What is a "B" list and what is a "tiered" event? My fiance and I are having a small wedding in our backyard with just close friends and family invited. I told him he could have a "B" list party...we are getting married in the afternoon, and anyone who wants to come after the "main" party (around 6 or 7 p.m.) is welcome to come and hang out. We will be having a bonfire and music and fireworks and just hanging out in general the rest of the night. Anyone who was at the wedding is welcome to stay, and as I said his friends that we couldn't invite are welcome to come and party the night away (no gifts, of course!).
Ugh I hate that this has turned into the "Let me tell you why I'm special and allowed to be rude to my guests who should be honored that they are allowed to be graced with my presence on my speshul day" thread. Was this on the TK homepage or in a mass email or something?
Don't worry guys, I have the Wedding Police AND the Whambulance on speed dial!
This entire thread is the reason I stopped paying attention to anything "The Knot" has to say about my wedding. "Etiquette" has become another word for judgement and privilege. Either you're happy for your friends/family and want to share in this occasion with them, or you're not. I say good riddance to the latter group.
Wow, snarky much? "If you invite me to your wedding with my DH, don't have a gap, and don't have us come after dinner I will most likely show up and play nice."
This discussion is very helpful to me, as I am planning our wedding in September, I do not want to offend anyone, or leave a bad taste in any of our guests' mouths at the wedding.
I see a lot of cash bars on people's deal-breakers or violations lists. What should you do if you cannot afford a cash bar? Our families are huge, and we are not receiving any financial help from our parents - an open bar is on our wish list as we really do want to give the gift of unlimited drinks to our guests, but an open bar is extremely expensive..
Would you cut family and friends to make a smaller guest list in order to save money for an open bar? Is it that big of a deal?
Not in our case. We looked hard to find a place we could bring in our own alcohol to cut the costs. An open bar was non-negotiable.
When hosting any event hosting guests properly is very important to us. So I would do anything to accomplish that. Even if it meant cutting the list. When we have a formal dinner party we only have dining seats for 8 people. That is all that is invited, because that is all way can host properly.
I see weddings the same way. It's just a bigger party. I like getting invited to weddings, but I do not get butt hurt if I'm not invited to weddings in my outer circles. Immediate family, really close friends, I would be. The next level? Nope, I just figured they couple either wants a smaller wedding for either personal or financial reasons. NBD.
What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests. Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated.
Thanks for your response... I guess I should have elaborated a bit more... we will be having a 2 hour gap that is then followed by a cocktail hour with open bar/passed hors d'oeuvres and then a seated dinner with open bar throughout the night. How do people who do not want to do a first look get rid of the gap? We need the time to fit in pictures.
@rachidoll, can you do as many shots as possible beforehand (you with each of your parties, family shots, etc.) to cut down on the shots that have to be done later? Then you really should be down to 30-45 minutes of pictures, which is filled nicely for your guests by the cocktail hour.
What you should do if you can't afford to pay for alcohol is not provide it. Limit what you provide to what you can pay for.
But sorry, expecting guests to open their wallets because you're not able or willing to is rude-even if they want the alcohol. It is in fact rude of guests to "expect" alcohol at weddings or to "expect" to pay for anything the hosts aren't providing, because it says to hosts that their hospitality is inadequate. It is not inadequate hospitality not to offer your guests alcohol as long as there is plenty of non-alcoholic beverages available that they don't have to pay for.
And yes, it is rude to send guests away between the ceremony and reception for a "gap."
Wow, I'm really glad the guests I am inviting to my wedding are not as demanding as you are. "I expect you to properly host me for every second of your wedding, from the moment I am seated in the pew to the moment the reception ends. " Really??? Most ,if not all couples want to be sure that their guests are having a good time, however do not forget it is their day, not yours. The bride and grooms main focus should be that they are having their dream day.
Lots of high rollers on here who scoff at cash bars...wow! I've only attended one wedding that was open bar and there were also ice sculptures and 300 people. We cannot afford to pay for the entire alcohol consumption at our wedding - half Irishmen, half firemen - and don't know many who would be able to, unless they are receiving assistance. There have been some blatant absurdities that have insulted me in the past:
Dress codes. Not casual, not black tie, but something the bride made up to discourage the females attending from outdoing her! It was not held in a church and it was a second marriage, and yet the invitation dictated, "Formal Modest," complete with specifics about how women should have their CHESTS and arms covered, dresses below the knees, etc. I almost rented a nun costume or a pantsuit a la Boogie Nights, but opted not to stoop.
Not inviting live-in significant others. Etiquette books are your friend. Read them and stop insulting people! If you don't know your guests well enough to not insult them, why are you inviting them?
A cutesy poem included in a bridal shower invitation that explained how the couple already had everything they needed and wanted gift cards. Are you kidding me?!
Dollar dances. 'Nuff said.
Not adequate seating. "We are all family here - choose a table, not a side," is ALL THE RAGE but unfortunately left myself and several other couples without seats at the last wedding we attended.
Longest married couple dances. There has been one at every single wedding I've attended, which tells me I'm alone on this one. The newly married couple dances for all of 5 seconds, that's always awkward. And even though everyone LOVES seeing the two eighty year-olds at the end who have been together for eternity, all of the people who have been together for 20 years without marriage are just sitting there awkwardly forcing a smile through all of this nonsense. Although that has never been me, I have witnessed it several times. You decided to get married, congratulations! Not everyone in attendance shares your views.
People who openly complain about any of the above at the event or to the offender. Two wrongs don't make a right, we all know that one. If you don't like 2 hour long masses, don't attend a church wedding. If you don't like the dress code on the invitation, politely decline. If someone asks for a gift card, give them what you'd have given them normally. If you don't like the dollar dance, don't participate!
Etiquette is pretty easy. It's not snobby, it's just common sense dictating that you should always have others in mind (instead of yourself). If making people feel uncomfortable is your thing, then you have nothing to be concerned about. :-)
Wow, I'm really glad the guests I am inviting to my wedding are not as demanding as you are. "I expect you to properly host me for every second of your wedding, from the moment I am seated in the pew to the moment the reception ends. " Really??? Most ,if not all couples want to be sure that their guests are having a good time, however do not forget it is their day, not yours. The bride and grooms main focus should be that they are having their dream day.
Sorry, but no. The couple are not entitled to a "dream day" at the expense of their guests' comfort. If they want a "dream day" that is about themselves only and no one else, they should invite no one else. That would be rude. Guests do indeed have the right to expect to be hosted properly every second of the time they are invited for.
Thanks for your response... I guess I should have elaborated a bit more... we will be having a 2 hour gap that is then followed by a cocktail hour with open bar/passed hors d'oeuvres and then a seated dinner with open bar throughout the night. How do people who do not want to do a first look get rid of the gap? We need the time to fit in pictures.
Hi, we are not having a first look, but we are having a cocktail hour (one hour) and we will fit all of our pictures in that cocktail hour with no problem with my big catholic family. If it was longer, I can not imagine what my poor guests from OOT would do!
If its separate places, you need to include their commute time to get to the reception/ cocktail hour place. Your cocktail hour is time for you to get you pictures done before the reception starts. I do not know why your pictures are going to take 2 hours. If you are going elsewhere to take pictures, please change this decision as making your guests wait so you can have pictures at a different place is rude.
ETA: I like PP idea about doing some pictures before the ceremony - bridesmaids pictures, mom picture, dad picture maybe, then your groom and his groomsmen can do their pictures. That way only large family pictures remain and maybe 1 or 2 of the entire bridal party.
I agree that a gap of under an hour is okay if there is travel required from the church to the reception. You almost need to build in a little bit of buffer time... if the ceremony starts a few minutes late or runs a bit long, if the receiving line takes longer than planned, if there is traffic between the church and the reception....plan it too closely and there won't be a cocktail hour!
This entire thread is the reason I stopped paying attention to anything "The Knot" has to say about my wedding. "Etiquette" has become another word for judgement and privilege. Either you're happy for your friends/family and want to share in this occasion with them, or you're not. I say good riddance to the latter group.
Thank you for your sanity. My blood was really boiling reading all of these responses until I saw your reply.
Wow, I'm really glad the guests I am inviting to my wedding are not as demanding as you are. "I expect you to properly host me for every second of your wedding, from the moment I am seated in the pew to the moment the reception ends. " Really??? Most ,if not all couples want to be sure that their guests are having a good time, however do not forget it is their day, not yours. The bride and grooms main focus should be that they are having their dream day.
When people say they expect to be properly hosted, they are asking very little actually. Just that they have a chair to sit in and food/beverages that are appropriate for the time of day (a meal at a meal time or something to nibble on at a non-meal time). They are not asking for alcohol or fancy food. They are asking that the hosts treat them like guests and not ATMs or props for pictures. A couple should still be able to have their "dream" day without treating their guests poorly. Once the couple decides to invite other people, the day stops becoming just about them. If you don't care about how you treat your guests, why are you inviting them in the first place?
Don't worry guys, I have the Wedding Police AND the Whambulance on speed dial!
Yikes, there are probably no actual "deal breakers" for me because it's just not my style. I'll either accept or decline your invitation based on my availability based on my schedule. My blog keeps me entirely too busy with events. HOWEVER the one wedding thing that just makes me gag is the dollar dance. I would still go to a wedding that had a dollar dance, but it seems so tacky to me. I understand it is regional but I've always felt like regional isn't a good reason to be tacky. Now with that being said my very best friend in the world, who I've grown up with for 30 years moved to Denverwhen we turned about 25 years old. She's lived there now for 10 years. She told me a few weeks ago that next year at her wedding they would absolutely do a dollar dance because everyone in Denver does them. My mouth fell open. She is the classiest most cultured person I know. I just couldn't believe it. But she said if she didn't do one people would be confused. I told her I refused to pay to dance with her. LOL.
Is this a UK / US split? UK its absolutely fine / pretty much expected that guests will have to pay for drinks after the wedding breakfast. I'd also be appalled if a guest complained that the food wasn't good enough at the wedding breakfast. What is a fundraiser?? And what is a dollar dance?
Wow I didn't know so many people had so many hang ups about weddings. I also don't like the dollar dance, garner toss and cheesy games but cash bar, gaps and honeymoon registry are totally fine with me. Instead of getting me some china set that I won't use I can spend it on something fun on the honeymoon!
20 minute ceremony max. Attendees will be parents, grandparents (there are 5 grandparents between us), and the 4-person wedding party aside from myself and my dude, I think we're going to be totaling out at 12 people.
He has really bad anxiety about being in front of crowds (poor kid was sweating bullets as the best man at his brother's wedding), so we're keeping the ceremony as tiny as we can, and then doing a biiiiiiig reception for everybody within like... 30 minutes of the ceremony so that we can get all the family pictures and any last-minute setup done before we go get wild.
Wedding things I hate:
- Long masses
- Toasts
- Being pushed into the bouquet toss crowd. NO THANKS. (This is mostly something I get with other guests who can't tone it down on the pushy nonsense)
- Forced interaction, mostly via dances. (again, pushy guests)
- Unattended kids at reception. I saw a MAGICALLY sleeping baby in a carrier probably 5 feet from a giant super loud speaker. (GUESSSTTTSSSS)
- No details on dress code or what kind of venue, even when I asked. Late september in NH, unheated tents. Froze my a** off and had super high heels that got ruined from sinking down in the dirt.
I think people are being ridiculous in saying a Cash Bar is bad wedding etiquette. I mean geez, some people can't afford to pay for everyone's alcohol! I would never be offended by a cash bar at a wedding.
Did you read the sticky and do you have any idea what the point of a reception is?
I'm guessing NO and NO.
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
I cannot understand the issue with cash bars. We are providing cocktails at the cocktail hour, wine with dinner, and champagne for toasts, but anything over that is not covered. How you can manage to have a 5 course meal and everything else included at the reception for 200 people and cover all their drinks is beyond me. We are paying for most of the reception ourselves, while paying a mortgage, two car payments, and everything else it costs to live. I have worked very hard to meet all the etiquette standards dictated for weddings, and I think it's horrible to shame people who just can't afford to cover everyone's drinks.
Also, for someone to express their distaste for something that someone else has included in their wedding (especially while still at said wedding) is not just poor etiquette, it is downright rude. You are there to help a couple celebrate their marriage, not to judge them on what they have provided you with.
I am really surprised to see so many people listing Gaps as a deal breakers. We are having a church ceremony, a 2 hour gap, and then the cocktail reception. Is this that terrible of etiquette? Y'all have me questioning my wedding day! :-/
It really is terrible etiquette. You should be hosting something for the guests immediately following the ceremony. Your wedding begins with the ceremony and ends with the closing of the reception. Guests should be hosted for the entire duration of your wedding. You can extend your cocktail hour, move up your recprion start time, or something else.
@dianamaidens You're right, alcohol is pricey. Which is why you shouldn't push the cost onto your guests. A host should never allow a guest to pay for something. You have several options. You can offer a limited bar, like just beer and wine. You can have a dry weddding, one with no alcohol. If alcohol is something you want, then you need to cover the expenses for it. You don't need to cut corners at the guest list. There are flowers, favors and things like that.
For the other pp, if you don't want to have a standard registry, that's fine. But why register for cash on a website that misleads guests and takes a cut of the money? Surely you're more clever than that.
20 minute ceremony max. Attendees will be parents, grandparents (there are 5 grandparents between us), and the 4-person wedding party aside from myself and my dude, I think we're going to be totaling out at 12 people.
He has really bad anxiety about being in front of crowds (poor kid was sweating bullets as the best man at his brother's wedding), so we're keeping the ceremony as tiny as we can, and then doing a biiiiiiig reception for everybody within like... 30 minutes of the ceremony so that we can get all the family pictures and any last-minute setup done before we go get wild.
Wedding things I hate:
- Long masses
- Toasts
- Being pushed into the bouquet toss crowd. NO THANKS. (This is mostly something I get with other guests who can't tone it down on the pushy nonsense)
- Forced interaction, mostly via dances. (again, pushy guests)
- Unattended kids at reception. I saw a MAGICALLY sleeping baby in a carrier probably 5 feet from a giant super loud speaker. (GUESSSTTTSSSS)
- No details on dress code or what kind of venue, even when I asked. Late september in NH, unheated tents. Froze my a** off and had super high heels that got ruined from sinking down in the dirt.
That is not against etiquette. Many people feel disappointed not seeing the ceremony, but it's not against etiquette rules to have a tiny ceremony and larger reception.
Tiered receptions are when people invite some guest to dinner and other just for dessert.
What differentiates an average host and a great host is anticipating unexpressed needs and wants of their guests. Just because the want/need is not expressed, doesn't mean it wouldn't be appreciated.
Re: What are your etiquette deal breakers?
What does PPD stand for?
ETA: my etiquette deal breakers would be anything that requires extra discomfort on my part -
- FI not being invited too
- not enough seats
- not a proper hosting at a meal time
I think everyone can agree that this is just not good. I would either not show up, or leave as soon as it was found out.
"If you invite me to your wedding with my DH, don't have a gap, and don't have us come after dinner I will most likely show up and play nice."
Etiquette is pretty easy. It's not snobby, it's just common sense dictating that you should always have others in mind (instead of yourself). If making people feel uncomfortable is your thing, then you have nothing to be concerned about. :-)
Oh dear god, I've never seen so many newbies posting at one time...
If its separate places, you need to include their commute time to get to the reception/ cocktail hour place. Your cocktail hour is time for you to get you pictures done before the reception starts. I do not know why your pictures are going to take 2 hours. If you are going elsewhere to take pictures, please change this decision as making your guests wait so you can have pictures at a different place is rude.
ETA: I like PP idea about doing some pictures before the ceremony - bridesmaids pictures, mom picture, dad picture maybe, then your groom and his groomsmen can do their pictures. That way only large family pictures remain and maybe 1 or 2 of the entire bridal party.
When people say they expect to be properly hosted, they are asking very little actually. Just that they have a chair to sit in and food/beverages that are appropriate for the time of day (a meal at a meal time or something to nibble on at a non-meal time). They are not asking for alcohol or fancy food. They are asking that the hosts treat them like guests and not ATMs or props for pictures. A couple should still be able to have their "dream" day without treating their guests poorly. Once the couple decides to invite other people, the day stops becoming just about them. If you don't care about how you treat your guests, why are you inviting them in the first place?
I'm the fuck out.
I'm guessing NO and NO.
"Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends time and space."
You can extend your cocktail hour, move up your recprion start time, or something else.
@dianamaidens You're right, alcohol is pricey. Which is why you shouldn't push the cost onto your guests. A host should never allow a guest to pay for something. You have several options. You can offer a limited bar, like just beer and wine. You can have a dry weddding, one with no alcohol.
If alcohol is something you want, then you need to cover the expenses for it.
You don't need to cut corners at the guest list. There are flowers, favors and things like that.
For the other pp, if you don't want to have a standard registry, that's fine. But why register for cash on a website that misleads guests and takes a cut of the money? Surely you're more clever than that.