Wedding Etiquette Forum

NER: What the heck do I do?

Firstly, hi. I've been lurking a long time. Years, perhaps, by now, but never posted.

I know you ladies are harsh, I'm okay with that, because I also know that (snowflakes aside) you're outsiders looking in, that can see the situation as explained and consider outcomes without vested interest, and that's what I need.

This is gonna be long, I'm sorry. I'll kinda bullet point it as much as possible.

Beginning of this year, I got out of an eight year long relationship. We have an 18 month old son together, we get on well for the sake of DS. We share custody equally based around work schedules. Works out he's at mine three days a week, his dad's three nights a week, and the last night is alternate weeks. So yeah, custody's as equal as can be. We live walking distance from each other, and work.

Around four months ago, I met a guy. We got real serious real quick. We want to get married.

He lives in the states, I live in the UK.

I don't know how I can possibly say that this is the real thing, I just know it is. That being said, I'm not saying we're gonna get married next week. We'll be looking at a couple of years, at least.

My issue is my son.
Obviously, we want to live together. Ideally, we want this to be in the states, although he's open to coming to the UK if need be.
He was married before, and has two DDs of his own, aged 12 and 8.

I know FI would be a great "dad" to my boy. (I put dad in quotes because I would never encourage my son to actually call him dad).
Problem is, my son is actually lucky enough in this day and age to have a dad who cares, who wants to be in his life, and I can't make myself comfortable with the idea of breaking that.

I have all kinds of half-baked ideas swirling around my head right now. DS spends six months with me, six months with his dad, or, three months three months three months three months, or, school in one place, holidays the other... I dunno. Neither of us see DS every single day because of work etc, but if we do miss a day, we certainly see him the next.
I hate the idea of not seeing him for weeks at a time. His dad will, too.
At the same time, I know FI and I are meant to be together, and being away from him is awful too.
The only thing that got me back on the plane to come home was the thought of my boy. I have nothing else here.
I mean I have a flat, and a job, and whatnot, but, it's all disposable. I know I could give my son so much more in the states.

That's about it, really.
I realise there's not even really a question there, but, I have no one else to talk to about all this... (Obviously FI and I discuss it at length, but we're both biased and stuck).

Please, be harsh, be bitchy, call me out as a terrible mother, whatever. I won't start stomping my foot and exclaiming that you "just don't understtaaaaaaand".

Please however, bare in mind, that I am fighting with myself over this, I wanna be with FI, and could pack up and go tomorrow if I wanted, but, my son, and by extension his relationship with his father, is the reason I am still in the UK.
That's a comma-tastic sentence... Sorry for that.

Regarding getting married - we know where we'll have the ceremony and reception, we know who we'll be inviting... The day's all kinda, loosely thought out. We will not action this until we have a better idea of what will be happening with the children.

If you've made your way through all that, and have any advice/thoughts/similar stories to share, I'm most appreciative.

If there's anything you don't understand, that's my bad for failing to explain fully, please ask and I'll update accordingly.

Thank you.
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Re: NER: What the heck do I do?

  • And there it is.
    Harsh but true, although to be fair, written in what I perceived to be a very... Understanding, way.
    Thank you for that.

    I read through your post several times. And simply sighed at the end. I know what you say is pretty much how it is. I know you make absolute sense. I know these are all things I've already told myself, but, as you said... Honeymoon phase. As much as I'm not viewing that as a "relationship's gonna crumble" thing... I absolutely see it as a "we're in love and can do anything" thing. Like, we see all these issues, and almost push them aside in a "something will work because we love each other and that will mean everything is possible somehow" kind of way.

    I needed someone to actually say it. To me. I mean not just generally reading things about others situations and twisting them to apply to us.

    We understand about the visas. We've had lengthy talks with immigration officers over the phone about which visas would apply in different scenarios, explained what we're aiming for and got information on what visa works best for us.

    We know we can't take the children out of the country for more than 28 days without written consent from the other parent, else it would become a child abduction case.

    We know this could take years to sort out.

    We know we want to be together.

    The problem with him moving here is the same as with me moving there. The children. Neither of us would ask the other to move outright, because we both know the reason we're not together already. However, we have agreed that the goal is to end up in the states.

    I just... I dunno.
    It will work, somewhere down the line, somehow, we'll eventually be together. Just... It's realistically a loooong way off.

    If any y'all have patented some sort of instant teleportation device, or something...?
    I'm guessing not...
  • I had begun plans to move to the states a while back, then DS came along and that idea went out the window in a heartbeat.

    I know that moving to the states, money would be no concern. He owns his house there, I rent a flat here. He has already shown that if I go there, I won't have to work, we'll be fine on his salary. That's irrelevant, as I'd want to work anyway. I've worked 50 hours a week minimum for all my adult life, and couldn't be doing with going to nothing, but, it would certainly mean I could work less hours, and spend more time with DS. Whilst I agree that money isn't everything, when you have a child to consider, it's a lot. It'd mean I could afford to do more with him other than days in the park etc. As he gets older I'll be able to afford for him to join different clubs, etc. Life around where he lives is just... Relaxed. Over here everything is such a stress. I'm not happy here. I hide it from my boy, of course but, children are ridiculously intuitive. I don't want him getting miserable because he knows I'm miserable.
  • indianaalumindianaalum member
    500 Love Its 500 Comments First Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited August 2014
    Your sons needs come first. Plain and simple.

    Having him move every 6 months is a HORRIBLE idea. Children need stability. Give him stability.. and for heaven's sake, don't uproot him away from his father who clearly loves him. (I am guessing the father would fight you anyway)

    Just out of curiousity. If he lives in another country, how did you meet him?
     PLease dear God, don't tell me you met him on the internet and you have only met him in person a hand full of times. Cuz if you tell me THAT, I will send you to therapy cuz you would be insane to uproot your child's entire life for that..


    and I am sorry, but 4 months is not that long in a relationship to be willing to uproot your child's entire life no matter how you met the man. It is simply not. It seems whimsical to me. I agree with others. This seems like a rebound. Truth be told, you shouldn't even introduce a chlild to a new man in your life until he has been in YOUR life for  a long time first.

    I also have a personal philosophy on love. If you feel you need to RUSH a relathionship, it is an INFATUATION, not love. True love doesn't feel the need to rush because it knows it will always be there.


    Slow down. If it is meant to be, it will stay there forever.

    OH, and one last thing, I wouldn't encourage hmi to move to UK either. Cuz if he is willing to do that, it says A LOT about him as a man. What kinda man abandones his chidlren for a woman? Like they saying says, if he does it FOR you, he would do it TO you. Pick a man who wouldn't so easily be willing to abandon his children for a woman either...otherwise, you might end up having a child whose father is absent form their life someday.
  • lilacck28lilacck28 member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    edited August 2014
    Your sons needs come first. Plain and simple.

    Having him move every 6 months is a HORRIBLE idea. Children need stability. Give him stability.. and for heaven's sake, don't uproot him away from his father who clearly loves him.

    and I am sorry, but 4 months is not that long in a relationship to be willing to uproot your child's entire life. It is simply not. It seems whimsical to me.


    Whimsical has more positive connotations than I would ascribe to this situation. More like flighty and irresponsible. 

    That is harsh, OP, I know. But take some time to really think about that. 
  • Don't listen to me because the situation isn't identical, but my British mother met my American dad, married him six months later and moved to the States away from her entire family, everyone she knew and loves. They're on their 37th anniversary.
    Work on things because you both have kids so it's incredibly complicated, but have faith that if he is the real deal you can have a happily ever after, in time.
    ________________________________


  • also, and I don't know all the circumstances or how UK courts work but think about that court case. 

    1. You have been in a very short relationship with this person from another country and want to relocate yourself and your child away from his father to be with this person. 

    2. You do not have a job set up in the US. and are basically relying on this other person to support both of  you. 

    3. Your son has spent his life happily with both of his parents in the UK. (I say this as it sounds like you have a very amicable situation worked out.)

    I would imagine that your side would not be looked upon favorably in this case, and that they would want to keep the child in a stable situation with his father. Of course, if you marry your bf/ fi right now, maybe that shifts things but... please don't marry someone you barely know after JUST getting out of a long term relationship. 

    I guess the main point is... don't think about marriage right now. Think about spending time with this guy to see if that is something you want to even consider. But if marriage DOES end up a possibility, know that there is most likely no way that you will be able to avoid really disrupting the life of your son. And that is pretty tragic. 


  • Don't listen to me because the situation isn't identical, but my British mother met my American dad, married him six months later and moved to the States away from her entire family, everyone she knew and loves. They're on their 37th anniversary.
    Work on things because you both have kids so it's incredibly complicated, but have faith that if he is the real deal you can have a happily ever after, in time.

    But were there already children involved?  That changes the situation completely. 


    That's what I meant by saying the situations aren't the same. No kids back then. It is a testament to true love happening quickly, though. I think if OP takes her time on this, and they both do what's best for their kids, their love may endure if it's right.
    ________________________________


  • I'd also like to hear the answers to PP's questions.  

    The biggest issue I see is that either moving to the US or UK cou
    ld cause children to lose regular access to their parent(s).  This is HUGE.  In some cases, having both parents involved is just not possible, but I really think it should be avoided at almost any cost.  I used to be in training as a school counselor, and while I know this is anecdotal, the vast majority of students who were having the most trouble in my experience and the experience of my professors and classmates did not have both parents in their lives.  Please, please, please do not do this.  

    A
    lso, is it possible that where you're living is feeling more stressful because of all of the changes you've experienced and not the actualocation?  I know from a stress-causing perspective too many major life events in too short of a time causes a lot more stress than they would've on their own.  

    Another warning sign that I don't think was mentioned yet was that you said you and FI push aside issues because you're in 
    love.  To put it very bluntly, this will not work.  You need to actually work through those issues.  If you ignore them, they will not go away, they will fester.  I saw this happen with my parents.  They were married for over 20 years and after they split, in a conversation about arguments, my mom told me they were still arguing over things that happened while they were dating.  25 years later!  They were in love and still are in some ways, but that's not enough.  

    Stop wedding p
    lanning, please.  I don't think that should be on your radar until you've got a solution to the myriad problems in this situation.  Get yourself to a counselor and get you and FI to couples/pre-marital counseling.  I recommend pre-marital counseling to everyone (before engagement even), but in cases with this many problems, I really think it's necessary.  
  • Don't listen to me because the situation isn't identical, but my British mother met my American dad, married him six months later and moved to the States away from her entire family, everyone she knew and loves. They're on their 37th anniversary. Work on things because you both have kids so it's incredibly complicated, but have faith that if he is the real deal you can have a happily ever after, in time.
    If you want to have a whirlwind romance and marry someone you just met, that is absolutely your prerogative. However, once you have a child, to uproot him his caring and active father that you only left 8 months ago is reckless and irresponsible.  This situation is apples and oranges. No one is saying for her to break up with this guy, but they are saying she need to slow down and put her child first.
    and his kids! 




  • Don't listen to me because the situation isn't identical, but my British mother met my American dad, married him six months later and moved to the States away from her entire family, everyone she knew and loves. They're on their 37th anniversary.
    Work on things because you both have kids so it's incredibly complicated, but have faith that if he is the real deal you can have a happily ever after, in time.

    If you want to have a whirlwind romance and marry someone you just met, that is absolutely your prerogative. However, once you have a child, to uproot him his caring and active father that you only left 8 months ago is reckless and irresponsible.  This situation is apples and oranges. No one is saying for her to break up with this guy, but they are saying she need to slow down and put her child first.

    and his kids! 


    Right, and I agree! I'm typing before caffeine. If they love each other, truly, their relationship will last through these obstacles. They can put kids first, have a long distance relationship, something. I'm just not discounting the fact OP wants to marry someone she just met. Everyone is right that kids come first. Kids get older; maybe off in the future one can move to be with the other.
    ________________________________


  • PPs have it pretty covered, but I'd love to see your responses to the questions, OP.

    Sounds to me like you may need to accept this will be a long-distance relationship until his kids are old enough for him to move out to the UK with you.  Moving any kids across an ocean and away from their other parent is probably not the way to go.

    Is the girls' mother in the picture?
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
    image

    "I'm not a rude bitch.  I'm ten rude bitches in a large coat."

  • lilacck28lilacck28 member
    1000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary First Answer
    edited August 2014
    Don't listen to me because the situation isn't identical, but my British mother met my American dad, married him six months later and moved to the States away from her entire family, everyone she knew and loves. They're on their 37th anniversary. Work on things because you both have kids so it's incredibly complicated, but have faith that if he is the real deal you can have a happily ever after, in time.
    If you want to have a whirlwind romance and marry someone you just met, that is absolutely your prerogative. However, once you have a child, to uproot him his caring and active father that you only left 8 months ago is reckless and irresponsible.  This situation is apples and oranges. No one is saying for her to break up with this guy, but they are saying she need to slow down and put her child first.
    and his kids! 
    Right, and I agree! I'm typing before caffeine. If they love each other, truly, their relationship will last through these obstacles. They can put kids first, have a long distance relationship, something. I'm just not discounting the fact OP wants to marry someone she just met. Everyone is right that kids come first. Kids get older; maybe off in the future one can move to be with the other.
    The kids in question are pretty young... so it sounds like it would be something like 6 years in the future when the guy's kids are adults/ in college... but it also sounds like he doesn't want to move to the UK and OP is desperate to come to the US. So then, maybe in 13-16 years when OP's son is 15-18? Unless she wants to give up most of her time with her son. 

    ETA: I miscalculated a bit. I was thinking the son was 2, but he is only 1 and a half. 
  • I pretty much agree with everyone else so I'll leave it at that for most of it.

    I just really wanted to address the "Like, we see all these issues, and almost push them aside in a "something will work because we love each other and that will mean everything is possible somehow" kind of way."

    No.  Love is not all you need - I don't care how great of a band The Beatles were.  Love is not enough.  I know that you're posting this on a wedding board and if you lurk around you'll find a whole host of idealistic, drippy "Well, but we love each other and that's all that matters and we'll make it work" because the reality is, sometimes love just isn't enough.  It sucks.  It's not fair.  But life is full of unfair things.  Sometimes, in life, just because you love someone doesn't mean you get to be together or that you even SHOULD be together.  I loved my ex, but we wanted and needed different things that just made us being together just fundamentally not the right thing for either of us.

    For you, it may not be what you want, but what you need because you already belong to a unit.  You have a son and that son has a loving father involved in his life and you need to provide your son with a stable relationship with both of his parents.  And this person in the U.S. who you say you love, isn't the person who can provide what you need, no matter how much you love each other.  It's just the cold hard truth of the matter.

    Also, just to briefly touch on another point, you talk about being miserable and unhappy.  I don't care what posh living accommodations you think this man in the US will be able to provide you, but it won't cure whatever is at the heart of the misery.  Stop looking at the external factors and stop looking for a quick fix.  The UK didn't create your misery and the US isn't going to solve it.  I get it - it's way easier to look at those things and blame them and put the responsibility of your happiness on a house, and some extra money, and on the guy in the US (which is also unfair to him) instead of looking within.  You owe it to yourself and your son to do some real soul searching, hopefully with the help of a counselor, to work through that first and foremost before you do anything, including entering into any kind of romantic relationship.
  • What Jaques said. 

    As someone who spent years in a long distance relationship, shoving all the "issues" aside is asking them to rear their ugly head at really inopportune times and teaches you how to fail at communicating with your significant other (which not failing at is even more important when you're long distance).

    You aren't really talking or having a meaningful relationship if you are shoving the issues aside; you're having a shallow whirlwind movie romance. Notice how romance movies rarely show you the ever after?
    image
  • Agree with what pps have said. Another thing to think about is what if you do move to the US and things don't work out. You already had one relationship that did not last. What happens if this new one does not? You will be in the US with a child, no job, no money, no place to live and no one there that you know that can help you. Does that really sound like something you want to put yourself and your child through?

    You need to slow down and start facing reality. Right now it sounds like you are doing a lot of dreaming about how things could be not what is realistic. You have known the guy for four months and he lives in another country. I mean how much time have you actually spent with him. IMO I doubt if you even really know this guy at all.

    Best of luck to you!
  • I have actually experienced a lot of the things PPs are saying would be so hard on your child, so I guess my take is a little different. As a kid, I was dragged all around the world, moved all the time, lived thousands of miles from family, and didn't meet a lot of them until I was 8 years old. 

    Obviously, that was my life and I'll never know if growing up in the same place would have been "better." I do know that I was never emotionally traumatized and am actually really grateful I got used to transitioning as a kid because my adult life has also been full of transition - probably largely because of the fact that moving far away from "home" (this word has never meant anything to me) and leaving behind people I love does not scare me. THIS IS NOT TO SAY I ENCOURAGE YOU PACKING UP AND MOVING TO THE US. I know the situations are apples and oranges, I'm just offering an opinion as a kid who DID live a lifestyle SORT OF similar to what we're talking about.  

    All that to say, I'm not going to say that you're kid living here and there would scar him for life. There's no way to know that. Every kid is a unique person who will react to things different. He could end up being a world traveler who lives in Africa and cures malaria, all thanks to the fact that he's used to globe trotting to see Mommy in the US and fell in love with adventures and traveling. Or he could end up being an insecure basket case because he grew up without his mom there and feels like she left him to run off with her exotic new boyfriend. 

    The point is, he is NOT old enough for you to know what kind of person he is yet in this way. When he's old enough to have a conversation and think for himself, then maybe that would be the time to think about a new situation where he spends some time with his dad each year and some time with you. I also totally second whoever it was said that if you're the one making the change, you need to be open to seeing DS less. So that will probably mean he spends the school year with dad and summer with you, or whatever. Which makes it sort of ironic to me that you're so worried about DS having a good life in the US with piano lessons and a big house with a pool when he'll still be with his dad a lot of the time. 

    You have a lot of grown up decisions to make. Take that you think you're "destined" to be with this guy out of it. What is the WISE choice? Are you willing to sacrifice seeing a lot of your son's childhood and growing up to be with this guy? Maybe you are and that's your issue. As a parent, I wouldn't be. 
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