Ok to put attire on invitation?

SP29 · January 2014

Guest should understand the formality of the event based on the formality of the invitation you send to invite them, as well as the location of the venue and time of day.

If they still have questions, they can ask. In which case, it is OK to let them know the general tone of dress. Never tell them they HAVE to wear a long gown, but it would be ok to let them know the BM's, MOB, and MOG will be in floor length gowns and the men will be in tuxes. Or, the opposite- suits and cocktail dresses.

I agree that "black tie optional" is more confusing. I would also be wondering, "Ok, so WHAT exactly am I supposed to wear?". Because black tie yes and black tie no are two very different outfits.

Jen4948 · January 2014

It's only okay to put "black tie" or "white tie," and only if the wedding truly is black tie or white tie respectively.

crunchymamaof2 · January 2014

agborensztein said:

I know I will be in the minority here, but the last several weddings I went to included the dress on the card, a few said black tie optional, and nobody I know was offended or confused. To me, "black tie optional" is helpful for women, because it gives you an idea of how formal a dress you should wear. It can be pretty stressful trying to figure out what to wear, and a little guidance is often appreciated, whether or not it technically goes with etiquette.

Did you personally ask every single guest at all of those weddings how they felt? Because I can promise you at least 1 (but likely several) were put off by being told how to dress. Adults don't need to be told how to dress. You should be able to figure it out yourself pretty damn easily, and if you can't, just ask. You being okay with something doesn't give the bride & groom the green light to be rude.

phira · January 2014

If you think your wedding is "black tie optional" (which, as other posters have pointed out, is a bit silly--if it's not black tie or white tie, then yeah, it's black tie optional), then what you probably mean is that your wedding is a semi-formal occasion. If that's the case, then I PROMISE you that your guests will know how to dress for your wedding without being told.

KeptInStitches · January 2014

I'm way too lazy to do the research - what's the difference between black tie and white tie?

Cookie Pusher · January 2014

White tie is even more formal than black tie. From a quick glance at the Wiki entry, the most obvious difference seems to be tails and white bow ties for men. I'm sure there are more, though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_tie

MobKaz · January 2014

PrettyGirlLost said:

jessstev said:

We are having a "black tie optional" wedding. I have that on our website but not sure if I should include on an information card (with other details) in the invitation as well. I would like guests to know so they don't feel uncomfortable - personally I always prefer some instruction, but is it ok etiquette wise?

I adore Tim Gunn and propose all responses to faux pas attire questions include a gif with him.

STARMOON44 · January 2014

@KeptInStiches- white tie is tails, gowns, military decorations, tiaras- picture Her Majesty entertaining.

PrettyGirlLost · January 2014

phira said:

If you think your wedding is "black tie optional" (which, as other posters have pointed out, is a bit silly--if it's not black tie or white tie, then yeah, it's black tie optional), then what you probably mean is that your wedding is a semi-formal occasion. If that's the case, then I PROMISE you that your guests will know how to dress for your wedding without being told.

I hate this phrase too because I find it equally confusing.

KeptInStitches · January 2014

@starmoon44 - but what makes it the tier above black tie, say, for a wedding?

Liatris2010 · January 2014

I don't think white tie weddings are a thing. White tie would be something like an inaugural ball, and event those are sometimes only black tie. White tie is a tux with tails. So, super formal. I've been to some fancy weddings, but never anything fancy enough to warrant a tux with tails.

HisGirlFriday13 · January 2014

Black tie still allows non-full-length gowns:

Black tie is a dress code for evening events and social functions derived from British and American costume conventions of the 19th century. Worn only for events after 6 p.m., black tie is less formal than white tie but more formal than informal or business dress. It is also more formal than recent intermediate codes of “creative,” “alternate” or “optional” black tie.

For men, the elements of black tie are a suit, of black or midnight blue wool, in which the jacket lapels and trouser braid are of silk or other contrasting material, a white dress shirt, a black bow-tie, an evening waistcoat or cummerbund, and black dress shoes. Women's dress for black tie occasions has varied greatly through the years; traditionally it was dinner (ankle) or tea (below mid-calf) length sleeveless evening gown, often accompanied by a wrap or stole, gloves, and evening shoes. Today, cocktail (knee) length dresses are considered equally appropriate in most places.

White tie does not:

White tie (or full dress, evening dress, full evening dress; slang top hat and tails or white tie and tails, tailsuit, tails) is the most formal evening dress code in Western fashion. It is worn to ceremonial occasions such as state dinners in some countries, as well as to very formal balls and evening weddings. The chief components for men are the black dress coat commonly known as an evening tailcoat, white bow tie, white waistcoat and starched wing collar shirt, while women wear a suitable dress for the occasion, such as a ball gown.

As evening dress, white tie is traditionally considered correct only after 6:00 p.m. although some etiquette authorities allow for it any time after dark even if that means prior to 6:00 p.m. (though there are some exceptions).^[1] The equivalent formal attire for daytime events is called morning dress. The semi-formal evening counterpart of white tie is black tie. Although female dress is not as formally codified as that of men, women are expected to wear full-length dresses such as ball gowns. Dresses with lengths above the ankle (such as cocktail or tea-length dresses) are frowned upon and considered inappropriate. Depending on the formality of the event, bare shoulders may or may not be acceptable. Shawls and long gloves are common accessories. Women's gloves should be white and upper-length/opera-length^{[citation needed]} and are never taken off until seated at a table. Then they are to be put on again after the meal is finished. At the most formal debutante balls, ball gowns are often required to be white. At hunt balls, ball gowns are often required to be black, white, silver or gold.

Where state decorations are worn it will usually be appropriate for royal and aristocratic women to wear tiaras.

Black tie = no tiara. White tie = tiara.

PrettyGirlLost · January 2014

Liatris2010 said:

I don't think white tie weddings are a thing. White tie would be something like an inaugural ball, and event those are sometimes only black tie. White tie is a tux with tails. So, super formal. I've been to some fancy weddings, but never anything fancy enough to warrant a tux with tails.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/2539fdddebd2b24636756a9f753ef779/tumblr_mzvzky2EFq1tqm119o6_250.gif

Tuxedos don't have tails, morning coats or tailcoats do ;-)

artbyallie · January 2014

@KeptInStitches, as far as I can tell, white tie is largely a factor of the guestlist and/or host. Royal or White House balls are white tie. Cotillions traditionally are as well, and since they are a 'gentry' sort of thing, I'm thinking the upper class nature contributes to the white tie determination. I was unable to find anything to back me up or to clarify, save that white tie functions generally feature famous musicians rather than just any live band, and have as many as three waiters per guest.

HisGirlFriday13 · January 2014

@PrettyGirlLos -- love, love, LOOOOOOOVE the Tim Gunn gif!

phira · January 2014

@PrettyLostGirl Semi-formal is like ... slacks or khakis, button down shirts or blouses, suits, cocktail dresses, etc. (basically, if I'm not expected to wear a floor-length dress, which I consider formal).

lc07 · January 2014

I agree that any indication of "dress code" on an invitation is not only insulting, it isn't helpful. "casual" at a wedding or a NYE party means something different to me than it does to my Chaldean friends. I learned that the hard way. Just send an invitation that is fancy. I will determine what I should wear based on your invitation, the time of day, and the venue. If I'm still unsure, I will contact someone to ask what others are planning to wear.

KeptInStitches · January 2014

Thanks for the clarification, all.

tcnoble · January 2014

@hisgirlfriday13 your Amy Farrah Fowler gif.... There aren't enough words. Just... Amazing.

tabathafaye · January 2014

Senecaf said:

I feel like I see this post daily. Does no one read before they post?

Snowflakes!

wrigleyville · January 2014

I don't like terms like "semi-formal". I still remember being wicked embarrassed at the Homecoming dance my freshman year of high school. My mom spent some time ironing a really pretty patterned dress and bolero my dad had bought for me, and I had my first pair of heels.

When I showed up, everyone was in Prom-type gowns, but maybe a little more cocktail dress-like. I was completely and totally underdressed. I didn't want to dance or show my face. Everyone kept staring at me, and most of the girls were whispering and smirking.

When my dad picked me up, he asked if I had a good time and if everyone liked my dress. I lied so he wouldn't be hurt and then cried as soon as I was in my room.

I know it might sound silly, but I will never forget that. That's why I hate "black tie optional" and "semi-formal".

afox007 · January 2014

HisGirlFriday13 said:
@PrettyGirlLos -- love, love, LOOOOOOOVE the Tim Gunn gif!

As soon as I read your description I wanted to find this gif! But why oh why did you end with white tie equals tiara now every damn snowflake is gonna be on here demanding a white tie wedding in a park so that she can can be a flipping princess!

HisGirlFriday13 · January 2014

@afox007: I was hoping that we could convince them that until they meet the other requirements, they don't get the tiara either. I may have failed in that endeavour.

HisGirlFriday13 · January 2014

wrigleyville said:
I don't like terms like "semi-formal". I still remember being wicked embarrassed at the Homecoming dance my freshman year of high school. My mom spent some time ironing a really pretty patterned dress and bolero my dad had bought for me, and I had my first pair of heels.

When I showed up, everyone was in Prom-type gowns, but maybe a little more cocktail dress-like. I was completely and totally underdressed. I didn't want to dance or show my face. Everyone kept staring at me, and most of the girls were whispering and smirking.

When my dad picked me up, he asked if I had a good time and if everyone liked my dress. I lied so he wouldn't be hurt and then cried as soon as I was in my room.

I know it might sound silly, but I will never forget that. That's why I hate "black tie optional" and "semi-formal".

It's not silly. It is a poignant illustration and well-written accoint of why black tie optional and semi-formal attire is effing stupid and terrible and rude.

afox007 · January 2014

@ HisGirlFriday13 We've seen the black tie optional a million times this past week alone. I guarantee there will be a flood start preparing

I on the other hand will be breaking out my tiara to go drink on my bday in a few weeks! Thank you Amy Farrah fowler for convincing my BFF I needed a tiara.

phira · January 2014

@wrigleyville Eeps

That sucks. Where I grew up, there was no homecoming dance, but we had two proms (junior and senior) and a sophomore semi-formal dance. Granted, the majority of the students at our school were band/chorus geeks, used to wearing semi-formal attire to band and chorus concerts ...

Here's my take on talking with guests about attire:

1) If you are having a pretty run-of-the-mill wedding, then take no immediate action. If someone asks you what to wear, have some examples of your-wedding-appropriate attire ready to go. ("Oh, thanks for asking! A cocktail dress/a blouse and slacks/khakis and a button down shirt/a suit and tie would be appropriate, or something like that."

2) If you are having an unusually formal or unusually casual wedding, if you've had a LOT of guests ask you what to wear, or if you are inviting a significant number of genderqueer folks, then I would suggest putting a question+answer on a wedding FAQ page on your wedding website. No more than one question+answer on a page dealing with lots of different questions you might get. Don't put it in the invitation. Don't make a separate page on your website. Limit yourself.

3) Phrase everything as suggestions and examples, and not as restriction (UNLESS your venue has a restriction and will turn guests away at the door). So if someone asks you what to wear, don't answer, "Well, no jeans or sneakers."

4) Consider the fact that many guests might not be sure what to wear with regards to the weather, not the event. If you're having an outdoor ceremony and reception in July, I'm going to dress much differently than if you're having an indoor ceremony and reception in the same month. If you're getting married in January, whether or not you'll have a coat check will influence my attire decisions.

Just as an example, we've answered attire questions in person (a friend of mine wasn't sure if she was allowed to wear pants to the wedding--I feel awful that she even spent time worrying about it!), and on our website, we listed several gender neutral examples of attire that we consider wedding-typical. We also let guests know that the entire wedding will be held indoors, with a coat check. Finally, because I'm not wearing white (and a lot of guests already heard about it, although not everyone knows what color I'm wearing), we also let guests know (on the website) that they should feel free to wear whatever colors they'd like, including white or ivory, or whatever color my dress is.

JeeGooDowster · January 2014

As other PP's have said...MOST people have the sense of what to wear to a wedding (especially by looking at the invitation, venue, etc.)...however there will always be a few who dress questionably, and trust me...it doesn't even matter if it said "black tie" or "white tie." At my wedding, there was formal attire, to summer dresses ,to guys wearing vans sneakers with a suit, to a fish shirt (yes a shirt with tons of fish on it)...nothing was said about attire on the website or the invitation.

PrettyGirlLost · January 2014

HisGirlFriday13 said:

@afox007: I was hoping that we could convince them that until they meet the other requirements, they don't get the tiara either. I may have failed in that endeavour.

I'm wearing a damn tiara. . . because I damn well feel like it, and it looks smashing with my dress :-)

PrettyGirlLost · January 2014

HisGirlFriday13 said:

I don't like terms like "semi-formal". I still remember being wicked embarrassed at the Homecoming dance my freshman year of high school. My mom spent some time ironing a really pretty patterned dress and bolero my dad had bought for me, and I had my first pair of heels.

When I showed up, everyone was in Prom-type gowns, but maybe a little more cocktail dress-like. I was completely and totally underdressed. I didn't want to dance or show my face. Everyone kept staring at me, and most of the girls were whispering and smirking.

When my dad picked me up, he asked if I had a good time and if everyone liked my dress. I lied so he wouldn't be hurt and then cried as soon as I was in my room.

I know it might sound silly, but I will never forget that. That's why I hate "black tie optional" and "semi-formal".
It's not silly. It is a poignant illustration and well-written accoint of why black tie optional and semi-formal attire is effing stupid and terrible and rude.

Can I get an AMEN! Thank you! Now please to join my anti-BTO, Semi-Formal movement. We have cookies at every meeting.

HisGirlFriday13 · January 2014

I had ONE guest ask me what to wear. She said, "I have this great, floor-length satin gown, is that OK?" I said, "You're free to wear whatever you want, but it's a mid-afternoon ceremony and my bridesmaids are in tea-length dresses, so that might be more formal than other people are dressing."

I wouldn't have cared if she HAD worn it, but I would have felt awful if she had worn it and felt over-dressed and out of place.

@PrettyGirlLost -- do the meetings also have tiaras for the participants? I want a tiara!

Ok to put attire on invitation?

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