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House buying- WWYD?

We've been looking for a few months and the inventory in our area is just so insanely low. In our price range, in the towns we want there are like 5 houses. When a new house come on market it's under agreement before we can even make an appointment to see it.

So this one came on the market which was done by a flipper/ investor. They re-did the roof, siding, kitchen, driveway, bathrooms, flooring, deck, recessed lighting. It looks gorgeous and we love how we wouldn't have to replace anything major like the roof for a long time. The night it went on market, there were 5 offers OVER asking price and ours won. Honestly, if there wasn't the pressure of the other offers, I would have offered lower as the house is smaller than I hoped for. But I told myself it's in a great location with great updates, you can learn to live with smaller (so, not my dream house but felt like we had to jump on it since it's better than anything else available).

Well we've been back & forth with the seller on everything. They have said they pulled a permit for all the updates they did- lie. We got the permit from the town and it's only for the deck- they never got one for roof, siding, electrical, etc. We asked them to put a handrail on the back deck stairs per building code, they lied and said it's currently up to code and they wouldn't change it. My husband knows the code- it's not to code. Our inspector said the water tank is corroded and has low air exchange and needs to be replaced for $1500. They brought in some bullshit inspector who wrote an invoice saying it's perfectly fine and they won't replace it. We had the well water tested and it came back 3 times the EPA limit for arsenic, so it needs a $5-8,000 filtration system. The seller said he won't install but when we get a quote he will credit us the cost at closing. This scares the shit out of me because what if the quote is $5,000 and then we own the house and they come to do it and run into problems and it turns into an $8,000 job? There's no way to know that? We also don't even know how much of the already small finished basement this shit is going to take up. Or how much the system is going to cost us annually in maintenance/ new filters.

I dunno, my dad just keep saying it's a great house in a great location and we should just do whatever to buy it. But DH & I are second guessing it now. Like this is a lot of bullshit from the seller that we are going to have to deal with and fix, it's already at the max of our budget, and I'm just kinda over this house and how the seller is lying about stuff. We would lose about $1,000 to walk away now and risk not finding another house we like for months. So part of me is like just deal with it, there's nothing else to chose from, but then part of me is like no my gut doesn't feel right about this house.

                                                                 

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Re: House buying- WWYD?

  • Jenna, we're in the process of buying too (we close next week, lord willing), and we've encountered some of the same problems, however, not to that big of an extent.

    We dealt with them not wanting to fix a few things we discovered in the home inspection, but we finally found someone to do it for us, and the sellers are crediting us that cost at closing. It's been a trip having to deal with them, but the issues we're facing are too minuscule for us to reconsider buying the house.

    If your gut doesn't "feel right", I'd say walk away, but that's just my opinion. We've been stressed out dealing with the sellers, but we are willing to face these tiny little bumps in the road because we both feel in our "gut" that this is definitely the home for us.
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  • jenna8984jenna8984 member
    5000 Comments Fifth Anniversary 500 Love Its First Answer
    edited May 2015

    What would I do? 


    Honestly, I would trust my gut. I know you're itching to get out of the apartment you're in, but if you're already aware that one thing isn't up to code, who's to say that other things aren't up to code. They didn't have a permit to do the electrical. Who's to say the electrical is done right? You wouldn't know unless you took out walls. 

    I think it would be worth losing $1000 to walk away from something I had this many concerns in, even if it meant staying in a too-small apartment for longer than I wanted.



    True. I just wasn't sure if I was like blowing things out of proportion. Like they are a pretty reputable flippping company who have done a lot of homes so part of me is like oh everything's fine with it, you're just worried for nothing. But...I don't really know that for sure.

    I really don't mind the apartment that much anymore. But I've seen the market fail to pick up in the last 6 months so I'm like what if continues to be shit for another year and I "missed out" on my chance at a great house.

                                                                     

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  • That seller sounds shady as fuck. Let some other poor sucker deal with him.
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  • Walk away! If it was H and I, and we were already at our max budget and were facing ALL of these issues and possibly more, we'd walk. IIRC, you already had to do a lot of work on your previous house when you first moved in. Do you really want to get into all of that AGAIN? Is this going to be your forever home or you do plan on one day moving into a bigger house?

     

    When H and I bought our house last year, we settled - A LOT. It's smaller than I wanted, farther away than I wanted but I was overly optimistic and we had pretty much no other option due to incredibly low inventory. We wanted out of our apartment (which was SO stupid because it really was an amazing place to live) and were so eager to buy a house. A year later and I regret it. We've had to do a lot more work than we realized (that was with honest sellers and a really thorough home inspection) and we have four years before we can sell it. I know you're not thrilled with your apartment but honestly, I would keep looking. Probably not what you want to hear but it's better than getting stuck with something that will suck you dry, financially and emotionally.

  • I would walk away. None of these are little things. Missing permits, things not up to code (probably more than you even know about yet), and arsenic are huge things, and make the house SUPER not worth it, IMO.

    What's the big deal about staying put for a while? I mean, I know you don't WANT to, but is that worth potentially digging yourselves into a HUGE hole?
  • I would avoid buying any flipped house, because the "upgrades" are likely to be mainly cosmetic, and the cheapest they could get away with and hastily done.  Are you sure the new roof isn't just shingles over the old?  One house I looked at they had done that and the weight even just by the time I looked at it had started to buckle the roof! 

    And unpermitted work is a big no-no to me.  I know you don't PLAN to sell the house, but BPs stay on record forever, so it may be a huge problem to the next buyer.

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  • I'd walk. With super big items like that, I'd be concerned it's the tip of the iceberg. 
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  • lyndausvilyndausvi mod
    Moderator Knottie Warrior 10000 Comments 500 Love Its
    edited May 2015
    I would walk away.

    My parents have bought a sold a lot of homes (20 something) and this last one they had similar problems. The home owners are also the builders.  Always gave some BS answer.    Those problems continued up to and after they bought.  To the point where they had to sue (and won).  They both regret not walking away from the closing the table when they had a chance.


    Trust your gut.






    What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests.  Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated. 
  • luckya23 said:

    I would avoid buying any flipped house, because the "upgrades" are likely to be mainly cosmetic, and the cheapest they could get away with and hastily done.  Are you sure the new roof isn't just shingles over the old?  One house I looked at they had done that and the weight even just by the time I looked at it had started to buckle the roof! 

    And unpermitted work is a big no-no to me.  I know you don't PLAN to sell the house, but BPs stay on record forever, so it may be a huge problem to the next buyer.

    This times a million!


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  • jenna8984 said:

    What would I do? 


    Honestly, I would trust my gut. I know you're itching to get out of the apartment you're in, but if you're already aware that one thing isn't up to code, who's to say that other things aren't up to code. They didn't have a permit to do the electrical. Who's to say the electrical is done right? You wouldn't know unless you took out walls. 

    I think it would be worth losing $1000 to walk away from something I had this many concerns in, even if it meant staying in a too-small apartment for longer than I wanted.



    True. I just wasn't sure if I was like blowing things out of proportion. Like they are a pretty reputable flippping company who have done a lot of homes so part of me is like oh everything's fine with it, you're just worried for nothing. But...I don't really know that for sure.

    I really don't mind the apartment that much anymore. But I've seen the market fail to pick up in the last 6 months so I'm like what if continues to be shit for another year and I "missed out" on my chance at a great house.

    I would maybe overlook a minor code violation on a back deck and a water heater needing to be replaced soon. I will not ever overlook uncertainty regarding electrical issues, or arsenic in the water. Those could affect the safety of myself, my SO, and our family. 
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  • Walking away and losing that $1000 could potentially be a small loss compared to the cost of the issues you mentioned (like if the filtration system turns out to cost more) and the issues you don't even know about  yet. Trust your gut.




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  • Walk away! If it was H and I, and we were already at our max budget and were facing ALL of these issues and possibly more, we'd walk. IIRC, you already had to do a lot of work on your previous house when you first moved in. Do you really want to get into all of that AGAIN? Is this going to be your forever home or you do plan on one day moving into a bigger house?

     

    When H and I bought our house last year, we settled - A LOT. It's smaller than I wanted, farther away than I wanted but I was overly optimistic and we had pretty much no other option due to incredibly low inventory. We wanted out of our apartment (which was SO stupid because it really was an amazing place to live) and were so eager to buy a house. A year later and I regret it. We've had to do a lot more work than we realized (that was with honest sellers and a really thorough home inspection) and we have four years before we can sell it. I know you're not thrilled with your apartment but honestly, I would keep looking. Probably not what you want to hear but it's better than getting stuck with something that will suck you dry, financially and emotionally.



    This is exaclty what we liked about the house. We had to replace the roof and siding and kitchen and stuff in our last house so we really want one that's updated. It seems like everything else out there needs the work and this one didn't. But I guess it's true that they probably cut corners and did stuff as cheap/ shitty as possible since they are in for the profit. And they clearly skipped the more expensive items such as the rusty water tank & filtration system.

    It sucks because I'd kill to get into this neighborhood but I'm seeing that it might not be worth it.

                                                                     

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  • I would walk, those are not small problems and it may just be the tip of the iceberg! We have always been OK with buying houses that need work but we are never at the top of our budget when we do this. As stressed as you are right now worrying about actually finding another house, imagine the stress when you have put everything into closing and you hit major repairs beyond what you thought would happen. Even in a slower market houses will pop up, just keep looking and be quick. Our first house was on the market for one day before there were 4 offers on the table, we came in and had 2hrs to decide to put in an offer. Second house was on the market 16 days, just keep looking, it will happen!

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  • jenna8984 said:

    What would I do? 


    Honestly, I would trust my gut. I know you're itching to get out of the apartment you're in, but if you're already aware that one thing isn't up to code, who's to say that other things aren't up to code. They didn't have a permit to do the electrical. Who's to say the electrical is done right? You wouldn't know unless you took out walls. 

    I think it would be worth losing $1000 to walk away from something I had this many concerns in, even if it meant staying in a too-small apartment for longer than I wanted.



    True. I just wasn't sure if I was like blowing things out of proportion. Like they are a pretty reputable flippping company who have done a lot of homes so part of me is like oh everything's fine with it, you're just worried for nothing. But...I don't really know that for sure.

    I really don't mind the apartment that much anymore. But I've seen the market fail to pick up in the last 6 months so I'm like what if continues to be shit for another year and I "missed out" on my chance at a great house.

    I would maybe overlook a minor code violation on a back deck and a water heater needing to be replaced soon. I will not ever overlook uncertainty regarding electrical issues, or arsenic in the water. Those could affect the safety of myself, my SO, and our family. 
       When buying a pre-owned home you sometimes have to replace/repair things.  Sometimes big expensive things.  That is just life. 

       I could deal with the back deck or the water heater.  But your list is much longer then those 2 things.  And expensive items at that.   Who knows what is behind the cosmetic stuff?

    Just because they are popular doesn't mean they can't do a bad job once in a while.  It's not unusual for flipping contractors to become lazy and cut corners to make a buck. They can start to get greedy.



     






    What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests.  Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated. 
  • I wouldn't walk; I'd RUN!  Far, far away.  Have you calculated how much it would cost to re-do everything wrong?  So not worth it.  People who don't get permits and lie about it are the same people who take shortcuts and do shoddy work. 




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  • I agree with all of the PPs: walk away.

    Everything you mentioned set off alarms. I might consider ignoring some of them but the arsenic in the water really worries me. It stinks to give up on something that you're excited about but this doesn't feel like the right place.
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  • anjemonanjemon member
    500 Love Its 500 Comments Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    I'm going to echo PP's that I would trust your gut.

    As you know we're in the home buying process too. We haven't had our inspection yet, but I'm in fear of this situation. And I just want to say that it's really shitty that you have to deal with it.

    I would be really worried about having not pulled permits for stuff. I don't have very much experience with contractors, but I feel like the reputable ones all make sure to do that stuff. If they didn't have someone who pulled permits, who's to say they actually had someone good do it? Maybe they did the wiring themselves or had someone unknowledgeable?

    I'd also be worried about their attitude. If your inspector found issues and they fought you on them, what will they do if something goes wrong with the roof or siding that they updated and you need help? Also, it's super shady to find someone else to sign off on stuff just so they can sell the house. Who says they haven't done this on other things?

    I know living in an not ideal space sucks. That's where we are too. H's place is not big enough for all our stuff and we don't have anywhere to be except in each other's hair. And the market is crazy here too. But I feel good about the fact that I'm more excited than worried about this house. I think you should keep looking until you find something that makes you happy. The market will even out or you'll find another place that doesn't give you as much to worry about before you even buy it.
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  • Did you not have an inspection clause?    






    What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests.  Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated. 
  • If they didn't pull appropriate permits then it probably wasn't inspected and that would worry me.  I would always wonder what shortcuts they took and how dangerous it really is.

    Most states should have an escape clause that says you can walk away due to inspection results as long as it isn't for cosmetic reasons.  Are you sure you will lose your $1,000?
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  • lyndausvi said:

    Did you not have an inspection clause?    

    That's probably why they'd be out $1K and not the full purchase price. Earnest money or something. 

    ***I don't know anything about real estate.
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  • lyndausvi said:

    Did you not have an inspection clause?    


    Yes we did. The $1,000 lost wouldn't be the deposit, it would be the money we spent on the 3 different inspections (wells and water lab testing are separate from the general inspector).

                                                                     

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  • I'd walk. Things being "new" doesn't mean that they're right, especially considering all the problems you've already found. Those upgrades aren't worth it if something blows up (literally or figuratively)... especially if corners were cut on plumbing or electrical and the repairs mean you have to literally REMOVE all the new stuff that was put in. 



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  • lyndausvi said:

    Did you not have an inspection clause?    

    That's probably why they'd be out $1K and not the full purchase price. Earnest money or something. 

    ***I don't know anything about real estate.
    When I bought my place we had an inspection clause.  I could back out over the results of the inspection.






    What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests.  Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated. 
  • I'd walk. Things being "new" doesn't mean that they're right, especially considering all the problems you've already found. Those upgrades aren't worth it if something blows up (literally or figuratively)... especially if corners were cut on plumbing or electrical and the repairs mean you have to literally REMOVE all the new stuff that was put in. 



    Well, or also - poorly done electric is how we think the fire started in our old house. 
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  • labrolabro member
    5000 Comments Sixth Anniversary 500 Love Its 5 Answers
    Did you not have an inspection clause?    
    This. Although, don't you still lose out on earnest money even with a clause contingent on inspection? Or do you get it back?

    Either way, I'd walk, $1000 or not.

    There are big things you can live with and big things you can't. Our big expensive item when we had our home inspected prior to buying was the siding. We knew it needed to be replaced and we knew what the cost would be, but we also knew we had a few years before it was absolutely needed and we could live with that. I don't think you can live with arsenic in the water - if your bank loan would even go through with all these other issues. Potential electrical work gets expensive fast too if you move in and find other issues.



  • Walk away. There was a lot of work that needed to be done to our house (namely all new electric) as well as some code stuff. But the owners were very amenable to crediting it to us and working with us.

    These people sound shady and who knows what else there is going on.
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  • labro said:

    Did you not have an inspection clause?    
    This. Although, don't you still lose out on earnest money even with a clause contingent on inspection? Or do you get it back?

    Either way, I'd walk, $1000 or not.

    There are big things you can live with and big things you can't. Our big expensive item when we had our home inspected prior to buying was the siding. We knew it needed to be replaced and we knew what the cost would be, but we also knew we had a few years before it was absolutely needed and we could live with that. I don't think you can live with arsenic in the water - if your bank loan would even go through with all these other issues. Potential electrical work gets expensive fast too if you move in and find other issues.


    Mine allowed me to pull out without penalty.   But the clause can be written that you still lose the earnst money.






    What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests.  Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated. 
  • I'd walk. Things being "new" doesn't mean that they're right, especially considering all the problems you've already found. Those upgrades aren't worth it if something blows up (literally or figuratively)... especially if corners were cut on plumbing or electrical and the repairs mean you have to literally REMOVE all the new stuff that was put in. 


    Well, or also - poorly done electric is how we think the fire started in our old house. 
    That too.

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