Attire prompt etiquette

stinacm · August 2018

@STARMOON44I like to think of etiquette as being the observation of polite societal patterns of behaviour which have become accepted as "proper" over the course of time, which is why I think of it as being old-fashioned. And it is both subjective and circumstantial, as the discussion of jeans indicates.

Maybe I've just been unfortunate in the Youth Of Today I have experienced, particularly in the workplace. What you experience is what you know. I bitch about people of other ages sometimes, too

lovesclimbing · August 2018

Something was bothering me about this, and with the more recent posts, I've figured out what.

You are acting like there is One Acceptable Dress for certain occasions, and that's simply false. As I said, I've worn denim to weddings and funerals. Denim was worn by some people to my wedding. Goodness, I was at a funeral recently where the sister of the deceased was wearing jeans and a fluorescent yellow sweatshirt that had some cheerful wording I forget exactly what along the lines of "smile" or "happy faces" on the front. Most of the family was in jeans (as was I). The deceased was fairly young, and I expect they were in too much grief to care about being dressed "properly."

"Semi formal," "Sunday best," "casual" all mean different things to different people. And it sounds like the people you are talking about consider nicely dressed to be something different than what you think it is, which is NOT wrong. It's just different.

And fwiw, I wouldn't immediately think of a mid afternoon outdoor wedding as a semi formal affair. Sure, I'd wear a dress, but it probably wouldn't be a cocktail dress. It'd be more of a sun dress type.

And yes, I do know how to dress up and have attended multiple formal events in gowns before.

stinacm · August 2018

Thank you, @lovesclimbing. The closest description I could get online to what I was looking at was "daytime semi-formal" or "dressy casual". I'm totally down with sun dresses. Khakis. No ties.

I think I feel like there's a minimum acceptable standard, rather than One Acceptable Dress, but we have also firmly established that my considerations when choosing how to dress may not line up with my guests', and that's going to have to be OK.

I can put this one to bed and get to worrying about something that will be far more important in the overall scheme of things: how much alcohol I need to have on hand

MRDCle · August 2018

knottieabfd6c15baff9e64 said:

Thank you, @lovesclimbing. The closest description I could get online to what I was looking at was "daytime semi-formal" or "dressy casual". I'm totally down with sun dresses. Khakis. No ties.

I think I feel like there's a minimum acceptable standard, rather than One Acceptable Dress, but we have also firmly established that my considerations when choosing how to dress may not line up with my guests', and that's going to have to be OK.

I can put this one to bed and get to worrying about something that will be far more important in the overall scheme of things: how much alcohol I need to have on hand

Well after reading through this thread I personally feel like the answer is: a lot.

lovesclimbing · August 2018

knottieabfd6c15baff9e64 said:

Thank you, @lovesclimbing. The closest description I could get online to what I was looking at was "daytime semi-formal" or "dressy casual". I'm totally down with sun dresses. Khakis. No ties.

I think I feel like there's a minimum acceptable standard, rather than One Acceptable Dress, but we have also firmly established that my considerations when choosing how to dress may not line up with my guests', and that's going to have to be OK.

I can put this one to bed and get to worrying about something that will be far more important in the overall scheme of things: how much alcohol I need to have on hand

So you would side eye the immediate family of a deceased person for not wearing what you consider to be a "minimum acceptable standard"?

My point was standards vary, and there is not one "minimum acceptable standard."

climbingsingle · August 2018

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

banana468 · August 2018

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

stinacm · August 2018

lovesclimbing said:

So you would side eye the immediate family of a deceased person for not wearing what you consider to be a "minimum acceptable standard"?

My point was standards vary, and there is not one "minimum acceptable standard."

Yes. Yes, I would.
I also side eye people who show up to interviews for desk jobs in jeans.
And people who go to the supermarket in any part of their pajamas.

If someone had posted that they had received an elegant invitation with no dress code indicated for a 2pm outdoor wedding and wanted to wear their jeans, would the forum response be "Sure, go for it!" or "No, unless there is something that indicates jeans are the dress du jour, you should at least put on a sundress or khakis"?

ahoywedding · August 2018

knottieabfd6c15baff9e64 said:

lovesclimbing said:

So you would side eye the immediate family of a deceased person for not wearing what you consider to be a "minimum acceptable standard"?

My point was standards vary, and there is not one "minimum acceptable standard."

Yes. Yes, I would.
I also side eye people who show up to interviews for desk jobs in jeans.
And people who go to the supermarket in any part of their pajamas.

If someone had posted that they had received an elegant invitation with no dress code indicated for a 2pm outdoor wedding and wanted to wear their jeans, would the forum response be "Sure, go for it!" or "No, unless there is something that indicates jeans are the dress du jour, you should at least put on a sundress or khakis"?

I used to side-eye some of that stuff, but I've really been trying to control myself. I hate saying things are "elitist," but hear me out on this one.

Not everyone has been on a professional job interview. There are some industries where "nice" jeans would be fine and the interviewer wouldn't give a crap. Not everyone has had a parent or some other adult in their life around to teach them those subtle dress code hints for things like weddings & funerals. (This is why PPs had suggested your FI gently have the discussion with his own children.) Some people attend their first wedding or funeral as an adult. Some "typical" venues excluded groups of people (namely POC) until fairly recently, so their parents may not even be able to offer advice. Not everyone HAS dress clothes. They're often expensive, harder to find second hand, and are less versatile than other options. Not everyone has the free time to run from store to store looking for a new dress.

I personally try not to go to leave the house in "fake pants," but you don't know why someone else is doing that. Maybe they're dealing with some shit and just can't get dressed. Maybe they have a sick child or are sick themselves. Maybe getting dressed is physically too hard. Maybe it's laundry day and those are their only clean pants. Maybe they gained a bunch of weight and those are the only pants that fit (*cough cough* Regina George).

If people are taking time out of their day to come celebrate you and your relationship, isn't their presence more important than their attire? Someone who is under dressed likely will realize it, and will feel self-conscious enough without your side-eye.

MairePoppy · August 2018

Eh, people around here show up at wakes and funerals in jeans all the time. One branch of the family belongs to a motorcycle club and they dress the same for all events. Jeans, leather jackets or vests, boots. At least they show up to pay their respects and they're a pretty nice bunch of people. For some of them, their motorcycles are their only vehicles.

banana468 · August 2018

knottieabfd6c15baff9e64 said:

lovesclimbing said:

So you would side eye the immediate family of a deceased person for not wearing what you consider to be a "minimum acceptable standard"?

My point was standards vary, and there is not one "minimum acceptable standard."

Yes. Yes, I would.
I also side eye people who show up to interviews for desk jobs in jeans.
And people who go to the supermarket in any part of their pajamas.

If someone had posted that they had received an elegant invitation with no dress code indicated for a 2pm outdoor wedding and wanted to wear their jeans, would the forum response be "Sure, go for it!" or "No, unless there is something that indicates jeans are the dress du jour, you should at least put on a sundress or khakis"?

I would advise that person that I think they'd be undressed if I was asked for my advice.

BUT, what I wouldn't do is assume that people wouldn't know what to do from the start.

stinacm · August 2018

That's fair, @banana468.

I hear you, @ahoywedding. I am a white middle-class woman living in a very white part of the USA. Privilege checked.

When I first emigrated to the USA, my (now ex) husband was unemployed and going back to school, and I had to wait for the government to issue my work authorisation. We were poor as dirt. I cobbled together a wardrobe from Goodwill and Walmart so that I could go on interviews, because everything else was out of my price range. Let's not even talk about what I got married in the first time round, because heck, *I* side-eyed myself for that one.

The one time I left my house in pj pants was the day my divorce finalised. I stopped in a gas station for ice cream and wine on my way to a friends house and yeah, I got side-eye. I had no fucks to give at that moment in time.

Yes, presence is more important than attire. Absolutely, and without question. At all events.

And, butter is delicious.

bubblylove · August 2018

I vote for not being judgy and talking to anyone about their "inappropriate" clothing. In many places jeans at a funeral is not bad. I have seen it many times. Same with weddings. Let people wear what they want for crying out loud.

STARMOON44 · August 2018

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

charlotte989875 · August 2018

I think there is a fundamental difference between someone asking “hey what should I wear to this event” then kindly giving them advice about what is “generally worn (in that circle)” and judging people for not wearing what *you* think is appropriate. So if someone asked for advice I would give my opinion, but I would not judge them to not doing as I suggest.

climbingsingle · August 2018

MairePoppy said:

Eh, people around here show up at wakes and funerals in jeans all the time. One branch of the family belong to a motorcycle club and they dress the same for all events. Jeans, leather jackets or vests, boots. At least they show up to pay their respects and they're a pretty nice bunch of people. For some of them, their motorcycles are their only vehicles.

My dad is a biker that belongs to a club, and has since before I was born. Many of his buddies are bikers too. But honestly, I've yet to see any of them show up to a wake in jeans.

I don't want my comments about jeans to come off as "elitist". I come from an extremely blue collar family. I did not grow up with money. But we were not allowed to wear jeans to events, even if that meant going to the cheapest place in town and buying whatever dress up clothes we could afford.

lovesclimbing · August 2018

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

Plus one to this!

All I'm saying is standards vary. I live in Alaska where dress tends to be more casual across the board. I think what's acceptable really varies based on a lot of things. I don't believe there is one "minimum acceptable standard" of dress except in places where there actually is supposed to be one listed - i.e. an actual formal wedding or a job where there is a dress code.

My first thought upon seeing that girl wearing a "happy" flourescent yellow shirt to a funeral was to have the journalist/writer side of me thinking of a first line of a story being about it as an illustration of that family's grief at the sudden loss of a young son, not to sideeye her for wearing something "inappropriate."

banana468 · August 2018

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

charlotte989875 · August 2018

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

STARMOON44 · August 2018

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

Eh dude was pretty clear. Don’t all Christians think they have an idea what Jesus thinks?

thisismynickname2 · August 2018

I just think if General You doesn't like how other people have presented themselves for an occasion, mask the side-eye, keep your mouth shut, and carry on like usual. Everyone is entitled to judgement in their brain, but acting on it is rude.
Who knows, maybe the person in nice jeans and clean sneakers is judging the sundress girl for having her goodies on display in a stiff breeze. Judgement can flow in all directions.

banana468 · August 2018

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

STARMOON44 · August 2018

banana468 said:

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

Like, literally let the little children come to me. Very specific. Very clear.

banana468 · August 2018

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

Like, literally let the little children come to me. Very specific. Very clear.

Right. I admit I nitpicked your comment previously. IMO it's the difference between knowing exactly what was said and thinking it's what he would say. I'm also no scholar.

Tangent: I didn't see the woman but wanted to find her and fume at her. She was an old woman and I wanted to ask, "Who made you the arbiter of when a kid is supposed to be here? I'm pretty sure he didn't say, "Let the children who are well behaved come to me"!

STARMOON44 · August 2018

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

Like, literally let the little children come to me. Very specific. Very clear.

Right. I admit I nitpicked your comment previously. IMO it's the difference between knowing exactly what was said and thinking it's what he would say. I'm also no scholar.

Tangent: I didn't see the woman but wanted to find her and fume at her. She was an old woman and I wanted to ask, "Who made you the arbiter of when a kid is supposed to be here? I'm pretty sure he didn't say, "Let the children who are well behaved come to me"!

“Let the children come to me.” “Only if they are silent, don’t have jam hands, and are wearing sailor suits.” She’s prob just reading a different translation.

lovesclimbing · August 2018

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

Like, literally let the little children come to me. Very specific. Very clear.

Right. I admit I nitpicked your comment previously. IMO it's the difference between knowing exactly what was said and thinking it's what he would say. I'm also no scholar.

Tangent: I didn't see the woman but wanted to find her and fume at her. She was an old woman and I wanted to ask, "Who made you the arbiter of when a kid is supposed to be here? I'm pretty sure he didn't say, "Let the children who are well behaved come to me"!

“Let the children come to me.” “Only if they are silent, don’t have jam hands, and are wearing sailor suits.” She’s prob just reading a different translation.

Wow, banana, that's just crazy to me! I remember reading an article aimed at parents that was basically, thank you for bringing your kids. It means in 20 years, we will still have a church instead of a church shuttering its doors like many do because all their members have died.

Here at the church I'm attending currently, a couple older gentlemen from out of state visited and one commented on how surprised he was at how many young children were in the church. It made me sad to think he doesn't see that where he's from!

banana468 · August 2018

lovesclimbing said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

charlotte989875 said:

banana468 said:

STARMOON44 said:

banana468 said:

climbingwife said:

I do have to comment about the whole jeans/denim thing. I personally do not feel that jeans are acceptable for a wake, funeral, wedding - even a baby shower. That's just the way my parents raised me. You had to dress up for all of those occasions, and jeans are not dressy clothes.

I had a wake to go to on a Friday evening. I wore jeans to work (very casual office) and then ran home to change into dress pants and a top for the wake. Honestly, I have and do side-eye people that wear jeans to wakes and funerals. I side-eyed my cousin's H's family when they showed up to their wedding in jeans.

Maybe that's old fashioned of me. I just feel like some events require a certain level of dressing. And denim ain't it.

I'm pretty much there with you. If you're a grown adult then you should not be wearing these articles of clothing to these events. I give you a pass at wakes/funerals when your only option is to go to or from work to the event and you're in a work-related uniform. Ex: my uncle died and worked for a home heating oil company. His coworkers came in their smelly uniforms to the wake or funeral - but that was their only option to make it and pay their respects - I get that. That's far different from making the choice to put on something casual.

I'll agree that to a certain extent Sunday best can vary but there's still a minimum. Our church is on the shore (you can see the shoreline from the church) and summer dress for men is often khaki shorts and boat shoes with a collared shirt. Even then our parish addresses from the pulpit and in the bulletin that being near the beach does not mean that beach attire itself is appropriate. Other churches are a bit more conservative so we know that DH has to wear pants to the ankle. Fine.

That said, I can tell you I went to a wedding in DH's family 14 years ago and they LOVE to boat but the dude in the shorts and birks stuck out hardcore in the sea of men with pants.

I wear jeans to church nearly every Sunday and I’m one of the nicest dressed people there. I don’t think Jesus cares and I think emphasizing appearance at church is fundamentally unchristian.

You can disagree with it but there are plenty of reasons that many churches have stated what is and isn't appropriate for dress. Also, I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe you know what Jesus thinks.

FTR, the calling out of inappropriate attire I've seen has always been addressing bathing suits and beach / pool attire as worn to church. Plenty of people wear jeans to church and for standard worship service in our parish it's considered the norm. At other parishes I've attended I didn't see denim on anyone for Sunday mass. It just wasn't done. However every parish in which I've ever been a parishioner has output a summer statement re-reminding people that bathing suits, cover ups, etc are for the beach and not for worship. This isn't new. It's something I can recall for the last 30 years.

But that’s a place with a specific dress code, which they are free to enforce. I wouldn’t argue with someone from the church (or any other place with a specific, articulated, dress code) enforcing those policies. I would have a big problem with individual members of the church (or attendees at other locations) judging people for what they were wearing, or trying to be the ones to enforce the rules.

Yes agreed. Only one time was DH approached by a church member and it was when we scooted Chiquito out for being a PITA and loud. We were asked to split our attendance and not bring the boy. Not happening. We'll remove him when he's a jackass.

Like, literally let the little children come to me. Very specific. Very clear.

Right. I admit I nitpicked your comment previously. IMO it's the difference between knowing exactly what was said and thinking it's what he would say. I'm also no scholar.

Tangent: I didn't see the woman but wanted to find her and fume at her. She was an old woman and I wanted to ask, "Who made you the arbiter of when a kid is supposed to be here? I'm pretty sure he didn't say, "Let the children who are well behaved come to me"!

“Let the children come to me.” “Only if they are silent, don’t have jam hands, and are wearing sailor suits.” She’s prob just reading a different translation.

Wow, banana, that's just crazy to me! I remember reading an article aimed at parents that was basically, thank you for bringing your kids. It means in 20 years, we will still have a church instead of a church shuttering its doors like many do because all their members have died.

Here at the church I'm attending currently, a couple older gentlemen from out of state visited and one commented on how surprised he was at how many young children were in the church. It made me sad to think he doesn't see that where he's from!

I want to ask anyone who questions DH and me if their kids still attend.

climbingsingle · August 2018

So just wanted to add something. We attended a wedding this weekend at a brewery. They inlcuded "cocktail attire" on the invite. And there were guys that still showed up in shorts/jeans and t-shirts.

STARMOON44 · August 2018

climbingwife said:

So just wanted to add something. We attended a wedding this weekend at a brewery. They inlcuded "cocktail attire" on the invite. And there were guys that still showed up in shorts/jeans and t-shirts.

Yup. Some people just do not care b

LondonLisa · August 2018

I put my hand up and admit I side eye it. And I would never, ever wear jeans to any sort of formal event (I don't even wear them to work).

But I also recognise that this my issue.

That being said, I remember an article I read a few years ago where a newly arrived Brit in New York received an invite that said "Dress: fancy". Fancy dress means silly costumes in the UK. She thought it was strange but did a "when in Rome". She showed up to a black tie party dressed as a tomato!

Also, Banana, that is crazy. I hope the Pope is reaching 'devout' people like that who side eye kids in church/ breastfeeding etc.

Attire prompt etiquette

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