This makes me sick..

Blueyed228 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:3c4eced5-71bb-4c6d-bf5c-544369c1d3cb">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I feel confident saying that I wish Vick had gotten more time, and that he would have had to serve the time he did actually get. Also, I would have been totally cool with them saying something like "1 year per dog" or something. Did he get fined? Because they should have fined his ass like, $250,000 per dog too. Seriously, for some people you have to hit them in their wallets before they start paying attention. Blue, I am SO with you on the NFL ban on felonies. There is NO reason they should be allowing people with felonies to take part in a sport like that anyways. Criminally violent guys going out every Sunday to bash the hell out of each other in a violent sport? Yeah, real great idea Commish.
Posted by NuggetBrain[/QUOTE]

Im not 100% sure, but I think he only had to give back the money he was given for the season. Like, they paid him for 5 years or something and he had to give it back since he couldnt fulfil his contract. Part of me wants to say that when the Eagles grabbed him, they may have had to pay Atlanta back the contract money. Im not sure though.

He did file bankruptcy though, so I dont know how much he actually paid back.

reddy123 · December 2010

See, in my belief system all animals are equal to humans no matter what. And I believe in reincarnation.

So that means Michael Vick will be reincarnated as a tortured fighting dog over and over and finally be rightfully punished.

NuggetBrain · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:38376a92-dcca-40a7-9cd2-23306238e58c">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : Why do you not think they're the same? I'm not asking this in a challenging way, I genuinely want to know your reasoning. Why is a human life more important than a dog's life, to you? I mean, how can you deem one life to be more important than another?
Posted by LessThanZero[/QUOTE]

Because if someone told me they were going to shoot my mother or shoot my cat and I had to pick which one they were going to shoot, I would pick my mother. If someone told me they were going to shoot my coworker or my coworker's dog and I had to pick, I'd pick my coworker. If you can honestly say that you'd even have to think for a moment about what your answer to that question would be, I wonder about you. Now, if someone said I had to pick between Hitler getting shot and my dog, I'd be living a long happy life with my dog. But generally, I just happen to think that human beings are capable of such greatness. You could be killing the next Ghandi, or someone who would find a cure for cancer, or even just somebody would make those people around them happier and better for knowing them. I don't feel that an animal, in normal circumstances, can contribute that kind of thing to society. That does not, however, mean that I consider them "lesser" than us. I just don't humanize animals. Because they aren't in fact humans.

I love animals. I really do. But I find it incredibly hypocritical when people say that somehow a dog's life the same as a human's, and go on rants about how evil Vick is and that he deserves to die or spend the rest of his life in prison for killing dogs, then go out and have a hamburger. Or put on their leather coat. Or go spraying to kill rats. I think people only think that way because a dog is cuter and more loveable than a sewer rat, smarter than a chicken, and doesn't taste as good as a cow.

jasmineh7777 · December 2010

I'm playing with semantics here, and I'm aware of that. But maybe here is what I'm trying to express.

It takes the same sort of evil to kill an animal that it does to kill a human. So, if you willingly kill an animal and take pleasure in it's pain, I think you are also the kind of person that would enjoy killing a human.

NuggetBrain · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:0179372d-f8a9-434c-b63f-59b03afd111a">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm playing with semantics here, and I'm aware of that. But maybe here is what I'm trying to express. It takes the same sort of evil to kill an animal that it does to kill a human. So, if you willingly kill an animal and take pleasure in it's pain, I think you are also the kind of person that would enjoy killing a human.
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

Oh, well yeah. I can get on board with that. But the bolded part is what makes a difference to me.

Blueyed228 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:c44373c1-8285-415f-8b33-0043d66cb14a">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : . But I find it incredibly hypocritical when people say that somehow a dog's life the same as a human's, and go on rants about how evil Vick is and that he deserves to die or spend the rest of his life in prison for killing dogs, then go out and have a hamburger. Or put on their leather coat. Or go spraying to kill rats. I think people only think that way because a dog is cuter and more loveable than a sewer rat, smarter than a chicken, and doesn't taste as good as a cow.
Posted by NuggetBrain[/QUOTE]

If he went out hunting for dogs, or used them to feed his kids, I could get on board with this. But even with legal hunting there are rules to keep it humane. You cant legally do what he did to a deer or a cow.

jasmineh7777 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:0f4e904b-c951-4c8f-bb29-bbdf92ede7ab">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : Oh, well yeah. I can get on board with that. But the bolded part is what makes a difference to me.
Posted by NuggetBrain[/QUOTE]

I really can't say I consider animal life equal to humans either. If I did, I wouldn't eat meat. And I love bacon.

allisong23 · December 2010

Nuggs, I agree completely. People murder other people every day, and many of them are not in prison for life. The kid who plowed into my friend and left her to die served 6 weeks. She was innocent and did nothing wrong, yet he killed her and he is out there living his life I love animals too, but the sentencing standards have to be harsher for those that kill humans than animals. If we are going to let murderers off easy, we can't be up in arms over people like Vick. If we are, our priorities are seriously effed up. I think there are very few people that deserve to be killed.

Then there is the fact that many rapists and child abusers never see serious jail time, but that's a whole 'nother matter.

NuggetBrain · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:a733e403-5e73-4a18-9143-983ba6846dc2">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : If he went out hunting for dogs, or used them to feed his kids, I could get on board with this. But even with legal hunting there are rules to keep it humane. You cant legally do what he did to a deer or a cow.
Posted by Blueyed228[/QUOTE]

I know, which is why I said it's the people who say he should be put to death or spend his life in prison for it, or that one animal's life is on par with another human's life. You can't say that torturing a dog is wrong enough to deserve death or life in prison, and then go eat a hamburger that was made from a cow that only died because people want hamburgers. Does that make any sense? It makes sense in my head.

If somebody is saying dude should have gone to prison for like, 7 years and actually SERVED his time and not gotten rehired by the NFL after he got out and had to pay a fine I would be giving them a high-fiver. But the fact that he got jail time while some old guy who shot and killed a father of 3 after a shouting match and a punch in the face because the dad's dog peed on old dude's award winning lawn and got 4 years probation doesn't sit right with me.

jasmineh7777 · December 2010

I'm also saying that his animal abuse indicates further violent crime. Maybe he shouldn't get life in prison, but he should have court-ordered therapy.

[Deleted User] · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:0179372d-f8a9-434c-b63f-59b03afd111a">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm playing with semantics here, and I'm aware of that. But maybe here is what I'm trying to express. It takes the same sort of evil to kill an animal that it does to kill a human. So, if you willingly kill an animal and take pleasure in it's pain, I think you are also the kind of person that would enjoy killing a human.
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

Yeah, but sentences aren't given out based on what someone might be capable of doing. They are handed out based on what they actually did.

If we followed this logic, then anyone who tortures any animal should be given the same punishment as serial killers because most serial killers start out by torturing animals.

Also, I'm totally with Nugget on this one. I love my animals dearly, but they are not more important than humans.

Blueyed228 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:8ec71547-ecbf-4c10-ba0b-8f90166f6316">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : I know, which is why I said it's the people who say he should be put to death or spend his life in prison for it, or that one animal's life is on par with another human's life. You can't say that torturing a dog is wrong enough to deserve death or life in prison, and then go eat a hamburger that was made from a cow that only died because people want hamburgers. Does that make any sense? It makes sense in my head. If somebody is saying dude should have gone to prison for like, 7 years and actually SERVED his time and not gotten rehired by the NFL after he got out and had to pay a fine I would be giving them a high-fiver.
Posted by NuggetBrain[/QUOTE]

It makes sense. I agree. The bolded part is also what I think I have been trying to say all along.

But I am the first to admit that I hate his existence because I am a biased pit owner and its an infuriating topic for me when it comes to pit fighting. Personally, I hope he gets the same treatment he gave his dogs, but logically I know that is ridiculous.

I try to keep my emotional brain out of it but it can be hard. Everytime I see his ugly mug on tv i want to rip the tv off the wall. And that would piss off H, so I stick to cursing him up and down when his games are on and praying that someone cheap shots him in the kneecaps.

NuggetBrain · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:1ccfb8bc-5898-4e15-9155-933fa988a7ba">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm also saying that his animal abuse indicates further violent crime. Maybe he shouldn't get life in prison, but he should have court-ordered therapy.
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

Completely agree, especially since he doesn't see that he did anything wrong.

Blueyed228 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:233810e9-31ec-49b0-8c1b-9de3641080f4">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : Yeah, but sentences aren't given out based on what someone might be capable of doing. They are handed out based on what they actually did. If we followed this logic, then anyone who tortures any animal should be given the same punishment as serial killers because most serial killers start out by torturing animals. Also, I'm totally with Nugget on this one. I love my animals dearly, but they are not more important than humans.
Posted by cew515[/QUOTE]

Is it fair to say that the punishments should be harsher than what they are on the books as of right now? Not as harsh as murder or things like that, but harsher than probation or 2 years?

NuggetBrain · December 2010

Noodle's aunt is convinced that their pittie is going to rip his mom's face off in the middle of the night. She won't even come over to their house because she thinks Precious is a horrific killer waiting to happen.

Precious is afraid of the vaccum cleaner. I kind of want to punch his aunt in the face for being a moron.

ricksang · December 2010

I just think he should not be playing ball. Let someone else more deserving take his place.

And unfortunately no matter what parents do, outside forces still influence children, especially celebrates.

[Deleted User] · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:dcb7324f-0406-413c-9fd9-233e09900d29">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : Is it fair to say that the punishments should be harsher than what they are on the books as of right now? Not as harsh as murder or things like that, but harsher than probation or 2 years?
Posted by Blueyed228[/QUOTE]

Oh. Of course. For sure. I'm not arguing that at all.

jasmineh7777 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:233810e9-31ec-49b0-8c1b-9de3641080f4">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : Yeah, but sentences aren't given out based on what someone might be capable of doing. They are handed out based on what they actually did. If we followed this logic, then anyone who tortures any animal should be given the same punishment as serial killers because most serial killers start out by torturing animals. Also, I'm totally with Nugget on this one. I love my animals dearly, but they are not more important than humans.
Posted by cew515[/QUOTE]

I don't think he served enough time for what he actually did, and he's now enjoying a lucrative career. Prison is supposedto be a deterrent, to "scare" people straight.
I don't think it works, because prison doesn't replace behavior, but that's the intent at least. Vick certainly hasn't suffered long-lasting consequences, or faced anythign that will likely deter him from further crime.

ricksang · December 2010

Vick also said he would still be fighting dogs if he had not been caught and then he followed that with abusing animals is wrong. Whuuut?

NuggetBrain · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:97214be6-d59e-486a-b060-98ae10b3427c">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : I don't think he served enough time for what he actually did, and he's now enjoying a lucrative career. Prison is supposed to be a deterrent, to "scare" people straight. I don't think it works, because prison doesn't replace behavior, but that's the intent at least. Vick certainly hasn't suffered long-lasting consequences, or faced anythign that will likely deter him from further crime.
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

That's why I said for some people you have to hit them in the wallet. I think removing his chance to make millions of dollars and smacking him with a hefty fine would have gone further than sticking in him prison for a few years. Because why should he care when he knows he's going to be able to trot right the f*ck back into the NFL once his term is over? With street cred?

[Deleted User] · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:97214be6-d59e-486a-b060-98ae10b3427c">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: This makes me sick.. : I don't think he served enough time for what he actually did, and he's now enjoying a lucrative career. Prison is supposed to be a deterrent, to "scare" people straight. I don't think it works, because prison doesn't replace behavior, but that's the intent at least. Vick certainly hasn't suffered long-lasting consequences, or faced anythign that will likely deter him from further crime.
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

Agreed. And I think there needs to be some major therapy thrown into the mix too.

Blueyed228 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:82a62f9b-0113-4a70-8d49-521925765c14">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I just think he should not be playing ball. Let someone else more deserving take his place. And unfortunately no matter what parents do, outside forces still influence children, especially celebrates.
Posted by ricksang[/QUOTE]

Exactly. Let some kid who may not be quite as good as Vick is (and as much as I hate his life, he is a pretty good ball player) but who is a good kid who has done all the right things in life take his place.

ricksang · December 2010

Yeah hit him in the wallet b/c we know he is money hungry= the dog fighting for extra money.

[Deleted User] · December 2010

I think we should hit him in the penis.

Blueyed228 · December 2010

Also, to get back on topic with the whole Obama thing, I wish he had called the players that spend a lot of time and money doing wonderful things in the community instead of acknowledging this dickbag.

ricksang · December 2010

Neuter him? JK LOL

ricksang · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:f4c6bfed-12e0-46e4-b9ea-54f8956b0a26">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]Also, to get back on topic with the whole Obama thing, I wish he had called the players that spend a lot of time and money doing wonderful things in the community instead of acknowledging this dickbag.
Posted by Blueyed228[/QUOTE]

That would be nice.

Maggie214624 · December 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_this-sick?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:89ad401a-df64-4331-9a9b-9f351a0035edPost:e8debcdb-93f9-40e3-9400-6723bbb86074">Re: This makes me sick..</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm still not convinced it's fair to hold athletes to a higher standard, though I relate to the argument that they are in the public eye and they are (inadvertant) role models. I think my problem is that poor behavior is poor behavior, no matter who is doing it. I don't really believe that athletes of old were better-behaved--it's just that their poor behavior wasn't as publicized. Babe Ruth was kind of an ass (and don't get me started on Ty Cobb), but not too many people complain about seeing them as role models. The media today puts a huge emphasis on the behavior of athletes (and movie stars, and pop stars, etc.), partly because we live in a ...maybe gossipy? culture. There must be some kind of demand for this kind of information, or else it would not be the cash cow that it is. In that sense, we are responsible for who is a role model. It's not entirely the fault of the players that we know everything about their personal lives, and in that sense it does seem a little unfair to me that they have to live up to a higher standard. This is not to say at all that they should blame the media--if they behave badly, they deserve to pay for it. Vick certainly should have paid more. And they should realize that given the way the media is, that it's going to be a big story and everyone is going to know about it. I feel like I didn't express this very well, and I really do see the point that people in the public eye need to be aware of how their actions affect society, and kids who look up to them and all the rest of it.
Posted by arwo[/QUOTE]

While I will agree that as a society we have created the demand for all the details of these athletes personal lives, they also know that their lives will be under a microscope. It is not as if they are not aware that they will be scrutinized. We have as a society enabled this sort of unlawful behavior from a very early age. In my experience I have seen athletes in high school on up get away with some pretty heinous things because they were great ball players. If society allows this behavior and then we seal the deal with a congratulatory call from the President, our children are getting a seriously skewed perception of what the real world is like for most people.

katiewhompus · December 2010

Arwo, in general I agree that we are way too nosy when it comes to athletes or celebrities. However, I think you can't really say that it's the public's fault that celebs shouldn't be committing felonies because someone might see them. They shouldn't be committing them because it's against the law. Then the public sees "Oh, so and so broke the law, but is making millions a year, so obviously it's not that big of a deal" and the wrong message gets to the public.

It's similar to how the teen mom's who promote abstinence and "don't make my mistake!" always seem to have fairly affluent and easy lives. Do you think a teen is going to believe it's horrible being a teen mom when they see the person who is a teen mom having perfectly styled hair, the latest fashions, and their own tv show? Not so much.

sweet_pea_flower04 · December 2010

I would quit talking about this issue, it gives it more significance then it deserves. If people are worried about teh economy, schools, and the job the president is doing then take an active roll to effect change-rather then going on about the president and what he is an is not doing.

This makes me sick..

Re: This makes me sick..

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