Do we need libraries anymore?

PrettyGirlLost

jenna8984 said:

Thanks for all the answers so far. And @emmyg65 that link was helpful.

I guess the part I just don't understand is why it's prioritized as a necessity. Reading books, reading magazines, watching DVD's, attending groups are a HOBBY. I constantly hear on the radio how 1 in 5 kids in this country are starving. I'm fine paying tax dollars to feed these kids because that is a true necessity that I feel people are entitled to- not being able to read a book for free.

Yeah and more people should take up that HOBBY and educate themselves and read literature of actual value, rather than dicking around on FB, Reddit, etc. or spending hours on end at the gym, or in front of the TV watching vapid and fake reality TV shows.

Our society is dumbing itself down because people don't actually read anymore.

PrettyGirlLost

jenna8984 said:

PDKH said:

Thanks for all the answers so far. And @emmyg65 that link was helpful.

I guess the part I just don't understand is why it's prioritized as a necessity. Reading books, reading magazines, watching DVD's, attending groups are a HOBBY. I constantly hear on the radio how 1 in 5 kids in this country are starving. I'm fine paying tax dollars to feed these kids because that is a true necessity that I feel people are entitled to- not being able to read a book for free.

By your reasoning, school and learning is also a hobby, so we should cut public education. This isn't an either/or situation. And I would strongly disagree and say that the ability to learn, reading comprehension, and critical thinking are necessities. Libraries fuel dreams and the skills to make something of themselves. There's a reason education used to be only for the wealthy.

Basic education is completely different. I agree that reading comprehension and critical thinking are necessities and that's why they are taught in school. I'm not saying libraries are not a wonderful resource and that people should not continue to learn. All I'm saying is that I'm a college graduate with great verbal skills and I've never stepped foot in a library. So while they are great and fun- they aren't needed in the equation to "fuel dreams and skills".

Maybe I should just stop talking. My point wasn't to argue against libraries, I just don't want to get all political about what the money could better be used for and my stand on socialism lol.

1st bolded- many people are not able to attend college because they can't afford it. 

And just because one attends and graduates from college doesn't automatically confer good verbal skills upon them.  In fact, most college grads I graduated with and know have a very poor vocabulary- there's a reason Kaplan and Princeton review make a fortune on prep classes for the GREs.  Those "GRE Words". .. yeah people used to use them in common, very day speaking.

Hell, the college kids I hear on my commute each day have a poor freaking vocabulary.  And I attribute it all to lack of reading and lack of reading a variety of fiction and nonfiction works.

2nd bolded- I don't see the connection between public libraries and socialism, and if there is one, well that is one form of socialism I can get behind.

jenna8984

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

QueerFemme

jenna8984 said:

PDKH said:

jenna8984 said:

Oh now my "privilege" is showing. What does that even mean? I didn't say "Daddy sent me to Harvard". I worked two jobs to pay for my own community college that every single person can attend if they apply. I then have student loans from finishing at a state university, where I also worked two jobs. So please spare me the dramatics that I'm like a billionaire stomping down on poor people and their resources.

 

And thank you all for showing me that a large number of people do in fact use public libraries. I was concerned with the tax money because I thought it would be a wasted venture that people no longer used. Now I am glad that it's coming to my town if so many people do in fact utilize and take advantage of it.

You are privelidged because you grew up in a society where education is taken for granted - we all are privelidged in this manner.

Privelidge doesn't come only in monetary form.

Ok, then others shouldn't be pointing fingers calling me priviledged if they have the same opportunities at public education that I had.



Privilege is also about even knowing that those educational opportunities exist and have access to them. The fact that you don't recognize that makes you privileged.

PrettyGirlLost

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

People are not harping on your or beating a dead horse, they are participating in a discussion.  A discussion is a give and take, and many times people are not in agreement.

As people read this thread, they are adding their opinions.  That's the purpose of internet forums.

emmyg65

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

Agreed 100%. No need to pile on at this point.

PrettyGirlLost

emmyg65 said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

Agreed 100%. No need to pile on at this point.

I don't think you guys understand who forum discussions work.

jenna8984

PrettyGirlLost said:

emmyg65 said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

Agreed 100%. No need to pile on at this point.

I don't think you guys understand who forum discussions work.

No, it's fine for people to keep talking amongst themselves about the topic. But I already conceded so they don't need to keep referencing me every time, speaking to me in a persuasive manner.

emmyg65

I do understand how forum discussions work. I participate in several online communities and also manage them for work. All of those communities are more heavily moderated than The Knot and, among other things, discourage piling on when it doesn't add to the conversation. It's unnecessary and can potentially create a hostile atmosphere where people are less likely to participate. I also understand that The Knot doesn't have this policy, and a vocal contingent doesn't want it. I just find it frustrating and wanted to chime in.

lyndausvi

jenna8984 said:

AddieCake said:

As an English teacher, the very idea of getting rid of libraries appalls me. Do you have any idea how many children's love of reading and learning is established and grows in libraries? 

When I was a kid I had a love of soccer but I didn't get to play in a league for free despite all the benefits that children get from organized sports. lol

AddieCake said:

Gyms certainly aren't a necessity, either. I've never stepped foot in one and probably never will. Nor do I "need" to, both b/c I manage to stay in shape w/o it and b/c it's not a "necessity." 

Yes I agree. I would personally enjoy a gym but once we start talking about necessity it's definitely not in the conversation anymore.

Ah.... there are tons of FREE parks around for people to play a pickup game of soccer or go for a walk or bike or whatever else you need to exercise.  

jenna8984

scribe95 said:

Look, the OP started what was clear to be a very controversial topic and can't expect the thread to stop just because she backtracks after good points were made.

I don't expect it to just stop but again, every subsequent post doesn't need to be directed at me. I appreciated the information given. I wasn't all "I hate you bitches, I'm going to burn down libraries"

grumbledore

Yes, we still need libraries.  They are indispensable for the poor.

And I use ours, as does my DD, and I also borrow e-books from our library system.

I am very pro-library.  And while physical health is obviously important, you can get a gym membership for $10/month pretty much everywhere now, and going outside is free, so yeah, I'd rather see the $$ spent on a library.

grumbledore

jenna8984 said:

I live in what I consider to be a small town (15k residents). We just got approved state funding for a new 11 million dollar library to replace the current one built in 1940. Most people would be excited for their town but I just think it's a giant waste of tax dollars. Honestly, not trying to sound ignorant but who the hell uses a library? Every school is equipped with a library and computers that enable to students to research anything they need. I don't know any adults who go to a library and could they not just use the one in the schools? I'm sorry but set up a few public computers in the town hall for people to use and call it a day. If people really want to read a hard cover book they can sit in the Barnes & Noble and read it or purchase it. Enlighten me if I'm missing something here, but 11 million dollars plus the cost of maintenance, utilities, employees does not seem worth it just because a few people don't want to purchase their own books or internet. (again not talking about school children as they have school libraries) 

Isn't physical health as important as mental health? I'd rather see an 11 million dollar workout/ gym complex that I can use for free....why is that not a reality? 

Honestly, I just re-read your OP, and I wish I would down vote it.  Sorry.  Every time I walk into our library, there are plenty of people there look for books, reading, and using the computers.  Not to mention they hold community events, have rooms that groups can use to meet free of charge, programs for children and the elderly/disabled, movie nights free and open to the public, and live music events.  And I live in a crappy small city, not a big metro area.

grumbledore

jenna8984 said:

Thanks for all the answers so far. And @emmyg65 that link was helpful.

I guess the part I just don't understand is why it's prioritized as a necessity. Reading books, reading magazines, watching DVD's, attending groups are a HOBBY. I constantly hear on the radio how 1 in 5 kids in this country are starving. I'm fine paying tax dollars to feed these kids because that is a true necessity that I feel people are entitled to- not being able to read a book for free.

You're joking, right?  People aren't "entitled" to read?  FFS.  I'm sorry but this thread has me riled up big time.  Depriving poor people of those silly socialist free books is so backward and fucked up.

Access to information is a necessity.  Especially in a supposedly free society.

grumbledore

PrettyGirlLost said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

People are not harping on your or beating a dead horse, they are participating in a discussion.  A discussion is a give and take, and many times people are not in agreement.

As people read this thread, they are adding their opinions.  That's the purpose of internet forums.

Nope, it's time to stop posting.  Socialist.

I tend to respond as I read, rather than waiting until the end of the thread, so sue me.

lyndausvi

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

By you logic after the first 10 people reply that should be it?   Those of us in west coast who were asleep when you posted this don't get to give our own opinion?  What if the first 10 were trolls?  Are we to just ignore replying because there were others who already gave opinions? 

You posted a conversational topic.  People are not going to stop replying because they didn't see the thread as early as other did. 

mysticl

I go to the library almost every week.  I take my son to story time.  We live in a small town and the only activities for kids his age are story time at the library, some special summer events at the library, and swim lessons (which is 8 days out of the whole year).  Story time gives him a chance to interact with other children his age.  Once it's over we go into the children's section of the library where he can play with the other kids and we check out books so he can have some variety in his bedtime story routine.  

jenna8984

lyndausvi said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

By you logic after the first 10 people reply that should be it?   Those of us in west coast who were asleep when you posted this don't get to give our own opinion?  What if the first 10 were trolls?  Are we to just ignore replying because there were others who already gave opinions? 

You posted a conversational topic.  People are not going to stop replying because they didn't see the thread as early as other did. 

So if I ask for Dominos phone number and receive it from numerous people but you see the question 5 hours later when I've already eaten my pizza, you're going to respond with the number anyway since you didn't get a chance earlier? You don't think that makes it moot?

jenna8984

Because that's how useful I find the additional responses lol

lyndausvi

jenna8984 said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

By you logic after the first 10 people reply that should be it?   Those of us in west coast who were asleep when you posted this don't get to give our own opinion?  What if the first 10 were trolls?  Are we to just ignore replying because there were others who already gave opinions? 

You posted a conversational topic.  People are not going to stop replying because they didn't see the thread as early as other did. 

So if I ask for Dominos phone number and receive it from numerous people but you see the question 5 hours later when I've already eaten my pizza, you're going to respond with the number anyway since you didn't get a chance earlier? You don't think that makes it moot?

Domino's number is not an opinion.   

lyndausvi

jenna8984 said:

Because that's how useful I find the additional responses lol

This isn't all about you.  I get YOU understand it now.  But there are a bunch of lurkers who might not.  

In addition to that,  even though a lot of people said yes they should build the library,  their various reasons on why differ somewhat.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds how people come to the same conclusion interesting. 

ohannabelle

The original post is so ill thought, so self involved, so obtuse, that I am actually embarrassed for the poster. The free public library is one of the greatest achievements and inventions in the history of the United States. Knowledge and information should be available to all people, regardless of income. If you had asked, your local librarian could have pointed you to many sources of information about how libraries serve and enhance and revitalize their communities. (It would involve reading, which is much, much more than "a hobby," probably involves written matter not on display at Barnes and Noble, and would have spared you the need to appeal to an Internet forum to "enlighten you.")

PrettyGirlLost

emmyg65 said:

I do understand how forum discussions work. I participate in several online communities and also manage them for work. All of those communities are more heavily moderated than The Knot and, among other things, discourage piling on when it doesn't add to the conversation. It's unnecessary and can potentially create a hostile atmosphere where people are less likely to participate. I also understand that The Knot doesn't have this policy, and a vocal contingent doesn't want it. I just find it frustrating and wanted to chime in.

Since you participate in multiple online forums you should know the difference between carry on a discussion and piling on.

This is not piling on.

You guys realize that many people respond as they read, that some others are in different time zones and might not have been awake or on the forum when the OP was posted. . . should they not be able to share their opinions?

Everyone is being civil and conversational here, here is nothing in this thread that warrants moderation.  Moderation Nazi can kill a discussion and a forum.

PrettyGirlLost

jenna8984 said:

jenna8984 said:

Ok I love this site and am on here quite often for fun. But this is one of the things I find annoying that scares new members away. The fact I agreed 10 posts ago and said ok I now see the importance and that it is not a wasted resource. Yet people continue to beat it like a dead horse. I get it, I admitted that, so there isn't a further reason to harp on me about the importance of it.

By you logic after the first 10 people reply that should be it?   Those of us in west coast who were asleep when you posted this don't get to give our own opinion?  What if the first 10 were trolls?  Are we to just ignore replying because there were others who already gave opinions? 

You posted a conversational topic.  People are not going to stop replying because they didn't see the thread as early as other did. 

So if I ask for Dominos phone number and receive it from numerous people but you see the question 5 hours later when I've already eaten my pizza, you're going to respond with the number anyway since you didn't get a chance earlier? You don't think that makes it moot?

Do you understand what the difference is between a question with a definitive answer and a question of opinion?

QueerFemme

People are still discussing it, because that's how discussions work.  You don't get to stomp your foot like a 4 year old and declare the discussion over.

ETA:   You are, however, more than welcome to stop participating in the discussion.

jenna8984

lyndausvi said:

jenna8984 said:

Because that's how useful I find the additional responses lol

This isn't all about you.  I get YOU understand it now.  But there are a bunch of lurkers who might not.  

In addition to that,  even though a lot of people said yes they should build the library,  their various reasons on why differ somewhat.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds how people come to the same conclusion interesting. 

Exactly why I said twice carry on the conversation without referencing me in every post. I don't know why that is hard to fathom for some people. Because then it is just beating a dead horse for people to post exactly like @ohannabelle just did. Yea, thanks hanna, got that answer already. People already explained to me what was wrong with my post and my opinion- I didn't need it again. People can continue on their opinions about why they like libraries without ripping me apart any longer.  

PrettyGirlLost

jenna8984 said:

lyndausvi said:

jenna8984 said:

Because that's how useful I find the additional responses lol

This isn't all about you.  I get YOU understand it now.  But there are a bunch of lurkers who might not.  

In addition to that,  even though a lot of people said yes they should build the library,  their various reasons on why differ somewhat.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds how people come to the same conclusion interesting. 

Exactly why I said twice carry on the conversation without referencing me in every post. I don't know why that is hard to fathom for some people. Because then it is just beating a dead horse for people to post exactly like @ohannabelle just did. Yea, thanks hanna, got that answer already. People already explained to me what was wrong with my post and my opinion- I didn't need it again. People can continue on their opinions about why they like libraries without ripping me apart any longer.  

They are referencing you because you started the discussion and it makes sense to reference the points that they are refuting or agreeing with!

And no one is ripping you apart- they are challenging your statements and opinions.  Have you never had a formal debate or a discussion with anyone?  Do ppl always just agree with you?

You need to learn not to take things so personally, hun!

jenna8984

PrettyGirlLost said:

jenna8984 said:

lyndausvi said:

jenna8984 said:

Because that's how useful I find the additional responses lol

This isn't all about you.  I get YOU understand it now.  But there are a bunch of lurkers who might not.  

In addition to that,  even though a lot of people said yes they should build the library,  their various reasons on why differ somewhat.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds how people come to the same conclusion interesting. 

Exactly why I said twice carry on the conversation without referencing me in every post. I don't know why that is hard to fathom for some people. Because then it is just beating a dead horse for people to post exactly like @ohannabelle just did. Yea, thanks hanna, got that answer already. People already explained to me what was wrong with my post and my opinion- I didn't need it again. People can continue on their opinions about why they like libraries without ripping me apart any longer.  

They are referencing you because you started the discussion and it makes sense to reference the points that they are refuting or agreeing with!

And no one is ripping you apart- they are challenging your statements and opinions.  Have you never had a formal debate or a discussion with anyone?  Do ppl always just agree with you?

You need to learn not to take things so personally, hun!

Well their basically saying in a nice manner "you're a fucking moron for having that opinion". And this is why I feel bad for newbies, because when someone posts something they truly know nothing about like a cash bar or a pot luck (or whatever is norm in their area) people go on for days telling her how rude she is. I'm sure she gets the picture after the first 15 posts but people don't quit. That's all I'm saying, that it reaches a point where it's not helpful and makes people obviously regret their post. I just think people need to realize when to stop after the point has been made several times.

ohannabelle

You do not have the right to dictate the terms of response to your statement, which you posted on a public message board. If it helps you learn something, then the responses are justified. If you had gone to the library and researched this before posting an uninformed opinion, you wouldn't have publicly embarrassed yourself.

jdluvr06

I use my library all the time. If I bought all the books I read then my house wouldn't have room for anything else. Libraries are very vital to our communities.