Legally married, now having a "real" wedding? Stop here first! (AKA, the PPD FAQ thread)

mblake525 · November 2013

Interesting point:

I was on the Wedding 911 app a few weeks ago (the IPhone app version of this forum). We were discussing PPDs. A woman from the UK said that it is illegal to have two ceremonies in certain areas there. You and your officiant can get in a lot of legal trouble. It is essentially considered bigamy. You are marrying someone when you are already married. It mainly applies to couples that get married in another country and return to the UK in an attempt to have a second wedding.

Note: I haven't done much research on the validity of that statement. It is certainly an interesting way to look at it though.

Emmy1493 · November 2013

PPD's are just a terrible idea. No correct way to justify or go about it. Case closed.

Pandemonia · November 2013

We've got a whole lot of different laws in the UK. However, the one that remains constant both here and across the Atlantic is the simple one that says you can only get legally married once to the same person at the same time - or rather without the benefit of a divorce in the interim. And that's one legal marriage. Regardless of what you call it.

So a Registry Office wedding in the UK or a Courthouse Wedding in the US is the legal, binding, marriage. You can fanny about with a PPD all you like but it isn't your marriage ceremony, symbolic or otherwise. For the simple reason that you are already married.

LDubHawksFan · November 2013

STBMrsEverhart said:

None of the three couples I used as examples lied to anyone that I'm aware of. I'm also not usually aware when any couple is celebrating their anniversary (or anniversaries as it could be) because up until the popularity of FB I wasn't generally aware it was someone's anniversary. Even if I attended their wedding, chances are good I wouldn't remember year in, year out. Anniversaries are personal remembrances, not generally community affairs, with the exception of the big ones that families like to celebrate as a group. My point was really, each couple I used as an example celebrates ONE anniversary, the date they had their symbolic ceremony, not their civil proceeding.

---------stupid quotes are broken!--------

Wrong, all of my close friends' wedding dates are in my work calendar and I send them a happy anniversary text or email without FB. You are still wrong with this whole concept of what a wedding is.

MobKaz · November 2013

STBMrsEverhart said:

Jen4948 said:

Those who don't appreciate being lied to would care.

None of the three couples I used as examples lied to anyone that I'm aware of. I'm also not usually aware when any couple is celebrating their anniversary (or anniversaries as it could be) because up until the popularity of FB I wasn't generally aware it was someone's anniversary. Even if I attended their wedding, chances are good I wouldn't remember year in, year out. Anniversaries are personal remembrances, not generally community affairs, with the exception of the big ones that families like to celebrate as a group. My point was really, each couple I used as an example celebrates ONE anniversary, the date they had their symbolic ceremony, not their civil proceeding.

Perhaps you are not high enough on their scale of life totem to qualify on their "people who need to know" list.

crunchymamaof2 · November 2013

I'm on the 911 App regularly, and man, there are some *lovely* entitled brides on it. There are also some wonderful ladies who should join here. I wish I could link some of the questions!

mblake525 · November 2013

@acove2006 I frequent it as well under a different screen name. Every time I have to explain why you can't make your guests wear a particular color, insert registry info into your invites, or why having a honeymoon registry is rude, I want to direct them here.

crunchymamaof2 · November 2013

@mblake525 ahhh I know! They drive me crazy. I also can't stand the 4-5 post vents or questions. It's a fricken app, there's a reason we're limited to 500 characters and no more than 39 posts per thread. KISS, anyone?

If you don't mind, PM me your screenname. I'm Alycia10.27.13. Just curious :-)

sarals24 · November 2013

I just got in a ridiculous discussion on WeddingBee about this. (I like that board for some things, but etiquette is not one of them!)

http://boards.weddingbee.com/topic/had-a-legal-ceremony-for-insurance-and-still-want-wedding-that-is-planned#axzz2m6C6iaN4

Apparently, some people want to get married legally FIRST because REASONS. And those reasons are IMPORTANT.

Viczaesar · November 2013

@KnotPorscha, vendor alert - johansmith

Sharina9105 · December 2013

I love this!!!

APDSS22 · December 2013

Basically, if you're describing the "oh-so-important" reasons you and your significant other got married and why you should have another "wedding" and your story doesn't include "but then I woke up from that dream and we're still not married, I was just asleep and will never mix Benadryl and vodka again" it is not acceptable.

OnceUponSnow · December 2013

Is it okay to have a second/better/real wedding if my original wedding was a disappointment/emergency/elopement? No.

Wow, that's incredibly judgemental. I was curious to see what a PPD was and read this, I couldn't believe it. It's not my case (my fiancé and I are not married) but if we were to have a courthouse paper signing and reading of the laws for legal matters, we would not consider it our wedding, and our family would totally expect us to throw a ''real'' wedding, one that's beyond simply putting your signature on a certificate. I guess it depends on the definition you have of a wedding, but to me it's more than signing papers, it's being surrounded by your loved ones when you declare your love and commitment. I don't understand how this could possibly be anyone's business to state it is NEVER OKAY to do this. Unless you meant in a particular country ? Because this can't possibly be a universal answer.

NYCBruin · December 2013

OnceUponSnow said:

Is it okay to have a second/better/real wedding if my original wedding was a disappointment/emergency/elopement? No.

Wow, that's incredibly judgemental. I was curious to see what a PPD was and read this, I couldn't believe it. It's not my case (my fiancé and I are not married) but if we were to have a courthouse paper signing and reading of the laws for legal matters, we would not consider it our wedding, and our family would totally expect us to throw a ''real'' wedding, one that's beyond simply putting your signature on a certificate. I guess it depends on the definition you have of a wedding, but to me it's more than signing papers, it's being surrounded by your loved ones when you declare your love and commitment. I don't understand how this could possibly be anyone's business to state it is NEVER OKAY to do this. Unless you meant in a particular country ? Because this can't possibly be a universal answer.

I think it's awfully judgmental and awful to think that people who choose to have JOP ceremonies didn't have a "real" wedding.

Doni2211 · December 2013

I'm so happy I stumbled across this thread. I'm new to the boards and it's a coincidence that my fiance and I just had this conversation and I'll preface it by saying that he's USAF, but I'm happy with the choice I made (excuse me for not using all the appropriate abbreviations by the way :P).

Since we're currently states apart, he wants to go to the JOP and then re-do the whole thing over again when he comes home in August. HE and his family want the big wedding; I have never wanted one - not even as a little girl. I don't care about dresses, or bridesmaids, decor, or any of that (just my preference). So, to tell me that I need to do it TWICE and expect gifts out of it is ridiculous.

Furthermore, I finally had to explain to him that it's a slap in the face to tell people how we paid for our wedding, if that's what we decided to do. Sure it's alluring as hell to use that lump sum to throw a big party, but what do you have after it? A lot of money spent on people who didn't remember anything about your wedding (<--- My original beef with weddings).

I told him that, because I love him and want him to be happy, I'll have a wedding. But, we're having ONE, in August. And it will be smaller. But, in having that conversation, I have a huge weight off my chest. I don't know why I was reluctant to tell him anyway, he was totally fine with it. Sure we'll be pretty poor this spring/summer, but in the end we get everything we want and it will all be worth it.

OnceUponSnow · December 2013

NYCBruin said:

OnceUponSnow said:

Is it okay to have a second/better/real wedding if my original wedding was a disappointment/emergency/elopement? No.

Wow, that's incredibly judgemental. I was curious to see what a PPD was and read this, I couldn't believe it. It's not my case (my fiancé and I are not married) but if we were to have a courthouse paper signing and reading of the laws for legal matters, we would not consider it our wedding, and our family would totally expect us to throw a ''real'' wedding, one that's beyond simply putting your signature on a certificate. I guess it depends on the definition you have of a wedding, but to me it's more than signing papers, it's being surrounded by your loved ones when you declare your love and commitment. I don't understand how this could possibly be anyone's business to state it is NEVER OKAY to do this. Unless you meant in a particular country ? Because this can't possibly be a universal answer.

I think it's awfully judgmental and awful to think that people who choose to have JOP ceremonies didn't have a "real" wedding.

I said that ? I said everybody who did this didn't have a real wedding ? Really ?

Take a breath and go read again.

OnceUponSnow · December 2013

Just wanted to say : I am totally against couples who married secretly and set up a ''wedding'' without telling any of their guests about their JOP wedding. That's just awful.

But if I want to throw a reception, paid all by myself and my future husband, to celebrate an important and meaningful event in our lives that goes well beyond the legal aspect of it, why would it be wrong ? It's a private event with a selected guestlist, people can choose not to attend if they think it is silly, but I don't see why we can't separate the papers from the event itself. You can do both the same day. You can do them separately. I believe family and friends will be happy to be there, no matter how you choose to proceed.

Just a little story : my grandfather was born on July 26th. But for some reason, the birth certificate states he was born two days earlier and they couldn't change it. So he is ''legally'' born July 24th, but we always celebrated his birthday on July 26th. Who is right ? The legal paper or his mother and whole family ? If you think it doesn't really change anything IRL, then that's also what I think about the whole ''courthouse wedding not being the real wedding'' issue.

NYCBruin · December 2013

OnceUponSnow said:

Just wanted to say : I am totally against couples who married secretly and set up a ''wedding'' without telling any of their guests about their JOP wedding. That's just awful.

But if I want to throw a reception, paid all by myself and my future husband, to celebrate an important and meaningful event in our lives that goes well beyond the legal aspect of it, why would it be wrong ? It's a private event with a selected guestlist, people can choose not to attend if they think it is silly, but I don't see why we can't separate the papers from the event itself. You can do both the same day. You can do them separately. I believe family and friends will be happy to be there, no matter how you choose to proceed.

Just a little story : my grandfather was born on July 26th. But for some reason, the birth certificate states he was born two days earlier and they couldn't change it. So he is ''legally'' born July 24th, but we always celebrated his birthday on July 26th. Who is right ? The legal paper or his mother and whole family ? If you think it doesn't really change anything IRL, then that's also what I think about the whole ''courthouse wedding not being the real wedding'' issue.

I'm guessing you didn't read the whole thread. There are several times where it's mentioned that there's nothing wrong with throwing a party to celebrate recent nuptials. It's the whole pretending to get married thing that's rude. A wedding, by definition, is when two people wed.

NYCBruin · December 2013

OnceUponSnow said:

NYCBruin said:

OnceUponSnow said:

Is it okay to have a second/better/real wedding if my original wedding was a disappointment/emergency/elopement? No.

Wow, that's incredibly judgemental. I was curious to see what a PPD was and read this, I couldn't believe it. It's not my case (my fiancé and I are not married) but if we were to have a courthouse paper signing and reading of the laws for legal matters, we would not consider it our wedding, and our family would totally expect us to throw a ''real'' wedding, one that's beyond simply putting your signature on a certificate. I guess it depends on the definition you have of a wedding, but to me it's more than signing papers, it's being surrounded by your loved ones when you declare your love and commitment. I don't understand how this could possibly be anyone's business to state it is NEVER OKAY to do this. Unless you meant in a particular country ? Because this can't possibly be a universal answer.

I think it's awfully judgmental and awful to think that people who choose to have JOP ceremonies didn't have a "real" wedding.

I said that ? I said everybody who did this didn't have a real wedding ? Really ?

Take a breath and go read again.

You basically imply in your post that you don't consider it a wedding unless there's a big celebration.

There are plenty of people who choose to get married in a simple ceremony. That signature means a lot to many people. Your post implies that it's "just a formality." Not to mention the many same sex couples who would do anything to be able to "just sign papers."

OnceUponSnow · December 2013

NYCBruin

I didn't ''imply'' anything about anyone, I spoke for me, according to my opinion about my wedding. I just found the statement I commented incredibly judgemental, as if there was only 1 way to get married. But on that matter, we obviously share the same opinion.

NYCBruin · December 2013

OnceUponSnow said:

NYCBruin
I didn't ''imply'' anything about anyone, I spoke for me, according to my opinion about my wedding. I just found the statement I commented incredibly judgemental, as if there was only 1 way to get married. But on that matter, we obviously share the same opinion.

You "defined" a wedding as being "more than signing papers" I can see now that you didn't mean that to say that you don't consider simply signing papers as a wedding, but based on what you wrote, that's what it sounded like.

And in general, when people say things like "well I'm not saying this is the case for other people, just that I would never do it" it comes off as rather judgmental. Like you're saying that something so simple as a courthouse marriage is good enough for other people but you're above that. Again, not saying that you think that, but that's how your first post came across.

aurorajanette · December 2013

@OnceUponSnow

You stated: "our family would totally expect us to throw a ''real'' wedding, one that's beyond simply putting your signature on a certificate."

Some people simply put a signature on a certificate, and they are no less married than someone who has a big party, or as you referred to it, a "real" wedding. When you were called out, you chose to backpedal on your statement. Fine. But you can't change the fact that you said it, and it was incredibly rude and judgmental.

Persnicketese · December 2013

PPD days are really tacky, IMO. Even if you are upfront.

Though I have a question: Would a vow renewal instead still be considered a PPD?

Example: A medical emergency forces the couple to get married before their wedding date. A year from the day they got married they have a vow renewal, where they speak their vows over again to each other, reaffirm their marriage and then have a big party to celebrate their anniversary and renewing their vows.

Is this the same as a PPD? It's a situation I saw come up in a conversation and since you all seem to be really knowledgeable I figure I might ask you all. Thanks!

KeptInStitches · December 2013

I'd say within a year I would side-eye a vow renewal with a ceremony affirming the vows unless there was some massive medical problem that had been resolved. I would never side-eye a kickass party.

WildMagelet · December 2013

Persnicketese said:

Example: A medical emergency forces the couple to get married before their wedding date. A year from the day they got married they have a vow renewal, where they speak their vows over again to each other, reaffirm their marriage and then have a big party to celebrate their anniversary and renewing their vows.

Not automatically. VRs that are tastefully done as vow renewals and not as wedding re-dos are not PPDs. I think there is a big difference between having a VR for a milestone anniversary or after a time of strife versus having a wedding redo because the first one wasn't good enough.

Persnicketese · December 2013

@Schatzi13 I think they might, but from what I've been told it's going to be very low key. They wanted to do the vow renewals on their own and for themselves, but their families asked to watch so they're letting anyone who wants to watch, watch. Their main focus is on throwing a party afterwards as a thank you for all the support they've gotten in the past year.

@flutterbride2b To them their first anniversary is a big milestone. It's not something I'd really celebrate with a vow renewal (I'd save that for a bigger anniversary, TBH), but they feel like the fact that despite everything that's happened to make it a year is a big deal.

WedinVolterra · December 2013

onlinebanker12 said:

I'd like to hear from destination wedding brides about how they actually did it. I know some who have their ceremony "legally" performed in the foreign country, and some who have the "legal" ceremony performed right before or after the destination celebration. I think saying those couples are "doing it wrong" is a little silly, though I agree that you should never lie to your friends and family.

We jumped through the 1000 hoops required to get legally married in Italy. I do love my official Italian marriage certificate!

And now, in hindsight, I am so grateful my mother insisted we do it that way. She felt it would be unfair or dishonest to ask people to travel to Italy for a lie.

artbyallie · December 2013

WedinVolterra said:

onlinebanker12 said:

I'd like to hear from destination wedding brides about how they actually did it. I know some who have their ceremony "legally" performed in the foreign country, and some who have the "legal" ceremony performed right before or after the destination celebration. I think saying those couples are "doing it wrong" is a little silly, though I agree that you should never lie to your friends and family.

We jumped through the 1000 hoops required to get legally married in Italy. I do love my official Italian marriage certificate!

And now, in hindsight, I am so grateful my mother insisted we do it that way. She felt it would be unfair or dishonest to ask people to travel to Italy for a lie.

How cool that you got married in Italy! IMHO that beats the hell out of all the 'destination weddings' that are just playacting.

chiualover · December 2013

I just want to say I thoroughly enjoyed this thread. I usually post on The Bump, But I like to check on this Etiqutte Board. You all post what I am thinking but can't say, because I am a Gift Registry consultant in a major department store.

And I am frightened by the entitled brats that my generation has and is raising.

SheMarie82 · December 2013

My FI HATES that I have read thi thread. We are going to NY to have the legal ceremony, and we will be having another ceremony in September. It is because it is not legal in Michigan for us to be married. I am now having panic attacks that people are going to find it to be distasteful the way that we are doing things. If it were legal here, then we wouldn't be traveling at all, but it is not an option for us to be legally wed in our home state.

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