your FFIL keeps his word and moves out when he says he will.

To the bolded, we can only respond to what you tell us, and according to your posts your FFIL is an alcoholic with an anger problem and an opportunist who took advantage of your FI. I'm glad the conversation went well, but that doesn't mean that the worst case scenarios people brought up weren't warranted concerns, or even things to be concerned about going forward. He's just moving out of the house, not out of your lives.

To the bolded I just need him out of the house, and our day to day lives. (meaning morning - night) We even told him that doesn't mean he can't come over etc. It just means that when its time to go home its time to go. He agreed, and even stated that yea this is for the best with us getting married.

My brain always skews to the downside of things. You just might want to change the locks on the doors once FFIL moves out. You certainly don't want a blanket invitation to "come over" turn into a situation when he shows up and lets himself in without warning.

Yup right there with you! I will go out and purchase new locks once he has moved all of his belongings out of the house. 100% I agree with that. He tried to ask during this conversation, about the dogs while we are on our honeymoon. Lol we stated that we have someone to come and take care of the dogs not to worry. Like sorry yes you lived here but once you are gone I do not want you staying over.

Like he can come for visits watch football whatever, but stay sober enough to return home.

Grooms father and Brides mother

Re: Grooms father and Brides mother

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