not attending my brother's wedding and am unsure how to feel!

loren817

I appreciate your feedback ohannabelle, and you're right, I did not mention what my mother said. She told my brother he was a disgrace and that she is happy my grandparents are not alive to see this. Again, incredibly regrettable, but it was limited to those two statements. And no, my fsil was not at the meeting, because she refused to come. My mother extended an invite multiple times to get together and try to settle things, and she refused every time saying it will take at least ten years until she will no longer be angry, and that my mother is dead to her. My father reached out to her as well and she never responded to his calls. in terms of myself searching for a rabbi, my brother asked me to do that for him because he didn't have the time. I would never take it upon myself to just search for them, because I agree that it would be overstepping. Every time my fsil and I spoke was because she reached out to me to discuss the situation. I always remained calm and listened as she said bad things about my mom because I knew how upset she was, but once she started threatening violence I was unable to stay on those calls.

loren817

My brother said that she would be incredibly upset if she had to pay for a rabbi, and I told him I would help him financially with anything that I could to make it easier on them, even if it meant paying for the photos or a deposit on the hall. He asked that I pay for the rabbi and not tell his fiancée.

ohannabelle

Then that's fair. Huge hugs. It is terrible to have rifts in families.

loren817

Come to think of it, she has not been angry with me at all and she knows I contacted the rabbis because my brother asked me to. The first time she showed hostility towards me was when I declined going to the rehearsal dinner because my mother was not invited because she was still upset with her. Meanwhile, my parents still bought her a Christmas present and gave it to my brother to give to her, as she will not speak to them.

mikenberger

I think at this point, your parents need to stop reaching out and definitely not buy her Christmas presents. She is a child having a tantrum. She needs to be ignored until she approaches the situation like an adult and wants to speak with the grown ups.

loren817

Oh for sure, the reaching out portion of this trying event is all done now. They reached out through my brother as she said she did not want calls from my mom, but that is done now. We all view my brother as estranged, even though he stills lives in my parents home!

MairePoppy

She and her mom are BSC and your brother is, too, if he goes through with this wedding. My sincere condolences to you and your family. I predict that this marriage won't last long. Your brother should know your door is open whenever he chooses to rejoin the family.

banana468

Your brother allowed this treatment to occur and he lives with your parents? And his stuff isn't on the front lawn why? ?

climbingsingle

Holy shit, man. This is awful. 

Why is your brother OK with his family being treated like this? I assume he saw the FB post about you as well? Wow. I'm at a loss for words. 

loren817

Climbingbride, his mentality is that although he does not like what is being said and did not care for the antisemitic email, that each person is entitled to their opinion. He said he already asked them to stop posting about me the first time around (stuff about my mom) and they didn't listen and so he is not going to tell them how they should feel or what they can and cannot say.

mikenberger

loren817 said:

Climbingbride, his mentality is that although he does not like what is being said and did not care for the antisemitic email, that each person is entitled to their opinion. He said he already asked them to stop posting about me the first time around (stuff about my mom) and they didn't listen and so he is not going to tell them how they should feel or what they can and cannot say.

I have some very choice words to say to your brother. 

And his stuff would be on the lawn. Complete and utter disrespect for his family. He's right that he shouldn't tell people how to feel etc but he can state what he feels and that he will not tolerate such disrespect to his family. I wonder how he'll feel when/if he has kids and they do the same to him. 

I feel so bad for your family. I'm sure this is very rough on all of them.

climbingsingle

loren817 said:

Climbingbride, his mentality is that although he does not like what is being said and did not care for the antisemitic email, that each person is entitled to their opinion. He said he already asked them to stop posting about me the first time around (stuff about my mom) and they didn't listen and so he is not going to tell them how they should feel or what they can and cannot say.

Wow. Honestly, I think your brother's attitude towards this is just as disrespectful as the FI and her family. And I'd be just as angry with him. I wouldn't even feel bad about missing his wedding at this point. How do you not stick up for your family? If my SO treated my family like that, there would be no wedding. 

novella1186

ClimbingBrideNY said:

loren817 said:

Climbingbride, his mentality is that although he does not like what is being said and did not care for the antisemitic email, that each person is entitled to their opinion. He said he already asked them to stop posting about me the first time around (stuff about my mom) and they didn't listen and so he is not going to tell them how they should feel or what they can and cannot say.

Wow. Honestly, I think your brother's attitude towards this is just as disrespectful as the FI and her family. And I'd be just as angry with him. I wouldn't even feel bad about missing his wedding at this point. How do you not stick up for your family? If my SO treated my family like that, there would be no wedding. 

Totally agree with this. He can't tell them how to feel or what to say, but he CAN say that he demands more respect than that for his own family because they deserve better, and he CAN say that insulting them and being nasty on social media is immature, hurtful, and unacceptable. The fact that he's being so passive in this and not even standing his ground, let alone standing up for his family, is so sad and so frustrating and so gross to me. 

banana468

novella1186 said:

ClimbingBrideNY said:

loren817 said:

Climbingbride, his mentality is that although he does not like what is being said and did not care for the antisemitic email, that each person is entitled to their opinion. He said he already asked them to stop posting about me the first time around (stuff about my mom) and they didn't listen and so he is not going to tell them how they should feel or what they can and cannot say.

Wow. Honestly, I think your brother's attitude towards this is just as disrespectful as the FI and her family. And I'd be just as angry with him. I wouldn't even feel bad about missing his wedding at this point. How do you not stick up for your family? If my SO treated my family like that, there would be no wedding. 

Totally agree with this. He can't tell them how to feel or what to say, but he CAN say that he demands more respect than that for his own family because they deserve better, and he CAN say that insulting them and being nasty on social media is immature, hurtful, and unacceptable. The fact that he's being so passive in this and not even standing his ground, let alone standing up for his family, is so sad and so frustrating and so gross to me. 

Exactly. What would your brother do if the tables were turned? His lack of action smacks of someone that has no integrity. Unless there are parts to the story that are omitted I have to wonder if you should been making calls to divorce attorneys instead of Rabbis.

[Deleted User]

thespeshulestsnowflake

Can I ask one thing (and correct me if I'm having some reading comprehension issues, its Monday), but are your parents still paying for part of this shit show? I got that they pulled out of the rehearsal dinner, but are there other parts they are paying for or have paid for? If so, they need to pull their money yesterday.

pegasuskat

I bet if your parents pullled their money, FSIL attitude would change.  Right now she gets her big fancy wedding and her way, what a lucky girl.  Your brother would be better off to run not walk, but he's a big boy and you can't tell him to do that.  I would not pay one more cent if I was your parents, and I would NO WAY give them any kind of gift.  After hearing what her mother posted on FB its not wonder she acts like she does, apple doesn't fall far...

climbingsingle

I'm also curious as to what else your parents have paid for. There's no way I'd be giving them more money towards this wedding. 

OliveOilsMom

loren817 said:

Hi all, I never post to these boards but I am in such a dilemma and do not know where else to turn. I am recently married (7 months) and next week is my older brothers' wedding. I have always been incredibly close to my brother, and I thought my future sister-in-law and I had a great relationship, but things are different now. I will attempt to make a long story short:

My brother and his fiancee' have been engaged for a year and a half and have not always been the most considerate to family when planning their wedding. A few months ago my brother informed our mother that he decided to not have a rabbi co-officiate their wedding, despite months of lying to her that they were looking for a rabbi. When I asked my brother and sister-in-law how they came to this decision, my brother said he didn't realize it would be a big deal and my sister in law stated that she "got lazy" and "didn't want to spend the money". Originally they had a rabbi, but the rabbi wouldn't co-officiate and so that was it for them. They found a deacon and basically said, screw it, no rabbi. My mom was incredibly hurt by this decision and the fact that my brother had been lying for over 7 months that he was searching for a rabbi, when he admitted that he did not. She said some things out of anger that are very regrettable. I do not agree with what she said, but I understand how angry she must have been to say it. Ultimately, a week later my mother and brother met with myself and my father and they both cried, apologized, and hugged it out. My brother told her he had no idea how important to her it was, and that he would tell his fiancee that they should consider finding a rabbi again. I did research for them and found three in one hour. However, my future sister in law was now so angry with my mother's comments that she refused to get a rabbi, purely out of spite and she admitted that to me. After another few weeks she decided that she would get a rabbi, but that my mother is not allowed in photos at the wedding and that if she comes within 20 feet of the bride she will be physically escorted out by the bride's brothers and uncles. My mom was incredibly upset, to say the least. Next, my sister in law's mother sent my mother an incredibly long and anti-semitic email. My mother did not respond hoping things would calm down. My father (who never said a bad word in all of this) called my future sister in law to say that he loves her and wants to try to discuss things and be a loving family again. She never returned his calls. The final straw came last week when my sister in law invited me to the rehearsal dinner. Unfortunately she is still holding a grudge against my mother and I was told that she would not be invited to the rehearsal, although my mother is still expected to pay for the party she is not invited too. I felt that this was too much and I finally said that I would not be able to attend the rehearsal dinner because I was disappointed in her decision, but that I would still be at the wedding. She then kicked me out of the bridal party and said I could no longer be a bridesmaid, which is her decision. I asked my brother if he wanted me to stand up for him on his side, since I have ALWAYS supported him, and he said he wants me up there but does not want to upset his fiancee, who by this point threatened me with the same physical violence as my mother, and also kicked me out of photos. I have tried to be neutral in all of this, but I don't think I can keep allowing her and my brother to hurt my mother, who has always been supportive of them. My sister in laws' ability to hold a grudge is incredible. Any way, I wanted a decision from my brother that I did not get, and he asked me to make it for him because he did not know what to do. I told him that I didn't want to make his day more hostile, and that I would not attend because it would be too upsetting for his fiancee. He thanked me. The wedding is in a week and we have not spoken since this last falling out two weeks ago. I doubt he will contact me. I am just not sure how I am supposed to feel. Yes, his wedding day is about him and he can make whatever decisions he wants, but why make such hurtful decisions? I have never seen him so afraid to stand up to someone, and his fiancee has already threatened to divorce him if she is upset on her wedding day. Is it just me, or is she nuts?!

If I were your parents, I would be cancelling every damn vendor they paid for!  And for those who pay, they DO get a say, if they want it.  But based on BSC bride's attitude, I would be canceling everything.

Your family overstepped some boundaries, but BSC bride and her family have overstepped more and added in some extra nastiness.  I think you and your parents need to have a Come to Jesus conversation about this upcoming wedding with your brother.  He needs to know the consequences of this wedding and how it will permanently impact his life going forward.  People are entitled to their feelings, but they are not entitled to attempt violence on other people.  In fact, attempted assault is against the law.

southernbelle0915

Your brother's FILs have threatened physical violence, made anti-semetic remarks, made remarks about your "extra weight" on FB, threatened to exclude your parents from photos they're probably paying for, caused boatloads of drama, and taken advantage of your family. And your brother just sits on the sidelines and says "Everyone has an opinion..."? Fuck. That. Fuck that right now.

Your FSIL is a bitch. And her family are grade A assholes. No doubt about that. But your brother is allowing them to treat y'all this way. He is also responsible.

Your parents need to pull their money from this shit show. Anything where their name isn't on the contract (usually it's the B&G, so this shouldn't be too much of a problem) should be pulled NOW. 

Look, I get that your mom feels bad about pushing the rabbi and about what she said. She shouldn't have and she apologized. But it's not even NEARLY on the level of what your brother's FILs are doing. Your parents need to stop feeling guilty about their minuscule role and cut the ties. Tell your brother they love him, but they will not be disrespected.

kmmssg

Your parents need to pull their money and cancel every single vendor they hired, kick your brother to the curb, and wash their hands of this.

IMO, your brother is the biggest problem in the whole deal.  It is one thing for crazy pants FSIL to act like a crazy bitch, but your brother is letting this happen to his family and doesn't have the backbone or balls to stand up to how his family is being treated.

He is the biggest problem in this whole shindig.

loveislouder

I mean this in the nicest way possible: Your brother needs to grow a pair and stand up to her. The way she is treating you and your family is absolutely ridiculous, and a marriage isn't going to make it any better. The fact that he's not saying anything is a huge reflection on him.

I have hugs for you for having to deal with all this. You deserve wine and chocolate.

Jen4948

Although I think it was wrong of your mother to butt in about the rabbi, your parents should teach your brother that "everyone is entitled to their own opinion" doesn't extend to their having to attend or pay for any part of a wedding where their DIL-to-be and her family call the groom's parents racial epithets or threaten violence against them, and if he continues to refuse to champion them to his wife, he will be responsible for the damage to their future relationship-by not paying a single penny toward this wedding, let alone attending. He can "own opinion" crap on his own time and dime.

loren817

Thank you all again for all of your support. Since everyone is asking, my parents have paid at least 8k towards this wedding, covering the flowers completely and a good chunk of the wedding hall and reception. My mother also gave my brother my grandmother's diamond to propose to his soon to be wife with, as he could not afford a ring. Now that heirloom is sitting on my FSIL's finger, and I was the one who suggested my mother give it to her, because that ring was originally coming to me!!!

OliveOilsMom

I think a quick call to the florist is in order.  Those beautiful flowers should be delivered to your parents house.  Or better yet, to the local old folks home, hospital, or anywhere than that reception.

Just imagine crazy bride's reaction when she has no flowers to hold or for her tables.

thespeshulestsnowflake

loren817 said:

Thank you all again for all of your support. Since everyone is asking, my parents have paid at least 8k towards this wedding, covering the flowers completely and a good chunk of the wedding hall and reception. My mother also gave my brother my grandmother's diamond to propose to his soon to be wife with, as he could not afford a ring. Now that heirloom is sitting on my FSIL's finger, and I was the one who suggested my mother give it to her, because that ring was originally coming to me!!!

I can't even with that fucking bitch-wad.

They need the money back. The ring too but that one seems near impossible since it unfortunately was given as a gift.

southernbelle0915

loren817 said:

Thank you all again for all of your support. Since everyone is asking, my parents have paid at least 8k towards this wedding, covering the flowers completely and a good chunk of the wedding hall and reception. My mother also gave my brother my grandmother's diamond to propose to his soon to be wife with, as he could not afford a ring. Now that heirloom is sitting on my FSIL's finger, and I was the one who suggested my mother give it to her, because that ring was originally coming to me!!!

Well, a gift is a gift, so the ring is long gone. And if they get divorced as FSIL has threatened, you can bet your ass she would pawn it. Scroungy bitch popsicle.

If I were your parents, I would call the florist and cancel the order. They'll probably have to eat the deposit, but oh well. And if they can get out of any other contracts, I'd do that as well. Not being spiteful, but basically "We're not ok with being disrespected in this way. It's your wedding, if you want these things, pay for it yourself."

Actions have consequences. Maybe if your parents do this, tornado bitch will show even truer colors and your brother will make the choice to back the hell out. He'd be so much better for it.

Jen4948

thespeshulestsnowflake said:

loren817 said:

Thank you all again for all of your support. Since everyone is asking, my parents have paid at least 8k towards this wedding, covering the flowers completely and a good chunk of the wedding hall and reception. My mother also gave my brother my grandmother's diamond to propose to his soon to be wife with, as he could not afford a ring. Now that heirloom is sitting on my FSIL's finger, and I was the one who suggested my mother give it to her, because that ring was originally coming to me!!!

I can't even with that fucking bitch-wad.

They need the money back. The ring too but that one seems near impossible since it unfortunately was given as a gift.

Actually, I think legally that any engagement or wedding items given by the groom to the bride or vice versa have to be returned to the giver if the wedding doesn't take place. Obviously, it's necessary to check this in one's own legal jurisdiction (s).

thespeshulestsnowflake

Jen4948 said:

loren817 said:

Thank you all again for all of your support. Since everyone is asking, my parents have paid at least 8k towards this wedding, covering the flowers completely and a good chunk of the wedding hall and reception. My mother also gave my brother my grandmother's diamond to propose to his soon to be wife with, as he could not afford a ring. Now that heirloom is sitting on my FSIL's finger, and I was the one who suggested my mother give it to her, because that ring was originally coming to me!!!

I can't even with that fucking bitch-wad.

They need the money back. The ring too but that one seems near impossible since it unfortunately was given as a gift.

Actually, I think legally that any engagement or wedding items given by the groom to the bride or vice versa have to be returned to the giver if the wedding doesn't take place. Obviously, it's necessary to check this in one's own legal jurisdiction (s).

I do think this is true, but it unfortunately seems like the wedding is taking place. If it doesn't, they absolutely should get the ring back.

climbingsingle

I think the engagement ring is considered a gift when given on a birthday or Christmas. If the engagement was called off now, she would have to return the ring. At least that's what I've learned from Judge Judy.