Pre Nup agreements

JenLD2015 · March 2015

So, how do we feel about these? I was all for it before getting engaged and now I just feel gross about it. However, I do see a benefit. It can help create a calmer situation if, god forbid divorce becomes an option.

Ours would be really straight forward. In fact, it would be pretty easy. Has anyone ever considered doing something like this online or through the Bar Association? Attorneys can be expensive.

If my only thing against doing this is the cost, maybe that isn't a good enough reason not to get one. My fiance is fine getting one, since the assets we would be protecting from community property would be mine.

Thoughts and advice welcome.

lyndausvi · March 2015

We didn't get one, but I'm all for them. Especially if this is second marriage, if you already have children, if one of you owns a business or has some potential trust or inheritance coming your way in the future.

The Pre-nup does not have to be one sided. Each party needs to have their OWN lawyer and negotiate any settlement before signing anything.

WinstonsGirl · March 2015

We don't have one, though looking back, I can see how they are good things. I think if you go into it thinking of it as a insurance for divorce, it's not great. But if you see it as insurance of what you are currently bringing in, you've got it in a more positive light.

For us, we each had property coming in and that money stayed with the house owner when they were sold. Everything else has been done 50/50 with us, so we didn't really see a huge need for it. If we were to divorce everything has been paid 50/50 from each of us so no one is really at more of an advantage/disadvantage than the other. It would be more beneficial to DH as he makes a lot more than I do and has stock through work but he didn't see the need for one. I was the one who brought up the discussion of if we wanted one or not.

mikenberger · March 2015

FI is insistent on one. I don't care either way. He stands to inherit half a million worth of farmland, so I understand it. And he got majorly screwed in his last divorce. But if it makes him feel better, whatever. I don't care.

julieanne912 · March 2015

Back when we were first dating, FI mentioned he might want one. He witnessed his parents go through a nasty divorce when he was a teenager and that's why he wants one. Most of the assets we would be protecting are his (ie the house we just bought is in his name only, and the downpayment came from the sale of his former home that he purchased before we met). But, our relationship is fairly traditional, so because of that, I forego job opportunities etc (I do work full time) because one of my priorities is taking care of our home and (potentially future) child. So, I would like some kind of protection written in for me and potential child as well.

But so far, we've been engaged a month and our wedding is in September, and he hasn't mentioned it at all, so we will see. It does feel a little icky to think about, but you never know what life may hold for you so you might as well protect yourself.

Case in point, my stepdad's parents were wealthy, his dad was an executive at IBM in the 70s. But then, his dad went off his rocker, literally, and spent all their money and ended up in an institution. His mother was left with nothing and two teenage kids to finish raising. Now, a prenup wouldn't have given her any assets since he wasted all of those away, but it just shows that even a good marriage can turn south if something happens to one of them.

JenLD2015 · March 2015

Yeah. I only see it as an insurance for what is being brought in. I don't think its insurance aginst divorce. I feel that we have a strong relationship, so I am not doing this out of fear.

Mostly, I have an inheritance from my dad and the parents suggested we get one.

bethsmiles · March 2015

They are an excellent idea for couples who have assets worth protecting when going into a marriage. SO and I don't have anything worth getting a pre-nup for but I think the view point that it's preparing for divorce or a couple just isn't as committed if they get one is naïve. No one gets married thinking they will get divorced but divorce happens, you never know what the future holds. In some cases it's really best to get a pre-nup and hope you never need to use it.

loveislouder · March 2015

I work in a law firm on domestic files and I see them all the time. I think they're a great idea if you're coming in with kids or a assets. FI and I had no separate assets (except our own crappy cars) when we got engaged so we didn't get one.

vikinganna87 · March 2015

I think these agreements are a good idea. I wanted one, but FI got really emotional and sad (which is rare) both times I brought it up. We got married last month without it, which is okay with me. We came into the marriage with about an equal amount of assets and our incomes are almost the same.

I haven't heard about anyone doing this online or through the Bar Association but I think it's worth investigating, especially since - if you know what should be covered - it should be relatively straightforward.

charcoalandblush · March 2015

My take on pre nups is this - you're agreeing to a pre nup whether you write your own or not. Your state has laws about what happens with your money/kids/stuff/etc. if you get divorced. If you like those rules, you don't need to write your own pre nup - you're basically agreeing to the one that the state has already written for you. If you're not ok with these rules, you need to write your own.

It's not about not trusting your partner or expecting divorce. It's about understanding the rules of marriage and divorce that you're subjecting yourself to and agreeing to those rules, or agreeing to change them.

I imagine that sometime soon, DF and I will sit down and look at the rules in our state and decide if we need/want our own prenup.

levioosa · March 2015

It depends on the situation for me. Ex wanted a pre-nup and I was really hurt by that. Dude, you have no assets, and I've put you through school, driven your ass around and paid for pretty much everything. But you want a fucking pre-nup? Nope. Good thing we aren't together anymore.

If SO wanted a pre-nup, within reason I would be fine with it. He has a good amount of money right now and is probably going to buy an investment house. I wouldn't mind if those things were included in a pre-nup. I also wouldn't mind if he had a business he wanted to protect. Children, businesses, trusts, or other assets are all valid reasons to get a pre-nup, IMO.

Now, my friend just had a big problem because her FI wanted a pre-nup for both everything before AND everything after their marriage. So basically in the event of a divorce, she would end up with absolutely nothing, which was totally unfair considering she would have been contributing to the business they started together after marriage. She took issue with it (obviously) and then lost it when he had a secret meeting with his Mom and lawyer to write one up. But, this is more of a cautionary tale about good communication and trust issues than about an actual pre-nup.

climbingsingle · March 2015

We don't have one. I was surprised that my H didn't want one - he owns his own business and stands to inherit a lot of money from his family. But he said no, and I didn't feel one was necessary either.

KatWAG · March 2015

I completely understand and support the idea of a pre-nup.

However, everything I hear from the lawyers I know is that a good lawyer can find some kind of loophole/ clause to void almost any pre-nup.

But I am not a lawyer, so what do I know?

lyndausvi · March 2015

charcoalandblush said:
My take on pre nups is this - you're agreeing to a pre nup whether you write your own or not. Your state has laws about what happens with your money/kids/stuff/etc. if you get divorced. If you like those rules, you don't need to write your own pre nup - you're basically agreeing to the one that the state has already written for you. If you're not ok with these rules, you need to write your own.

It's not about not trusting your partner or expecting divorce. It's about understanding the rules of marriage and divorce that you're subjecting yourself to and agreeing to those rules, or agreeing to change them.

I imagine that sometime soon, DF and I will sit down and look at the rules in our state and decide if we need/want our own prenup.

I get your point, however, people move and laws change. Heck, DH and I have been married for 6 years and have lived in 3 states and 1 territory.

Where you live now could mean jack shit 20 years from now if CURRENT laws change and/or you move to another state.

Just saying I would never rely on your current states laws in protecting you in the future.

lyndausvi · March 2015

KatWAG said:
I completely understand and support the idea of a pre-nup.
However, everything I hear from the lawyers I know is that a good lawyer can find some kind of loophole/ clause to void almost any pre-nup.
But I am not a lawyer, so what do I know?

They can. That is why it's important to have separate lawyers.

Back in the day it was the one with the most assets basically handing their SO a piece of paper on the wedding day telling them to sign the paper or there would be no wedding. That is BS.

There are other things that caused the people to sign in distress. Or the one with the assets hired their SO's lawyer for them. Hello, conflict of interest?

It's always important to have your own lawyer look over things. No not cheap out. Even then, it's no guarantee it will stick, but more than likely it can still be the basis of the final agreement.

amelisha · March 2015

If we had more assets we totally would have gotten one. As it is, we both have some retirement savings, I have interests in my parents' properties, and he has some investments, but we don't have much else and so it's not significant enough to bother with. My net worth is higher on paper than his (thanks to the property I own 50/50 with my parents), but we make salaries in the same range and we don't own anything together yet or have kids or anything, so it didn't seem that necessary.

Bubblegum5586 · March 2015

I get why they are important but H and I had nothing going into our marriage. We started dating as poor college students and moved into an apartment as poor post college students. Since getting married we have much better jobs and own a house now but it always been together.

katiekessler123 · March 2015

I know this is going to be an unpopular opinion, and I understand why some people may want one, but if my husband asked me to sign a pre-nup before we got married I would be very upset and would question marrying him.

lovegood90 · March 2015

katiekessler123 said:
I know this is going to be an unpopular opinion, and I understand why some people may want one, but if my husband asked me to sign a pre-nup before we got married I would be very upset and would question marrying him.

See, I have the opposite opinion- if my SO refused to sign one/got upset, I would be the one questioning marrying HIM. FFS, it's not a contract saying "I want to divorce you one day." I think people really need to get over themselves when they get upset about these things.

holyguacamole79 · March 2015

Another unpopular opinion. We never considered a pre-nup. For us, it didn't make sense to make vows to each other to be faithful to each other until death separates us and then sign a document that says "but if that doesn't work out ...."

MyNameIsNot · March 2015

I think they are very smart, especially for couples who have significant assets or debts, a business, children from prior relationships, or expect to inherit anything. After handling divorces for years, I see how emotional and expensive litigating a divorce can be. Even if the worst happened to my relationship, I would never want to go through that or put my H through that. I would rather know ahead of time what to expect in the case of divorce and be able to get through it as quickly as possible so that I could focus on healing myself.

As far as using an online form, I wouldn't do it. One of the primary challenges to a pre-nup is whether both parties stood on equal ground in the negotiation, and whether both parties had their independent counsel advise them.

Yes, you can expect to spend a little money on a pre-nup, but it shouldn't cost any more than a Will. Just as you wouldn't want to forgo a Will to leave your family to figure it out or spend time and money litigating, spending $1,000 to get a pre-nup is smart compared to risking spending $30K to litigate a divorce.

ETA: clarity

redheadbride15 · March 2015

The word leaves a very nasty taste in my mouth. I can't even imagine bringing it up when I'm about to make the most important commitment of my life, and I say that even coming from a family in which nearly everyone before me has been divorced. However, we're both entering this marriage on equal footing financially, so maybe I'd feel differently if things were a bit more lopsided?

katiekessler123 · March 2015

lovegood90- We never even discussed a prenup, so I didn't deny him one that he wanted. Furthermore, I think he would feel the same if I brought one up to him. I realize it's not a guaranteed divorce. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, myself included.

Holyguacamole79 (love your name, BTW)- you summed up my thoughts well.

VulgarGirl · March 2015

We have one.

We face the fact that our union is still not legal in a lot of places. We protect ourselves as best we can and that includes a prenup.

charcoalandblush · March 2015

lovegood90 said:

katiekessler123 said:
I know this is going to be an unpopular opinion, and I understand why some people may want one, but if my husband asked me to sign a pre-nup before we got married I would be very upset and would question marrying him.
See, I have the opposite opinion- if my SO refused to sign one/got upset, I would be the one questioning marrying HIM. FFS, it's not a contract saying "I want to divorce you one day." I think people really need to get over themselves when they get upset about these things.

I agree wholeheartedly. If someone can't support my decision to protect myself and my assets, I would feel very disrespected.

yogadevil · March 2015

At least in my state (Minnesota) inheritance is not considered community property. That would have been the main reason for us to get one. We chose not to, as were going into the marriage with equal or shared assets (anything of value is already in both our names).

I will Say this though, no matter how sweet, thoughtful, honest, nonmanipulative a person may be- You marry one person, but I promise you that you divorce a completely different person.

dcbride86 · March 2015

We aren't having one (although as soon as I was sworn in at the Bar, I joked with FI that I was going to start working on one). However, I agree with PP that they can be a really great thing, especially if you have kids. I actually know a priest who refused to perform weddings for people who already had kids unless there was a prenup.

If the cost is the only thing making you hesitate, I would go ahead and get one. It really shouldn't be all that expensive, and it's definitely worth protecting your assets. I don't know what state you live in (and it's been awhile since I took Family Law), and the laws about community/separate property vary a lot by state.

I would NOT use an online form. There are TONS of problems associated with those, and sites like LegalZoom are illegal in several states for this reason. It's good to see a lawyer in person so you know it's phrased properly and your assets are really protected.

MyNameIsNot · March 2015

yogadevil said:
At least in my state (Minnesota) inheritance is not considered community property. That would have been the main reason for us to get one. We chose not to, as were going into the marriage with equal or shared assets (anything of value is already in both our names).

I will Say this though, no matter how sweet, thoughtful, honest, nonmanipulative a person may be- You marry one person, but I promise you that you divorce a completely different person.

That's exactly Linda's Lynda's point above. That's what the law is in your current state today. You could move to a different state or your state could change the law. The idea is to "lock in" that rule so that you are still as expected if the rules change.

Still, inheritance as community property is a little more complicated than yes/no. It depends on whether it gets intermingled with other assets and blah blah blah.

dcbride86 · March 2015

MyNameIsNot said:

yogadevil said:
At least in my state (Minnesota) inheritance is not considered community property. That would have been the main reason for us to get one. We chose not to, as were going into the marriage with equal or shared assets (anything of value is already in both our names).

I will Say this though, no matter how sweet, thoughtful, honest, nonmanipulative a person may be- You marry one person, but I promise you that you divorce a completely different person.

That's exactly Linda's point above. That's what the law is in your current state today. You could move to a different state or your state could change the law. The idea is to "lock in" that rule so that you are still as expected if the rules change.
Still, inheritance as community property is a little more complicated than yes/no. It depends on whether it gets intermingled with other assets and blah blah blah.

This exactly. If you moved to another state, that inheritsnce might be community property. Or if you use that inheritance to purchase a home that you both improve, it might turn into community property. This is why it's best to see a lawyer and get a document drafted that pre-sets the terms and what State laws will be applied in interpreting the agreement.

kmmssg · March 2015

I don't think it is wise to do this online. I think they only way you are both properly protected is using separate lawyers. If this is important to you guys I would find the money so that your interests are equally protected.

southernbelle0915 · March 2015

I understand the sentiment that marriage is not a business transaction and lots of people "mean it" when they say their "until death do us part" vows...

I bet there are few, if any, married posters on here who expect they'll divorce their spouse. We all want to be happy forever. But if you look at national stats, many of those same posters' marriages will end in divorce.

So if you have a bunch of assets that you want to protect (in case, despite your hopes and dreams, you become part of that statistic), a prenup makes a lot of sense.

DH and I do not have one. He makes more money than me, but not by much. I will probably inherit more than him, but not by much. Yea, maybe it will be messy if we become part of the stat. To tell you the truth, we just didn't really think about it before we got married. But I totally understand and support why people do it.

Pre Nup agreements

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