Catholics - Presbyterian Minister/Pastor

mim29 · January 2015

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere on the site but honestly, most of it is from 2010-2011 so those people are probably off by now.

I have a friend whose mother is a Presbyterian Minister. My fiancé and I are both Catholic however, we do not wish to be married in the Church. Will Presbyterian Ministers perform a marriage union outdoors/outside of a place of worship, factoring in of course that we are not Presbyterians? It would be for the sake of having someone we know perform the ceremony. I know that Catholic priests can technically marry you (if they so choose) outside the Church by appealing to the local bishop and gaining their approval. I'm just not sure we're willing to jump through hoops to do it. Will it just depend on the person, or is there some sort of Canon law for this faith? I keep Googling but all I seem to get are results about the church's appeals for gay marriage.

southernbelle0915 · January 2015

mim29 said:

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere on the site but honestly, most of it is from 2010-2011 so those people are probably off by now.

I have a friend whose mother is a Presbyterian Minister. My fiancé and I are both Catholic however, we do not wish to be married in the Church. Will Presbyterian Ministers perform a marriage union outdoors/outside of a place of worship, factoring in of course that we are not Presbyterians? It would be for the sake of having someone we know perform the ceremony. I know that Catholic priests can technically marry you (if they so choose) outside the Church by appealing to the local bishop and gaining their approval. I'm just not sure we're willing to jump through hoops to do it. Will it just depend on the person, or is there some sort of Canon law for this faith? I keep Googling but all I seem to get are results about the church's appeals for gay marriage.

I'm not sure if they'd perform it. If you want your friend's mom to do the ceremony, just ask her. I'm sure she'd be willing to give you more information.

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

It sounds like you want an outdoor wedding. I had one, so I'm obviously partial, but I'm not Catholic, so the consequences of not marrying within the church never applied to me. What if you had the ceremony in the church and then had an outdoor reception? You can take a couple photos in the church and then head outside for the rest. Personally, that's what I would have done if I were Catholic.

flantastic · January 2015

The rules are not hard and fast for Presbyterians about outdoor ceremonies, so yes, just ask her.

Southernbelle is accurate about the consequences for Catholics, though. The Church isn't going to let you receive Eucharist or be a godparent to your nieces or nephews (i.e. be Catholic when it's convenient) if you've made it clear that you don't take your faith seriously enough to do what it takes to be married with the blessing of your Church... and especially if you don't really want to do anything to fix that. And fixing it after you've had a wedding outside the Catholic Church is hard.

mim29 · January 2015

We are having an outdoor wedding. We are thinking of doing the big wedding (outdoors) and then later on a smaller ceremony in a Catholic church - for immediate family. We go to Church about as often as most nowadays. We live by Christian values and both believe in God, we are just "technically" Catholic.

My father is Episcopalian but was married to my (Catholic) mother in the Catholic church. He was not however, permitted to receive communion at his own wedding - something I find thoroughly disrespectful and contradictory to Christian values, but that is the prerogative of the Church. He still goes to Communion when attending Mass with my mother... To us a Sacrament is more between you and the relationship you have with God/your faith than what someone else thinks. We believe that God is no less present outdoors than inside of a church/chapel. I think you're right though, it will just depend on what she says and how she feels about it. Thanks for the feedback!

flantastic · January 2015

mim29 said:

We are having an outdoor wedding. We are thinking of doing the big wedding (outdoors) and then later on a smaller ceremony in a Catholic church - for immediate family. We go to Church about as often as most nowadays. We live by Christian values and both believe in God, we are just "technically" Catholic.
My father is Episcopalian but was married to my (Catholic) mother in the Catholic church. He was not however, permitted to receive communion at his own wedding - something I find thoroughly disrespectful and contradictory to Christian values, but that is the prerogative of the Church. He still goes to Communion when attending Mass with my mother... To us a Sacrament is more between you and the relationship you have with God/your faith than what someone else thinks. We believe that God is no less present outdoors than inside of a church/chapel. I think you're right though, it will just depend on what she says and how she feels about it. Thanks for the feedback!

The bolded is not something you should plan on being able to do. Most priests aren't on board with "well, you did whatever you wanted the first time, and now you want it to be 'made Catholic.'" You'll have some convincing to do.

apromise22 · January 2015

If you go to Catholic church semi-regularly, I would urge you to seriously consider getting married in the church. If you feel a mass with communion would alienate non-Catholic guests, you can have a non-mass rite of marriage (about 20-30 mins). My friends did that and it was really nice.

I'm getting married in a (Episcopal) church so I'm biased, but I think church weddings are the best. Nothing beats a church organ in terms of beauty and drama.

If you're planning on the smaller ceremony later, I would talk with your pastor--I'd guess they wouldn't allow that if you're already legally married.

Your priest would almost definitely not marry you outdoors.

southernbelle0915 · January 2015

mim29 said:

We are having an outdoor wedding. We are thinking of doing the big wedding (outdoors) and then later on a smaller ceremony in a Catholic church - for immediate family.

You will have a very hard time finding a priest who will agree to this. Once you're married, you're married. If that's outside, then get married outside and own it! You only get one wedding. After that, you're wed.

And if you're thinking of staging the outdoor one and then actually getting married at the Catholic one, I strongly urge you not to do this. Not only would the Catholic Church probably not be ok with this, but it's terribly rude to your guests. They would think they're attending a wedding - not a pretend staging of a wedding.

mim29 · January 2015

This was more just to find out if a Presbyterian was even able to officiate the marriage ceremony. It was just a thought, no strong feelings attached yet. I would not have the Catholic ceremony for guests outside of the family. You are correct though; I've been struggling with it for some time because unfortunately it would be to make our families happy, and to some degree my fiancé. He too however, would [mostly] only be doing it to appease his family. In hindsight I don't think it's a reason to get married in a church and I think a priest/minister would see right through it - which is one of the main reasons we have decided to have it outdoors. As an aside though, my friends and family are not strict enough to alienate me from being a godmother because of my marriage location; the Church can feel about it how they wish. If the Church wants to tell me I can't participate in Communion they can... My relationship with God is not their own and I don't believe He would reject me because of this decision.

flantastic · January 2015

mim29 said:

This was more just to find out if a Presbyterian was even able to officiate the marriage ceremony. It was just a thought, no strong feelings attached yet. I would not have the Catholic ceremony for guests outside of the family. You are correct though; I've been struggling with it for some time because unfortunately it would be to make our families happy, and to some degree my fiancé. He too however, would [mostly] only be doing it to appease his family. In hindsight I don't think it's a reason to get married in a church and I think a priest/minister would see right through it - which is one of the main reasons we have decided to have it outdoors. As an aside though, my friends and family are not strict enough to alienate me from being a godmother because of my marriage location; the Church can feel about it how they wish. If the Church wants to tell me I can't participate in Communion they can... My relationship with God is not their own and I don't believe He would reject me because of this decision.

It's not your friends and family that would prevent you from being a godparent - most parishes need some kind of verification that you're in good standing before the baptism. To the bolded: the Church will tell you that, and the priest will likely have some serious concerns when you come after your outdoor wedding and want to have the small convalidation ceremony. I'm just warning you that the chances are good that the priest will not allow you to do the things I've mentioned. I'm glad you feel your family wouldn't do anything silly like alienate you over this, though.

But I understand that you feel the sacramental/Church marriage itself isn't really that important to you.

holyguacamole79 · January 2015

@flantastic is 100% correct. If you choose to marry outside the Church (and by that, I don't mean physically outside, but if you don't work with a Catholic priest / deacon to have your marriage recgonized by the Catholic Church), you cannot be a Godparent, Confirmation Sponsor, or even an EMHC (Eucharistic Minister).

I teach Confirmation and RCIA at my church. When candidates submit the name of his/her proposed sponsor or Godparent, we require the pastor of their church to send a letter confirming that the person is in good standing (unless the sponsor / Godparent is a member of our parish). My husband & I also recently became Eucharistic Ministers at our parish, and the application specifically asked if we were married in the Church.

I definitely agree that this is a decision between you & your FI - please do not marry in the Catholic Church merely to appease your families.

banana468 · January 2015

mim29 said:

This was more just to find out if a Presbyterian was even able to officiate the marriage ceremony. It was just a thought, no strong feelings attached yet. I would not have the Catholic ceremony for guests outside of the family. You are correct though; I've been struggling with it for some time because unfortunately it would be to make our families happy, and to some degree my fiancé. He too however, would [mostly] only be doing it to appease his family. In hindsight I don't think it's a reason to get married in a church and I think a priest/minister would see right through it - which is one of the main reasons we have decided to have it outdoors. As an aside though, my friends and family are not strict enough to alienate me from being a godmother because of my marriage location; the Church can feel about it how they wish. If the Church wants to tell me I can't participate in Communion they can... My relationship with God is not their own and I don't believe He would reject me because of this decision.

It isn't about rejection. The issue is that the Catholic Church has rules and there are consequences if you don't follow them. Your family members may ASK you to be a Godparent but that doesn't mean that you can be one. If you marry outside the church you cannot be a Godparent. As PP said, the church will ask regarding your marital status and will want to know where you were married. Many parishes also required you to be a registered member of at least 6 mos before you can get a certificate authorizing you to be a Godparent. You can't just call up and say, "Hi I'm the Godparent. Please give me my paperwork." You need to show proof that you're a Catholic in good standing (and that you regularly attend Mass).

Also, the comment about your father not being able to receive the Eucharist at your parents' wedding -

"He was not however, permitted to receive communion at his own wedding - something I find thoroughly disrespectful and contradictory to Christian values, but that is the prerogative of the Church. He still goes to Communion when attending Mass with my mother... To us a Sacrament is more between you and the relationship you have with God/your faith than what someone else thinks. "

I think you need to do a bit of research. Again, there are actual rules of what makes a Sacrament and it isn't about YOUR interpretation. It isn't contrary to Christian values that a non-Catholic isn't able to receive a Catholic Sacrament. Think of it this way: If you're a citizen of the United States, do you think you should be able to travel as a Brazilian citizen with a Brazilian passport? The Catholic Church has its own rules and if you're not a Catholic, you cannot receive their Sacraments.

mim29 · January 2015

The sacrament of Communion is practiced in both Churches. I find it offensive to deny someone the Sacrament, because both faiths practice the consecration of the Eucharist, representing the exact same thing. The both uphold almost the exact same values and beliefs. My parents however, chose not to have a Mass because of the priests decision. Both Churches recognize the same seven sacraments. Also, FYI? My mother is allowed to receive Communion in his church.

On the second count, I guess I wasn't altogether clear. I meant that I am/can be an "unofficial" godparent regardless of Church mandate. My friends and family would not withhold that from me on; whether or not it was recognized by the Catholic Church would be disregarded. In other words, my religious practice is not as important to them as it is to entrust their children to me as a guiding influence in their lives. That doesn't make them "bad Catholics" nor is it grounds to revoke their rights to Catholicism. People have godparents all the time who don't get married in a church. My 32 year old sister for example, has a godson and she hasn't been to church since she was 18. It didn't matter to the family. I was not asking to be preached at, I simply wanted a yes or no answer. Once again the forums on this website resulted in people being judgmental and accusatory towards someone with nothing but well-meant intentions. As a final statement however, I will not be married in the Catholic Church. My relationship with God and Christian values have proven to be more important to me than copping out as a cafeteria Catholic. I believe that my relationship with Him is between us, and no one else.

For example:To me, the Eucharist is a symbol of Christ; like my father I do not believe in literal Transubstantiation, nor do I believe in the divine intervention when it comes to the selection of a Pope or priests. They are messengers and people of God. I do not believe that they were divinely "chosen" directly by Him. I do not believe that God intervenes in the choice that cardinals make directly when election time comes. I believe that they made the choice to follow a life dedicated to serving Him and the faithful of their own accord. I also take issue with their standpoints on other aspects of marriage, but understand their prerogatives. I don't believe that couples should HAVE to accept children. I believe they have the right to choose that option for themselves. I believe that homosexuals are no less equal in the eyes of God than anyone else, including His acceptance of a marriage. God does not reject us for who we are and I don't think the Church has moral ground to contradict or renounce that. They can have children just as much as a heterosexual couple, so why deny them the same rights as anyone else? My Christian values do not equal Catholicism, nor do they entirely equate to the Episcopal faith. Again, this is what I have chosen and I won't be judged for it.

flantastic · January 2015

No one is judging you. We're just telling you that there will be actual consequences within the Catholic faith for marrying outside the Church.

If you don't care about those consequences, which you seem to have clearly stated, that's one thing. But many brides do care about those consequences and just hadn't heard about them until posting here, so we wanted to make sure you were making a fully informed decision.

banana468 · January 2015

I'm not judging you. I'm telling you where you are simply incorrect in your assessment of Catholicism.

The fact is, you're basically saying that you don't agree with major aspects of the faith and I'm not just referring to some of the more social concepts like homosexual marriage. If you don't agree with their stance on receiving the Eucharist and what the Eucharist even is then you're not a practicing Catholic.

That isn't an insult to you. It's stating that if you don't follow the beliefs, don't try to work around them.

Ex: Being a Godparent is part of the Baptismal process. You aren't just someone's Godparent because the parents of the child deemed it so. If you are a Godparent and no longer practicing BUT you were given the certificate that you were in good standing at the time of Baptism then that's an issue between you and the Church and the other parents.

Bottom line if following the rules of the Catholic Church isn't something you want to do then don't get married in one. Understand that with that comes consequences and don't be upset that those are very much real consequences. Many people come to the understanding that they are leaving the church because she isn't for them and that's fine. What you can't do is decide that you're only in the Church when it suits you. That's like saying that you want to be married when it's in good times only. It just doesn't work that way.

southernbelle0915 · January 2015

mim29 said:

The sacrament of Communion is practiced in both Churches. I find it offensive to deny someone the Sacrament, because both faiths practice the consecration of the Eucharist, representing the exact same thing. The both uphold almost the exact same values and beliefs. My parents however, chose not to have a Mass because of the priests decision. Both Churches recognize the same seven sacraments. Also, FYI? My mother is allowed to receive Communion in his church.
On the second count, I guess I wasn't altogether clear. I meant that I am/can be an "unofficial" godparent regardless of Church mandate. My friends and family would not withhold that from me on; whether or not it was recognized by the Catholic Church would be disregarded. In other words, my religious practice is not as important to them as it is to entrust their children to me as a guiding influence in their lives. That doesn't make them "bad Catholics" nor is it grounds to revoke their rights to Catholicism. People have godparents all the time who don't get married in a church. My 32 year old sister for example, has a godson and she hasn't been to church since she was 18. It didn't matter to the family. I was not asking to be preached at, I simply wanted a yes or no answer. Once again the forums on this website resulted in people being judgmental and accusatory towards someone with nothing but well-meant intentions. As a final statement however, I will not be married in the Catholic Church. My relationship with God and Christian values have proven to be more important to me than copping out as a cafeteria Catholic. I believe that my relationship with Him is between us, and no one else.
For example:To me, the Eucharist is a symbol of Christ; like my father I do not believe in literal Transubstantiation, nor do I believe in the divine intervention when it comes to the selection of a Pope or priests. They are messengers and people of God. I do not believe that they were divinely "chosen" directly by Him. I do not believe that God intervenes in the choice that cardinals make directly when election time comes. I believe that they made the choice to follow a life dedicated to serving Him and the faithful of their own accord. I also take issue with their standpoints on other aspects of marriage, but understand their prerogatives. I don't believe that couples should HAVE to accept children. I believe they have the right to choose that option for themselves. I believe that homosexuals are no less equal in the eyes of God than anyone else, including His acceptance of a marriage. God does not reject us for who we are and I don't think the Church has moral ground to contradict or renounce that. They can have children just as much as a heterosexual couple, so why deny them the same rights as anyone else? My Christian values do not equal Catholicism, nor do they entirely equate to the Episcopal faith. Again, this is what I have chosen and I won't be judged for it.

You're making this about religious principles when it's not. You asked a question and people answered. People brought up some things about the Catholic church that you maybe didn't know. That's not "judging". It's simply informative. Take it or leave it. You've obviously chosen to leave it.

You obviously disagree with some pretty basic Catholic beliefs, so it's probably good you aren't getting married in the Church. And whatever you were originally thinking of doing (convalidation?) with the Church after your wedding is probably a bad idea too.

lovecrossesoceans · January 2015

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

southernbelle0915 said:

mim29 said:

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere on the site but honestly, most of it is from 2010-2011 so those people are probably off by now.

I have a friend whose mother is a Presbyterian Minister. My fiancé and I are both Catholic however, we do not wish to be married in the Church. Will Presbyterian Ministers perform a marriage union outdoors/outside of a place of worship, factoring in of course that we are not Presbyterians? It would be for the sake of having someone we know perform the ceremony. I know that Catholic priests can technically marry you (if they so choose) outside the Church by appealing to the local bishop and gaining their approval. I'm just not sure we're willing to jump through hoops to do it. Will it just depend on the person, or is there some sort of Canon law for this faith? I keep Googling but all I seem to get are results about the church's appeals for gay marriage.

I'm not sure if they'd perform it. If you want your friend's mom to do the ceremony, just ask her. I'm sure she'd be willing to give you more information.

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

It sounds like you want an outdoor wedding. I had one, so I'm obviously partial, but I'm not Catholic, so the consequences of not marrying within the church never applied to me. What if you had the ceremony in the church and then had an outdoor reception? You can take a couple photos in the church and then head outside for the rest. Personally, that's what I would have done if I were Catholic.

Just a heads up, that is totally not true. You can still receive Communion even if you were not married in the Church in the Sacrament. The only way one cannot receive the Eucharist is if they are in the state of mortal sin or if they have been excommunicated. Being married outside of the Church does not bring out excommunication.

Hope this helps!

LoveCrossesOceans

lovecrossesoceans · January 2015

mim29 said:

The sacrament of Communion is practiced in both Churches. I find it offensive to deny someone the Sacrament, because both faiths practice the consecration of the Eucharist, representing the exact same thing. The both uphold almost the exact same values and beliefs. My parents however, chose not to have a Mass because of the priests decision. Both Churches recognize the same seven sacraments. Also, FYI? My mother is allowed to receive Communion in his church.

Just as a second heads up, the Eucharist is understood entirely differently. In the Catholic Church, the Eucharist is the literal body and blood of Christ, it is not a symbol or metaphor as it is in non-Catholic church. It's an entirely different concept and practise all together.
LoveCrossesOceans

MobKaz · January 2015

lovecrossesoceans said:

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

southernbelle0915 said:

mim29 said:

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere on the site but honestly, most of it is from 2010-2011 so those people are probably off by now.

I have a friend whose mother is a Presbyterian Minister. My fiancé and I are both Catholic however, we do not wish to be married in the Church. Will Presbyterian Ministers perform a marriage union outdoors/outside of a place of worship, factoring in of course that we are not Presbyterians? It would be for the sake of having someone we know perform the ceremony. I know that Catholic priests can technically marry you (if they so choose) outside the Church by appealing to the local bishop and gaining their approval. I'm just not sure we're willing to jump through hoops to do it. Will it just depend on the person, or is there some sort of Canon law for this faith? I keep Googling but all I seem to get are results about the church's appeals for gay marriage.

I'm not sure if they'd perform it. If you want your friend's mom to do the ceremony, just ask her. I'm sure she'd be willing to give you more information.

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

It sounds like you want an outdoor wedding. I had one, so I'm obviously partial, but I'm not Catholic, so the consequences of not marrying within the church never applied to me. What if you had the ceremony in the church and then had an outdoor reception? You can take a couple photos in the church and then head outside for the rest. Personally, that's what I would have done if I were Catholic.

Just a heads up, that is totally not true. You can still receive Communion even if you were not married in the Church in the Sacrament. The only way one cannot receive the Eucharist is if they are in the state of mortal sin or if they have been excommunicated. Being married outside of the Church does not bring out excommunication.
Hope this helps!

LoveCrossesOceans

You could not be more wrong.

If one does not follow the form of marriage required for Catholics under Canon Law, they are not considered married in the eyes of the Church. Until you have the marriage validated, (blessed) you may not receive communion. You are still a member of the Church, are not excommunicated, and required to attend Mass on Sundays and Holy Days.

Who should not receive Communion....... Anyone not in full communion with Christ and his Church. If one publicly and obstinately persists in grave sin (living in adultery, promoting abortion, etal) Canon Law requires that person not approach for Communion until he/she is reconciled to God in his heart and through the Sacrament of Reconciliation. This includes those who are living in “irregular” marriages not considered valid by the Church. If you (or anyone) has grave, unconfessed sin—or has no intention of changing—why would you approach Our Lord in Holy Communion in a state that would offend and grieve him? The Sacrament of Confession—also an intimate encounter with him—prepares one to receive him worthily.

southernbelle0915 · January 2015

lovecrossesoceans said:

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

southernbelle0915 said:

mim29 said:

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere on the site but honestly, most of it is from 2010-2011 so those people are probably off by now.

I have a friend whose mother is a Presbyterian Minister. My fiancé and I are both Catholic however, we do not wish to be married in the Church. Will Presbyterian Ministers perform a marriage union outdoors/outside of a place of worship, factoring in of course that we are not Presbyterians? It would be for the sake of having someone we know perform the ceremony. I know that Catholic priests can technically marry you (if they so choose) outside the Church by appealing to the local bishop and gaining their approval. I'm just not sure we're willing to jump through hoops to do it. Will it just depend on the person, or is there some sort of Canon law for this faith? I keep Googling but all I seem to get are results about the church's appeals for gay marriage.

I'm not sure if they'd perform it. If you want your friend's mom to do the ceremony, just ask her. I'm sure she'd be willing to give you more information.

However, if y'all are Catholic, you need to think really long and hard about not marrying in the church. If you don't, you can no longer receive the Eucharist, you can't be a god parent, etc. There are several ladies on these boards who know more about the consequences than I do. Hopefully they will chime in.

It sounds like you want an outdoor wedding. I had one, so I'm obviously partial, but I'm not Catholic, so the consequences of not marrying within the church never applied to me. What if you had the ceremony in the church and then had an outdoor reception? You can take a couple photos in the church and then head outside for the rest. Personally, that's what I would have done if I were Catholic.

Just a heads up, that is totally not true. You can still receive Communion even if you were not married in the Church in the Sacrament. The only way one cannot receive the Eucharist is if they are in the state of mortal sin or if they have been excommunicated. Being married outside of the Church does not bring out excommunication.
Hope this helps!

LoveCrossesOceans

I'm not even Catholic and I know the bolded is incorrect..

See @MobKaz's response. Also, @banana468, @flantastic and @holyguacamole79 and I'm sure several others who are also versed in the Catholic faith can speak to that.

banana468 · January 2015

The only way you can still receive the Eucharist if you were married outside the church is if you received dispensation OR if you were married in something like a Russian Orthodox church where the marriage is recognized as valid.

You can't get married outside in the garden and still receive the Eucharist. Well, you CAN but you're not supposed to. There isn't an interrogation in the Communion line but you are supposed to know what you're doing.

flantastic · January 2015

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.

But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

banana468 · January 2015

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.

photokitty · January 2015

banana468 said:

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.

Eta ~ boxes *************************************

My Catholic education taught me that an opinion is not a sin. For example, being gay is not a sin, having relations outside of marriage it's the sin. So the only easy the priest should be able to deny her the Eucharist us if he knows she had an abortion and had not been to confession since. Priests like that give Catholicism a bad name.

I am currently outside the Eucharist, my priest told me he would still give it to me, but I refuse bc I know I'm not in good standing. It was my choice (due to the annulment process) and I live with the consequences. I didn't make excuses or go against what my heart felt was right.

flantastic · January 2015

photokitty said:

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.
Eta ~ boxes ************************************* My Catholic education taught me that an opinion is not a sin. For example, being gay is not a sin, having relations outside of marriage it's the sin. So the only easy the priest should be able to deny her the Eucharist us if he knows she had an abortion and had not been to confession since. Priests like that give Catholicism a bad name. I am currently outside the Eucharist, my priest told me he would still give it to me, but I refuse bc I know I'm not in good standing. It was my choice (due to the annulment process) and I live with the consequences. I didn't make excuses or go against what my heart felt was right.

I think that other priests and bishops said "there's a reason that's not the general policy" but I think the Pelosi example had more to do with her actions to perpetuate abortion, not just her opinion in support of it.

banana468 · January 2015

flantastic said:

photokitty said:

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.
Eta ~ boxes ************************************* My Catholic education taught me that an opinion is not a sin. For example, being gay is not a sin, having relations outside of marriage it's the sin. So the only easy the priest should be able to deny her the Eucharist us if he knows she had an abortion and had not been to confession since. Priests like that give Catholicism a bad name. I am currently outside the Eucharist, my priest told me he would still give it to me, but I refuse bc I know I'm not in good standing. It was my choice (due to the annulment process) and I live with the consequences. I didn't make excuses or go against what my heart felt was right.
I think that other priests and bishops said "there's a reason that's not the general policy" but I think the Pelosi example had more to do with her actions to perpetuate abortion, not just her opinion in support of it.

Ditto. I think it's the actively campaigning for the rights of it that make the area at least "gray".

photokitty · January 2015

banana468 said:

flantastic said:

photokitty said:

banana468 said:

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.

Eta ~ boxes *************************************

My Catholic education taught me that an opinion is not a sin. For example, being gay is not a sin, having relations outside of marriage it's the sin. So the only easy the priest should be able to deny her the Eucharist us if he knows she had an abortion and had not been to confession since. Priests like that give Catholicism a bad name.

I am currently outside the Eucharist, my priest told me he would still give it to me, but I refuse bc I know I'm not in good standing. It was my choice (due to the annulment process) and I live with the consequences. I didn't make excuses or go against what my heart felt was right.

I think that other priests and bishops said "there's a reason that's not the general policy" but I think the Pelosi example had more to do with her actions to perpetuate abortion, not just her opinion in support of it.

Ditto. I think it's the actively campaigning for the rights of it that make the area at least "gray".

Thank God the pope is more inclusive or people would get turned away for supporting gay marriage or attending a gay marriage ceremony next. I don't think individual priests or even bishops for that matter should be deciding whether she had committed a moral sin on this grounds, but then it's just one more reason to add on to why I have not chosen to takethe steps to get back in good standing.

flantastic · January 2015

photokitty said:

flantastic said:

photokitty said:

flantastic said:

By doing something that specifically separates you from the Church, like totally disregarding the sacrament of marriage, you put yourself out of full "communion" with the Church (temporarily, hopefully). Hence the idea that you shouldn't be participating in Communion, our greatest act of unity in and with Christ.
But as Banana said, it's primarily self-enforced.

The only instance I can recall when a priest publicly stated that he would not give communion to a person was years ago when the Democratic National Convention was in Colorado and a local priest said he would not give the Eucharist to Nancy Pelosi due to her public views on abortion.
Eta ~ boxes ************************************* My Catholic education taught me that an opinion is not a sin. For example, being gay is not a sin, having relations outside of marriage it's the sin. So the only easy the priest should be able to deny her the Eucharist us if he knows she had an abortion and had not been to confession since. Priests like that give Catholicism a bad name. I am currently outside the Eucharist, my priest told me he would still give it to me, but I refuse bc I know I'm not in good standing. It was my choice (due to the annulment process) and I live with the consequences. I didn't make excuses or go against what my heart felt was right.
I think that other priests and bishops said "there's a reason that's not the general policy" but I think the Pelosi example had more to do with her actions to perpetuate abortion, not just her opinion in support of it.

Ditto. I think it's the actively campaigning for the rights of it that make the area at least "gray".
Thank God the pope is more inclusive or people would get turned away for supporting gay marriage or attending a gay marriage ceremony next. I don't think individual priests or even bishops for that matter should be deciding whether she had committed a moral sin on this grounds, but then it's just one more reason to add on to why I have not chosen to takethe steps to get back in good standing.

That's why it's the general policy for the priests to let you do your own self-policing, give you the benefit of the doubt, and offer you Communion if you choose to come up for it. That's why it was a big deal that the one priest even spoke out and said anything.

holyguacamole79 · January 2015

I think the big thing to remember about the Eucharist is that it is not just something between you and God. When you go forward to receive the Eucharist, you are saying "Amen" not just to the fact that the wafer is truly the Body of Christ, but you are also saying Amen (I agree / So be it) to the entire Eucharistic prayer.

CCC 1354 In the anamnesis that follows, the Church calls to mind the Passion, resurrection, and glorious return of Christ Jesus; she presents to the Father the offering of his Son which reconciles us with him.

In the intercessions, the Church indicates that the Eucharist is celebrated in communion with the whole Church in heaven and on earth, the living and the dead, and in communion with the pastors of the Church, the Pope, the diocesan bishop, his presbyterium and his deacons, and all the bishops of the whole world together with their Churches.

So, receiving the Eucharist is a declaration that you are in communion with the Pope and Bishop. Now, if your bishop is like mine and is a huge Steelers fan and you're not, that doesn't mean that you're not in communion with him. What it means is that the bishop and Pope are the teaching authority entrusted to the Church by Jesus (Matthew 16:18).

Paul said ""Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself." (1 Cor 11:27-29)

If a couple marries outside the Catholic Church, they are not in communion with the Catholic Church. Therefore, it is inappropriate for them to receive the Eucharist when they are saying "Amen" to something they clearly do not agree with.

photokitty · January 2015

holyguacamole79 said:
I think the big thing to remember about the Eucharist is that it is not just something between you and God. When you go forward to receive the Eucharist, you are saying "Amen" not just to the fact that the wafer is truly the Body of Christ, but you are also saying Amen (I agree / So be it) to the entire Eucharistic prayer.

CCC 1354 In the anamnesis that follows, the Church calls to mind the Passion, resurrection, and glorious return of Christ Jesus; she presents to the Father the offering of his Son which reconciles us with him.
In the intercessions, the Church indicates that the Eucharist is celebrated in communion with the whole Church in heaven and on earth, the living and the dead, and in communion with the pastors of the Church, the Pope, the diocesan bishop, his presbyterium and his deacons, and all the bishops of the whole world together with their Churches.

So, receiving the Eucharist is a declaration that you are in communion with the Pope and Bishop. Now, if your bishop is like mine and is a huge Steelers fan and you're not, that doesn't mean that you're not in communion with him. What it means is that the bishop and Pope are the teaching authority entrusted to the Church by Jesus (Matthew 16:18).
Paul said ""Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself." (1 Cor 11:27-29)
If a couple marries outside the Catholic Church, they are not in communion with the Catholic Church. Therefore, it is inappropriate for them to receive the Eucharist when they are saying "Amen" to something they clearly do not agree with.

Funny thing is I don't remember Jesus saying all that at the last supper about bishops and deacons et al.

My crisis of faith never stems from God, but the man made rules that typically benefit the men making them or just men in general.

holyguacamole79 · January 2015

photokitty said:

I think the big thing to remember about the Eucharist is that it is not just something between you and God. When you go forward to receive the Eucharist, you are saying "Amen" not just to the fact that the wafer is truly the Body of Christ, but you are also saying Amen (I agree / So be it) to the entire Eucharistic prayer.

CCC 1354 In the anamnesis that follows, the Church calls to mind the Passion, resurrection, and glorious return of Christ Jesus; she presents to the Father the offering of his Son which reconciles us with him.
In the intercessions, the Church indicates that the Eucharist is celebrated in communion with the whole Church in heaven and on earth, the living and the dead, and in communion with the pastors of the Church, the Pope, the diocesan bishop, his presbyterium and his deacons, and all the bishops of the whole world together with their Churches.

So, receiving the Eucharist is a declaration that you are in communion with the Pope and Bishop. Now, if your bishop is like mine and is a huge Steelers fan and you're not, that doesn't mean that you're not in communion with him. What it means is that the bishop and Pope are the teaching authority entrusted to the Church by Jesus (Matthew 16:18).
Paul said ""Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself." (1 Cor 11:27-29)
If a couple marries outside the Catholic Church, they are not in communion with the Catholic Church. Therefore, it is inappropriate for them to receive the Eucharist when they are saying "Amen" to something they clearly do not agree with.
Funny thing is I don't remember Jesus saying all that at the last supper about bishops and deacons et al. My crisis of faith never stems from God, but the man made rules that typically benefit the men making them or just men in general.

I can appreciate that, and I know that you're not alone. I believe with all my heart that God is the only judge and that many of us will be surprised by whom we will see in heaven one day (hopefully).

CMGragain · January 2015

OP, a Presbyterian minister can perform a marriage ceremony for you. No problem. She will probably require some form of pre-marital counselling. This marriage will be recognized by everyone EXCEPT the Catholic Church, which will not recognize you as being married.

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