Not Engaged Yet

Help.

You ladies all have great advice, so this is the best place to come I think. I've posted here before, but I may ramble, I'll do my best not to. I know we need to talk about things, but I just need to vent to stop myself from crying.

Boyfriend and I haven't been together long, just about 11 months. I'm not rushing to the aisle or to a ring, but we've talked about them. He's brought up rings - asking what I'd like mine to look like, asked me to send him pictures/links, asked what size. I have let him initiaye any conversation about actual rings. We've talked about weddings - size, time of year, he even went as far to ask who my bridesmaids would be. The one time line talk we have discussed was children, we both agreed we'd try when I'm 25, which is 2.5 years from now. He knows I want to be married before I have children.

Anyway, so now you've got the background. Here's where everything gets confusing and where I feel embarrassed and I guess slightly stupid. Last night, joking around, I told him his birthday present was me proposing and teased that it was because he was taking too long. His response "but it hasn't even been a year!!" Which is fine, but now I feel silly for entertaining the idea of us getting engaged any time soon and it's hard for me to tell if he was getting caught up in the romantic idea of engagement or if he's changed his mind or what.

More back story - the divorce is not official from his first marriage. The papers are sitting on his desk, signed by his ex and the notary. I brought up a while ago that they hadn't been signed and his response was that they've been separated for so long that he forgets it isn't official but he knows it's important to me and what's important to me is important to him. He knows I don't want to talk about weddings or engagements until papers are in, but seems to be in no rush to get anything done.


I have probably forgot to include things, I've been kind of a mess since last night. I know it's silly, I just feel embarrassed and confused and hurt. There's no need to rush, I know. I don't talk about marriage or engagements to people, I don't talk about serious/big things unless I'm ready then or very serious about it in the near future. I'm not a crier (cryer?), but all of this ended in me sitting on my couch crying last night.
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Re: Help.

  • Ollie08Ollie08 Central FL member
    500 Love Its 1000 Comments Fourth Anniversary Name Dropper
    megso16 said:
    You ladies all have great advice, so this is the best place to come I think. I've posted here before, but I may ramble, I'll do my best not to. I know we need to talk about things, but I just need to vent to stop myself from crying. Boyfriend and I haven't been together long, just about 11 months. I'm not rushing to the aisle or to a ring, but we've talked about them. He's brought up rings - asking what I'd like mine to look like, asked me to send him pictures/links, asked what size. I have let him initiaye any conversation about actual rings. We've talked about weddings - size, time of year, he even went as far to ask who my bridesmaids would be. The one time line talk we have discussed was children, we both agreed we'd try when I'm 25, which is 2.5 years from now. He knows I want to be married before I have children. Anyway, so now you've got the background. Here's where everything gets confusing and where I feel embarrassed and I guess slightly stupid. Last night, joking around, I told him his birthday present was me proposing and teased that it was because he was taking too long. His response "but it hasn't even been a year!!" Which is fine, but now I feel silly for entertaining the idea of us getting engaged any time soon and it's hard for me to tell if he was getting caught up in the romantic idea of engagement or if he's changed his mind or what. More back story - the divorce is not official from his first marriage. The papers are sitting on his desk, signed by his ex and the notary. I brought up a while ago that they hadn't been signed and his response was that they've been separated for so long that he forgets it isn't official but he knows it's important to me and what's important to me is important to him. He knows I don't want to talk about weddings or engagements until papers are in, but seems to be in no rush to get anything done. I have probably forgot to include things, I've been kind of a mess since last night. I know it's silly, I just feel embarrassed and confused and hurt. There's no need to rush, I know. I don't talk about marriage or engagements to people, I don't talk about serious/big things unless I'm ready then or very serious about it in the near future. I'm not a crier (cryer?), but all of this ended in me sitting on my couch crying last night.
    Just out of curiosity, how long was he married? What's the reason for divorce?

    The bolded really makes me worry. If he is on board with the divorce and they've been separated for so long, then he should be eager to sign the papers and finalize things. Being divorced myself, I could not get them signed fast enough! Just to be able to close that chapter of my life. Why is he hanging on? 

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  • ShallowSeasShallowSeas Indianapolis, IN member
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    I'm also concerned with the fact that the papers have been sitting on his desk, ready to go. When I divorced my XH, I turned in those papers the morning after he came and signed them. I couldn't get them in fast enough.
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    Ollie08evadorrough
  • 1. the bit about you joking and him saying "but it hasn't even been a year!"?As long as you laughed and moved on, that's not a big deal at all. If you made a big deal, have a chat with him and say "I really didn't mean to pressure you, I was just joking." And maybe some other time have a conversation with him about when you'd ideally like to get married. If you've talked about when kids come along, then this shouldn't be a big deal. I talked with my fiance about timeline throughout our entire relationship, starting 3 months in. But the intensity  and specificity of those talks changed the closer we got to getting engaged. 

    2. the bit about him not signing divorce papers? yeah. that's a big deal. I would DEFINITELY not be thinking about marriage yet. If all he has to do is sign the papers, and he has not, I would be concerned as well. I think he's putting you in a terrible situation. 
  • @loves2shop4shoes‌ you're right.

    I don't think so. They've been separated for 5 years, he dated 2 other girls prior to me. He'll be 28 on Saturday.

    @Ollie08‌ I don't know, honestly. It's making me worry as well and making me start to question a relationship I had previously never questioned. He's forgetful, but I don't understand forgetting THAT. I've asked point blank if he still has any feelings for her and he's always said no and he's even friends with her fiancé, so I really don't get it.
  • So the main reason you're upset is because your (married) boyfriend pointed out that you haven't even been together a year when you joked he was taking too long to propose?  You say you agree that that's not a long time to have been together, and you're in no rush to get married, so I don't know why this would upset you. 

    If the reason you're upset is because you're starting to wonder if he's even serious about you and why he hasn't finalized his divorce, yes, I think these are valid concerns that need to be discussed with him immediately.

     

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  • megso16 said:
    You ladies all have great advice, so this is the best place to come I think. I've posted here before, but I may ramble, I'll do my best not to. I know we need to talk about things, but I just need to vent to stop myself from crying. Boyfriend and I haven't been together long, just about 11 months. I'm not rushing to the aisle or to a ring, but we've talked about them. He's brought up rings - asking what I'd like mine to look like, asked me to send him pictures/links, asked what size. I have let him initiaye any conversation about actual rings. We've talked about weddings - size, time of year, he even went as far to ask who my bridesmaids would be. The one time line talk we have discussed was children, we both agreed we'd try when I'm 25, which is 2.5 years from now. He knows I want to be married before I have children. Anyway, so now you've got the background. Here's where everything gets confusing and where I feel embarrassed and I guess slightly stupid. Last night, joking around, I told him his birthday present was me proposing and teased that it was because he was taking too long. His response "but it hasn't even been a year!!" Which is fine, but now I feel silly for entertaining the idea of us getting engaged any time soon and it's hard for me to tell if he was getting caught up in the romantic idea of engagement or if he's changed his mind or what. More back story - the divorce is not official from his first marriage. The papers are sitting on his desk, signed by his ex and the notary. I brought up a while ago that they hadn't been signed and his response was that they've been separated for so long that he forgets it isn't official but he knows it's important to me and what's important to me is important to him. He knows I don't want to talk about weddings or engagements until papers are in, but seems to be in no rush to get anything done. I have probably forgot to include things, I've been kind of a mess since last night. I know it's silly, I just feel embarrassed and confused and hurt. There's no need to rush, I know. I don't talk about marriage or engagements to people, I don't talk about serious/big things unless I'm ready then or very serious about it in the near future. I'm not a crier (cryer?), but all of this ended in me sitting on my couch crying last night.
    JIC

    1.  if he's not signed the papers, it's probably not because he has forgotten.  how old is he?  I'm assuming you're 22/23.  how long has he been separated, and how long have the papers been sitting there?

    2.  while it's really fun to talk about engagement and rings and weddings and honeymoon and wedded bliss, there are a few things that I see (as a stranger) that I do wish you would take into consideration.  he probably hasn't been divorced/separated very long, and it looks like he got married young.  do you know why his first marriage didn't work out?  "she was crazy" isn't a good answer.  if he is this young and has a separation and unofficial divorce, it would really be a good move for you to find out what part he had in the separation of his first marriage... it's likely these issues could be a problem for your relationship with him, too.

    3.  although you said your comment about proposing because he is taking too long was just teasing, I firmly believe that in EVERY joke there is at least a glimmer of truth.  be honest with yourself.  I think you were looking for validation from him, right?  and you didn't get it, so you were hurt.  am I close?

    4.  my H and I dated the first time when we were about your age.  we had a big, nasty break-up.  I hated his guts for a while, but a year later, after we both had time to mature and admit our part in what went wrong, we were able to get back together.  obviously, we got married.  my H was NOT a good candidate for marriage the first time we dated, no matter how much he WANTED to be or how much I loved him.  sometimes, the timing isn't right.  and that's okay.  it's totally okay to know that you love this person, you're committed to them, but the timing isn't quite right for engagement or marriage.  I pushed him to commit more than he was ready, and it hurt our relationship.

    5.  learn to float with the ebb and flow of life...  in your romantic relationship(s) or anything.  if you can learn to be content with exactly where you're at in life, you'll be SO MUCH HAPPIER.  I learned this the hard way.  I've noticed that many young adults (especially in their mid-twenties) have a hard time with this...  it's an awkward, transitional period of life.  you're an adult, but you're not quite where you want to be.  but if you can learn to just go with life and release all these expectations of what you SHOULD be at a certain age or phase in life, you'll be much happier.  when you can let go of these expectations, it'll also reduce those tensions and pressures on your relationships with others.  I thought I would be done having kids by the time I was 25-27, but it looks like we won't be able to even get started until 29-30...  and depending on adoption and/or biological timelines, it could be even later.  you can't control these things, so just let them happen when they do.

    I hope that I didn't hurt your feelers, because it was not my intention.  it's hard to convey tone over the internet!  I hope that I could provide you with some encouragement and also a little bit of lessons learned from my own/others' experiences.


    carliealissaCLoGreenEyes[Deleted User]beanbot2002
  • @severmilli12‌ I'm going to talk to him tonight about it.

    @lilacck28‌ I did just laugh it off. I think part of my issue is that I'm the type of person who doesn't say things unless I've put a lot of thought into it and so I don't understand why he started talking about engagement 7 months ago. I'm much less inclined to think about marriage at all after watching how this divorce isn't happening. I'm starting to take it personally.
  • @carliealissa I think the joke just brought all the "oh, yeah...you're still married" worry back up the surface and that's why it caused the subsequent freaking out. 
  • ShallowSeasShallowSeas Indianapolis, IN member
    Sixth Anniversary 1000 Comments 500 Love Its First Answer
    I'm glad you are going to talk to him about these concerns.  If I were you, I would be very upfront about it all, especially the divorce that hasn't happened yet.  Let him know that there will be no wedding talk and no engagement until those papers are turned in to the court house. Not having those papers turned in is leaving your relationship at a standstill.
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  • lilacck28lilacck28 member
    500 Love Its 1000 Comments Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    edited June 2014
    megso16 said:
    @severmilli12‌ I'm going to talk to him tonight about it. @lilacck28‌ I did just laugh it off. I think part of my issue is that I'm the type of person who doesn't say things unless I've put a lot of thought into it and so I don't understand why he started talking about engagement 7 months ago. I'm much less inclined to think about marriage at all after watching how this divorce isn't happening. I'm starting to take it personally.
    Laughing it off was good. Don't feel badly. Talking about details and getting wires crossed is normal. I'm pretty sure during some timeline talk I got my feelings hurt because Fiance was being a little more vague than I wanted, or made a joke or something and in my head I was thinking "wait! so are you not serious? tear!". Which was silly, and I moved on.  Its how you handle those miscommunications that tell you if this relationship can last. 

    And you SHOULD be taking it personally. 


    ETA: Hugs. 
  • Yeah, this is a big deal.  Obviously it's not quite the same as though you are involved in an affair and cheating on someone, but he is still technically a married man.  Until that divorce is finalized your relationship really has no future potential at all, aside from you continuing to be the girlfriend of a married man.  What if he DID propose to you right now?  Similarly, I don't understand how his married wife is "engaged" to another man, and as a previous poster said, why she isn't freaking out about the papers being signed.  Not knowing all the details, this whole thing seems odd.  If it were me I would run if he does not get those papers signed ASAP.

     

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    lilacck28
  • @CocoBellaF‌ he's 28 now, they've been separated for about 5 years. The papers have been sitting there for 2 weeks, but they only got signed after I said I wasn't comfortable talking about anything wedding related until they were signed. I had information wrong - he signed them, but they're still sitting on the desk regardless. They were young when they got married -she was pregnant and they thought they were doing the right thing by getting married. From what I've heard, the marriage dissolved because she was more interested in partying than being a mom and they're two very, very different people. You're absolutely right. I guess I was looking for some kind of sign/hint/what have you that I'm not the only one who's thought about it or excited by the possibility of it. I don't want either of us to end up committed to something we don't whole heartedly want and something that isn't right at the moment. I do need to learn how to let go, I'm bad at relinquishing control at times. You didn't hurt my feelers :) I came here for advice and that's what I got. I appreciate it!
    carliealissa
  • @severmilli12‌ the papers got signed and notarized two weeks ago, only after I had the "I'm not comfortable talking about wedding related things while they're not signed" conversation. It just need to get finished. It's not fair to me that it's not.
  • BreMRBreMR member
    500 Love Its 500 Comments Second Anniversary Name Dropper
    I'm a little less concerned about someone not signing divorce papers, especially if it has been 5 years.  My dad is still married to his "wife" after a 5 year separation, they've both completely moved on and have no feelings for each other, but his wife had some medical issues a few years ago and really needs insurance, so my dad keeps her on his insurance.  I think he mostly does it for hush money because he makes a ton of money since their split and he doesn't want her to take it... but who knows :)

    However, I was with my fiance for 12 years and we talked about marriage on and off for 12 years, talking about the kind of food he absolutely didn't want, what kind of dress he thinks is pretty, where we may have it.. but as far as getting engaged, he absolutely was on his own timeline for that. I wouldn't take it personally, talking about marriage and getting engaged are two totally different things.  Plus, with such a short relationship, you should be relieved that he's talking about marriage with you but not rushing to make it official. There is no rush! :)


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  • there really is no rush!  while marriage is wonderful and just plain awesome in its own right, from my experience, dating is much more romantic and spontaneous.  enjoy the phase in life you're in now, because when it's gone... it's GONE.
  • @lilacck28‌ they have two children together, she will always be in his life, so there's not much that can be done there. I'm not sure if she's brought it up to him, I'd hope she has considering she's planning a wedding in the next year and a half. It does sound like a bad romcom, no fun. I'm going to have to talk to him about why they're still sitting there. A miscommunication is okay and I know that as a woman, I probably get more excited over it than he does. Or I think about it more, who knows. I think it just caused a lot of worry and forced me to think about that stack of papers that seem to just be collecting dust.
  • Dignity100Dignity100 Northeastern Ohio member
    2500 Comments 500 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    A lot has already been said here.

    You're 22-ish - so enjoy life!  Look at your career and start working on that!

    You've been in your relationship for 11 months.  He's not even divorced yet.  You're already talking about a wedding, but what about everything that comes with that (aka a marriage).  Honestly, after 11-months already talking marriage when he has 1 failed marriage already, people are going to side-eye.  Since you're in the relationship, you probably don't see it so much.  Most of those I know that were involved in a serious relationship has proceeded with their next relationships with caution and quite a bit slower. (I don't know your relationship though).

    Stop putting dates on stuff like 'I want to start trying to have kids at 25, but I need to be married first'.  It's ok to have goals in life, but putting them on stuff like 'have kids by' and 'married by' just seems silly to me.  Things change!  You may have meant it in more of a 'I want to get settled into my life on my own before having kids and I don't think that will happen until at least 25', but there's other/better way to word such things.


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  • Step 1 get that divorce!!! After that you can stop worrying about THAT, and move on to the fun stuff like worrying about when he might propose.  Mine came about 4 years after I started hoping for it ;)

    This is really irrelevant, but just to throw it out there, too- 25 is young for babies.  If your life doesn't happen to end up matching up with your timeline, you have plenty of time.  Try not to stress, and enjoy the ride :)

     

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  • @carliealissa‌ if he did propose right now, I don't know. Honestly, the whole thing IS odd. Nowhere in it does it make sense, which is what causes a lot of my worry.
  • BreMRBreMR member
    500 Love Its 500 Comments Second Anniversary Name Dropper
    I also agree with @Dignity100 I use to say "I want to be married by 25, first kid by 26, and be done having kids by 30" 

    I had my first kid at 21 (SURPRISE!) and won't be married until I'm 29.  Having a timeline for life doesn't always go according to plan.
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  • SwazzleSwazzle New Jersey member
    10000 Comments Seventh Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    The biggest red flag to me here is the fact that he's still legally married and HE is the one who hasn't signed and filed the divorce papers. What is he waiting for? I honestly wouldn't concern myself with anything but that. 



    bethsmilesKeptInStitches
  • BreMRBreMR member
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    I guess reevaluating the situation, it is a little different than my dad staying married to his wife, it is something they  mutually agreed on, so much different than someone being delivered divorce papers and not signing them...


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    carliealissa
  • Sorry for the redundancy in my posts-  Apparently we are talking faster than I can keep up on this thread!

     

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  • BreMRBreMR member
    500 Love Its 500 Comments Second Anniversary Name Dropper
    Sorry for the redundancy in my posts-  Apparently we are talking faster than I can keep up on this thread!
    ha!! Same here, I am just reiterating everything that has been said  :) Woops! 
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  • lilacck28lilacck28 member
    500 Love Its 1000 Comments Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    edited June 2014
    @megso16

    I'm so glad to hear that you're going to have a talk with him. And yeah, having kids with her changes things; that is definitely a pertinent detail. Keep us updated! I hope it all turns out okay. I think chit chatting ideas about weddings is great, and usually a sign that the guy cares for you a lot,  but this seems like a relationship that I would want to be in for at least a few years before getting engaged, since there are kids to consider and he's been slow with divorce, and since you are very young. ETA: and I wouldn't consider it until he is ACTUALLY divorced. 

    And venting here/ asking for feedback can be really helpful. Just want to reiterate that you are NOT being silly for being concerned and are not pushy for needing solid answers. 
    CLoGreenEyes
  • @BreMR‌ you have my total respect for not going crazy during those 12 years.

    I think a lot of why they've been separated for so long but not officially divorced has to do with money. What a wonderful world.

    @Dignity100‌ taking things slower after that totally makes sense and I'm sure people would look at him sideways if we got engaged so fast. His past is something I need to remind myself to keep in mind more often. The "when do you want to do x y z?" conversation was more of him asking when I thought we might be ready/how many kids/etc.
  • BreMRBreMR member
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    @megs016 Oh trust me, I definitely went crazy :)  To be fair though, we were dating since 16 and did have an 8 month hiatus I wouldn't have married him during those years, we had some really rough times. We've been back together for 3 years now, so the last 3 years were the hardest :)  
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  • @Swazzle‌ I don't know, but I'm going to talk to him about it tonight. It is the biggest concern and the underlying cause of every other concern that I end up with, which has just been "is he serious?"

    @BreMR‌ it is, which sucks. I went and looked - he signed them, but they're still not filed and they're in his possession, so ball is in his court. I can't keep up with how fast everyone's talking either @carliealissa‌ :) oh, I'm bad at remembering all of my thoughts at once sometimes - he's the one who filed for divorce, but they signed the papers at the notary's office, which is why they're here. But that makes even less sense to me. He filed, so why isn't he jumping on it?

    @lilacck28‌ her and I get along, which is great. Oddly enough and probably mostly due to children being involved, all 4 of us get along.

    Thank you, I mean that. It's hard to not feel pushy or crazy and I don't ask often about the divorce, but it's getting to a point where I sincerely don't understand the delay.
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