DH is nicer than I am (but Karma's a bitch!)

daria24

I would definitely say something to the officiant. At the very least she should speak to the county clerk and get as much info as possible. I wouldn't want to be liable.

HisGirlFriday13

lyndausvi said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Second question: Do I tell the officiant, whom I'm friends with, that what she's doing isn't legal?

Because she's planning to do this more often.

I would.   Maybe ask how she went about getting her license in PA.

I would, except she posted about it on FB. So I think I'm going to send her a FB message and be like...'FYI..you're not legally allowed to do that.'

HisGirlFriday13

I FB messaged the officiant this morning, and basically just said, 'So, I'm like 99.9% certain you know this, but York County is the anomaly in the state of PA in that it doesn't actually allow online ordained ministers to perform marriages. The state isn't going to come in and say, 'Oh, you're not legal,' but should anyone ever question the validity of the marriage, the burden of proof is on the married couple to prove that their officiant was, in fact, a real minister,' and then I linked to the relevant section of our county's website.

Haven't heard back yet, but I will update y'all if I do. DH has decided he's NOT going to tell bridezilla, because if I tell officiant, officiant can tell 'zilla, and then DH gets to stay out of the drama.

lyndausvi

That makes sense.    Keep us updated

KPBM89

I'm a little late seeing this (been packing us up for a busy weekend), but I am so glad the shit hit the fan for that couple!  I'll be checking back on Tuesday for updates!

beethery

@HisGirlFriday13

That is probably the best way to go about it, so that you and DH aren't directly involved in any dramatic repercussion.

phira

This is my entertainment for Friday. Wowzahs.

Sugargirl1019

I'm so excited for more updates. This is fantastic entertainment. Such craziness.

ladyamanuet

FH is ordained online, and he married friends of ours 5.5 years ago.  He jokes all the time that they might not really be married.... so I just sent him those articles.  GA isn't mentioned anywhere... but I am sure he'll get a lump in his throat about it

HisGirlFriday13

Heard back from the officiant.

She says she did know, but 'isn't concerned' for PPD people because 'who would question their marriage?'

She's bookmarking it for future reference, though.

Well OK then.

lyndausvi

Bless her heart.

HisGirlFriday13

DH said, 'Well, then it's on them.'

And also reports that family members are continuing to decline attendance.

beethery

@HisGirlFriday13 is she at least going to tell the couple? Because that could be kind of important?

HisGirlFriday13

@beethery‌: I am given to understand not. Apparently she's of the opinion that what they don't know won't hurt them.

That is not an opinion I share, but no one asked me.

beethery

Oh lawd lol, I don't even know what to say... besides that I'm glad she's not going to officiate my ceremony.

mrsmorales2be

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Heard back from the officiant. She says she did know, but 'isn't concerned' for PPD people because 'who would question their marriage?' She's bookmarking it for future reference, though. Well OK then.

Just...wow. This whole thing is nuts, and just keeps getting better...and better...

chibiyui

HisGirlFriday13 said:

@beethery‌: I am given to understand not. Apparently she's of the opinion that what they don't know won't hurt them.

That is not an opinion I share, but no one asked me.

....... so, they aren't legally married? Or are they legally married cause the likelihood of York County checking into it is nil?

HisGirlFriday13

chibiyui said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

@beethery‌: I am given to understand not. Apparently she's of the opinion that what they don't know won't hurt them.

That is not an opinion I share, but no one asked me.

....... so, they aren't legally married? Or are they legally married cause the likelihood of York County checking into it is nil?

My understanding is legal as long as no one looks too closely. And it's York County. So that might be the case.

daria24

chibiyui said:

HisGirlFriday13 said:

@beethery‌: I am given to understand not. Apparently she's of the opinion that what they don't know won't hurt them.

That is not an opinion I share, but no one asked me.

....... so, they aren't legally married? Or are they legally married cause the likelihood of York County checking into it is nil?

It is not the county's responsibility to verify whether any officiant is legit. So no one is going to accuse them of fraud on their taxes. However if they decide to divorce, or if one of their families wants to dispute inheritance or one spouse's right to make end if life decisions about the other one, they may have grounds to declare their marriage null and void.

So basically they are married until someone decides to argue in court that they aren't.

Sugargirl1019

It makes my head hurt to think about what would happen if someone decided to look into it in 30 years and they find out that at age 60 they are not married.. The past 30 years have been a total lie to insurance and the govt. Would you owe money? Go to jail for fraud?

phira

That's the kind of answer people give when they DIDN'T know about the situation and think you should just go away.

Basically, a bullshit answer.

HisGirlFriday13

phira said:

That's the kind of answer people give when they DIDN'T know about the situation and think you should just go away.

Basically, a bullshit answer.

Yep. I know.

But I'm pretty sure officiant has lined up other officiating gigs and doesn't want to be out that extra income, so she's gonna pretend she doesn't know.

daria24

I'd be tempted to leave reviews on WW, etc stating that she's misleading people and not telling them she *might* not be 100% legally allowed to perform weddings.

HisGirlFriday13

daria24 said:

I'd be tempted to leave reviews on WW, etc stating that she's misleading people and not telling them she *might* not be 100% legally allowed to perform weddings.

I feel like this is on the couples, honestly. It's on the damn county website. They need to do their research.

SammiNJonni

HisGirlFriday13 York is not an anomaly where I am getting married in Northampton county you can not be ordained online either. I think it is more counties than not where that is the case. 

HisGirlFriday13

SammiNJonni said:

HisGirlFriday13 York is not an anomaly where I am getting married in Northampton county you can not be ordained online either. I think it is more counties than not where that is the case. 

Oh, that's interesting!! Thanks for sharing!

It didn't even cross my mind that this might not be legal, but that's partly because DH and I didn't look into it ourselves.

Other than not wanting to attend a PPD if we've been lied to, I don't question the validity of the form of someone else's marriage; I clearly (naively) assume that people will perform the necessary legal steps to get married because that's kind of the point.

lyndausvi

I read there are 2 counties that allows internet "ministers". Bucks county is one of them.

daria24

HisGirlFriday13 said:

daria24 said:

I'd be tempted to leave reviews on WW, etc stating that she's misleading people and not telling them she *might* not be 100% legally allowed to perform weddings.

I feel like this is on the couples, honestly. It's on the damn county website. They need to do their research.

While couples should do their research, if she is knowingly offering a service (for a fee!) that she knows is legally questionable, I hold her accountable too.

smalfrie19

Sugargirl1019 said:

It makes my head hurt to think about what would happen if someone decided to look into it in 30 years and they find out that at age 60 they are not married.. The past 30 years have been a total lie to insurance and the govt. Would you owe money? Go to jail for fraud?

In my state there is a law that basically says that if someone says they are legal, and they aren't, as long as you were led to believe it was legal, it is.

HisGirlFriday13

smalfrie19 said:

Sugargirl1019 said:

It makes my head hurt to think about what would happen if someone decided to look into it in 30 years and they find out that at age 60 they are not married.. The past 30 years have been a total lie to insurance and the govt. Would you owe money? Go to jail for fraud?

In my state there is a law that basically says that if someone says they are legal, and they aren't, as long as you were led to believe it was legal, it is.

PA is the opposite. The burden is on you to make sure it's legal. That was the whole crux of the court case back in 2007.